Way to estimate TSS

domi said:

Hey!

I had a powermeter for about a year, now it doesn´t work anymore, I don´t have the money to buy a new one, so I startet again to train by HR-monitor.
But I dont want to miss out on PMC in WKO+ is there a way to properly estimate my TSS for every workout?

Domi

Sure there are a variety of ways to estimate TSS. The one I use most often is to estimate the overall intensity of my ride relative to my current FTP. Square that and muliply it by 100 for every hour ridden. I often do this as I cool down from a training ride and when I load the PM data in WKO+ I find my estimates are within a few TSS points.

It's pretty easy with practice, the way I think of it is that I get 100 "TSS base points" for every hour ridden and then I scale that based on the nature of the ride. So for a typical 2x20 session I might have a full hour of riding (100 TSS base points) with a full ride IF around .8 to .85 once you include WU, CD and rest between intervals. So IF^2 is between .64 and ~.75 or .7 as a swag. IOW, my TSS estimate for a ride like that would be 100*0.7 or 70. A bit higher if I was near the high end of L4 for my 20 minute efforts, a bit lower if I wasn't pushing so hard.

Good luck,
-Dave

daveryanwyoming said:

Sure there are a variety of ways to estimate TSS. The one I use most often is to estimate the overall intensity of my ride relative to my current FTP. Square that and muliply it by 100 for every hour ridden. I often do this as I cool down from a training ride and when I load the PM data in WKO+ I find my estimates are within a few TSS points.

It's pretty easy with practice, the way I think of it is that I get 100 "TSS base points" for every hour ridden and then I scale that based on the nature of the ride. So for a typical 2x20 session I might have a full hour of riding (100 TSS base points) with a full ride IF around .8 to .85 once you include WU, CD and rest between intervals. So IF^2 is between .64 and ~.75 or .7 as a swag. IOW, my TSS estimate for a ride like that would be 100*0.7 or 70. A bit higher if I was near the high end of L4 for my 20 minute efforts, a bit lower if I wasn't pushing so hard.

Good luck,
-Dave

This is like i do it now, but the problem is, that it is very hard for me to estimate my TSS from rides which were very "stochastic", e.g. grouprides or things like that!
I thought of a formula with average heartrate but this doesn´t work at all!

domi

domi said:

Hey!

I had a powermeter for about a year, now it doesn´t work anymore, I don´t have the money to buy a new one, so I startet again to train by HR-monitor.
But I dont want to miss out on PMC in WKO+ is there a way to properly estimate my TSS for every workout?

Domi

If you have Hr data from previous workouts for which you know TSS, you could calculate Trimps and do a regression between Trimps and TSS, if you have a good fit then you could use the regression formula to estimate TSS from Trimps.

Hope it helps, Ale.

amartinez said:

If you have Hr data from previous workouts for which you know TSS, you could calculate Trimps and do a regression between Trimps and TSS, if you have a good fit then you could use the regression formula to estimate TSS from Trimps.

Hope it helps, Ale.

I just tried this one, but for me Trimps doesn´t work, i get too high TSS-Numbers.
Looks like I have to work with Daves method, I tried this one for some workouts and they seemed to be pretty near the real numbers!

domi

domi said:

I just tried this one, but for me Trimps doesn´t work, i get too high TSS-Numbers.
Looks like I have to work with Daves method, I tried this one for some workouts and they seemed to be pretty near the real numbers!

domi

I'm suggesting to use Tss estimated from Trimps REGRESSION, not direct Trimps numbers which, usually, will be higher:

1h @ FT -> Tss=100

if DeltaHr was 75% in that hour -> Trimp~123
if DeltaHr was 80% in that hour -> Trimp~142
if DeltaHr was 85% in that hour -> Trimp~151

If you publish (or send me) a series of <Trimp, Tss> from your previous workouts I can help you with the regression, just to see what happens.

amartinez said:

I'm suggesting to use Tss estimated from Trimps REGRESSION, not direct Trimps numbers which, usually, will be higher:

1h @ FT -> Tss=100

if DeltaHr was 75% in that hour -> Trimp~123
if DeltaHr was 80% in that hour -> Trimp~142
if DeltaHr was 85% in that hour -> Trimp~151

If you publish (or send me) a series of <Trimp, Tss> from your previous workouts I can help you with the regression, just to see what happens.

This would be really nice, but just to be sure, how have you calculatet this?
I calculatet Trimps, and then searched for a number which relates Trimps to TSS, then I tried to calculate with this number other TSS and they were often to high... maybe I took a wrong workout. But most Workouts where I have heartrate and watts are older than one year, because I didn´t use the heartrate-strap very often!

thanks for help,
domi

domi said:

This would be really nice, but just to be sure, how have you calculatet this?

Using the formula:

Trimps= <minutes> * DeltaHr * 0.64 * exp(1.92*DeltaHR)

Where DeltaHr = (Hr - HrRest) / (HrMax - HrRest)

If DeltaHr=0.85 for 1h @ FT (Tss=100)

Trimps = 60 * 0.85 * 0.64 * exp(1.92*0.85) = 168.9

Btw there was an error in my previous calc for 0.85:o , the other two are ok.