What is on those TdF bikes?

"Stan Lipnowski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Watching the TF on OLN, it seemed that many bikes had a yellow rectangular
object hanging off the non drive side chain stay.It seemed to be in

various

Quoted message said:

positions that did not make it seem to be a cadence sensor.
Ideas?
Stan

Micro chips for tracking the bikes?

The yellow ones are EPO, the red ones are EGH ;-)

Sorry,

Bow

"Stan Lipnowski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Watching the TF on OLN, it seemed that many bikes had a yellow rectangular
object hanging off the non drive side chain stay.It seemed to be in

various

Quoted message said:

positions that did not make it seem to be a cadence sensor.
Ideas?
Stan

Stan Lipnowski said:

Watching the TF on OLN, it seemed that many bikes had a yellow rectangular
object hanging off the non drive side chain stay.It seemed to be in various
positions that did not make it seem to be a cadence sensor.
Ideas?
Stan

A scoring transponder.

These guys make them for all kinds of racing, even radio control!

<http://www.amb-it.com/>

Now they've entered the T de F.

Barry

"Dave Thompson" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Micro chips for tracking the bikes?

Yes, Micro chips used to registerer the bikes as they pass the finishing
line - giving not only the time but also the exact placement. That's what
we were told on tv here in Denmark.
Ivar

Stan Lipnowski said:

Watching the TF on OLN, it seemed that many bikes had a yellow
rectangular object hanging off the non drive side chain stay.It seemed
to be in various positions that did not make it seem to be a cadence
sensor. Ideas? Stan

AMB IT. Identification and Timing system.

see:

< http://www.amb-it.com/marketing/AMB_Activ.pdf>

I wondered what happens when the need to switch bicycles mid stage,,,...
as happens upon occasion.

--

"Stan Lipnowski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news

Quoted message said:

Watching the TF on OLN, it seemed that many bikes had a yellow rectangular
object hanging off the non drive side chain stay.It seemed to be in various
positions that did not make it seem to be a cadence sensor.
Ideas?
Stan

GPS / heartrate sender unit?

ST

"daveornee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Stan Lipnowski said:

Watching the TF on OLN, it seemed that many bikes had a yellow
rectangular object hanging off the non drive side chain stay.It seemed
to be in various positions that did not make it seem to be a cadence
sensor. Ideas? Stan

AMB IT. Identification and Timing system.

see:

< http://www.amb-it.com/marketing/AMB_Activ.pdf>

I wondered what happens when the need to switch bicycles mid stage,,,...
as happens upon occasion.

They could supply RFID tags for all the team's bicycles including the backup
ones. The new tag should still register when it crosses the finish line.
After the fact, they must have some manual process to associate the new tag
with a particular rider. It would be easier if the riders could just wear
the tag like runners do.

rosco' reverse-the-following'ocsor_g said:

They could supply RFID tags for all the team's bicycles including the
backup ones. The new tag should still register when it crosses the
finish line. After the fact, they must have some manual process to
associate the new tag with a particular rider. It would be easier if
the riders could just wear the tag like runners do.

The feedback loop on the road is 1.2m past the finish line, the transponder
it 1.2m behind the front of the front wheel. Attaching the transponder to
the rider would be less accurate since the placings and timings are taken
on the bike not the rider

Ivar Hesselager said:

"Dave Thompson" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Micro chips for tracking the bikes?

Yes, Micro chips used to registerer the bikes as they pass the
finishing line - giving not only the time but also the exact
placement. That's what we were told on tv here in Denmark.

Well, that seems the plausible explanation, except for the fact that
finishing order is determined by the frontmost part of the bike to
cross the line (the leading edge of the front wheel), and these tags
are rather haphazardly located on the chainstay.

MSeries said:

rosco' reverse-the-following'ocsor_g said:

They could supply RFID tags for all the team's bicycles including
the backup ones. The new tag should still register when it crosses
the finish line. After the fact, they must have some manual process
to associate the new tag with a particular rider. It would be
easier if the riders could just wear the tag like runners do.

The feedback loop on the road is 1.2m past the finish line, the
transponder it 1.2m behind the front of the front wheel. Attaching
the transponder to the rider would be less accurate since the
placings and timings are taken on the bike not the rider

Yes, but the leading edge of the front wheel, not some spot on the
rear triangle.

MSeries said:

rosco' reverse-the-following'ocsor_g said:

They could supply RFID tags for all the team's bicycles including the
backup ones. The new tag should still register when it crosses the
finish line. After the fact, they must have some manual process to
associate the new tag with a particular rider. It would be easier if
the riders could just wear the tag like runners do.

The feedback loop on the road is 1.2m past the finish line, the transponder
it 1.2m behind the front of the front wheel.

? I presume you mean the sensor on the road is 1.2 m before the finish
line so that the transponder on the bike would be over it just when the
front wheel reaches the line.

Quoted message said:

Attaching the transponder to
the rider would be less accurate since the placings and timings are taken
on the bike not the rider.

I wore one on a recent triathlon and they are very annoying after an hour or
so. It was velcro'd around my ankle and had a bit of neoprene between it
and my skin. If that tried to get onto the tour it wouldn't last long. I
imagine pro cyclists can be as bad as spoilt actresses at times.

"rosco" <reverse-the-following"ocsor_g"@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"daveornee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Stan Lipnowski said:

Watching the TF on OLN, it seemed that many bikes had a yellow
rectangular object hanging off the non drive side chain stay.It

seemed

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to be in various positions that did not make it seem to be a cadence
sensor. Ideas? Stan

AMB IT. Identification and Timing system.

see:

< http://www.amb-it.com/marketing/AMB_Activ.pdf>

I wondered what happens when the need to switch bicycles mid stage,,,...
as happens upon occasion.

