Whasup with Baratz??

(Jan) said:

How Do You Trap A Quackbuster?

Opinion by Consumer Advocate Tim Bolen

July 3rd, 2003

Do I detect Jan bashing Dr Baratz by passing on yet another pack
o'lies from Tim Bolen?

<snip lies>

--
Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight

"Peter Bowditch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

(Jan) said:

How Do You Trap A Quackbuster?

Opinion by Consumer Advocate Tim Bolen

July 3rd, 2003

Do I detect Jan bashing Dr Baratz by passing on yet another pack
o'lies from Tim Bolen?

<snip lies>

You do, indeed! Barrett, too. $ KaChing! ;o) Rich

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
Date: 7/3/2003 9:27 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

(Jan) said:

How Do You Trap A Quackbuster?

Opinion by Consumer Advocate Tim Bolen

July 3rd, 2003

Do I detect Jan bashing Dr Baratz by passing on yet another pack
o'lies from Tim Bolen?

You seem to detect what Jan posts, but you can't seem to detect what Baratz
does.

Quoted message said:

<snip lies>

Prove it!!!

Restored:

How Do You Trap A Quackbuster?

Opinion by Consumer Advocate Tim Bolen

July 3rd, 2003

It's easy. You set out cheese.

Our project in Wisconsin is a prime example of how to deal with quackbusters,
correctly, and efficiently. First, understand who, and what, you're dealing
with. Once you know that, you've installed a ring in their nose, which you can
use to lead them to their end. That's what we're doing to Robert S. Baratz MD,
DDS, PhD, the current President of the National Council Against Health Fraud
(NCAHF) in Wisconsin.

Quackbusters are so arrogant, and predictable, by nature, that it's easy to
lead them to their downfall. Individually, they're like one of those
pull-string dolls I bought for my kid when she was three years old. Pull the
string and you get a message like "I'm going to be a big girl some day." And
then it wets it's diaper.

I call the rank-and-file quackbusters "Barrett's Parrots." If failed MD
Stephen Barrett says it, the minions say it. Like the pull-string doll,
there's only one message - and that's ALL there is.

Except for the diaper part.

Hair Removal Salon owner, Robert S. Baratz, is sort of an UPGRADED quackbuster.
Made in a laboratory, Baratz is sort of a combination pull-string doll, and
rodent. Watch videos of him, and you'll see what I mean.

I've helped nail little Bobbie in Florida twice, Texas twice, California twice,
and some other places. He's easy to beat. I'm not surprised he broke into
tears in Wisconsin. He ran twice in Florida, had a jury laugh at him in Texas,
dropped a case in California to avoid being deposed, and more. If he'd had any
idea that a trap was being set in Wisconsin, he'd have stayed home with the
drapes drawn, with his Mom answering the front door..

Quackbusters, individually, or together, aren't much. Their hallmark is the
"fake resume," designed to make quackbusters look like they are in the same
world as those they criticize - when they aren't. Almost all of them do it -
to try to give some credibility to their dubious pronouncements about health
care. In Robert Baratz's case, the resume is a major issue. His resume is
literally, a fantasy world. For details:

http://www.quackpotwatch.org/opinionpieces/quackbusterexpertperjury.htm

But Baratz isn't the only one.

Wallace Sampson, who parades himself on the internet as the editor of "The
Scientific Review of Alternative Medicine" (belch) claims as his descriptive
title "Clinical Professor of Medicine at Stanford University." The fact is,
this rancid old fart probably couldn't even FIND Stanford University, if he had
to... He's NEVER taught an alternative medicine class at Stanford, or for that
matter, ANY class at Stanford. He got his title ("Clinical Professor ...) when
he was required by his former employer, Santa Clara Medical Center, to sign off
on Stanford medical students, working weekends, cleaning bedpans. Sampson
performed that function in the 1980s, and he's been using the title ever since.

I guess, on a quackbuster resume, it sounds better to say "Clinical Professor
of Medicine at Stanford University," then the reality of "bedpan cleaner
signer-off-er." What we should all make note of is the significant fact that
Sampson uses this self-description FIRST and FOREMOST, which would indicate
that, to him, being a "bedpan cleaner signer-off-er." was, and is, the high
point of his professional career.

Sampson is typical of quackbuster leadership.

