What Do you Do in lightning Storm

Bagger said:

The death of a hillwalker caused by lightning hitting
his walking

pole

Quoted message said:

does beg the question about what to do if caught out
on a hill

during

Quoted message said:

a storm. Do you throw the poles away or do you risk it and
carry on. Can't say there is an easy answer.

my hillwalking blog is at
bagger.typepad.comindexOpen ↗

Put the poles down and walk 30-50 feet away and crouch
down, wait till the storm passes well over, retrieve the
poles and carry on.

I did this one time fishing my local loch. I could see the
storm moving in so put the rod down and moved back from it.
I got some querying looks from the anglers near me so I said
" If you think I'm standing here waving 10' of carbon fibre
about in lightning you are sadly mistaken". It was like a
Mexican wave right round the loch as the penny dropped 🙂

You might not stop being hit, but you can limit the
possibility.

--
Don`t Worry, Be Happy

Sandy
--

E-Mail:- [email hidden] Website:-
ftscotland.co.ukftscotland.co.ukOpen ↗ IRC:- Sandyb in #rabble
uk3.arcnet.vapor.com Port:6667 #Rabble Channel Website:-
rabble.ftscotland.co.ukrabble.ftscotland.co.ukOpen ↗
ICQ : 41266150

"Bagger" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

The death of a hillwalker caused by lightning hitting his
walking pole does beg the question about what to do if
caught out on a hill during a storm. Do you throw the
poles away or do you risk it and carry on. Can't say there
is an easy answer.

The Mountain Craft and Leadership book by Eric Langmuir that
they used to get you to read for Mountain Leader Training
has a section on it.

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

The death of a hillwalker caused by lightning hitting his
walking pole does beg the question about what to do if
caught out on a hill during a storm.

Run like heck?
--
Fran If you need my email address please ask.

"Bagger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

The death of a hillwalker caused by lightning hitting his
walking pole does beg the question about what to do if
caught out on a hill during a storm. Do you throw the
poles away or do you risk it and carry on. Can't say there
is an easy answer.

my hillwalking blog is at
bagger.typepad.comindexOpen ↗

See topic "Climber killed by lightning bolt". I know it's a
long shot but it just might help. You must have seen it -
you posted.

KRO

Paul Saunders <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Sandy Birrell said:

science.nasa.govessd18jun9Open ↗
9_1.htm

"Other lightning victims had been holding metal objects
such as golf clubs, fishing rods, hay forks, or
umbrellas. But even those not holding metal objects are
as likely to be struck by lightning as a bronze statue of
the same size."

If I was a bronze statue I would consider that an
acceptable risk. ;-)
--
Gordon

Paul Saunders <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

You wrote "More in the press about Monday's tragic accident
when a hillwalker was killed by lightning. According to a
report in the DailyRecord the lightning hit his aluminium
walking pole."

The article that Sandy linked to said that most lightning
strikes hit the head and that the main damage occurs at the
exit and entry points,
i.e. the head and the feet. If lightning struck a pole that
you were carrying then surely the exit and entry
points would be the hands and feet? Would you not
stand a slightly better chance of survival in that
instance? I'd prefer the walking pole to be hit than
my head.

Since my walking poles are most frequently attached to my
rucksack I am considering whether they are worth carrying at
all during any likelihood of an electrical storm.
--
Gordon

In article <[email hidden]>, Paul
Saunders <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Sandy Birrell said:

science.nasa.govessd18jun9Open ↗
9_1.htm

"Other lightning victims had been holding metal objects
such as golf clubs, fishing rods, hay forks, or
umbrellas. But even those not holding metal objects are
as likely to be struck by lightning as a bronze statue of
the same size."

Paul
--
wilderness-wales.co.ukwilderness-wales.co.ukOpen ↗
wildwales.fsnet.co.ukwildwales.fsnet.co.ukOpen ↗
photosig.comuserphotosOpen ↗

There was that programme recently about lightning strikes
where a girl in the USA was on a boat and was struck by
lightning - 15 k from the centre of the storm! Lightning
can travel!
--
Bill Grey billboy.co.ukbillboy.co.ukOpen ↗

In article
<[email hidden]>, Phil Cook
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Put the poles down and walk 30-50 feet away and crouch
down, wait till the storm passes well over, retrieve the
poles and carry on.

