Ullrich is freeeeeeeeee !!!!!!!!!!!

The TdF presentation should garner a few headlines...

Slow down, it's a mine field out there...

zlatan said:

[font=Arial]great news.. from cyclingheros.com

According to Austrian daily news "Neue Zeitung für Tirol" the court of Madrid has send a letter to Jan Ullrich in which the court stated that Jann Ullrich is not accused of anything in the Puerto case nor did the court took any action against Jan Ullrich. The letter was send to be used as a certification for the UCI and the Swiss cycling federation. The Austrian newspaper writes that the Swiss Cycling federation is not responsible for the handling of the Ullrich case but it isn't clear on which facts this information is based on. [/font]

[font=Arial]President of the Austrian cycling federation, Rudolf Massak repeated that Ullrich would become an Austrian license if he would move to Austria and would apply for an Austrian license. Massak told "Neue": "I can't understand the policy of the German cycling federation (Vice president of the German cycling federation, Dieter Kühnle told German newsagency SID on Friday that it's "unthinkable" that ullrich would become a German license, Cyclingheroes). Sylvia Schenk had to step down in 2004 because she pushed fiercely the fight against doping and now they want to refuse a Jan Ullrich a license, although there is no evidence," Massak is wondering about the behaviour of his German neighbours. "In a constitunional state the presumption of innocence is essential. When Ullrich lives in Austria and applies for a license he will receive one."[/font]

[font=Arial]Retired Austrian pro Georg Totschnig commented: "It would be nice to see him more often as kind of neighboor. German magazine "Kicker" speculated yesterday that Totschnig will be one of Ullrichs sport directors in the 2007 season.[/font]

[font=Arial]UCI president Pat Mcquaid admitted today that the court documents of the court from Madrid can't be used against the riders who are allegedly involved in the Puerto case. In a pressrelease the UCI stated: " The recent developments of the "Puerto" operation, in particular the communication of October 3rd last in which the Spanish authorities notified the UCI of the ban to use documents of this file for any disciplinary procedure, our Federation has asked for the intervention of the World Agency Anti-doping Agency (WADA). [/font][font=Arial]The UCI indeed considers that WADA, which often claims its position of influence in the relations between the political authorities and the sports authorities, must now utilise that influence with the Spanish government by supporting the will of the UCI to be able to complete the disciplinary procedures which were opened according to its rules and regulations. [/font]

[font=Arial]The UCI is determined to establish individual responsibility of all persons implied in this affair and counts on WADA’s support to reach this as soon as possible. " [/font]

[font=Arial]Since the UCI statement refers to the letter of the Madrid court from october 3, it's again very confusing that the Swiss cycling federation claimed last week that they still wait for documents from the Spanish authorities.[/font]

[font=Arial]The UCI also attacked Tour de France organizer ASO in todays pressrelease: "The UCI would like to state also that a proposal of collaboration in terms of anti-doping fight, which was recently addressed to ASO, Tour de France organiser, was firmly refused. The UCI deeply regrets this. [/font]

[font=Arial]Leaving aside all the differences which persist on the UCI ProTour, the intention of the UCI involved allowing the organizers of the biggest cycling race to participate in the development of the anti-doping strategy which will be put into place at the beginning of the next season. [/font]

[font=Arial]Doping is a common problem to all parties involved in cycling, and the UCI, given the mission conferred by its institutional role, would like to broaden the discussion with all its stakeholders as it has always done it in the past. [/font]

[font=Arial]ASO’s decision, along with their decision not to invite the President of the UCI to the presentation of the 2007 Tour de France on Thursday, constitutes an additional proof of the will of its leaders to refuse their solidarity to the cycling family, in the most difficult circumstances. [/font]

[font=Arial]The UCI can only take note of this attitude and express its strong disagreement with the people responsible for this decision."[/font]

[font=Arial]Meanwhile five Spanish riders took action against some paragraphs of the ethical code. Although several media reported that five riders are involved, Patrick Lefevere told sporza.be that four riders have filed a law suit against their teams and that it's possible that the riders also will take action against the UCI and the AIGCP (International Association of Professional Cycling Teams). Lefevere, president of the AIGCP also said that the Pro-Tour teams want to ask DNA probes of riders that are allegedly implicated with "certain cases" on a voluntary basis. [/font]

[font=Arial]Related stories: [/font]

[left][font=Arial]Massak: "I will license him"[/font]

[/left]

zlatan said:

[font=Arial]the court of Madrid has send a letter to Jan Ullrich in which the court stated that Jann Ullrich is not accused of anything in the Puerto case nor did the court took any action against Jan Ullrich. [/font]

There is no civil laws against sportmen who are using PEDs. As user of PEDs, they can't be accused.
If the letter says something like : "No fact binds Jan and Fuentes", das ist sehr gut für Jan.

