Trike Rim Suggestions

Oops...noticed a couple errors where I suggested 406 tires in the rear. Please ignore these,
obviously all rear tires with be 559's.

Ken

"Ken Huizenga" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I am in the process of spec'ing a new Trice with ICE. It will have 20"
(406) front wheels with Deore mechanical disk brakes and a 26" (559) rear wheel with a rear
parking brake. It is a new model called the Eclipse, which is basically an XL with a 26"
rear wheel instead of the third 20" wheel of the XL.

I am looking for suggestions on the best rims to buy considering that I am about 270 pounds and
plan to do some loaded touring with at least two and probably four panniers on the back. I
don't plan on carrying pots & pans, stove, etc., but would carry clothes, tools, tent, sleeping
bag, etc.

I would like to be able to swap tires, to the extent possible on both the front and the rear, to
provide for a range of uses for the trike from:

- Fast riding, no load (other than myself) on nice dry streets. For this

I

Quoted message said:

would probably use 35-406 Schwalbe Marathon Slicks on the front and a

40-559

Quoted message said:

Schwalbe Marathon on the rear. I don't see myself going narrower than

that

Quoted message said:

in all likelihood, with the possible exception of running the 35-406 Slick in the rear also.

- Loaded touring: For this I would probably use 40-406 Schwalbe Marathons

on

Quoted message said:

the front and 47-406 Schwalbe Marathons on the back.

- Winter riding on snow-packed streets. For this I would would probably

use

Quoted message said:

something like 54-406 agressive treaded tires in the front and possibly a 54-559 studded tire in
the rear. I haven't really investigated these

tires

Quoted message said:

much but examples could include the 54-559 Schwalbe Ice Spiker and the 54-406 Schwalbe
Dirty Harry.

**********Here's the question: For this type of tire range, is is

possible

Quoted message said:

to get one set of rims that would provide safe, dependable

service?*********

Quoted message said:

Someone from ICE has suggested that their standard spec Alex DV15's will work OK for all of the
above, but I'm somewhat skeptical, as the inner rim width of these tires is only 15mm. I'm
pretty sure they'd work OK on the narrower options above, but I'm concerned about sidewall
damage for wider tires and also the safety of having such wide tires on such narrow rims. I've
also heard that narrow rims on wide tires reduces the effective width of the tire. Having those
studs on the Ice Spiker tires won't do me much good on a trike if the studs are sticking up in
the air instead of into

the

Quoted message said:

snow, if you know what I mean.

I've been thinking that a better option might be the Sun Rhyno Lite rims

for

Quoted message said:

the front with 22mm inner rim width and Rhyno Lite XL rims which have a
23.5mm inner rim width. Opinions on Alex DV15's, the Rhynos or other suggestions would be very
welcome. Also, does anyone think I'm trying to cover too broad of a range of uses and tire
widths with one set of rims?

Ken Huizenga Appleton, Wisconsin Easy Racers Folding Gold Rush Future owner of ICE Trice Eclipse

Ken Huizenga said:

I am in the process of spec'ing a new Trice with ICE. It will have 20"
(406) front wheels with Deore mechanical disk brakes and a 26" (559) rear wheel with a rear
parking brake....

To quote Zach Kaplan, "The Conti Grand Prix 28-406 tyre works nicely on the 28mm outside width
Velocity Taipan rim so this rim will take the full width range of available 406mm tyres. For best
aerodynamics and handling in the event of an air loss the tyre width should be as close as possible
to the rim width." [1]

The Taipan [2] would also be one of the strongest rims available. Note that while the "Taipan" is
not available in ISO 559-mm size, Velocity makes the "Cliff Hanger" with the same rim section in
559-mm, so a matching set is possible.

[1] Full thread at <groups.google.comgroupsOpen ↗
usw-ex0106-048.remarq.com&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DISO-8859-1%26q%3Dzach%2B-
kaplan%2Btaipan%26meta%3Dgroup%253Dalt.rec.bicycles.recumbent>
[2] <http://www.velocityusa.com/> Click on "Recumbent" on the menu located on the left side
of the page.

Tom Sherman - Planet Earth

Tom:

Thanks for your suggestion. When browsing the Velocity website I identified the Taipan for front
406's and the Cliff Hanger for rear 559 as the most likely candidates IF I went with Velocity.
Anyone able to comment on those
vs. the Rhyno Lite and Rhyno Lite XL?

Ken

"Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ken Huizenga said:

I am in the process of spec'ing a new Trice with ICE. It will have 20"
(406) front wheels with Deore mechanical disk brakes and a 26" (559)

rear

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

wheel with a rear parking brake....

To quote Zach Kaplan, "The Conti Grand Prix 28-406 tyre works nicely on the 28mm outside width
Velocity Taipan rim so this rim will take the full width range of available 406mm tyres. For best
aerodynamics and handling in the event of an air loss the tyre width should be as close as
possible to the rim width." [1]

The Taipan [2] would also be one of the strongest rims available. Note that while the "Taipan" is
not available in ISO 559-mm size, Velocity makes the "Cliff Hanger" with the same rim section in
559-mm, so a matching set is possible.

