wheels without wheels...so to speak

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 19:44:10 GMT, "Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO
REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I have a chance to get an old bike, nice frame, which I'm pretty sure has
27" wheels (it's from the 1970s), Now some 27" tyres still seem to be
available (correct?), but I'm wondering if I will be able, in time, to fit
700c wheels. I guess it's a quesiton of frame clearances... views?

Yes, and yes. Probably :-) I think 700c is smaller.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

Ah .. I thought 700c was bigger (700mm = 27.55"😉 .. but then I'm not sure
how the diameters are calculated.

ta
NJ

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 19:44:10 GMT, "Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO
REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I have a chance to get an old bike, nice frame, which I'm pretty sure has
27" wheels (it's from the 1970s), Now some 27" tyres still seem to be
available (correct?), but I'm wondering if I will be able, in time, to

fit

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

700c wheels. I guess it's a quesiton of frame clearances... views?

Yes, and yes. Probably :-) I think 700c is smaller.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 20:02:52 GMT, "Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO
REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I thought 700c was bigger (700mm = 27.55"😉 .. but then I'm not sure
how the diameters are calculated.

Me neither. My old tourer was 27" and is now 700c, but I'm stuffed if
I can remember the difference & I gave away the old wheels.

700c is not 700mm thobut.

AASHTA: 27" is ISO 630, 700c is ISO 622.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire_sizing.html

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]>typed

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 19:44:10 GMT, "Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO
REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I have a chance to get an old bike, nice frame, which I'm pretty sure has
27" wheels (it's from the 1970s), Now some 27" tyres still seem to be
available (correct?), but I'm wondering if I will be able, in time, to fit
700c wheels. I guess it's a quesiton of frame clearances... views?

Quoted message said:

Yes, and yes. Probably :-) I think 700c is smaller.

Quoted message said:

Guy

700c are smaller (wheel diameter 622mm) than 27" (diameter 630mm). This
may cause trouble with brakes.

--
Helen D. Vecht: [email hidden]
Edgware.

I've just had another look thru Google groups, and found a few old posts,
that generally seem to be positive (it can be done) but with some
reservations. I'd still welcome views, and an authoritative line on the
relative sizings ...

NJ

"Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ah .. I thought 700c was bigger (700mm = 27.55"😉 .. but then I'm not sure
how the diameters are calculated.

ta
NJ

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 19:44:10 GMT, "Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO
REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I have a chance to get an old bike, nice frame, which I'm pretty sure

has

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

27" wheels (it's from the 1970s), Now some 27" tyres still seem to be
available (correct?), but I'm wondering if I will be able, in time, to

fit

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

700c wheels. I guess it's a quesiton of frame clearances... views?

Yes, and yes. Probably :-) I think 700c is smaller.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington

University

Quoted message said:

Thanks Guy - great site.

Nj

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 20:02:52 GMT, "Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO
REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I thought 700c was bigger (700mm = 27.55"😉 .. but then I'm not sure
how the diameters are calculated.

Me neither. My old tourer was 27" and is now 700c, but I'm stuffed if
I can remember the difference & I gave away the old wheels.

700c is not 700mm thobut.

AASHTA: 27" is ISO 630, 700c is ISO 622.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire_sizing.html

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]>typed

Quoted message said:

700c is not 700mm thobut.

Unless shod with beefy 39mm tyres ;-)

Quoted message said:

AASHTA: 27" is ISO 630, 700c is ISO 622.

Quoted message said:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire_sizing.html

Quoted message said:

Guy

--
Helen D. Vecht: [email hidden]
Edgware.

Helen Deborah Vecht said:

700c are smaller (wheel diameter 622mm) than 27" (diameter 630mm). This
may cause trouble with brakes.

As Helen says, the 700's are smaller, so they'll definitely fit in the
frame. You'll find though that the spacing of the rear dropouts will
need opening, as modern hubs are wider. This isn't a problem, the
difference is only a few mm each side and you can do it yourself, or
give it to your LBS. It's a small job.

The other issue you'll have, again as Helen mentions, is the brakes.
Because the new wheels will have a smaller diameter the rim sits
further away from the brake fixing point. Generally there will not be
enough adjustment available to remedy it with existing brakes. Still
no biggie though, new brakes or a drop bracket will solve this hiccup.

There are plenty of us in u.r.c who run old frames with new wheels and
drivetrains, when you get round to doing the job just give a shout and
there will be plenty of advice available..

In the meantime, if you want to read up about re-spacing your frame
and the other issues involved then, as always, Sheldon is your man.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html
--

"Bob"

'The people have spoken, the [censored]'

Email address is spam trapped.
To reply directly remove the beverage.

Thanks all. If I get the bike, I'll no doubt be back in touch!

best
NJ

"Call me Bob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Helen Deborah Vecht said:

700c are smaller (wheel diameter 622mm) than 27" (diameter 630mm). This
may cause trouble with brakes.

As Helen says, the 700's are smaller, so they'll definitely fit in the
frame. You'll find though that the spacing of the rear dropouts will
need opening, as modern hubs are wider. This isn't a problem, the
difference is only a few mm each side and you can do it yourself, or
give it to your LBS. It's a small job.

The other issue you'll have, again as Helen mentions, is the brakes.
Because the new wheels will have a smaller diameter the rim sits
further away from the brake fixing point. Generally there will not be
enough adjustment available to remedy it with existing brakes. Still
no biggie though, new brakes or a drop bracket will solve this hiccup.

There are plenty of us in u.r.c who run old frames with new wheels and
drivetrains, when you get round to doing the job just give a shout and
there will be plenty of advice available..