Anybody can see that the first qualification to be a top quackbuster is to be
hateful, and resentful of other's accomplishments. The second qualification is
to be vicious. The third is to be willing to lie, and misrepresent important
issues. The fourth, and very important, is to LIKE hurting others - the
ability to revel in the knowledge of how much damage they are doing to
Americans.

Knowing the quackbuster's personality traits makes it easy to set a trap.

The Trap...

In the Wisconsin case, Baratz came in thinking the case was going to be a
slam-dunk. For Baratz, and prosecutor Arthur Thexton, knew that Eleazar and
Genia Kadile were suffering the financial and emotional devastation of having
two of their grown children beset by lupus, an incurable disease. They knew
these two kind, caring, people had each given one of their children more life
by donating each of them a kidney. They knew that only one of those children
survived. Baratz figured he'd come in, get a quick $50,000 in fees, take the
Kadile's home, their business, their retirement, their very lives, away from
them, and go on to his next victim.

But it didn't work. Baratz and Thexton didn't count on Eleazar and Genia's
friends coming to their aid.

In Wisconsin, Baratz sunk his teeth into the cheese... and we slammed the trap
shut. And now HE, Robert S. Baratz, MD, DDS. PhD, is on trial for his life.

Never before, in any trial, anywhere, of a leading-edge health practitioner
like Eleazar Kadile MD, has the situation been reversed - where the accuser is
on trial, except here. But it won't be the last time. Look what happened to
quackpots Wallace Sampson, and Stephen Barrett, when they showed up in Los
Angeles Superior Court (NCAHF vs. King Bio), didn't like the Court's decision,
and filed an appeal. The Three Judge Appeals Court labeled them "biased, and
unworthy of credibility."

What we did in Wisconsin was a simple tactic. It can be used on any
quackbuster who comes to testify in any case. Just keep them talking. Keep
them writing down answers. Keep asking about the claims they make on their
resumes. It doesn't take long before they run out of stock answers. Then,
like Baratz did, they'll start to make things up. Keep going. That's when
you've got them. Keep going some more. One bad answer, or two, can be written
off as a mistake. Thirty bad answers, or fifty, or a hundred, become a pattern
of Perjury and Fraud.

As an example, Baratz claims on his resume that he's a "Consultant to the FDA
Office of Criminal Investigation." When it was pointed out that we have two
different letters from the FDA saying they "never heard of him," Baratz
responded that he was "a secret agent," and that "he couldn't tell us what
department, or Supervisor, he worked for" (insert laughter here). Agent
double-O Goofball? Do you suppose he has a shoe phone?

This is what Baratz is facing July 14th, 15th, and 16th. And maybe the 17th,
and 18th. He's going to be cross-examined ONLY on his RESUME and his
CREDIBILITY, on those days. If he survives that, and I doubt that he will,
then he'll face a whole week of cross-examination on his "expert witness"
statements. His "expert witness" statements were so ludicrous, that top MDs
and Scientists reviewing his documents, and the statements within those
documents, at first thought "this guy knows nothing about science, or
medicine." But then reality struck. Baratz has three doctorates. He has to
know. He was simply lying. Lying under oath is called Perjury. Perjury is a
Misdemeanor. In volume, it's a Felony.

This is a landmark case...

Have you ever heard of a case where the Judge assigns THREE DAYS of
cross-examination on the "expert witness's" resume and credibility, before?

When I say that Baratz is on trial for his life, I mean exactly that.

Tim Bolen - Consumer Advocate

Quoted message said:

[email hidden]

I'll add that to my killfile.

Jan

This gets sicker and sicker. It is time Jan was sent to Coventry for a
while, I think. 99% of her posts are clearly intended to provoke and
antagonise. It is demeaning for any of us to have to counter lies from
the likes of Bolen, and it has proved a total waste of time responding to
Jab on anything. I suggest she be ignored totally. .

Peter Moran

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: "Peter Moran" [email hidden]
Date: 7/3/2003 11:51 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

This gets sicker and sicker.

(Your post of the denial of not seeing any fraud any cover-ups and any
dishonesty, is just that, Sick,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,)

That's seem to be the case.

This resume seems to be full of lies.

A pity to expose them.

http://www.quackpotwatch.org/opinionpieces/quackbusterexpertperjury.htm

Quackbuster "expert witness" may be charged with PERJURY in Florida Case...

