When is cycling "dangerous"?

"warren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

Heck, that has happened to me for free
Dave

"Dave H" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"warren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

Heck, that has happened to me for free
Dave

I did better then that when I got hit head on by that car on the wrong side
of the road, which I went flying over the top of car like superman. Didn't
get hurt, so I must be superman, without a helmet as well.

yep, we would not do it for any amount of money. We always leave home
thinking it wont happen to us. I remember one morning when the sun was
coming up over the ridges and the sky was crystal clear on one of those
mornings that only god could create. Well, things suddenly went wrong and I
was on the road getting splattered. When all done I spent a little time in
the ER and came away with only a broken collar bone, 7 broken ribs and a
punctured lung. Hellofa fun day and would not chose to do it again for any
sum of money.

"warren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

No one has yet said they would, yet bike racers pay an entry fee 20-50
times a year with the understanding that exactly this scenario could
occur except they will not get $10,000 for it. So what is the real
danger, and what causes us to draw the line in a different place for
different scenarios?

-WG

In article <[email hidden]>, Sierraman

Quoted message said:

"Dave H" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"warren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

Heck, that has happened to me for free
Dave

I did better then that when I got hit head on by that car on the wrong side
of the road, which I went flying over the top of car like superman. Didn't
get hurt, so I must be superman, without a helmet as well.

But if someone offered you the $10K in advance would you do it?

-WG

In article <[email hidden]>,

warren said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Sierraman

Quoted message said:

"Dave H" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"warren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
> discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
> that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
> avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
> enhance one's life, etc.
>
> On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
> bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
> themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
> $10,000?

Heck, that has happened to me for free
Dave

I did better then that when I got hit head on by that car on the wrong side
of the road, which I went flying over the top of car like superman. Didn't
get hurt, so I must be superman, without a helmet as well.

But if someone offered you the $10K in advance would you do it?

-WG

Hm. I'd think about it. But I've crashed at faster speeds than that (off
a motorcycle)

We're talking US dollars, right? After-tax dollars, correct?

young enough to be stupid,
--
Ryan Cousineau, [email hidden] http://www.wiredcola.com
Verus de parvis; verus de magnis.

"IMKen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

yep, we would not do it for any amount of money.

I would not do it for any amount of money. Why would anyone? Money
isn't that hard to get a hold of. And no, I'm not rich.

And yes, I think cycling is quite dangerous.

-RJ

Quoted message said:

"warren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

No one has yet said they would, yet bike racers pay an entry fee 20-50
times a year with the understanding that exactly this scenario could
occur except they will not get $10,000 for it. So what is the real
danger, and what causes us to draw the line in a different place for
different scenarios?

-WG

[censored], I'd do that for 10G in a heartbeat.

If you can get the money together, I'll do it.

If you want to tape it and sell the tape, I'm fine with that too.

Let me know.

warren <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

No one has yet said they would, yet bike racers pay an entry fee 20-50
times a year with the understanding that exactly this scenario could
occur except they will not get $10,000 for it. So what is the real
danger, and what causes us to draw the line in a different place for
different scenarios?

-WG

Bill Laudien said:

[censored], I'd do that for 10G in a heartbeat.

If you can get the money together, I'll do it.

If you want to tape it and sell the tape, I'm fine with that too.

Let me know.

Here's $5.

warren said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

No one has yet said they would, yet bike racers pay an entry fee 20-50
times a year with the understanding that exactly this scenario could
occur except they will not get $10,000 for it. So what is the real
danger, and what causes us to draw the line in a different place for
different scenarios?

-WG

Well, this "very successful bike racer in his 60s" presumably has been
around a while, though of course he may have just taken up racing.
This is one of those things that is probably stronly colored by one's
personal experience. All of us know people who've been severely injured
racing. I would say that the majority of racers who've raced
consistently for at least a few years have broken bones. Most are,
however, reasonably healthy.
No one enters racing if they think too much about crashing. If you
become to afraid of crashing, it's time to quit. I did.
So there is an element of denial in all this. Taking a chance on
something that MIGHT injure you is not the same as taking $10,000 for a
sure thing.
But I can't live here in New York City thinking about the next
terrorist threat, and folks in S.F. can't be waiting for the big one,
though we know both of these things may happen.
I guess the somewhat unsatisfactory answer is you do it because you
want to, and I'll worry about the consequences when they happen.

