Vitamin & Supplement Brands

Quoted message said:

heard that the vitamin and supplement industry isn't very heavily regluated
by the FDA
Damus

That's a plus. The FDA and government in general is the worse thing of all time
for safe medicine and health care.

Quoted message said:

so what's the harm in ordering products from, say, India?
Damus

Damus, if that is the sort of day to day "logic" you apply to critical health
decisions...I think you should order herbs from say India, Bangladesh.

"Damaeus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I know this is probably a question asked trillions of times, but is there
any way to know which brands of vitamins and supplements are truly what
they say they are?

No.

Quoted message said:

I know that I should look for "natural" supplements,

Why? They are all chemcials.

Quoted message said:

but how does one know whether the item they're buying is really what's
contained in the capsule or gelcap?

One does not know what is in that tablet or capsule. Several years ago
testing was done on bottles of ephedra compounds, and found that the potency
of each tablet/capsule ranged from 0% to 400% of the posted strength.
Imagine if you took four of the higher potency ones. People died.

Many of the FDA warnings and recall alerts are based on 'foreign' substances
being in these products. Recently, they found that some of the herbal
viagara products contained the real deal. Imagine buying something to avoid
a medication that you know you should not take, but get it anyway.

There are other compelling reasons, but, I hope by now you get the point.

Quoted message said:

For example, how do I know that the capsule from a Kelp bottle is really
kelp and not lawn clippings from some guy's front yard?

Good question. I can assure you that they are not my lawn clippings. Beyond
that, no guarantees. BTW, if you find a company willing to bottle lawn
clippings, let me know. They can buy mine (which should be healthy, since I
give my lawn supplements,...errr....fertilizer....).

Quoted message said:

What brand do you trust? Do you trust the items you find at Wal-Mart, or
do you order online? What about products shipped from overseas?

Risky, dude, risky.

I've

Quoted message said:

heard that the vitamin and supplement industry isn't very heavily

regluated

Quoted message said:

by the FDA, so what's the harm in ordering products from, say, India?

Good question. However,the fact that they are not more closely regulated isa
travesty. If something is sold as beneficial to nes body, then it should be
regulated just like a pharmaceutical. The fact that ephedra was not
regulated resulted in hundreds of deaths and thousands of reported adverse
events. The supplement industry is fighting a law which would merely require
that they report all adverse event reports to the FDA. This is utterly
scandalous.

Quoted message said:

Thanks,
Damaeus

"Damaeus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I know this is probably a question asked trillions of times, but is there
any way to know which brands of vitamins and supplements are truly what
they say they are? I know that I should look for "natural" supplements,
but how does one know whether the item they're buying is really what's
contained in the capsule or gelcap?

You would know that the seller was truly interested in the safery and needs
of the consumer if they stuck to the following rules, among others..
Unfortunately they are more usually trying to "keep up with the Jones's" by
outdoing whatever other people are doing in the market.

1. The product would not have any unneeded herbal content. No herbs are
known to be safe or useful for long term use in the healthy and it merely
allows the seller to charge more.

2. They should not contain unneeded or possibly harmful levels of minerals.
Iron is a definite no no in the non-anaemic. Selenium is dangerous if taken
in amounts not much more than normal requiremnets, and should probably only
be needed in geographical areas of selenium deficiency associated with a
higher incidence of some cancers (e,g, NZ).. Sodium and potassium are
completely unnecessary, but may have to be present in vitamin salts. Too
little is known to justify other minerals such as zinc, or suggest what dose
may be appropriate in a population within which most or even all are not
going to be deficient..

3. They should be marked "NOT FOR CHILDREN". Adult preparations are
dangerous in children and you should be teaching your kids to eat better,
not rely on pills.

4. Megavitamin usage has not been reliably shown to be safe and effective
for any condition, despite the elapse of thirty years of study. Benefits
for added vitamins in studies are inconsistent, and those that are seen are
from modest additional intake, especially if from the diet. So a simple
multivitamin with about normal requirements and at most a little selenium
might be beneficial. I would expect most brands made in the USA by major
firms, even if cheap, would probably suffice.

And ask those who say they are selling "natural vitamins" where they really
get their vitamins from. You may have to take more synthetic vitamin E
than of the natural isomer to get the same effect, but the evidence also
suggests you will do even better getting it from food.

Since big pharmaceutical companies make the vitamins that the public has
been consuming in such monumental amounts, who on earth can you trust in
this matter?