I have read somewhere , spanish laws about doping have changed since.

And of course Jan has never doped... All attacks to Lance, Basso and Jan are [censored]...

There is contact between Vorarlberg and Ullrich...

poulidor said:

There is no civil laws against sportmen who are using PEDs. As user of PEDs, they can't be accused.
If the letter says something like : "No fact binds Jan and Fuentes", das ist sehr gut für Jan.

I have read somewhere , spanish laws about doping have changed since.

Don´t like the way things are going.

I think it´s bad for the sport that the proofs that are being used by spanish courts against Fuentes can´t be use against the cyclists.

I don´t give much credit to the proofs, but i would like UCI to be allawoed to study them and if they could make up a case they could in a "speciall court" try to convict the cyclists as sportsmans in a "fair trial". Requests of blood ( if that would prove them as guilty - 100% sure ), real study of evidence, etc, etc...

This would, if someone is found innocent, provide for the future. UCI won´t get behind the code of conduct, will never again take percipitated measures, and probably UCI manegement would go down like a Flying dishwasher. Because, the way i see it the goverment body of UCI needs a conviction on this guys, so they will do anything they can to convict them and if they don´t get a chance to use the "documents" of OP they will hide behind the "couldn´t do more"," hands are tied" story.

Because the way things are going, the innocence in this case will be much like in the LA cases...

And i don´t want Jan to get free by a techical detail.

On the other hand it would be good to anoy all the LA fans😄

I guess if we were to use your logic every time there were difficulties with a particular case we could create "special courts" to convict them. The law is there to serve both the accusers and the accused. If the law doesn't suit one of them then that's TOO BAD.

acpinto said:

Don´t like the way things are going.

I think it´s bad for the sport that the proofs that are being used by spanish courts against Fuentes can´t be use against the cyclists.

I don´t give much credit to the proofs, but i would like UCI to be allawoed to study them and if they could make up a case they could in a "speciall court" try to convict the cyclists as sportsmans in a "fair trial". Requests of blood ( if that would prove them as guilty - 100% sure ), real study of evidence, etc, etc...

This would, if someone is found innocent, provide for the future. UCI won´t get behind the code of conduct, will never again take percipitated measures, and probably UCI manegement would go down like a Flying dishwasher. Because, the way i see it the goverment body of UCI needs a conviction on this guys, so they will do anything they can to convict them and if they don´t get a chance to use the "documents" of OP they will hide behind the "couldn´t do more"," hands are tied" story.

Because the way things are going, the innocence in this case will be much like in the LA cases...

And i don´t want Jan to get free by a techical detail.

On the other hand it would be good to anoy all the LA fans😄

In retrospect, does anyone else think the UCI and teams jumped the gun by suspending the OP riders? Did it do more harm than good to keep them out of racing before any conclusions could be reached? Is this part of the Pro Tour charter going too far?

At first I was like, great, more drama -- which I like -- and some of the dope-aholics got caught. But now I'm thinking, would it have hurt to let them race? It's not like they would spoil an otherwise clean event. Landis kinda' proved that.

Oh wait. I'm being hypocritical somewhat with that statement. Disregard.

But, is it okay to impose sanctions prior to reaching conclusions? Conclusions reached through currently accepted channels?

I'd rather watch them race under a cloud of suspicion than what OP produced.

tomkay said:

I guess if we were to use your logic every time there were difficulties with a particular case we could create "special courts" to convict them. The law is there to serve both the accusers and the accused. If the law doesn't suit one of them then that's TOO BAD.

"special courts" means something like a comission with some law experts, Medical experts, people from UCI, WADA, OC... Not a trial were Jan would have to say before the thing started. How do you declare? and we would go. Not Guilty. I say that because we all now the problem with sports and civil law.
History tell us a lot. Bosman gained the case and put end to an era were teams were from the countries, now FIFA is thinking how to restrain the foreign players. In portugal we had a case with a Football club - Gil Vicente - He was send down one division because of a decision by the goverment body and has put the case on a civil court. So FIFA as order FPF to take action. Result:
The Junior teams of Gil Vicente couldn´t play also.

helmutRoole2 said:

In retrospect, does anyone else think the UCI and teams jumped the gun by suspending the OP riders? Did it do more harm than good to keep them out of racing before any conclusions could be reached? Is this part of the Pro Tour charter going too far?