Opinion by Tim Bolen

March 31st, 2001

Massachusetts "Quackbuster" Robert S. Baratz MD, DDS, PhD hopped on a plane
last January, from Boston to Florida, to show up in a West Palm Beach courtroom
as a "surprise rebuttal witness" in the Florida Dental Board vs Phillips case.

What a belly laugh that was. Baratz made a total ass out of himself during the
deposition, then walked out when he didn't like the questions he was being
asked. And, after the dust settled, the story got even better...

Seems Baratz had a MAJOR problem, during the deposition testimony, staying
within the bounds of truth. So much so that PERJURY charges may be on the
horizon.

Baratz LIED about his qualifications on his CV resume BIG TIME. Baratz is one
of de-licensed MD Stephen Barrett's (www.quackwatch.com) top lieutenants in the
floundering "quackpot menace."

Baratz testified (under oath) that he was a Consultant for the Food & Drug
Administration (FDA) Office of Criminal Investigation (OCI), and as such had
insider knowledge of FDA policy and thinking. He sounded impressive and
authoritative in his testimony. It's just that it was all a LIE - The FDA never
heard of Baratz, and I have a letter from the the FDA Office of Internal
Affairs (OIA) to prove what I say.

Of course, now the Court has a copy of the FDA letter...

Not only did Baratz LIE about his relationship with FDA, but he LIED about
almost all of his current employment. In his deposition Baratz made FANTASTIC
claims about his qualifications.

HERE IS WHAT I FOUND when I checked on his claims:

Most significant are Baratz’s FALSE CLAIMS to current employment (on his CV
resume):

(1) On page #2, under “Practice and Patient Care Experience,” Baratz claims
“Assistant Clinical Professor of Emergency Medicine, School of Medicine,
Boston University School of Medicine,”

I called the Boston University School of Medicine and asked for Baratz. They
have no listing for him. I asked for the Personnel office, and was directed to
the Director of personnel, George Snowden, who told me that Robert S. Baratz is
not an employee of the University, is NOT ON THE STAFF, and to his knowledge,
has no relationship with the University. Snowden, a long time employee of the
University, had never heard of Baratz, and wished to be provided with any
documents, or data, where Baratz claimed an affiliation with the University.

(2) On page #5, under “Current Hospital Staff Appointments,” I called all
of the three hospitals listed and asked for Baratz:

(A) Carney Hospital, after several telephone calls, responded that Baratz was
definitely NOT “on Staff” as he claims, but was restricted to a limited
relationship called “Provisional Associate,” which, it was explained to me,
meant that he could, with permission, bring a patient to the hospital. The
hospital did not know of ANY INCIDENT in which Baratz ever brought a patient to
the hospital.

(B) Martha’s Vineyard Hospital had no listing for him, knew of no way to
reach him, and DID NOT have him on their staff directory. They did not know who
he was.

(C) Jordan Hospital had no listing for him, and their response to me was
“I’ve never heard of him.”

(3) On page #4, under “Other Professional Experience and Employment,”
Baratz claims “Director, IMCSI (Computer Based Medical Device Tracking
systems)...”

I called two different nationwide telephone directory services and could get no
telephone number for a company, or corporation named IMCSI, nor the longer
version of it’s name (International Medical Consultation Services Inc.). The
Internet had no listing for any such company; no website, nothing.

(4) MOST IMPORTANT - On page #4, under “Other Professional Experience and
Employment,” Baratz claims “Consultant, United States Government, U. S.
Food and Drug Administration (FDA), Office of Criminal Investigation (OCI).

I called the FDA OCI in Washington DC and was referred to the FDA Office of
Internal Affairs, where I spoke to Assistant Special Agent in Charge Paul F.
Gebicke. Mr. Gebicke requested that I FAX to him, immediately, portions of the
documents where Baratz indicated his relationship with the FDA. I faxed to him
the entire seven page CV, and relevant pages concerning Baratz's claim to a
relationship with FDA, in the Baratz deposition.

Mr. Gebicke responded to me by telephone and indicated that his office had
investigated Baratz’s claims (as per the documents faxed to them), and that
they would respond to my request by letter. They did so, faxing me a letter
dated March 2, 2001, signed by Donald L. Briggs, Special Agent In Charge, FDA
Office of Internal Affairs.