DISCLAIMER I.don't hold myself out to be any ultimate authority on vitamins,
but suspect I have looked at more of the relevant evidence than most of
those promoting them..

Peter Moran

In article <[email hidden]>,

Damaeus said:

I know this is probably a question asked trillions of times, but is there
any way to know which brands of vitamins and supplements are truly what
they say they are? I know that I should look for "natural" supplements,
but how does one know whether the item they're buying is really what's
contained in the capsule or gelcap?

For example, how do I know that the capsule from a Kelp bottle is really
kelp and not lawn clippings from some guy's front yard?

What brand do you trust? Do you trust the items you find at Wal-Mart, or
do you order online? What about products shipped from overseas? I've
heard that the vitamin and supplement industry isn't very heavily regluated
by the FDA, so what's the harm in ordering products from, say, India?

It's fairly rare to find assays of various supplements. I've seen
them in Consumer Reports a few times. There's also an outfit called
ConsumerLab that does tests of various supplements and reports the
ones that pass (but not the ones that fail, which is unfortunate).

Based on what I've seen in Consumer Reports, you're usually pretty
safe going to Costco and buying their house brand (Kirkland, and don't
ask me where that name comes from). Beyond that, I really don't know
what to suggest.

OK, that's not quite true -- I would strongly suggest that you ignore
Spammin' Dave Wickware, who is a public nuisance, remarkably ignorant,
a major-league spammer, and far from impartial (since he's all set to
try to sell you stuff). Oh, and forget about taking algae, be it
Super Blue Green or any other kind -- it's a really dismal source of
nutrients.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

I believe consumerslab DOES tell which brands of vitamins/supplements/et
al pass, pass conditionally or fail their testing. However, it looks
like a paid subscription to their complete reports is necessary for all
this information. They do offer limited but free information at their
web site though.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

I believe consumerslab DOES tell which brands of vitamins/supplements/et
al pass, pass conditionally or fail their testing. However, it looks
like a paid subscription to their complete reports is necessary for all
this information. They do offer limited but free information at their
web site though.

Yes, I believe the publically-available (for free) info doesn't tell
you which products failed the tests, and you have to subscribe to get
all the info.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

Vitamin Power's supplements are all certified. They are manufactured
to USP standards for dietary supplements. They have been in business
since 1975. You can get 20% OFF and free shipping on orders over
$27.99 at http://www.kostlessvitamins.com

[email hidden] wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I believe consumerslab DOES tell which brands of vitamins/supplements/et
al pass, pass conditionally or fail their testing. However, it looks
like a paid subscription to their complete reports is necessary for all
this information. They do offer limited but free information at their
web site though.

You don't know what your talking about on some of this, Peter.
My comments are mixed in below.
<snip>

"Peter Moran" <[email hidden]> > You would know that the seller was
truly interested in the safery and needs

Quoted message said:

of the consumer if they stuck to the following rules, among others..
Unfortunately they are more usually trying to "keep up with the Jones's"

by

Quoted message said:

outdoing whatever other people are doing in the market.

1. The product would not have any unneeded herbal content. No herbs are
known to be safe or useful for long term use in the healthy and it merely
allows the seller to charge more.

I agree that a most vitamin supplement should not have herbs.
And most don't and even when they do the doses of the herbs are tiny.
Anyway all supplements aren't just vitamins and herbals, to frame the
discussion
in such a manner betrays a hostile attitude.

Quoted message said:

2. They should not contain unneeded or possibly harmful levels of

minerals.

Quoted message said:

Iron is a definite no no in the non-anaemic. Yes.
Selenium is dangerous if taken
in amounts not much more than normal requiremnets, and should probably

only

Quoted message said:

be needed in geographical areas of selenium deficiency associated with a
higher incidence of some cancers (e,g, NZ)..

Animals studies indicate otherwise. And 200 mcg supplementation
doses are considered safe for adults. In some area of mainland China
people get rather large doses of Se from their locally based
diets without adverse events.

Quoted message said:

Sodium and potassium are
completely unnecessary, but may have to be present in vitamin salts.

In the case of Na, it a case of simple reporting on the label. Anyway,
some people try to restrict their Na. And K is limited by regulation here
in the States to 99 mgs for OTC preparations.

Quoted message said:

Too
little is known to justify other minerals such as zinc, or suggest what

dose

Quoted message said:

may be appropriate in a population within which most or even all are not
going to be deficient..

Many will be short on zinc. ACE inhibitors cause excessive excretion
of Zn. Higher levels of Zn reduce Cd uptake which is a very good thing.

