Ultra-light bike tournig methods?

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Was recently reading an article in Adventure Touring abt how when
touring people take too much stuff.... and methods of taking less
(ultra-light).

Curious what others here do to keep the clutter and "stuff" down on
tour that includes both camping along way and some staying in motel.

Example..... if a person had only say a rear rack only...could you
use a compression sack for major gear....and what else?

Just looking for some ideas on how to NOT take everything and the
kitchen sink along and keep the bike and tour light and lively but at
same time have what you "need".

Well, consider carefully what you need. I have seen people on tour with
three pairs of shoes, a week's worth of cycling clothing, a couple days
with of casual wear, cell phone, Palm Pilot and an espresso maker. Take
what's essential. There are lots of touring books and packing lists
from experienced tourists to provide a starting point. Go here and
search for "packing list:"

http://www.trentobike.org/

Also, the following site has an "equipment list" link that will show you
lists of equipment people actually use:

http://www.crazyguyonabike.com

Both of the above sites have great touring reports (and some mediocre
ones, too).

Equipment choice hinges on whether you want to camp. I hate camping, so
I don't do camping tours. As a result, I can do a two or more week tour
with 10 pounds of gear, including the saddlebag to carry it in.
However, this does rather limit me to touring in places where there is
food and lodging readily available. Most of the world fits that
description, but there are interesting places where my style of touring
wouldn't work. My style of touring is also fairly expensive; camping
can drastically reduce the costs.

http://www.wallbike.com/carradice/longflaps.html

http://www.rivbike.com/webalog/baggage_racks/20079.html

If you like to camp, as millions of people do, then you're going to have
to haul a tent, sleeping bag, pad. If you want to do camp cooking, now
you need a stove, fuel, cookware. So you can hit 30 pounds of gear
easily, and some people haul 50-60 pounds of stuff. Yikes!

Basically, keeping the bike "light and lively" is going to be
diametrically opposed to a camping/cooking tour. But that can still be
a heck of a lot of fun (if you like to camp, unlike me).

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Well, consider carefully what you need. I have seen people on tour with
three pairs of shoes, a week's worth of cycling clothing, a couple days
with of casual wear, cell phone, Palm Pilot and an espresso maker. Take
what's essential.

Do you mean to suggest an espresso maker is *not* essential for touring?
I'd sooner leave home my bottle of port and box of dark chocolate!

Touring is not, IMHO, an exercise in asceticism. It's a pleasant way to
travel. I'd rather have a few extra pounds of gear on the bike and
enjoy my creature comforts in camp.

On the other hand, sometimes I *do* save weight by not carrying my
medium-format camera and tripod for landscape photography.

--
[email hidden] is Joshua Putnam
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/>
Braze your own bicycle frames. See
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/build/build.html>

I was in Scotland a few years ago and photographed this round-the-world
Japanese cyclist who was carrying 60kg of kit. I've never seen anything
like it!

http://www.pbase.com/gearoidmuar/image/37629524

Quoted message said:

I was in Scotland a few years ago and photographed this round-the-world
Japanese cyclist who was carrying 60kg of kit. I've never seen anything
like it!

http://www.pbase.com/gearoidmuar/image/37629524

Am I imagining things or is the guy in the picture flipping you the
bird?

[email hidden] wrote

Quoted message said:

Curious what others here do to keep the clutter and
"stuff" down on tour that includes both camping along
way and some staying in motel.

The method I've seen lots of tourers use in Europe is having a support
vehicle to carry all the "stuff" for the group.

Quoted message said:

... tour light and lively but at same time have what you "need".

Crux is the detailed meaning for you of the word "need".

Repair tools and replacement parts:
What frequency of what kinds of repairs are you going to make for
yourself -- rather than taking the time and trouble of arranging
transportation to a bike shop and waiting for its opening hours?
I feel like I should be able to repair a breaking of a chain or
derailleur-cable or brake-cable on my own. Lately an interesting question
for me is when to carry a spare tire (especially for a tandem, which wears
down tire rubber faster).

Other stuff:
Key question here is to distinguish between comfort and survival. Like if
"running and jumping all night long" counts for you as a way to make it thru
an unxpected cold night . . . or sleeping in the same sweaty clothes you
rode in counts as sufficient comfort for you (and your companions?) . . .
there's new opportunities to save weight for that desired "light and lively"
touring the next day.
Not me.

For me a "need" if there's a significant chance of cold weather is something
to cover my fingertips while I'm riding. So I've got a pair of large-size
uninsulated shell mits I can put over my fingerless cycling gloves. Because
without them I've been in situations where my fingers got so cold in the
wind + wet that I wasn't sure how long I's still be able to use them to grab
the brake levers.

Key strategic question:
If "light and lively" is important ...
* why do a multi-day tour at all? or
* why not choose a tour with mostly gentle or flat terrain, where your
riding will _feel_ light?

Ken

In article <[email hidden]>,

Joshua Putnam said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Well, consider carefully what you need. I have seen people on tour
with three pairs of shoes, a week's worth of cycling clothing, a
couple days with of casual wear, cell phone, Palm Pilot and an
espresso maker. Take what's essential.