In short, BARATZ's FDA CLAIMS ARE A FRAUD.

FDA Brigg’s letter indicates that his office investigated five claims made by
Baratz either in his CV, or in his testimony recorded on the deposition, as
follows:

“Between February 28, 2001 and March 02, 2001, Special Agents of the FDA OIA
made the following inquiries that failed to reveal Baratz either has/has had a
consultant or contractual relationship with the FDA in general, or specifically
with the FDA Office of Criminal Investigations (OCI), the law enforcement
branch of the FDA.

On 2/28/01, an OIA SA spoke with OCI Assistant Director (AD) Frank Forgione who
said no records could be located that support the assertion that Baratz has
ever been a ‘consultant’ to OCI.”

“On 3/01/01, an OIA SA spoke with Center for Drug Evaluation and Research
(CDER) representative Glenna Caffrey, who is responsible for screening
prospective nominees as SGE to FDA panels on drug matters. No records could be
located that support the assertion that Baratz has ever been an SGE panelist,
guest panelist, or participant of record in CDER issues.”

“On 3/01/01, an OIA SA spoke with Center for Device and Radiological Health
(CDRH) representative Kathleen Walker, who is responsible for screening
prospective nominees as SGE to FDA panels on device matters. No records could
be located that support the assertion that Baratz has ever been an SGE
panelist, guest panelist, or participant of record in CDRH issues.”

“On 3/01/01, an OIA SA spoke with Center for Biologic Evaluation and Research
(CBER) representative William Freas, who is responsible for screening
prospective nominees as SGE to FDA panels on drug matters. No records could be
located that support the assertion that Baratz has ever been an SGE panelist,
guest panelist, or participant of record in CBER issues.”

“The above inquiries were made with respect to assertions that Robert S.
Baratz is a medical doctor and DDS (dentist) who alleges a relationship with
the FDA as a result of his alleged expertise in the area of general Dentistry,
drugs, and devices related to this field.”

(5) On page #4, under “Other Professional Experience and Employment,”
Baratz claims “Consultant NBC News, New York.”

I called NBC News, New York. They never heard of him, and told me he was
definitely NOT a consultant to them.

(6) On page #4, under “Other Professional Experience and Employment,”
Baratz claims “Consultant ABC News, New York.”

I called ABC News, New York. They never heard of him, and told me he was
definitely NOT a consultant to them.

(7) On page #4, under “Other Professional Experience and Employment,”
Baratz claims “Consultant, State of California, Office of the Attorney
General, and Board of Dental Examiners.”

First off, there is no such organization in California called “The Board of
Dental Examiners.” The licensing agency for dentists in California is called
the “California Dental Board.” I called them, they researched their records
carefully, and responded that they had never heard of Baratz, he was not now,
nor ever had been, a consultant for the State of California.

No other State agency we contacted (listed by Baratz on his CV) could find any
record of him as a consultant.

(8) On page #1, under “Skills: Business Development, Entrepreneurial
Activities, Administration, and Organization” Baratz claims “Founder of two
corporations in medical device area. One (Polymedica) is now >$100M on NASDAQ,
other (IMCSI) in growth stages.”

I called Polymedica and asked for Baratz. They had no office or phone number
for him. I told them that Baratz claims to be THE FOUNDER of the company, and
they then referred me to the CEO, who called me back, and said that he did know
Baratz, but that he had no knowledge of whether Baratz had any financial
interest in Polymedica.

(9) On page #2, under “Communications,” Baratz claims “National
spokesperson for professional organization (American Dental Association) for
scientific matters.”

Organizations, especially a large one like the American Dental Association
(ADA), do not lightly give, or allow, “spokespersons.” I called the
American Dental Association main office in Chicago, Illinois, and asked for
Baratz, or the office for “spokespersons.” I was routed around the office
to several people who would be familiar with anyone who acted as a
“spokesperson” for the ADA. No one I talked to at the ADA had ever heard of
him, or had any record of him acting as a "spokesperson." I examined the
ADA’s website carefully, and could not find Baratz listed anywhere in their
data base.

I wonder if Bobbie got his witness fees up front?...

Quoted message said:

It is time Jan was sent to Coventry for a
while, I think.

Uh huh, hear no evil, see no evil, read no evil.