They could supply RFID tags for all the team's bicycles including the

backup

Quoted message said:

ones. The new tag should still register when it crosses the finish line.
After the fact, they must have some manual process to associate the new

tag

Quoted message said:

with a particular rider. It would be easier if the riders could just wear
the tag like runners do.

The tags aren't used for determining finishing order, as their time
resolution isn't good enough. They just record which riders finished in
which bunch. Photofinish camera are still used to determine placings.

Nick

"Tim McNamara" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ivar Hesselager said:

"Dave Thompson" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

> Micro chips for tracking the bikes?

Yes, Micro chips used to registerer the bikes as they pass the
finishing line - giving not only the time but also the exact
placement. That's what we were told on tv here in Denmark.

Well, that seems the plausible explanation, except for the fact that
finishing order is determined by the frontmost part of the bike to
cross the line (the leading edge of the front wheel), and these tags
are rather haphazardly located on the chainstay.

"LAN Support" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| The tags aren't used for determining finishing order, as their time
| resolution isn't good enough. They just record which riders finished in
| which bunch. Photofinish camera are still used to determine placings.
|
| Nick

Chip timing resolution is .01 second for running/ skating races; probably
greater if needed.
ED3

Edward Dike said:

"LAN Support" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| The tags aren't used for determining finishing order, as their time
| resolution isn't good enough. They just record which riders finished in
| which bunch. Photofinish camera are still used to determine placings.

Quoted message said:

Chip timing resolution is .01 second for running/ skating races; probably
greater if needed.

At 40mph / 65 km/h .01 seconds is only good down to a resolution of
0.18m (or a little over 6"😉. There can be several bikes squeezed into
that space. They'll be keeping the cameras for a while it appears.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $695 ti frame

On Tue, 06 Jul 2004 21:44:33 -0700, Mark Hickey <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Edward Dike said:

"LAN Support" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| The tags aren't used for determining finishing order, as their time
| resolution isn't good enough. They just record which riders finished in
| which bunch. Photofinish camera are still used to determine placings.

Quoted message said:

Chip timing resolution is .01 second for running/ skating races; probably
greater if needed.

At 40mph / 65 km/h .01 seconds is only good down to a resolution of
0.18m (or a little over 6"😉. There can be several bikes squeezed into
that space. They'll be keeping the cameras for a while it appears.

And since the rules apparently state that the finish order is (as
mentioned elsewhere) determined by the first part of the bike to cross
the plane of the finish line, and given the impossibility of putting
the chip at that point without something sticking forward to mount it,
I don't think the chips will be used for time and finish order without
a rules change.

They allow a much better job of documenting interim positions and
groupings than can be achieved by people keeping track manually,
though.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Surrealism is a pectinated ranzel.

Tim McNamara said:

Well, that seems the plausible explanation, except for the fact that
finishing order is determined by the frontmost part of the bike to
cross the line (the leading edge of the front wheel), and these tags
are rather haphazardly located on the chainstay.

It's not plausible, it's true. <G>

The system manufacturer has an article about the usage on it's web
site. As someone else mentioned, photo finishes are used for judging
extremely close finishes. Even the auto racing bodies that use them
run video at the finish line.

These systems are terrific for general race data, and a real time
ordering of the field and margin data that can be easily fed to the
press and scoreboards.

Barry

"Mark Hickey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| "Edward Dike, III" <edd(2+1)[email hidden]> wrote:
|
| >
| >"LAN Support" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| >news:[email hidden]...
| >| The tags aren't used for determining finishing order, as their time
| >| resolution isn't good enough. They just record which riders finished in
| >| which bunch. Photofinish camera are still used to determine placings.
|
| >Chip timing resolution is .01 second for running/ skating races; probably
| >greater if needed.
|
| At 40mph / 65 km/h .01 seconds is only good down to a resolution of
| 0.18m (or a little over 6"😉. There can be several bikes squeezed into
| that space. They'll be keeping the cameras for a while it appears.
|
| Mark Hickey
| Habanero Cycles
| http://www.habcycles.com
| Home of the $695 ti frame

Given the unparalleled stakes of the TdF, and reliability issues with chip
timing in general- occasional missed scans at starts/ finishes, that's a
good thing.

Whoa to the poor soul who trips on the extension cord and unplugs it at the
wrong moment.

I suspect the resolution is mostly a function of the spreadsheets used to
record data. I have no idea what it takes to overwhelm a chip timing
system, but high speed film allows for the input of human judgments, and
verification by almost anyone viewing the results, which certainly adds to
the credibility of the results.

ED3

Tim McNamara <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Ivar Hesselager said:

"Dave Thompson" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

> Micro chips for tracking the bikes?

Yes, Micro chips used to registerer the bikes as they pass the
finishing line - giving not only the time but also the exact
placement. That's what we were told on tv here in Denmark.

Well, that seems the plausible explanation, except for the fact that
finishing order is determined by the frontmost part of the bike to
cross the line (the leading edge of the front wheel), and these tags
are rather haphazardly located on the chainstay.

They are transponders. They are set a certain distance from the front
of the bike, the sensor loop across the road is the same distance from
the finish line so that transponder-at-loop = front-wheel-at line.

This year it is only experimental, the official positions and timings
are done by more traditional (photographic) methods.

Andrew Webster