Who's next?

[email hidden] (crit pro) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I'm done with the latest piece of [censored].

Come on, I know there is someone out there seeking fame.

crit pro

Phil Zajicek, come on down. You're the next contestant on the Price is High!

CP,

How does Sudafed, a decongestant that USADA un-banned in 2003, equate to
doping? Catching cheaters is one thing, but testing negative the day before
that test, as well as the day after? Makes me wonder why USADA even gave him a
warning.

[email hidden] (crit pro) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I'm done with the latest piece of [censored].

Come on, I know there is someone out there seeking fame.

crit pro

[censored],

The kid tested positive for sudafed for crissakes. Big [censored] deal.

Why don't you give it a rest?

[email hidden] (Brian trdina) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (crit pro) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I'm done with the latest piece of [censored].

Come on, I know there is someone out there seeking fame.

crit pro

[censored],

The kid tested positive for sudafed for crissakes. Big [censored] deal.

Why don't you give it a rest?

No kidding! Some of these anti-doping crusaders on RBR are starting
to remind me of the crowd in Monty Python and the Holy Grail,
demanding that the witch be burned. Phil's "positive" for sudafed is
as damning as having turned crit pro into a newt, except that unlike
in the movie, crit pro hasn't gotten better.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Ronde Chump said:

CP,

How does Sudafed, a decongestant that USADA un-banned in 2003, equate to
doping? Catching cheaters is one thing, but testing negative the day before
that test, as well as the day after? Makes me wonder why USADA even gave him a
warning.

I don't have a lot of facts in front of me.... but this is based on
the levels in his urine.... so if he takes 1 pill today, and that
puts him at 5... and takes 2 pills the next day... and that puts him
at a 6... that makes him positive one day, but not the day before.

My sources tell me they have seen a lot of people on the start line
taking Sudafed this year.... Funny how that works.

Scott
--
-*- Scott Patton
-*- Colorado Springs, CO
-*- http://www.FixedGearFever.com
-*- Track Racing Web Services

In article <[email hidden]>,

Scott Hendricks said:

[email hidden] (Brian trdina) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (crit pro) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I'm done with the latest piece of [censored].

Come on, I know there is someone out there seeking fame.

crit pro

[censored],

The kid tested positive for sudafed for crissakes. Big [censored] deal.

Why don't you give it a rest?

No kidding! Some of these anti-doping crusaders on RBR are starting
to remind me of the crowd in Monty Python and the Holy Grail,
demanding that the witch be burned. Phil's "positive" for sudafed is
as damning as having turned crit pro into a newt, except that unlike
in the movie, crit pro hasn't gotten better.

My understanding is that they just set a level for psuedophedrine(sp).

That means you can use it, all you want, as long as you stay below the
limit.

Now, if Phil was taking the "Normal adult dose" as listed on the package,
the limit may be a little low...

I don't know Phil. I don't know Crit Pro. I take Claritin D that has
the junk in there... I guess they probalby aren't testing a lot of
slow masters fatties... so I think I am safe!

Scott

--
-*- Scott Patton
-*- Colorado Springs, CO
-*- http://www.FixedGearFever.com
-*- Track Racing Web Services

In article <[email hidden]>, scott patton

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Scott Hendricks said:

[email hidden] (Brian trdina) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (crit pro) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...
> I'm done with the latest piece of [censored].
>
>
> Come on, I know there is someone out there seeking fame.
>
> crit pro

[censored],

The kid tested positive for sudafed for crissakes. Big [censored] deal.

Why don't you give it a rest?

No kidding! Some of these anti-doping crusaders on RBR are starting
to remind me of the crowd in Monty Python and the Holy Grail,
demanding that the witch be burned. Phil's "positive" for sudafed is
as damning as having turned crit pro into a newt, except that unlike
in the movie, crit pro hasn't gotten better.

My understanding is that they just set a level for psuedophedrine(sp).

That means you can use it, all you want, as long as you stay below the
limit.

Now, if Phil was taking the "Normal adult dose" as listed on the package,
the limit may be a little low...

When I talked to a guy at USADA about sudafed he did not say anything
at all about how much a person could take. I think this is all a smoke
screen by Phil.

-WG

"scott patton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

No kidding! Some of these anti-doping crusaders on RBR are starting
to remind me of the crowd in Monty Python and the Holy Grail,
demanding that the witch be burned. Phil's "positive" for sudafed is
as damning as having turned crit pro into a newt, except that unlike
in the movie, crit pro hasn't gotten better.

He actually tested positive for norpseudoephedrine, which is a metabolite of
pseudoephedrine but also a stimulant in its own right.

Quoted message said:

My understanding is that they just set a level for psuedophedrine(sp).

That means you can use it, all you want, as long as you stay below the
limit.

psuedophedrine is now completely legal, but norpsuedophedrine is restricted
to 5mcg/mL in a urine sample.