99% of her posts are clearly intended to provoke and

Quoted message said:

antagonise.

Well, no, They are a quest to find the truth.

Quoted message said:

It is demeaning for any of us to have to counter lies from
the likes of Bolen,

Are they lies Peter??

He gives page and number, surely he didn't make it up.

Quoted message said:

, and it has proved a total waste of time responding to
Jab on anything.

Yep, she just doesn't fall or approve of the lies of organized medicine OR it's
members,,,,,,,,,,,,,such as you and your blindness.

I suggest she be ignored totally. .

Quoted message said:

Peter Moran

Sure you do. That's the ticket.

It is called

*I-don't-want-to-be-informed-attitude.

Jan

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote:

Jan, have you any idea how revolting it makes you appear to keep
repeating the drivel from Tim Bolen? You keep saying that you don't
like his style, you have even tried to attack people by saying that
they write like Bolen, but you regurgitate every lie that he tells
because his words support your hatred.

--
Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight

(Jan) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: "Peter Moran" [email hidden]
Date: 7/3/2003 11:51 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

This gets sicker and sicker.

(Your post of the denial of not seeing any fraud any cover-ups and any
dishonesty, is just that, Sick,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,)

That's seem to be the case.

And then Jan vomits it all up again. And this woman says that she has
no hate.

--
Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: "Peter Moran" [email hidden]
Date: 7/3/2003 11:51 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

This gets sicker and sicker.

(Your post of the denial of not seeing any fraud any cover-ups and any
dishonesty, is just that, Sick,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,)

That's seem to be the case.

This resume seems to be full of lies.

A pity to expose them.

http://www.quackpotwatch.org/opinionpieces/quackbusterexpertperjury.htm

$ Ka [yawn] Ching ;o) Rich

Quoted message said:

(Jan) said:

How Do You Trap A Quackbuster?

Opinion by Consumer Advocate Tim Bolen

July 3rd, 2003

Do I detect Jan bashing Dr Baratz by passing on yet another pack
o'lies from Tim Bolen?

<snip lies>

--
Peter Bowditch [email hidden]

At this rate, the MHA faithful will be contributing Millions of US Dollars &
Euros to Dr Barrett and Peter B. I hope you guys use the money to take a well
deserved vacation, like the one's pharm companies give to every US MD.

<< because his words support your hatred.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So whose hatred are you supporting?

"If you're gonna walk on thin ice, you may as well dance." (Jessie Winchester).

DEBBEE1023 said:

<< because his words support your hatred.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So whose hatred are you supporting?

You should stop blaming yourself for your abuse.
Inventing illnesses won't get you sympathy, just
disgust. As long as you wallow in your self-hatred
and imaginary illnesses, you won't make any progress
toward good mental health.

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
Date: 7/4/2003 2:02 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

(Jan) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: "Peter Moran" [email hidden]
Date: 7/3/2003 11:51 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

This gets sicker and sicker.

(Your post of the denial of not seeing any fraud any cover-ups and any
dishonesty, is just that, Sick,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,)

That's seem to be the case.

And then Jan vomits it all up again. And this woman says that she has
no hate.

Sounds like the hate is coming from you Peter.

Furthermore, you have been asked if you can find any fraud, any coverups, any
dishonesty, any lies.

You haven't answered.

How come??

Do take each comment line by line.

You seem eager to do this with any fraud for alternative medicine, but you
can't bring yourself to do it, when this doctor is still on staff.

I am waiting. It is very easy to see.

Jan

Neither can you see Peter Moran's lies, neither have you known Baratz to lie,
and of course you can't explain your own.

Quoted message said:

I can't really comment on that. I have never seen Peter Moran tell a lie, so I
don't really know what you are talking about there.

Uh huh, and at this very moment, you are lying through your teeth.

You know it, *I* know it any sane truthful person knows it and GOD knows it.

See any fraud, any cover-uups, any dishonesty or any lies here Peter???

You seem to keep dodging this. How come??

Can'T break the *good ole boy and girl club *snydrome??

Step right up Peter, don't be shy.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/809196.asp

Peter Moran wrote:

All medical advances have entailed risk, ever since the first caveman said"I
wonder what this berry does?".

Using retroviruses to try and correct lethal and potentially lethal gene
defects is a very legitimate and logic alavenue of medical research. So this is
nothing to do with "conspiracies", "coverups" .