Do you mean to suggest an espresso maker is *not* essential for
touring? I'd sooner leave home my bottle of port and box of dark
chocolate!

Touring is not, IMHO, an exercise in asceticism. It's a pleasant way
to travel. I'd rather have a few extra pounds of gear on the bike
and enjoy my creature comforts in camp.

An excellent illustration of the variable definition of the term "need."
Of course, in my definition of touring the word "camp" involves a room
with a bed, bathroom and shower. Creature comforts indeed! ;-)

Quoted message said:

On the other hand, sometimes I *do* save weight by not carrying my
medium-format camera and tripod for landscape photography.

Well, the old Zone VI field camera was fairly reasonable to carry
around. I don't know what alternatives there are now.

After much resistance to digital, my brother in law gave me a Fuli
FinePix A205 for Christmas a few years. It's rather bulky so I don't
carry it for bike rides, using my old Olympus XA for that as it's
smaller, but I've been impressed with the usefulness of the digital
camera. I have been keeping an eye on the very small digital cameras to
have one for bike riding. Not having a darkroom any more- not having
been able to set it up in 20 years or more- digital is appealing. But
still, digital images do not (yet) approach the fine quality of a fine
art print.

Quoted message said:

Am I imagining things or is the guy in the picture flipping you the
bird?

He could be but I doubt it. I was talking to him for quite a while
beforehand and asked if I could photography him. He had no problem with
that.

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Joshua Putnam <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

On the other hand, sometimes I *do* save weight by not carrying my
medium-format camera and tripod for landscape photography.

Well, the old Zone VI field camera was fairly reasonable to carry
around. I don't know what alternatives there are now.

The two MF cameras I've used on the bike were at opposite ends of the
portability spectrum.

One was a Moscow 5 pocket camera -- took beautifully sharp 6x9 negatives
yet folded up to fit in a jersey pocket. But it was too IR-permeable
for Kodak infrared film.

The other was a Mamiya Universal with a 70mm back and a couple of
lenses. It fit nicely in an Oyster Bucket pannier with foam.

Quoted message said:

After much resistance to digital, my brother in law gave me a Fuli
FinePix A205 for Christmas a few years. It's rather bulky so I don't
carry it for bike rides, using my old Olympus XA for that as it's
smaller, but I've been impressed with the usefulness of the digital
camera. I have been keeping an eye on the very small digital cameras to
have one for bike riding. Not having a darkroom any more- not having
been able to set it up in 20 years or more- digital is appealing. But
still, digital images do not (yet) approach the fine quality of a fine
art print.

I do have digitals as well. For work I carry an old Canon PowerShot
A40. Very reliable, quite rugged, does a fine job for documenting
things, and it fits in a pocket.

For better-quality photography, my Dimage 7Hi has manual controls and
external flash. I'd compare the quality to good 35mm snapshots, not as
good as professional-quality 35mm, but pretty good.

About the only 35mm I still do is HIE -- I don't have a darkroom, but I
can develop with a changing bag, scan negs, and get real prints of the
few shots that really deserve it.

--
[email hidden] is Joshua Putnam
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/>
Updated Infrared Photography Gallery:
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/photo/ir.html>

Quoted message said:

I was in Scotland a few years ago and photographed this round-the-world
Japanese cyclist who was carrying 60kg of kit. I've never seen anything
like it!

http://www.pbase.com/gearoidmuar/image/37629524

Awesome pic! I bet that Japanese cyclist really flies when he removes
his load.

Besides http://www.crazyguyonabike.org check out
http://www.kenkifer.com and http://www.downtheroad.org

Quoted message said:

Was recently reading an article in Adventure Touring
abt how when touring people take too much stuff.... and
methods of taking less (ultra-light).

Curious what others here do to keep the clutter and
"stuff" down on tour that includes both camping along
way and some staying in motel.

Example..... if a person had only say a rear rack
only...could you use a compression sack for major
gear....and what else?

Just looking for some ideas on how to NOT take
everything and the kitchen sink along and keep the bike
and tour light and lively but at same time have what
you "need".

"[email hidden]" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Besides http://www.crazyguyonabike.org check out
http://www.kenkifer.com and http://www.downtheroad.org

Thanks

What's everyone opinions on bags vs a trailer?

Their is also a yahoo group
http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/ultralightbiking/
that may prove useful. Ken kifer http://www.kenkifer.com
had a great approach to cycling. Sure miss his posts .
Dave
http://www.noweldrecumbent.com

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Was recently reading an article in Adventure Touring
abt how when touring people take too much stuff.... and
methods of taking less (ultra-light).

Curious what others here do to keep the clutter and
"stuff" down on tour that includes both camping along
way and some staying in motel.

Example..... if a person had only say a rear rack
only...could you use a compression sack for major
gear....and what else?

Just looking for some ideas on how to NOT take
everything and the kitchen sink along and keep the bike
and tour light and lively but at same time have what
you "need".

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Quoted post said:

Besides http://www.crazyguyonabike.org check out
http://www.kenkifer.com and http://www.downtheroad.org

Thanks

What's everyone opinions on bags vs a trailer?