I did that on the first occasion. I walked downhill a
little way and put the poles and axe on the ground and sat
on my rucksack and waited. After the storm seemed to have
passed I set off again. There was then a second storm and I
hightailed it off the mountain as I was in a more exposed
position. Too damn scary.

Reminiscing I recall a survey near Abernant Colliery (for
Paul's information) I was on the hill to the NE of the
colliery lining out using aluminium ranging rods. A
thunderstorm developed and I did not like it one little bit.
It was a case of to Hell with the rods - let's get out of
here. I was expecting to see puddles of molten aluminium the
following day, but the rods were safe.

I wasn't going to hang around there in a storm - no way!
--
Bill Grey billboy.co.ukbillboy.co.ukOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Put the poles down and walk 30-50 feet away and crouch
down, wait till the storm passes well over, retrieve the
poles and carry on.

Try to be on lower ground as possible, away from trees,
remove spectacles and other metal objects, I remember a 999
program had a story about a golfer had his glasses struck by
lightning.

Sandy Birrell said:

Bagger said:

The death of a hillwalker caused by lightning hitting his
walking

pole

Quoted message said:

does beg the question about what to do if caught out
on a hill

during

Quoted message said:

a storm. Do you throw the poles away or do you risk it
and carry on. Can't say there is an easy answer.

my hillwalking blog is at
bagger.typepad.comindexOpen ↗

Put the poles down and walk 30-50 feet away and crouch
down, wait till the storm passes well over, retrieve the
poles and carry on.

I did that on the first occasion. I walked downhill a little
way and put the poles and axe on the ground and sat on my
rucksack and waited. After the storm seemed to have passed I
set off again. There was then a second storm and I
hightailed it off the mountain as I was in a more exposed
position. Too damn scary.
--
Phil Cook looking north over the park to the
"Westminster Gasworks"
95/284 5/219 c.100/300 (>900m with drop>100m )

* Knowlege is powder <noyouc@ant> deigned to grace
uk.rec.walking
* with their presence by declaiming:

Quoted message said:

Try to be on lower ground as possible, away from trees,
remove spectacles

Yeah - and then fall into a loch or off a cliff 8^/

Regards: Jim Ford

Thanks for the advice - interesting to hear first hand accounts.
I dug out an old copy of Eric Langmuirs Mountaincraft and leadership
and there's an interesting section on lightning storms there. Its
worth a look if you have the book. I've paraphrased his main points on
my Blog at bagger.typepad.comindexOpen ↗

Phil Cook <[email hidden]>
wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Sandy Birrell said:

Bagger said:

The death of a hillwalker caused by lightning hitting
his walking

pole

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

does beg the question about what to do if caught out on
a hill

during

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

a storm. Do you throw the poles away or do you risk it
and carry on. Can't say there is an easy answer.

my hillwalking blog is at
bagger.typepad.comindexOpen ↗

Put the poles down and walk 30-50 feet away and crouch
down, wait till the storm passes well over, retrieve the
poles and carry on.

I did that on the first occasion. I walked downhill a
little way and put the poles and axe on the ground and sat
on my rucksack and waited. After the storm seemed to have
passed I set off again. There was then a second storm and
I hightailed it off the mountain as I was in a more
exposed position. Too damn scary.

Jim Ford said:

* Knowlege is powder <noyouc@ant> deigned to grace
uk.rec.walking
* with their presence by declaiming:

Quoted message said:

Try to be on lower ground as possible, away from trees,
remove spectacles

Yeah - and then fall into a loch or off a cliff 8^/

Regards: Jim Ford

science.nasa.govessd18jun99 1.htmOpen ↗

--
Don`t Worry, Be Happy

Sandy
--

E-Mail:- [email hidden] Website:-
ftscotland.co.ukftscotland.co.ukOpen ↗ IRC:- Sandyb in #rabble
uk3.arcnet.vapor.com Port:6667 #Rabble Channel Website:-
rabble.ftscotland.co.ukrabble.ftscotland.co.ukOpen ↗
ICQ : 41266150

Bagger said:

I dug out an old copy of Eric Langmuirs Mountaincraft and
leadership and there's an interesting section on
lightning storms there. Its worth a look if you have the
book. I've paraphrased his main points on my Blog at
bagger.typepad.comindexOpen ↗

You wrote "More in the press about Monday's tragic accident
when a hillwalker was killed by lightning. According to a
report in the DailyRecord the lightning hit his aluminium
walking pole."

