vegetarian diet

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

people ,
I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but I
love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I am
a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle mass?
please advise.

Arun
India

Check this link for losing weight and building muscle
http://www.intense-workout.com/same.html

Quoted message said:

people ,
I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but I
love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I am
a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle mass?
please advise.

Arun
India

If you want to change then you're going to have to change.

I lost a lot of weight by balancing my macronutrients and lifting
weights three times a week and doing high intensity interval training
three times a week.

I maintain the weight loss by eating a diet with balanced macronutrients
at maintenance calorie levels and doing cardio three to five times a
week (often in the context of a sport or family activity) and lifting
weights two or three times a week.

The keys to this are to eat less and exercise more. You get to figure
out how to eat less all by yourself, but many of us have found that we
are sated and have better energy levels and retain muscle mass best if
we get a bunch of our calories from protein. If you insist on not
eating the protein then you're likely going to have to "supplement" it
from some choice like protein powders.

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

Delenn

Delenn said:

Quoted message said:

people ,
I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but I
love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I am
a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle mass?
please advise.

Arun
India

If you want to change then you're going to have to change.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

The keys to this are to eat less and exercise more. You get to figure
out how to eat less all by yourself, but many of us have found that we
are sated and have better energy levels and retain muscle mass best if
we get a bunch of our calories from protein. If you insist on not
eating the protein then you're likely going to have to "supplement" it
from some choice like protein powders.

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

i like that phrase.

a strict vegetarian (vegan?) cannot have protein powder
either since it is made from whey...milk. perhaps they
could have the soy based stuff but before that they
can just up their nuts and tofu quantity. realize that when
she says she want to "gain muscle", she is setting aside
for a moment the "lose weight" part. Obviously, she needs
to make a choice. Most people opt to lose the weight first.
Plenty of fat and some muscle will go too, and then she can
worry about shape. There's no reason why she can't
lose weight, and work out hard enough to at least
maintain her current muscles.

i stopped eating meat last year. it is a bit of a struggle
to get what i consider the right amount of protein
every day. but i supplement with whey powder.
without that, it's not easy. especially if you're
trying to keep the %age of your calories that you're
getting from fat low too.
....thehick

frank-in-toronto said:

Delenn said:

Quoted message said:

people ,
I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but I
love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I am
a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle mass?
please advise.

Arun
India

If you want to change then you're going to have to change.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

The keys to this are to eat less and exercise more. You get to figure
out how to eat less all by yourself, but many of us have found that we
are sated and have better energy levels and retain muscle mass best if
we get a bunch of our calories from protein. If you insist on not
eating the protein then you're likely going to have to "supplement" it
from some choice like protein powders.

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

i like that phrase.

a strict vegetarian (vegan?) cannot have protein powder
either since it is made from whey...milk. perhaps they
could have the soy based stuff but before that they
can just up their nuts and tofu quantity. realize that when
she says she want to "gain muscle", she is setting aside
for a moment the "lose weight" part. Obviously, she needs
to make a choice. Most people opt to lose the weight first.
Plenty of fat and some muscle will go too, and then she can
worry about shape. There's no reason why she can't
lose weight, and work out hard enough to at least
maintain her current muscles.

Actually, you can get soy protein powder, but that's not friendly to
animals, either, because huge acreages of rain forest are being cut
down to grow soy. Come to think of it, a strict vegetarian is harming
animals by eating agricultural crops that destroy wildlife habitat.

Quoted message said:

i stopped eating meat last year. it is a bit of a struggle
to get what i consider the right amount of protein
every day. but i supplement with whey powder.
without that, it's not easy. especially if you're
trying to keep the %age of your calories that you're
getting from fat low too.
...thehick

Have you considered also giving up agricultural foods, and relying
instead on strict foraging for food?

-----------
Proton Soup

"Thanks for noticing that I didn't actually say anything." - Mike Lane

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

people ,
I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but I
love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I am
a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle mass?
please advise.

Arun
India

If you want to change then you're going to have to change.

