vego como leso

lol
that person is exactly whats wrong with the world, 10bucks says she drives a 4x4 caus its safer.
the bike lanes in canberra are great, and theres allways ppl on them. just wish they would join up some black spots.

jetsan said:

lol
10bucks says she drives a 4x4 caus its safer.

Hey, go easy on the 4x4's. :p My wife drives a 4x4 and I ride my bike. Everyone is happy and noone starts carrying on like that lunatic woman. If Bicycle Victoria didn't have 40,000 members then they wouldn't have such a strong voice, but they do and the result is more bike lanes.

luke1972 said:

Found this funny article

Waste of Money

Letter to the Editor:
Progress Leader - Booroondara

It's been discussed in aus.bicycling

http://www.cyclingforums.com/t293379-have-you-seen-this-in-booroondara.html

luke1972 said:

Found this funny article

Waste of Money

Letter to the Editor:
Progress Leader - Booroondara

It is incomprehensible that nearly $1 million has been spent on more bicycle lanes when they are not used. If thousands or even hundreds of cyclists were in evidence on the roads I would happily accept the need for bike lanes, but there are not.

Bicycle Victoria/Australia and the lucky, selfish, seven cyclists - or whoever is lobbying the State Government or local council for the lanes
- I'm sure are laughing their bike pants off as they cruise in their own totally empty lane of taxpayers' road.

I am sick of this politically correct, environmentallly friendly rubbish. Try living in the real world. People just don't want to ride bikes except for a bit of exercise on the weekend (but not on Balwyn Road).

How do you get the weeks shopping home in your bike basket, for instance. Oh, yeah, I forgot - you don't go shopping because you are a vegetarian and grow your organic vegetables at home, and, of course, you weave your own clothes.

Sorry, but I am annoyed at the waste of money, when community centres and the like are busting their guts to raise a few grand that would help so many in the community instead of a very few pedal pushers who obviously are fit enough to ride.

Diane Keating, Balwyn.

How does she know there's no-one on them?

If she drives past them while taking the kids to school then she'll find that every self respecting rider is at work, making some money to put clothes on their kids and tyres on the bike. Maybe if she had a look at the bike tracks other than at 9am and 3:30pm she'd get a much better idea.

We're not all accidentally fit and healthy. We get this way by being proactive and getting out there.

Her whingeing won't change anything. The bike tracks are already there and more will be going in. 🙂 The Government know encouraging bike riding makes for an overall healtheir population. They're just doing the right thing for a change. At least my taxpayers dollars and benefitting ME!!!!!!!!

Quoted post said:

Sorry, but I am annoyed at the waste of money, when community centres and the like are busting their guts to raise a few grand that would help so many in the community instead of a very few pedal pushers who obviously are fit enough to ride.

Diane Keating, Balwyn.

WHy are they wasting my taxpayers money on community centres, I don't use them, I resent the government paying millions of dollars on social services that I don't use.

What she would note if she cared to be aware of the media is that every ongoing survey that exists (such as swanston st) of cyclists has shown significant growth in the number of users, to some extent by the provision of the facilities in the first place.

Does she think everyone starts out fit enough to ride? Gee I'm really fit maybe I should start riding a bike.. feck!

You need to be very careful when you start complaining that one smaller group is getting the money when what you want is money for a more miniscule group.

PiledHIgher

nitrous said:

Hey, go easy on the 4x4's. :p My wife drives a 4x4 and I ride my bike. Everyone is happy and noone starts carrying on like that lunatic woman.

Sorry, Nitrous! 4WDs are not safer, and are a blot on the landscape! Everyone is not happy, especially the environment!

Diane Keating's letter made my blood boil, to the extent that I actually wrote a letter to the Progress Leader - something I very rarely do.

By the way, it's Boroondara (NOT Booroondara) - for some reason, nearly everyone makes this mistake.

My wife drives our 4x4 as it is the only car we own. It is also used to take the family on holidays, often on 4WD roads. We only want to own 1 car, so unfortunately the weekly shopping and driving around the city is done in the 4x4. The additional cost of fuel is our problem. As far as being worse for the environment goes, I ride my bike to work every day. 1 4x4 is less polluting than 2 sedans.

I'm personally sick and tired of hearing people complain about 4x4's. Courier vans, taxis and ignorant people who don't look for cyclists, opening car doors and pulling out in front of bikes, are much more dangerous than an observant 4x4 driver. And, the simple truth is my wife and child ARE safer in the 4x4 in the event of an accident, which is much more likely to be caused by a drunk driver or impatient taxi driver than someone who is 20cm higher up.

We need to be more tolerant of all types of road users. In the words og John Lennon, "All we need is love"

do dooo doo dooo dooo.