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

"Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

warren said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

No one has yet said they would, yet bike racers pay an entry fee 20-50
times a year with the understanding that exactly this scenario could
occur except they will not get $10,000 for it. So what is the real
danger, and what causes us to draw the line in a different place for
different scenarios?

-WG

Well, this "very successful bike racer in his 60s" presumably has been
around a while, though of course he may have just taken up racing.
This is one of those things that is probably stronly colored by one's
personal experience. All of us know people who've been severely injured
racing. I would say that the majority of racers who've raced
consistently for at least a few years have broken bones. Most are,
however, reasonably healthy.
No one enters racing if they think too much about crashing. If you
become to afraid of crashing, it's time to quit. I did.
So there is an element of denial in all this. Taking a chance on
something that MIGHT injure you is not the same as taking $10,000 for a
sure thing.
But I can't live here in New York City thinking about the next
terrorist threat, and folks in S.F. can't be waiting for the big one,
though we know both of these things may happen.
I guess the somewhat unsatisfactory answer is you do it because you
want to, and I'll worry about the consequences when they happen.

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

God numbers our days. We don't have to be stupid, but we could as easily
get creamed IN a car as BY one (or in any other kind of cycling accident).

I got creamed by a car about 20 months ago. I literally bought the farm.
Got a nifty new bike out of it and a $200,000 settlement that paid off what
I owed on my 22 acre farm. Of course, $40,000 of that went to hospital
bills, but it was still one of the best financial things that ever happened
to me. Today I can hardly run a step. I walk OK. I can ride about as well
as ever. And I'm debt free. Amen.

The Lord works in mysterious ways.

Bob C.
P.S. The doc said, if it weren't for the fabulous condition I was in from
all the riding I do, the wreck would almost certainly have killed me.

Quoted message said:

but it was still one of the best financial things that ever happened
to me. Today I can hardly run a step. I walk OK. I can ride about
as well as ever. And I'm debt free. Amen.

Yes, but the question is this. Telling us honestly, if you knew the
financial outcome in advance and you saw that car coming at you again,
would you do you level best to avoid the accident or would you just close
your eyes and wait for it to happen? I can't imagine that money is much of
a substitute if you've been put into a wheelchair.

------
Dave Casey - Realtor
www.LasVegasHomesDirect.com
[email hidden]

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS said:

warren said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

Quoted message said:

No one enters racing if they think too much about crashing. If you
become to afraid of crashing, it's time to quit. I did.
So there is an element of denial in all this. Taking a chance on
something that MIGHT injure you is not the same as taking $10,000 for a
sure thing.
But I can't live here in New York City thinking about the next
terrorist threat, and folks in S.F. can't be waiting for the big one,
though we know both of these things may happen.
I guess the somewhat unsatisfactory answer is you do it because you
want to, and I'll worry about the consequences when they happen.

IMO, bicycling on (most) roads with cars isn't dangerous, at least not
enough more dangerous than driving on roads with cars to warrant
worrying about it or stopping. It's also rather less dangerous than
obesity or poor condition induced by lack of exercise.

Bicycle racing is potentially dangerous. OTOH, the worst injury I've
seen up close was at a CX race due to a wheel that folded up on flat
ground 20 yards before the finish line - no bad cornering, no high
speed, no getting taken out by squirrels, etc. You never know.

What is really dangerous is sitting on your butt and never doing
anything (cycling, or whatever) because you are afraid something bad
might happen. IMHO. Like your point about NYC and SF.

warren said:

But if someone offered you the $10K in advance would you do it?

-WG

Hell, I know how to fall.

I'd be very tempted to give it a try, more likely to if I could put on
some elbow and knee pads.

--
--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
"We should not march into Baghdad. ... Assigning young soldiers to
a fruitless hunt for a securely entrenched dictator and condemning
them to fight in what would be an unwinnable urban guerilla war, it
could only plunge that part of the world into ever greater
instability." George Bush Sr. in his 1998 book "A World Transformed"

"Dave Casey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

but it was still one of the best financial things that ever happened
to me. Today I can hardly run a step. I walk OK. I can ride about
as well as ever. And I'm debt free. Amen.