I lost a lot of weight by balancing my macronutrients and lifting
weights three times a week and doing high intensity interval training
three times a week.

I maintain the weight loss by eating a diet with balanced macronutrients
at maintenance calorie levels and doing cardio three to five times a
week (often in the context of a sport or family activity) and lifting
weights two or three times a week.

The keys to this are to eat less and exercise more. You get to figure
out how to eat less all by yourself, but many of us have found that we
are sated and have better energy levels and retain muscle mass best if
we get a bunch of our calories from protein. If you insist on not
eating the protein then you're likely going to have to "supplement" it
from some choice like protein powders.

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

Delenn

Just about all Indians are vegetarians - it is not an option to ask him to
reconsider - something to do with their religion

Proton Soup said:

Have you considered also giving up agricultural foods, and relying
instead on strict foraging for food?

http://www.acorn.net/fruitarian/what.html

Delenn

David said:

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

Quoted message said:

Just about all Indians are vegetarians - it is not an option to ask him to
reconsider - something to do with their religion

Spoken like the true religious scholar you are. I think you're trying
to say that Hindus don't eat beef. Try reading the second sentence of
my paragraph again.

My experience with vegetarians is that very few of them are actually
vegetarian for ethical or religious reasons. I'm not saying it isn't
possible, but a better guess is that it seemed fashionable or healthy to
them, or they're just really picky eaters that enjoy being a pain in the
ass and/or controlling food in obsessive ways.

I don't know this guy or his situation so I'm just speculating.

Delenn

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

David said:

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

Quoted message said:

Just about all Indians are vegetarians - it is not an option to ask him

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

reconsider - something to do with their religion

Spoken like the true religious scholar you are. I think you're trying
to say that Hindus don't eat beef. Try reading the second sentence of
my paragraph again.

My experience with vegetarians is that very few of them are actually
vegetarian for ethical or religious reasons. I'm not saying it isn't
possible, but a better guess is that it seemed fashionable or healthy to
them, or they're just really picky eaters that enjoy being a pain in the
ass and/or controlling food in obsessive ways.

I don't know this guy or his situation so I'm just speculating.

Delenn
\

O goodness me! You noticed about my expertise. Most of what I know about
Indians I learned after wandering in the Rugs Bazaar store - the owner had
this turban on and when I was there he was eating vegetable chow mein -
strictly no meat. Plus his father I remember was very angry when he gave a
customer a 7000% discount on this carpet that had a beetroot stain on it.
(still it is pretty stupid to talk to a vegetarian from India in the same
way you would to a teenager in Boston who frivolously chose a certain
lifestyle. The idea of suggesting he was a 'picky' eater! I found it
hilarious)

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

David said:

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

Quoted message said:

Just about all Indians are vegetarians - it is not an option to ask him

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

reconsider - something to do with their religion

Spoken like the true religious scholar you are. I think you're trying
to say that Hindus don't eat beef. Try reading the second sentence of
my paragraph again.

My experience with vegetarians is that very few of them are actually
vegetarian for ethical or religious reasons. I'm not saying it isn't
possible, but a better guess is that it seemed fashionable or healthy to
them, or they're just really picky eaters that enjoy being a pain in the
ass and/or controlling food in obsessive ways.

I don't know this guy or his situation so I'm just speculating.

Delenn

You can bet your menorah that if an Indian is vegetarian it is for
religions/ethical or deeply cultural reasons. I can guarantee it is not
because he is a 'picky' eater!

Delenn said:

Proton Soup said:

Have you considered also giving up agricultural foods, and relying
instead on strict foraging for food?

http://www.acorn.net/fruitarian/what.html

Delenn

Yeah, I eat a lot of fruit myself, but primarily because I like it.
It's a shame though that we don't plant more trees that make food.
Around here, the predominant species appears to be some ornamental
worthless piece of [censored]. It's some kind of pear or apple, but the
fruits are smaller than plums, hard and bitter. I think they plant
them because harvesting the fruit would be a pain in the ass. Apple
trees always wind up with a bit of a mess under them, rotten and
fermenting, with yellow jackets buzzing around and piles of mush to
slip and fall on. Can't have that. It's a shame really.