The article that Sandy linked to said that most lightning
strikes hit the head and that the main damage occurs at the
exit and entry points,
i.e. the head and the feet. If lightning struck a pole that
you were carrying then surely the exit and entry points
would be the hands and feet? Would you not stand a
slightly better chance of survival in that instance?
I'd prefer the walking pole to be hit than my head.

You also pointed out that Langmuir "does not recommend
discarding equipment".

The "frequency of strokes" diagram in the book is
interesting. There's a much greater concentration of strikes
on the very steep slope/cliff adjacent to the summit than on
the slightly steeper slope/cliff dropping away from the
lower edge of the summit plateau.

The "safe zone" extends an equal distance horizontally from
the base of the cliff as the height of the cliff, but *not*
within 3m of the base of the cliff.

Taking Fan Brycheiniog as an example, the safe zone would be
within 200m of the base of the cliff. so my favoured camp
site at the NW corner of the lake (site of the last
expedition) seems to be within that safe zone.

Paul
--
wilderness-wales.co.ukwilderness-wales.co.ukOpen ↗
wildwales.fsnet.co.ukwildwales.fsnet.co.ukOpen ↗
photosig.comuserphotosOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

I dug out an old copy of Eric Langmuirs Mountaincraft and leadership
and there's an interesting section on lightning storms there. Its
worth a look if you have the book. I've paraphrased his main points on
my Blog at bagger.typepad.comindexOpen ↗

And here's another good resource:
www.nols.edu/resources/research/pdfs/
lightningsafetyguideline.pdf

Seán

"Sandy Birrell" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:PbMoc.2670
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Jim Ford said:

* Knowlege is powder <noyouc@ant> deigned to grace
uk.rec.walking
* with their presence by declaiming:

Quoted message said:

Try to be on lower ground as possible, away from trees,
remove spectacles

Yeah - and then fall into a loch or off a cliff 8^/

Regards: Jim Ford

If you keep some metal through that bit then definitely
remove it (the metal, that is) when there's lightning about.

Quoted message said:

science.nasa.govessd18junOpen ↗
99_1.htm

Oh right. That explains things differently ;-)

--
Adrian

Sandy Birrell said:

science.nasa.govessd18junOpen ↗
99_1.htm

"Other lightning victims had been holding metal objects such
as golf clubs, fishing rods, hay forks, or umbrellas. But
even those not holding metal objects are as likely to be
struck by lightning as a bronze statue of the same size."

Paul
--
wilderness-wales.co.ukwilderness-wales.co.ukOpen ↗
wildwales.fsnet.co.ukwildwales.fsnet.co.ukOpen ↗
photosig.comuserphotosOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

The article that Sandy linked to said that most lightning
strikes hit the head and that the main damage occurs at
the exit and entry points,
i.e. the head and the feet. If lightning struck a pole
that you were carrying then surely the exit and entry
points would be the hands and feet? Would you not
stand a slightly better chance of survival in that
instance? I'd prefer the walking pole to be hit than
my head.

I'm definitely no expert on this subject, and I haven't
looked into it, but surely the simple fact that a bolt of
lightning has passed through your body is the major concern,
regardless of whether it entered through your [censored] or your
elbow. Wouldn't such a high charge do some pretty major
damage to the heart or other major organs (that is not
intended to sound 'smutty'!!)?

I've never heard of anyone being struck by lightning but
surviving because it only hit them on the thumb or whatever.

Like I said, no export, so I'm quite happy to be
proved wrong!

regards,

Michael S

Quoted message said:

And here's another good resource:
www.nols.edu/resources/research/pdfs/
lightningsafetyguideline.pdf

That should read:

nols.edulightningsafetyOpen ↗
guideline.pdf

Seán