It is a matter of the quality of informed consent that was applied. It would
be unusual these days for such issues to not be addressed carefully by the
researchers and the ethics committees to which all clinical trials are
submitted thesedays. We cannot know how culpable the doctors are from this
rather emotive news item.

Peter Moran
==============================

Years earlier, a scientist just a few miles away from the Gelsinger’s home in
Tucson had raised serious questions about whether the experiment was safe.

Documents

• Feb. 8, 2002: FDA letter, attempt to ban Dr. Wilson from other
experiments.
• March 3, 2000: FDA Warning Letter, original findings about the gene
therapy experiment.

(SEE ANY COVER-UPS THERE, PETER??)

The trouble is, Paul Gelsinger says, Dr. Wilson’s team had never told him
that anyone had ever raised questions about safety

(That's fine and dandy according to organized medicine member, Peter Moran.)

AND PETER BOWDITCH!!

ADVERSE REACTIONS WERE NOT REPORTED
And that was just the beginning. Federal investigators, pouring through
Penn’s records, announced at the conference that they had made a series of
startling discoveries, raising questions about whether the doctors had covered
up problems and broken basic test rules.

In fact, just a few months before Jesse had signed up for the experiment,
several monkeys given viruses similar to Jesse’s got sick. And two of them
died.

(SEE ANY COVER-UP THERE PETER??))

The rules for the experiment said: Even if volunteers didn’t get visibly ill,
if tests showed that any of them had a significant reaction called “grade
3,” the experiment was supposed to be “halted” immediately.
Records show there were “grade 3” reactions in more than one
patient. The first time, doctors stopped, called the government and got
permission to continue, saying an unusual condition with the patient might have
been the cause.
The second time, they stopped, called and got permission again, citing
another unusual condition.
But when it happened a third time, they didn’t stop, didn’t call.
Then, a fourth time. They didn’t stop or call then either

(FOUR TIMES PETER!!!!!)

For their own safety, volunteers weren’t supposed to have a blood
ammonia level higher than 50. But people were coming in with higher levels and
without proper approval. The limit was raised to 70.
When Jesse signed up over the summer, he was within the limits, but
records show that when Penn doctors tested him, just days before the
experiment, his reading was 114 — more than double the original safety limit.

(That's way cool huh Peter???)

HIGH FINANCIAL STAKES
With so many red flags from the monkey deaths to the reactions in other
volunteers, even to Jesse’s own ammonia levels, Why had Dr. Wilson’s team
allowed the experiment to continue?

(Wonder if Peter can answer this question?)

At the University of Pennsylvania, the conflict committee approved Dr.
Wilson’s arrangement with Genovo.
In fact, the university itself owned a piece of his company and stood to
profit, too.

(Hmmmmmmmmm).

In a statement, the university acknowledged that some information
“should have been shared with the FDA sooner.”

(Just a minor little slip,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,)

There was no information given to Jesse or his family about the monkey deaths.
There was no information given to Jesse or his family about toxic results in
prior patients. There was no information that would allow Jesse and his family
to make any kind of informed decision.”

(Peter STILL can't see any coverup!!!! NO dishonesty!)

CONFIDENTIAL REPORTS

He told congress that other private companies in the race for cures had
also been doing gene therapy experiments and had also gotten adverse reactions.
But instead of sharing the information, government rules allowed them to stamp
those reactions “confidential,” classifying them as trade secrets to
protect their research investments.
So, while the government knew about them, other researchers like Dr.
Wilson and volunteers like Jesse Gelsinger were never allowed to see them.

(TRust the government!!!)

“I was outraged,” says Paul. “I had a right to know. Jesse had a right to
know.

(Oh my,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,emotions).

***In February, the Food and Drug Administration said that because Dr. Wilson
filed “false and misleading” reports and “repeatedly and deliberately
violated regulations***

REPEAT FOR THE HARD HEADED!!!

Dr. Wilson filed “false and misleading” reports and “repeatedly and
deliberately violated regulations

(No coverups,,,,,,,,,,no fraud,,,,,,,,,,no deliberate violations,,,,,,,,,,,,)

HOW DOES THAT GRAB YOU PETER BOWITCH?????