Quoted message said:

3. They should be marked "NOT FOR CHILDREN". Adult preparations are
dangerous in children and you should be teaching your kids to eat better,
not rely on pills.

This comment is pure horse feathers. Just look at a label and it will say
something llike the following: "Suggested Use: As dietary
supplement use One (1) softgel in adults..........."
People know to adjust doses down to lower levels for kids.

Further,in modern lifestyles in which people are in doors far too
many (perhaps most) are short on vitamin D. With this vitamin, adult doses
are
too low for optimal health even in infants and more so in adults..

Infants and small children
might get a little too much preformed vitamin A but only slightly
from an adult dose sized tablet.
Most people are aware that small children and infants
have different needs. Such authoritarian thinking
results in having bathroom heaters bearing labels advising buyers
not to use heater in the bathroom.

More comments below.

Quoted message said:

4. Megavitamin usage has not been reliably shown to be safe and effective
for any condition, despite the elapse of thirty years of study.

Your eyes are closed or a best looking in the review mirror.
You pulled the 30 year number out of your hat; if you are
focused on Linus Pauling that was longer ago .....try 35 to 40 years.
Nor was he the first.

Inositol is quite effective in preventing panic attacks, and treating
various OCD disorders.

Vitamin E helps slow the onset diabetic complications.

Niacin is used to lower cholesterol.

Vitamin D and K can be used in the treatment of osteoporosis.
to help slow or even halt its progression. And I mean 10X of the AIs.
Not the tiny amounts found in most supplements.

Vitamin D supplement at 2000 IU (not a typo) in infants prevents
type 1 diabetes in kids and young adults.

Coenzyme Q can be used to slow the onset of drug toxicity. It modestly
reduce blood pressure and improve cardiac function.

High dose folic acid helps women genetically prone to bearing neural
tube defectives not to have a repeat experience.

Combined high dose vitamin E and niacinamide slow the progression
of type 1 diabetes.

Modest doses of b6 (5x of RDA) and Mg lower the odds of kidneys stones.

Many elderly are B-12 short, folic acid status impaired and getting
suboptimal levels of Mg. Some of this is due to meds and some is
due to impaired digestion and absorption. Not all of this is due
to poor diet choices.

Andropausal farts and their post-menopausal buddies
will wring their hands and say 'lets study it more before
we act' which is cowardly nonsense.On many of these
things it time to go mainstream and sort it out later.

Cowardly attitudes like yours have resulted in an inadequate
folic acid program which has added too little folic acid.
Result the reduction in NTD births was only 30% not the
possible 70% the research indicated as possible.
Vitamin fortification is just vitamin supplementation of the sly.

Quoted message said:

Benefits
for added vitamins in studies are inconsistent, and those that are seen

are

Quoted message said:

from modest additional intake, especially if from the diet. So a simple
multivitamin with about normal requirements and at most a little selenium
might be beneficial. I would expect most brands made in the USA by major
firms, even if cheap, would probably suffice.

And ask those who say they are selling "natural vitamins" where they

really

Quoted message said:

get their vitamins from. You may have to take more synthetic vitamin E
than of the natural isomer to get the same effect, but the evidence also
suggests you will do even better getting it from food.

Dietary levels are likely too low to help slow the onset of diabetic
neuropathy.
The evidence that food sources are absorbed better aren't surprising as
solublized forms of E have been available since at least the early
70's and the caution to take with the most fatty of meal of the day
goes back to at least the 60's. And anyway the reseach you refer to
if you refer to the latest research by Maret Tauber (think I got the name
right)
doesn't compare vitamin E from food (as I recall) rather it
compares E fortified cereal to a vitamin E capsule source as I recall.
And the E capsules used in the study weren't solublized.

Quoted message said:

Since big pharmaceutical companies make the vitamins that the public has
been consuming in such monumental amounts, who on earth can you trust in
this matter?

DISCLAIMER I.don't hold myself out to be any ultimate authority on

vitamins,

Quoted message said:

but suspect I have looked at more of the relevant evidence than most of
those promoting them..

You don't show signs of it. IMO

Quoted message said:

Peter Moran

Lets see if Peter goes silent.......as Mark de Toad
(of sci.med.nutrition) often has.........................
...................William A. Noyes

"tuxedoMan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Vitamin Power's supplements are all certified. They are manufactured
to USP standards for dietary supplements. They have been in business
since 1975. You can get 20% OFF and free shipping on orders over
$27.99 at http://www.IAMADINGBATSPAMMER.com