In the meantime, if you want to read up about re-spacing your frame
and the other issues involved then, as always, Sheldon is your man.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html
--

"Bob"

'The people have spoken, the [censored]'

Email address is spam trapped.
To reply directly remove the beverage.

in message <[email hidden]>, Just zis Guy,

you know? (') said:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 19:44:10 GMT, "Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO
REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I have a chance to get an old bike, nice frame, which I'm pretty sure
has 27" wheels (it's from the 1970s), Now some 27" tyres still seem to
be available (correct?), but I'm wondering if I will be able, in time,
to fit 700c wheels. I guess it's a quesiton of frame clearances...
views?

Yes, and yes. Probably :-) I think 700c is smaller.

It is, yes. About 4mm on radius, so with long drop brake calipers you
can get away with it. A bigger problem is that modern wheels are wider
(longer axle) than older ones. As Always, Sheldon Has The Answer:
<URL:http://www.sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html>

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
Iraq war: it's time for regime change...
... go now, Tony, while you can still go with dignity.
[update 18 months after this .sig was written: it's still relevant]

Nick said:

I have a chance to get an old bike, nice frame, which I'm pretty sure
has 27" wheels (it's from the 1970s),

Don't let that put you off....

Quoted message said:

Now some 27" tyres still seem to be available (correct?)

There are some, yes.

Quoted message said:

but I'm wondering if I will be able, in
time, to fit 700c wheels. I guess it's a quesiton of frame
clearances... views?

Brakes will be the only practical issue (apart from hub), the blocks will
need lowering by 4mm, or brake caliper(s) replaced if that's not possible.

I converted my old tourer to 700c and am happy with the results, except
it's as heavy as a tank. First time on the lightweight racer for me
tonight, though, after a couple of weeks of riding only the tank. Didn't
just feel like a different bike, it was like a whole different form of
transport! It just went... fast and easy! Bloody amazing difference.
Astonishing (and astonishing how quickly I forget what the bike feels
like). And a lot of that is down to weight, I'm sure. Sorry, I'm
drifting way off topic now. Or am I? Yes, not all old bikes are heavy.

~PB

"Pete Biggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I converted my old tourer to 700c and am happy with the results, except
it's as heavy as a tank. First time on the lightweight racer for me
tonight, though, after a couple of weeks of riding only the tank. Didn't
just feel like a different bike, it was like a whole different form of
transport!

I sense a valuable marketing tool for enterprising bike manufacturers:
'Don't let traffic scare you off your bicycle. Buy the Tank.'

Sam
---
http://www.freewheelingforum.com/index.php
http://www.prettygoodbritain.com

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 19:44:10 GMT, "Nick" <nickandoscar@REMOVE THIS TO
REPLYtiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I have a chance to get an old bike, nice frame, which I'm pretty sure has
27" wheels (it's from the 1970s), Now some 27" tyres still seem to be
available (correct?), but I'm wondering if I will be able, in time, to fit
700c wheels. I guess it's a quesiton of frame clearances... views?

Yes, and yes. Probably :-) I think 700c is smaller.

You're right, Guy - 700c wheels ought to fit a frame made for 27"
ones, as the latter are indeed smaller. But the OP will have to ensure
that there's enough drop in the brakes for the blocks to make
sufficient contact with the new rims.

David E. Belcher

Thanks for the info guy(s).

From R4 this am: 'two goldfish in a tank. One says to the other "I thought
you knew how to drive this thing..."'.

Boom, and again, boom.

Nick

"Sam" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Pete Biggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I converted my old tourer to 700c and am happy with the results, except
it's as heavy as a tank. First time on the lightweight racer for me
tonight, though, after a couple of weeks of riding only the tank.

Didn't

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

just feel like a different bike, it was like a whole different form of
transport!

I sense a valuable marketing tool for enterprising bike manufacturers:
'Don't let traffic scare you off your bicycle. Buy the Tank.'

Sam
---
http://www.freewheelingforum.com/index.php
http://www.prettygoodbritain.com

Nick said:

Old question, I'm sure (and yes, I've looked at Google) but ...

I have a chance to get an old bike, nice frame, which I'm pretty sure has
27" wheels (it's from the 1970s), Now some 27" tyres still seem to be
available (correct?), but I'm wondering if I will be able, in time, to fit
700c wheels. I guess it's a quesiton of frame clearances... views?

The brakes are the problem. They may not reach the smaller 700c rims,
which means more expense finding deep-drop brakes which won't work as
well anyway. If the bike has cantilever brakes it's more elegant to
have the pivots moved.

27" tyres are fairly easy; 27" rims are getting rare but still
available. Ask your local bike shop to have a look in their storeroom -
they might be glad to see the back of them. SJSC sell a range of 27"
rims at the usual sell-your-granny prices.

Sam said:

I sense a valuable marketing tool for enterprising bike manufacturers:
'Don't let traffic scare you off your bicycle. Buy the Tank.'

Yes! Let's have an arms race in bike weights, like there currently is
cars. I wouldn't let my kids ride to school on anything less than a
60lb roadster, and you are a Bad Parent if you give them anything less ;-)

Zog The Undeniable said:

The brakes are the problem. They may not reach the smaller 700c rims,
which means more expense finding deep-drop brakes which won't work as
well anyway.

Won't work /quite/ as well as regular brakes of the same model, but
deep-drop dual-pivot calipers can work better than old centre-pull or
naff-type side-pull brakes, for example. My front Alhonga DD DP is
marvelous.

Quoted message said:

If the bike has cantilever brakes it's more elegant to
have the pivots moved.

Or calipers can be fitted if the frame & forks have suitable mounting
holes (perhaps currently just used for reflectors). Doesn't look elegant
but works.

~PB