-----------
Proton Soup

"Thanks for noticing that I didn't actually say anything." - Mike Lane

Delenn <[email hidden]> wrote in news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

David said:

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices.
If it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

Quoted message said:

Just about all Indians are vegetarians - it is not an option to ask him
to reconsider - something to do with their religion

Spoken like the true religious scholar you are. I think you're trying
to say that Hindus don't eat beef. Try reading the second sentence of
my paragraph again.

My experience with vegetarians is that very few of them are actually
vegetarian for ethical or religious reasons. I'm not saying it isn't
possible, but a better guess is that it seemed fashionable or healthy to
them, or they're just really picky eaters that enjoy being a pain in the
ass and/or controlling food in obsessive ways.

I don't know this guy or his situation so I'm just speculating.

Actually, David's closer to right than you are. The Hindus I meet (i.e.
all middle-class ex-pats in the high-tech community) are all either
vegetarian or think they ought to be.

The up side for Arun is that Indian vegetarianism usually leaves lots of
options--milk is okay, fish is often okay, and sometimes eggs are. You can
also go a long way on lentils and chick peas. But I'd lean on the whey
powder, I think.

Hugh

--
Run like hell and let the clowns deal with the bull.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

people ,
I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but I
love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I
am
a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle mass?
please advise.

I think anyone looking to gain muscle on a vegan diet should read what
Mike Mahler has to say on the subject. Start here:

http://www.vegsource.com/articles2/mahler_big_strong.htm

and also check on Mike's latest DVD, the focus of which is on gaining
both size and strength using kettlebells. I'm not trying to gain muscle
size but he gives a lot of detail on the finer points of many
kettlebells lifts - solid stuff, a lot of which you won't find anywhere
else, and overall a nice contribution to the body of kettlebell training
material that's out there now. Here's a link:

http://www.kbnj.com/mmsize.htm

In the meantime, I recommend you diet by the tried and true formula -
lift weights, do cardio, and eat 500 calories per day less. When you
feel you've accomplished what you want in fat reduction, then worry
about putting on more muscle.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

"Proton Soup" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

frank-in-toronto said:

Delenn said:

[email hidden] wrote:

> people ,
> I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but I
> love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I am
> a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
> combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle mass?
> please advise.
>
> Arun
> India

If you want to change then you're going to have to change.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

The keys to this are to eat less and exercise more. You get to figure
out how to eat less all by yourself, but many of us have found that we
are sated and have better energy levels and retain muscle mass best if
we get a bunch of our calories from protein. If you insist on not
eating the protein then you're likely going to have to "supplement" it
from some choice like protein powders.

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

i like that phrase.

a strict vegetarian (vegan?) cannot have protein powder
either since it is made from whey...milk. perhaps they
could have the soy based stuff but before that they
can just up their nuts and tofu quantity. realize that when
she says she want to "gain muscle", she is setting aside
for a moment the "lose weight" part. Obviously, she needs
to make a choice. Most people opt to lose the weight first.
Plenty of fat and some muscle will go too, and then she can
worry about shape. There's no reason why she can't
lose weight, and work out hard enough to at least
maintain her current muscles.

Actually, you can get soy protein powder, but that's not friendly to
animals, either, because huge acreages of rain forest are being cut
down to grow soy. Come to think of it, a strict vegetarian is harming
animals by eating agricultural crops that destroy wildlife habitat.

When are you going to stop using this lame excuse to make yourself feel
better, genius? According to information compiled by the United States
Department of Agriculture, over ninety percent of all the grain/agriculture
produced in America goes to feed livestock-cows, pigs, sheep, and
chickens-that wind up on dinner tables. Yet the process of using grain to
produce meat is incredibly wasteful. Figures from the U.S. Department of
Agriculture show that for every sixteen pounds of grain fed to cattle, we
get back only one pound of meat.