There is no need to own a large 4WD. Subaru, for example, make 4WD's which are not mammoth like, nor heavy burners of fuel. The size equals safety argument has a few flaws. First, it's not safe for the occupants of the smaller vehicle. Second, if everyone ends up driving a large 4WD then that argument goes out the window. It does also seem to be the case that driver's of large 4WD's are generally worse drivers.

I do think it's commendable that you cycle to work, so cheers to you.

nitrous said:

My wife drives our 4x4 as it is the only car we own. It is also used to take the family on holidays, often on 4WD roads. We only want to own 1 car, so unfortunately the weekly shopping and driving around the city is done in the 4x4. The additional cost of fuel is our problem. As far as being worse for the environment goes, I ride my bike to work every day. 1 4x4 is less polluting than 2 sedans.

I'm personally sick and tired of hearing people complain about 4x4's. Courier vans, taxis and ignorant people who don't look for cyclists, opening car doors and pulling out in front of bikes, are much more dangerous than an observant 4x4 driver. And, the simple truth is my wife and child ARE safer in the 4x4 in the event of an accident, which is much more likely to be caused by a drunk driver or impatient taxi driver than someone who is 20cm higher up.

Nitrous - I appreciate that you only own 1 car (that's good!) and that do you bit for the environment by riding to work every day, and that at least you do go on 4WD roads (most 4x4 owners do not!), but I am personally sick and tired of people driving these monsters on city roads - it is basically a fashion. The moneyed who formerly bought BMWs or Mercedes in sedan format now get the same make in 4x4 format.

Your statement that "the simple truth is my wife and child ARE safer in the 4x4 in the event of an accident" is contentious, to say the least. A 4WD is safer in a head-on collision (although a non-4x4 which comes into collision with a 4x4 is definitely very much unsafer than he/she would be in a collision between two sedans), but due to the high centre of gravity, a 4x4 is much more likely to roll over under certain conditions. Many 4x4 owners quote the issue of safety as a justification for buying road monsters, but various articles in newspapers and magazines have cast considerable doubt over this assertion.

biker jk said:

It does also seem to be the case that driver's of large 4WD's are generally worse drivers.

Come on man, that is like saying "All cyclists are generally supporters of critical mass and other vigilanty type cycling hooligan behavior, they don;t obey road rules and run red lights while riding on the footpath and knocking over grannies, thinking they own the "shared" bike paths and yelling at people to restrain their dogs."

Really don't want to get into an argument over this, but you guys are starting to sound like the vego commo leso that was the original subject of this thread.

biker jk made some very valid points, but spoilt it all by his last assertion that 4WD drivers were generally worse drivers - certainly a sweeping generalisation.

No more a sweeping generalisation than that about courier van and taxi drivers. The difference being that 2 tonnes of large 4WD will do a lot more damage. Perhaps I should qualify my comment and say that in my experience drivers of large 4WD's are worse drivers.

biker jk said:

No more a sweeping generalisation than that about courier van and taxi drivers. The difference being that 2 tonnes of large 4WD will do a lot more damage. Perhaps I should qualify my comment and say that in my experience drivers of large 4WD's are worse drivers.

Much better.

🙂

Still, I'd be more concerned by the type of driver than the car they are driving. A good, courteous driver in a 4x4 is CERTAINLY safer than an agressive, drunk, over confident hoon in a mini.

2 tonne or 1 tonne, they are both deadly weapons in the wrong hands.

All I am saying is lay off generalising about 4WD drivers. I totally agree that there are many people out there who really don't need the 4WD's that they drive, but as long as they are courteous and observant then they are no more dangerous than any other vehicle on our roads.

I love the way the media portray it with a "Boy killed by 4WD!" type headline and then you read the article and it explains that the kids father parked the car on a hill, left the handbrake off and then it rolled down the hill and killed the kid. I bet it wouldn't have even made the newspaper if the bloke had been driving a Falcon.

The pollution argument is valid, 4WD's have bigger engines and therefore use more fuel, but more greenhouse emmissions are created by leaving a central heating unit for a family sized home on all night than driving 100km in a well maintained 4x4. BUT you don't see Ray Martin snooping around peoples houses at 4am checking to see if their heating is on.

There are soooooooooooooooooooo many problems in this world and I think in order to be effective in driving change we need to choose our battles wisely. I feel that there are bigger fish to fry than a bunch of people driving bigger cars than they may necessarily need.

I think the real problem lies in the abilities of the driver behind the 4WD.

I feel that some drivers behind the wheel of a large 4WD are not educated in the differences between a "normal" car and the 4WD. They are not aware or are not used to the blind spots, the size of the vehicle, and as a result do not excercise the necessary caution.

Perhaps the driving tests in Sydney are too easy! I know of many people who simply cannot reverse park a car, and have gone through years of driving without having reversed parked once, apart from the test day. Do these people deserve a driving license? In my books they are classed as dangerous drivers, as it does not appear they have the base to control the vehicle.