Yes, but the question is this. Telling us honestly, if you knew the
financial outcome in advance and you saw that car coming at you again,
would you do you level best to avoid the accident or would you just close
your eyes and wait for it to happen? I can't imagine that money is much

of

Quoted message said:

a substitute if you've been put into a wheelchair.

------
Dave Casey - Realtor
www.LasVegasHomesDirect.com
[email hidden]

Dave,

No way I'd take the money up front to repeat that stunt. It all worked out
nicely in the end, but it was no fun at all, getting there. Lots of pain
and suffering. There aren't words to describe what it was like riding in
that ambulance strapped to a hard wooden board and absorbing every little
bump in the road with a broken back, hip, pelvis and ankle. And that was
just a warmup for the ER experience.

Bob C.

"Benjamin Weiner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS said:

warren said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell

him

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

Quoted message said:

No one enters racing if they think too much about crashing. If you
become to afraid of crashing, it's time to quit. I did.
So there is an element of denial in all this. Taking a chance on
something that MIGHT injure you is not the same as taking $10,000 for a
sure thing.
But I can't live here in New York City thinking about the next
terrorist threat, and folks in S.F. can't be waiting for the big one,
though we know both of these things may happen.
I guess the somewhat unsatisfactory answer is you do it because you
want to, and I'll worry about the consequences when they happen.

IMO, bicycling on (most) roads with cars isn't dangerous, at least not
enough more dangerous than driving on roads with cars to warrant
worrying about it or stopping. It's also rather less dangerous than
obesity or poor condition induced by lack of exercise.

Bicycle racing is potentially dangerous. OTOH, the worst injury I've
seen up close was at a CX race due to a wheel that folded up on flat
ground 20 yards before the finish line - no bad cornering, no high
speed, no getting taken out by squirrels, etc. You never know.

What is really dangerous is sitting on your butt and never doing
anything (cycling, or whatever) because you are afraid something bad
might happen. IMHO. Like your point about NYC and SF.

I couldn't agree more!

Bob C.

$10,000 to pull an Abdu?
How is this related to the "Is cycling 'dangerous'? subject line.
One thing I'm NOT worried about when I ride is that I'm going to
DELIBERATELY crash. If I was inclined to do that, ANY activity would be
dangerous.
Diving: $10K to do a cutaway INTO the platform.
Running: $10K to do a face plant into the sidewalk.
NASCAR: $10K to hit the wall at 200+mph
Cooking: $10K to plunge my hand into a boiling pot, grab a scalding cookie
tray...........................??????????????
Most of us ride with the intent of avoiding injury, avoiding dangerous
roads, always alert to avoid trouble, even while sprinting.
When I race I don't pay the entry fee to be injured, but if I do crash and
need it, I will get whatever money I need to cover my injuries. It's called
health insurance, and like most insurance, the premiums I pay are based on
the supposition that I have a vested interest in AVOIDING the pain and
suffering of injury.
AND..........IF I DID have $10K to spend for purely cosmetic improvements,
since I am an active cyclist, a new bike would improve my looks a lot more
than a face lift, or tummy tuck or liposuction.

warren <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

A very successful bike racer in his 60's said this to me today as we
discussed the relative dangers of cycling. Some of his friends tell him
that cycling is dangerous, training on roads with cars should be
avoided, as is having optional, but potentially dangerous surgery to
enhance one's life, etc.

On occasion he asks a person how they would feel about getting on a
bike, doing an all out sprint to say, 35mph, and then throwing
themselves over the bars and onto the ground, and would they do it for
$10,000?

No one has yet said they would, yet bike racers pay an entry fee 20-50
times a year with the understanding that exactly this scenario could
occur except they will not get $10,000 for it. So what is the real
danger, and what causes us to draw the line in a different place for
different scenarios?

-WG

ojo said:

$10,000 to pull an Abdu?
How is this related to the "Is cycling 'dangerous'? subject line.
One thing I'm NOT worried about when I ride is that I'm going to
DELIBERATELY crash. If I was inclined to do that, ANY activity would be
dangerous.

I though rbr had already concluded that deliberately crashing was a good
way to increase your adrenaline count and thereby go on to win your race.