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

David said:

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
need working on.

Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.

Quoted message said:

Just about all Indians are vegetarians - it is not an option to ask him
to
reconsider - something to do with their religion

Spoken like the true religious scholar you are. I think you're trying to
say that Hindus don't eat beef. Try reading the second sentence of my
paragraph again.

My experience with vegetarians is that very few of them are actually
vegetarian for ethical or religious reasons. I'm not saying it isn't
possible, but a better guess is that it seemed fashionable or healthy to
them, or they're just really picky eaters that enjoy being a pain in the
ass and/or controlling food in obsessive ways.

lol, love how you can stereotype a group of very diverse people into
something that satisfies your own need for self-worth.

"Zwanz of Never" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"Proton Soup" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

frank-in-toronto said:

Delenn <[email hidden]> wrote:
>[email hidden] wrote:
>> people ,
>> I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but I
>> love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I
>> am
>> a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
>> combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle mass?
>> please advise.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>If you want to change then you're going to have to change.
<snip>
>The keys to this are to eat less and exercise more. You get to figure
>out how to eat less all by yourself, but many of us have found that we
>are sated and have better energy levels and retain muscle mass best if
>we get a bunch of our calories from protein. If you insist on not
>eating the protein then you're likely going to have to "supplement" it
>from some choice like protein powders.
>
>Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
>it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices. If
>it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
>it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups might
>need working on.
>
>Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.
i like that phrase.

a strict vegetarian (vegan?) cannot have protein powder
either since it is made from whey...milk. perhaps they
could have the soy based stuff but before that they
can just up their nuts and tofu quantity. realize that when
she says she want to "gain muscle", she is setting aside
for a moment the "lose weight" part. Obviously, she needs
to make a choice. Most people opt to lose the weight first.
Plenty of fat and some muscle will go too, and then she can
worry about shape. There's no reason why she can't
lose weight, and work out hard enough to at least
maintain her current muscles.

Actually, you can get soy protein powder, but that's not friendly to
animals, either, because huge acreages of rain forest are being cut
down to grow soy. Come to think of it, a strict vegetarian is harming
animals by eating agricultural crops that destroy wildlife habitat.

When are you going to stop using this lame excuse to make yourself feel
better, genius? According to information compiled by the United States
Department of Agriculture, over ninety percent of all the
grain/agriculture produced in America goes to feed livestock-cows, pigs,
sheep, and chickens-that wind up on dinner tables. Yet the process of
using grain to produce meat is incredibly wasteful. Figures from the U.S.
Department of Agriculture show that for every sixteen pounds of grain fed
to cattle, we get back only one pound of meat.

Excellent. Just for you, tomorrow, after a day of driving my gas-guzzling
SUV, having a meat-lovers pizza for lunch...I'll only eat half and throw the
rest away...I'm going to go out and have some nice veal parmigiana. Just for
you.

David

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Excellent. Just for you, tomorrow, after a day of driving my gas-guzzling
SUV, having a meat-lovers pizza for lunch...I'll only eat half and throw
the rest away...I'm going to go out and have some nice veal parmigiana.
Just for you.

David

That doesn't bother me a bit, I've grown to accept that some people only
think of themselves....

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Zwanz of Never" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"Proton Soup" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

frank-in-toronto <[email hidden]> wrote:
> Delenn <[email hidden]> wrote:
>>[email hidden] wrote:
>>> people ,
>>> I am in a real dilemna , I am overwieght and need to lose weight but

I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>> love to do weights which means less cardio.. any suggestions? also I
>>> am
>>> a vegetarian and hence no meat or eggs for me , is there any
>>> combination other than supplements that will help me gain muscle

mass?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>> please advise.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>If you want to change then you're going to have to change.
><snip>
>>The keys to this are to eat less and exercise more. You get to figure
>>out how to eat less all by yourself, but many of us have found that we
>>are sated and have better energy levels and retain muscle mass best if
>>we get a bunch of our calories from protein. If you insist on not
>>eating the protein then you're likely going to have to "supplement" it
>>from some choice like protein powders.
>>
>>Consider carefully what advantages being vegetarian has for you. If
>>it's ethical then it's what it is and you'll live with your choices.