Jeff

In article <[email hidden]>,

Jeff Jones jeff@cyclingnews-punt-com said:

"scott patton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

No kidding! Some of these anti-doping crusaders on RBR are starting
to remind me of the crowd in Monty Python and the Holy Grail,
demanding that the witch be burned. Phil's "positive" for sudafed is
as damning as having turned crit pro into a newt, except that unlike
in the movie, crit pro hasn't gotten better.

He actually tested positive for norpseudoephedrine, which is a metabolite of
pseudoephedrine but also a stimulant in its own right.

Quoted message said:

My understanding is that they just set a level for psuedophedrine(sp).

That means you can use it, all you want, as long as you stay below the
limit.

psuedophedrine is now completely legal, but norpsuedophedrine is restricted
to 5mcg/mL in a urine sample.

Jeff

So... my question (and I really have no idea) ... does the body turn
psuedophedrine into norpsuedophedrine?

Calling Mike Murray....

Scott

--
-*- Scott Patton
-*- Colorado Springs, CO
-*- http://www.FixedGearFever.com
-*- Track Racing Web Services

scott patton said:

My sources tell me they have seen a lot of people on the start line
taking Sudafed this year.... Funny how that works.

Just this year? Caffeine and Sudafed is pretty old skool. Cheap and
available. Won't turn any donkeys into racehorses though.

Unlike CP I can't see getting worked up over cold meds.

Bob Schwartz
[email hidden]

In article <[email hidden]>,

Bob Schwartz said:

scott patton said:

My sources tell me they have seen a lot of people on the start line
taking Sudafed this year.... Funny how that works.

Just this year? Caffeine and Sudafed is pretty old skool. Cheap and
available. Won't turn any donkeys into racehorses though.

Unlike CP I can't see getting worked up over cold meds.

Has to do with them being legalized.

One thing I read pointed out that Caffiene had it's biggest affect on
the body at LOWER doses than it did at the "legal limit". But now,
I guess you can rage all you want on caffiene...

Scott

--
-*- Scott Patton
-*- Colorado Springs, CO

Ronde Chump said:

CP,

How does Sudafed, a decongestant that USADA un-banned in 2003, equate
to doping? Catching cheaters is one thing, but testing negative the
day before that test, as well as the day after? Makes me wonder why
USADA even gave him a warning.

Before you all go off on a righteous tangent, the test detected one of the
metabolites above the allowable limit. Does anyone know how much Sudafed a
man must take to land above 5 micrograms/mL for a metabolite?

I think he mowed down a package or two.

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 16:01:08 GMT, warren <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

When I talked to a guy at USADA about sudafed he did not say anything
at all about how much a person could take. I think this is all a smoke
screen by Phil.

No, its the new USADA Judge Potter Stewart standard for drug abuse, "I
can't tell you how much, but I know it when I see it."

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

Kyle Legate said:

Before you all go off on a righteous tangent, the test detected one of the
metabolites above the allowable limit. Does anyone know how much Sudafed a
man must take to land above 5 micrograms/mL for a metabolite?

is that a lot? (yes, i'm hopeless with measurements)

don't know what any of it means, but i found this online about the process-

Pseudoephedrine is partly metabolised in the liver by n-demethylation to
norpseudoephedrine, an active metabolite. Pseudoephedrine and its
metabolite are excreted in the urine; 55% to 90% of a dose is excreted
and unchanged. The apparent total body clearance of pseudoephedrine
(c1/f) was approximately 7.5 ml/nim/kg. The elimination rate constant
(kel) was approximately 0.13 hr-1. The rate of urinary elimination is
accelerated when the urine is acidified. Conversely, as the urine pH
increases, the rate of urinary elimination is slowed.
http://emc.medicines.org.uk/emc/assets/c/html/displaydoc.asp?documentid=7093

Kyle Legate said:

Before you all go off on a righteous tangent, the test detected one of the
metabolites above the allowable limit. Does anyone know how much Sudafed a
man must take to land above 5 micrograms/mL for a metabolite?

Quoted message said:

I think he mowed down a package or two.

Just out of curiosity, what would a mown package or two actually do?
With respect to performance enhancement. I imagine it might make
your eyes bug out, but would you be significantly faster? My guess
there is that it wouldn't.

Bob Schwartz
[email hidden]

h squared said:

Kyle Legate said:

Before you all go off on a righteous tangent, the test detected one
of the metabolites above the allowable limit. Does anyone know how
much Sudafed a man must take to land above 5 micrograms/mL for a
metabolite?

is that a lot? (yes, i'm hopeless with measurements)

Based on what you wrote below, as well as specific time release data and
pseudoephedrine amount in Sudafed from the Pfizer site, here's some
calculations I scratched in the sand...

the limit of nor-pseudo... is 5 microg/ml

A man has around 5 litres of blood, so the total amount of nor-pseudo... in
his blood is 25 mg. Assuming all nor-pseudo... is in the blood, which is
asking a lot.

Sudafed Sinus and Allergy has 60 mg of pseudo... per pill. Half is released
immediately, and the other half is released over the next couple of hours.