Trailers really make it easy to take too much stuff!

This isn't all that complicated and you seem to be making it much more
difficult than it is (assuming all the questions are being posted by
only one person using a fake e-mail address).

There's a danger in spending so much time and energy getting ready that
you never go. Just go. If the equipment you have isn't perfect, so
what? You'll have a ball anyway. Thousands of people rode across the
U.S. in the 1970s on 40 lb Schwinn Continentals with a Pletscher rack
and their stuff in a nylon bag strapped to the rack with bungie cords.
They had a great time. It's not about the bike. All the bike has to be
is comfortable and reliable. A tour is about the places you see and the
people you meet.

I've toured on a cyclo-cross bike in the Alps, and on an "all rounder"
in the Mississippi River Valley. I've ridden both on brevets. I've
done brevets on my racing bike. I've done long distance rides on my
single speed. It doesn't matter. They were all fun (except the the
200K ride with 8 1/2 hours of rain at 42 degrees F and a 25 mph headwind
for the last 63 miles. That wasn't fun, but which bike I rode would
have made no difference).

Pack light. Two sets of cycling clothing, one pair of SPD style shoes
that you can walk and cycle in, one set of lightweight casual clothes
that you can wear to a restaurant and to the laundromat. A rain jacket
and a cycling hat are a necessity, arm warmers, leg warmers and some
light weight long finger gloves. I have a couple of medicines I carry
(aspirin, migraine medication) and a small hiker's first aid kit from
REI that is in a very small pouch. Sunscreen and lip balm, too. ID,
credit card, ATM card, small amount of cash. Also a phone card versus a
cell phone- the former weighs less but is often useless in an emergency.

Take enough tools to fit all the fasteners on your bike plus tire
levers, patch kit, a spare tube, a foldable spare tire, a spoke wrench,
two spare spokes of each size. I carry a Ritchey CPR 9 or a Cool Tool
for most of those tools and a Crank Bros. Speed Lever for the tire lever.

The above will get you through weeks of minimailst credit card touring,
will fit in a Carradice Nelson saddle bag and will weigh less than 10
pounds. Your bike will feel normal after a couple of days.

If I was camping, I'd take the same list of stuff plus the necessary
camping gear. Ultralight backpacking gear really is often very light
and quite suitable for cycle touring. I'd use a bivy sack rather than a
tent.

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

If I was camping, I'd take the same list of stuff plus the necessary
camping gear. Ultralight backpacking gear really is often very light
and quite suitable for cycle touring. I'd use a bivy sack rather than a
tent.

I was a bivy-sack tourist until I got married.

Now that we have three kids, our lightweight tent is a six-person,
three-season dome. If we're packing really light in the summer, we can
skip the thick air mattresses and inflator pumps and just take
Thermarest pads.

On the other hand, the tandem plus Trail-a-bike has *lots* of cargo
capacity.

--
[email hidden] is Joshua Putnam
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/>
Braze your own bicycle frames. See
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/build/build.html>

If you are going to bike/pack a combination of self contained backpacking,
and cycling - trailers can be great, the trailers are big enough to carry a
extended trip backpack in. I do this with a bob coz "no longer made" it is a
waterproof tupperware container single wheeled trailer. The nice thing is
that the trailer fits perfectly inside the tub for air/bus travel. For
family trips we take a bykaboose folding trailer 2 wheeled. For solo or just
plain trips bags are the easiest to handle on tour.
Hope this helps,
David
http://noweldrecumbent.com

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"[email hidden]" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Besides http://www.crazyguyonabike.org check out
http://www.kenkifer.com and http://www.downtheroad.org

Thanks

What's everyone opinions on bags vs a trailer?

In article <[email hidden]>,

Joshua Putnam said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

If I was camping, I'd take the same list of stuff plus the
necessary camping gear. Ultralight backpacking gear really is
often very light and quite suitable for cycle touring. I'd use a
bivy sack rather than a tent.

I was a bivy-sack tourist until I got married.

There is that. I was assuming that "me" would be doing a solo tour, but
that of course is an unfounded notion.

Quoted message said:

Now that we have three kids, our lightweight tent is a six-person,
three-season dome. If we're packing really light in the summer, we
can skip the thick air mattresses and inflator pumps and just take
Thermarest pads.

On the other hand, the tandem plus Trail-a-bike has *lots* of cargo
capacity.

And a good thing, it sounds like!

Joshua Putnam said:

I was a bivy-sack tourist until I got married.

Ok

So any advice on what brand/model bivvy sack to get?

On Fri, 13 Oct 2006 22:53:05 -0700, Joshua Putnam <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I was a bivy-sack tourist until I got married.

Now you're a NO-SACK tourist! <G>

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]
says...

Quoted message said:

Joshua Putnam said:

I was a bivy-sack tourist until I got married.

Quoted message said:

So any advice on what brand/model bivvy sack to get?

I never had any complaints with my Outdoor Research bivy.

--
[email hidden] is Joshua Putnam
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/>
Braze your own bicycle frames. See
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/build/build.html>