If

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>it's for health reasons you might want to re-think your beliefs. If
>>it's because you're a picky eater then realize that your hang-ups

might

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>need working on.
>>
>>Because you're going to have to change if you want to change.
>i like that phrase.
>
>a strict vegetarian (vegan?) cannot have protein powder
>either since it is made from whey...milk. perhaps they
>could have the soy based stuff but before that they
>can just up their nuts and tofu quantity. realize that when
>she says she want to "gain muscle", she is setting aside
>for a moment the "lose weight" part. Obviously, she needs
>to make a choice. Most people opt to lose the weight first.
>Plenty of fat and some muscle will go too, and then she can
>worry about shape. There's no reason why she can't
>lose weight, and work out hard enough to at least
>maintain her current muscles.

Actually, you can get soy protein powder, but that's not friendly to
animals, either, because huge acreages of rain forest are being cut
down to grow soy. Come to think of it, a strict vegetarian is harming
animals by eating agricultural crops that destroy wildlife habitat.

When are you going to stop using this lame excuse to make yourself feel
better, genius? According to information compiled by the United States
Department of Agriculture, over ninety percent of all the
grain/agriculture produced in America goes to feed livestock-cows, pigs,
sheep, and chickens-that wind up on dinner tables. Yet the process of
using grain to produce meat is incredibly wasteful. Figures from the

U.S.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Department of Agriculture show that for every sixteen pounds of grain

fed

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to cattle, we get back only one pound of meat.

Excellent. Just for you, tomorrow, after a day of driving my gas-guzzling
SUV, having a meat-lovers pizza for lunch...I'll only eat half and throw

the

Quoted message said:

rest away...I'm going to go out and have some nice veal parmigiana. Just

for

Quoted message said:

you.

David

I think it is disgraceful to eat veal parmigiana when veal schnitzel is
*much* tastier!

"Zwanz of Never" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Excellent. Just for you, tomorrow, after a day of driving my gas-guzzling
SUV, having a meat-lovers pizza for lunch...I'll only eat half and throw
the rest away...I'm going to go out and have some nice veal parmigiana.
Just for you.

That doesn't bother me a bit, I've grown to accept that some people only
think of themselves....

Oh, hardly. I'll think about the cow, the pig, and the little baby calf that
I'll be eating.

David

Zwanz of Never said:

"Delenn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My experience with vegetarians is that very few of them are actually
vegetarian for ethical or religious reasons. I'm not saying it isn't
possible, but a better guess is that it seemed fashionable or healthy to
them, or they're just really picky eaters that enjoy being a pain in the
ass and/or controlling food in obsessive ways.

lol, love how you can stereotype a group of very diverse people into
something that satisfies your own need for self-worth.

How is my need for self-worth related to why people become vegetarian?

Now I'm wondering - why is the OP vegetarian? Religion, perceived
health benefits or because he just doesn't like a lot of foods and
builds rules around them and spends a lot of effort and energy
controlling exactly what minute ingredients are in his food?

Ever try to go out to dinner with a vegan? Tons of fun. I've had the
experience of attempting to serve meals to vegans as well as attempting
to go out to restaurants with vegans. The ones I know are vegan mostly
because they hate nearly every food and that way they can vet everything
to see if it suits before they will put it in their mouths... and I
assure you they aren't just looking for animal products. One person I
know intimately hates nearly all vegetables, dislikes the feel of oil,
and doesn't use herbs or spices. She lives on baked potatoes with soy
sauce. It certainly isn't for ethics or religion, though she claims
it's for health.

I'm not saying that all vegetarians are like that, but I know enough of
them who are vegetarian because of food control issues that I suspect
it's a mild form of mental illness.

Now... how does that make me feel more self-worth? I've got my own
foibles, I don't need to gloat over other people's. I note them and go on.

Delenn