Under the best conditions for conversion of pseudo... to nor-pseudo..., 45%,
that's 13.5 mg right away, and that assumes immediate conversion in the
liver, and not counting the excretion rate.

I guess it is possible, but he'd have to double his dose, and get pricked
soon after taking the med.

If this was a urine test, then never mind. I have no idea the size of his
bladder.

Quoted message said:

don't know what any of it means, but i found this online about the
process-

Pseudoephedrine is partly metabolised in the liver by n-demethylation
to norpseudoephedrine, an active metabolite. Pseudoephedrine and its
metabolite are excreted in the urine; 55% to 90% of a dose is excreted
and unchanged. The apparent total body clearance of pseudoephedrine
(c1/f) was approximately 7.5 ml/nim/kg. The elimination rate constant
(kel) was approximately 0.13 hr-1. The rate of urinary elimination is
accelerated when the urine is acidified. Conversely, as the urine pH
increases, the rate of urinary elimination is slowed.
http://emc.medicines.org.uk/emc/assets/c/html/displaydoc.asp?documentid=7093

scott patton said:

Quoted message said:

I don't know Phil. I don't know Crit Pro. I take Claritin D that has
the junk in there... I guess they probalby aren't testing a lot of
slow masters fatties... so I think I am safe!

It does seem to make you hyper:

http://www.papillonsartpalace.com/ANIMATED_FAT_HAPPY_LITTLE_KID_JUMPING_AROUND.gif

warren <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, scott patton

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Scott Hendricks said:

[email hidden] (Brian trdina) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...
> [email hidden] (crit pro) wrote in message
> news:<[email hidden]>...
> > I'm done with the latest piece of [censored].
> >
> >
> > Come on, I know there is someone out there seeking fame.
> >
> > crit pro
>
>
> [censored],
>
> The kid tested positive for sudafed for crissakes. Big [censored] deal.
>
> Why don't you give it a rest?

No kidding! Some of these anti-doping crusaders on RBR are starting
to remind me of the crowd in Monty Python and the Holy Grail,
demanding that the witch be burned. Phil's "positive" for sudafed is
as damning as having turned crit pro into a newt, except that unlike
in the movie, crit pro hasn't gotten better.

My understanding is that they just set a level for psuedophedrine(sp).

That means you can use it, all you want, as long as you stay below the
limit.

Now, if Phil was taking the "Normal adult dose" as listed on the package,
the limit may be a little low...

When I talked to a guy at USADA about sudafed he did not say anything
at all about how much a person could take. I think this is all a smoke
screen by Phil.

-WG

Warren,

You're starting to sound like a newt. Phil took an OTC allergy med.
It's legal, so long as the metabolites stay under a certain level.
His didn't, he presented a perfectly reasonable explanation of how it
happened, and accepted his punishment like a man.

Can you name a single, plausible scenario that would've led to Phil's
"positive", other than the one he's presented?

While we're at it, can you define the performance-enhancing quality of
the pseudoephedrine he took? Other than the obvious, 'gee, I can
breath through my nose now' benefit? I guess riding WITHOUT clogged
sinuses is a performance enhancement.

There's a good reason why pseudoephedrine isn't banned anymore... it
isn't a performance enhancer.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Scott Hendricks said:

warren <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, scott patton

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Scott Hendricks <[email hidden]> wrote:
>[email hidden] (Brian trdina) wrote in message
>news:<[email hidden]>...
>> [email hidden] (crit pro) wrote in message
>> news:<[email hidden]>...
>> > I'm done with the latest piece of [censored].
>> >
>> >
>> > Come on, I know there is someone out there seeking fame.
>> >
>> > crit pro
>>
>>
>> [censored],
>>
>> The kid tested positive for sudafed for crissakes. Big [censored] deal.
>>
>> Why don't you give it a rest?
>
>No kidding! Some of these anti-doping crusaders on RBR are starting
>to remind me of the crowd in Monty Python and the Holy Grail,
>demanding that the witch be burned. Phil's "positive" for sudafed is
>as damning as having turned crit pro into a newt, except that unlike
>in the movie, crit pro hasn't gotten better.

My understanding is that they just set a level for psuedophedrine(sp).

That means you can use it, all you want, as long as you stay below the
limit.

Now, if Phil was taking the "Normal adult dose" as listed on the package,
the limit may be a little low...

When I talked to a guy at USADA about sudafed he did not say anything
at all about how much a person could take. I think this is all a smoke
screen by Phil.

-WG

Warren,

You're starting to sound like a newt. Phil took an OTC allergy med.
It's legal, so long as the metabolites stay under a certain level.
His didn't, he presented a perfectly reasonable explanation of how it
happened, and accepted his punishment like a man.

Can you name a single, plausible scenario that would've led to Phil's
"positive", other than the one he's presented?

He took too much?

Scott

--
-*- Scott Patton
-*- Colorado Springs, CO