This week marks the third anniversary of Jesse Gelsinger’s death. At
the University of Pennsylvania, Dr. Wilson

****is still on the faculty****

(Soooooooooo in organized medicine,,,,,,,,,,,)

****Filing *false and misleading reports* is A OK,,,,,,,,,,,,****

****REPEATED and DELIBERATE violations,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,is A OK.***

but no longer in charge of its gene therapy program. And, in Congress,
lawmakers are still debating legislation to provide more protection for medical
volunteers.

******in the end, whether Jesse was betrayed by the doctors he and his family
thought they could trust.*********

Jan

(Jan) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
Date: 7/4/2003 2:00 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote:

Jan, have you any idea how revolting it makes you appear to keep
repeating the drivel from Tim Bolen? You keep saying that you don't
like his style, you have even tried to attack people by saying that
they write like Bolen, but you regurgitate every lie that he tells
because his words support your hatred.

I have no hatred.

As I stated it is by page number and what Baratz claims. It appears he lied
about his resume, under oath.

Are you saying every bit of this is made up?????

Yes.

<snip yet another round of filth, posted by someone with so much
hatred that she will believe anything about the people she hates>

--
Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
Date: 7/4/2003 9:11 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

(Jan) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
Date: 7/4/2003 2:00 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote:

Jan, have you any idea how revolting it makes you appear to keep
repeating the drivel from Tim Bolen? You keep saying that you don't
like his style, you have even tried to attack people by saying that
they write like Bolen, but you regurgitate every lie that he tells
because his words support your hatred.

I have no hatred.

As I stated it is by page number and what Baratz claims. It appears he lied
about his resume, under oath.

Are you saying every bit of this is made up?????

Yes.

We will see, I guess.

Quoted message said:

<snip yet another round of filth, posted by someone with so much
hatred that she will believe anything about the people she hates>

ZZzz. New fad buzz word and accusation.

I hate no one. I do hate the act of lying.

You seem to believe every word Baratz writes, he is terrible mistaken.

Still wating for you to answer my questions about the fraud, dinshonesty and
lies Peter Moran can't see.

And

The question you stated was very easy to answer about Barrett sying we should
have people tried in court with little or no evident and on accusation only.

You seem to have a lot to say about Jan.

And nothing to say about either of the above.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know why.

Jan

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
Date: 7/4/2003 2:02 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

(Jan) said:

>Subject: Re: Whasup with Baratz??
>From: "Peter Moran" [email hidden]
>Date: 7/3/2003 11:51 PM Central Standard Time
>Message-id: <[email hidden]>
>
>This gets sicker and sicker.

(Your post of the denial of not seeing any fraud any cover-ups and any
dishonesty, is just that, Sick,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,)

That's seem to be the case.

And then Jan vomits it all up again. And this woman says that she has
no hate.

Sounds like the hate is coming from you Peter.

Furthermore, you have been asked if you can find any fraud, any coverups,

any

Quoted message said:

dishonesty, any lies.

You haven't answered.

How come??

Do take each comment line by line.

You seem eager to do this with any fraud for alternative medicine, but you
can't bring yourself to do it, when this doctor is still on staff.

I am waiting. It is very easy to see.

Jan

Neither can you see Peter Moran's lies, neither have you known Baratz to

lie,

Quoted message said:

and of course you can't explain your own.

Quoted message said:

I can't really comment on that. I have never seen Peter Moran tell a lie,

so I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

don't really know what you are talking about there.

Uh huh, and at this very moment, you are lying through your teeth.

$1 KaChing Quackwatch
$5 Kaching Peter

;o) Rich

In said:

I hate no one. I do hate the act of lying.

Which must make for horrible conflicts, since
she does it so much. Sort of like a nymphomaniac
from an ultra-Puritanical background, she can't
stop herself from doing what she hates.

--
| Microsoft: "A reputation for releasing inferior software will make |
| it more difficult for a software vendor to induce customers to pay |
| for new products or new versions of existing products." |
end

Quoted message said:

In said:

I hate no one. I do hate the act of lying.

Which must make for horrible conflicts, since
she does it so much. Sort of like a nymphomaniac
from an ultra-Puritanical background, she can't
stop herself from doing what she hates.

Didn't I hear that her hole is getting deeper and wider _ALL_ the time?

DEBBEE1023 said:

<< because his words support your hatred.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So whose hatred are you supporting?

Not yours.