At first I was like, great, more drama -- which I like -- and some of the dope-aholics got caught. But now I'm thinking, would it have hurt to let them race? It's not like they would spoil an otherwise clean event. Landis kinda' proved that.

Oh wait. I'm being hypocritical somewhat with that statement. Disregard.

But, is it okay to impose sanctions prior to reaching conclusions? Conclusions reached through currently accepted channels?

I'd rather watch them race under a cloud of suspicion than what OP produced.

Yes I agree fully. I started off being shocked by OP and happy that cheaters were brought to justice, even Basso and Ullrich if they were realy guilty.

Now its gone full circle and Im more leaning towards the opinion that cheaters or notm, nothing has been proven and they should have raced.

Its got to the point where Ive almost absolved David Millar of all his sins...

What's next? Ill start warming to Virenque.... Eh no, thats probably a bridge way too far.

wicklow200 said:

Yes I agree fully. I started off being shocked by OP and happy that cheaters were brought to justice, even Basso and Ullrich if they were realy guilty.

Now its gone full circle and Im more leaning towards the opinion that cheaters or notm, nothing has been proven and they should have raced.

Its got to the point where Ive almost absolved David Millar of all his sins...

What's next? Ill start warming to Virenque.... Eh no, thats probably a bridge way too far.

But i liked Richard tears, i couldn't do that... We should nominate him for an Oscar.

Someone let me know when it's time for me to gloat.
U- unscrupulous
C- conspirators
I - international

So in other words, they did not find bags of blood at the lab?

The organizers need to get their [censored] together. There was blood there and chances are high it was JU and Basso's with many others. If what we were told had truth to it , then we know doping went on.....
But...... What needs to be done is to decide if doping is going to prosecuted by all organizations or it is not.......
It isn't fair to the riders to release their names if they are not going to prosecute. JU's career is basically over. He has been connected to this and he is a pariah. Now that they have destroyed what he had left, they are now not going to allow the truth come out. They have taken away JU's chance to be innocent.
Plus time is not on JU's side.

The sport of cycling as it is now in Europe is a farce.

wolfix said:

So in other words, they did not find bags of blood at the lab?

It isn't fair to the riders to release their names if they are not going to prosecute ...

That why i don´t like were this is going, because if this ends like this we will have the poor litle ones on the cyclists side, the poor litle ones on the UCI side, the poor litle ones on the tour organisation, the poor litle ones on the Guarda Civil, the poor litle ones on the spanish federation and courts, the poor litle ones on the sponsor and teams... everyone will be a poor litle one because of the guy that telled the press about this.

The news about JU being cleared by the Spanish judge in the OP case is welcome news.

The "evidence" cited by the UCI and Telekom team management was never compelling : this however didn't prevent either organisation from suspending JU (and the other OP riders).

Hard to know what course JU ought to take now.

Should he sue the UCI?
We know that Telekom compensated JU for the early termination of his contract.

From what I've been told JU wants to see this issue through to it's finality.
The fact that there is no evidence against him should be his starting point.

Given what he has been subjected to since June - he might be well advised to
simply sue the UCI and be done with.

So do people actually think Jan is drug free? Not that is almost laughable.

Well hold on to your helmet. The team directors are stepping in again. Now it looks like any rider implicated in the OP will have to supply a DNA sample before they will be allowed to sign a contract with any Pro Tour team. If that holds, then it wouldn't be long before every rider re-newing a contract would be forced to supply a DNA sample. I have to agree with this 100%. If the Spanish Courts, UCI, WADA can't make the system work, then by all means let the teams and their sponsors set some rules that could actually produce some un-clouded answers.

It now would remain to be seen whether any of the OP implicated riders actually go through with a DNA sample or if they simply run away and hide.

This is on velonews, but I suspect it will be everywere shortly.

David

Ullrich will leave Switzerland, and some of his problems but ...
What about the swiss federation and investigation against Jan ?
Is this investigation still stopped or can it continue with Jan linked with austrian federation?
Thanks.

poulidor said:

Ullrich will leave Switzerland, and some of his problems but ...
What about the swiss federation and investigation against Jan ?
Is this investigation still stopped or can it continue with Jan linked with austrian federation?
Thanks.

It can (and probebly will) continue but the court of Madrid says they are not allowed to use the Puerto documents and than they basicly have.. nothing.