[1] Full thread at

<groups.google.comgroupsOpen ↗
4%40usw-ex0106-048.remarq.com&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DI
SO-8859-1%26q%3Dzach%2Bkaplan%2Btaipan%26meta%3Dgroup%253Dalt.rec.bicycles.r
ecumbent>

Quoted message said:

[2] <http://www.velocityusa.com/> Click on "Recumbent" on the menu located on the left side of the
page.

Tom Sherman - Planet Earth

"Ken Huizenga" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>... <snip>

Quoted message said:

I've been thinking that a better option might be the Sun Rhyno Lite rims for the front with 22mm
inner rim width and Rhyno Lite XL rims which have a
23.5mm inner rim width. Opinions on Alex DV15's, the Rhynos or other suggestions would be very
welcome. Also, does anyone think I'm trying to cover too broad of a range of uses and tire
widths with one set of rims?

Ken:

I think the Sun Rhyno Lite rims are an excellent compromise given your tire selections. The wider
rims will support those tires better than the narrow Alexes (duh!) and they'll be more laterally
rigid- something necessary in a trike rim that's not necessary in a bicycle rim.

Whatcha gonna do with the Fold Rush when you get the trike?

Jeff

Ken, Unless snow conditions are vastly different in Appleton than they are in Minneapolis, your
biggest problem will be that it's hard to find knobby tires narrow enough for winter riding on the
street in 406 and
559.

On my 2WD trike I started out with a 20" x 1-3/8" (451) on the front and 26" x 1.95" on the back.
After pushing all that rubber through the snow for a few days I swapped out the front for a 20" x 1"
and found some old IRC All Terrain 26" x 1.4" for the back. I should have built it with 700s so I
could run 30 or 32mm cyclocross tires in the rear.

Your conditions may vary, but here there are only a few days in the spring, when packed snow is
breaking up under you, that fat, low pressure tires would help.

The biggest problem is when cars mash new fallen snow into a compact dense mess that won't support
your weight, then they push it over to the edge where bikes ride. This can be exhausting with 2
skinny tires, almost impossible with 3 fat ones.

Caveat; If you are going off-road, ignore the above and go for all the flotation you can get.

"Jeff Wills" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I think the Sun Rhyno Lite rims are an excellent compromise given your tire selections. The wider
rims will support those tires better than the narrow Alexes (duh!) and they'll be more laterally
rigid- something necessary in a trike rim that's not necessary in a bicycle rim.

Whatcha gonna do with the Fold Rush when you get the trike?

Jeff

Jeff:

I still plan to keep the Folding Gold Rush and will still ride it a lot. I will enjoy the variety of
the Trike, the improved ability to ride on snowy/icy surfaces and some other things, but the Gold
Rush is a fantastic, comfortable, speedy laid-back ride and it won't be neglected because of a new
baby brother🙂

Ken

"Jeff Wills" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Ken Huizenga" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

<snip>

Quoted message said:

I've been thinking that a better option might be the Sun Rhyno Lite rims

for

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the front with 22mm inner rim width and Rhyno Lite XL rims which have a
23.5mm inner rim width. Opinions on Alex DV15's, the Rhynos or other suggestions would be very
welcome. Also, does anyone think I'm trying

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

cover too broad of a range of uses and tire widths with one set of rims?

Ken:

I think the Sun Rhyno Lite rims are an excellent compromise given your tire selections. The wider
rims will support those tires better than the narrow Alexes (duh!) and they'll be more laterally
rigid- something necessary in a trike rim that's not necessary in a bicycle rim.

Whatcha gonna do with the Fold Rush when you get the trike?

Jeff

Jeff/Others:

If I wanted to go REALY skinny/fast/high pressure (at least for a recumbent trike) would I be able
to safely mount the Schwalbe Stelvio 28-406 and 25-559 tires on the Sun Rhyno Lite rims? Or would
I be asking for trouble if I went that narrow? What about the Velecoty Taipan - 406 and
Cliffhanger 559?

I'm not talking about riding Stelvios on tour or even for thousands of miles. Just putting them on,
for example, to do a fast time trial of 20 miles or at the most attempt to do a fast Century ride.
I've done a Century in just under 7 hours including stops. (Stops of about 45 minutes) My next goal
is to do one in 6 hours. I think my strategy will be to ride a bit faster but cut the rest stops
down to one of about 10 or 15 minutes at about 60 miles. My other strategy is to lose some weight in
the off season🙂

Ken

Mark: Thanks for the advice. I don't have any experience riding trikes in snowy conditions, so I can
readily see how my preliminary strategies for dealing with the situation could be way off. I'll keep
your suggestion of "narrow with tread" instead of "wide with tread" in mind during my search and
experimentation. Thanks again. Ken

"Mark Stonich" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ken, Unless snow conditions are vastly different in Appleton than they are in Minneapolis, your
biggest problem will be that it's hard to find knobby tires narrow enough for winter riding on the
street in 406 and
559.

On my 2WD trike I started out with a 20" x 1-3/8" (451) on the front and 26" x 1.95" on the back.
After pushing all that rubber through the snow for a few days I swapped out the front for a 20" x
1" and found some old IRC All Terrain 26" x 1.4" for the back. I should have built it with 700s so
I could run 30 or 32mm cyclocross tires in the rear.

Your conditions may vary, but here there are only a few days in the spring, when packed snow is
breaking up under you, that fat, low pressure tires would help.

The biggest problem is when cars mash new fallen snow into a compact dense mess that won't
support your weight, then they push it over to the edge where bikes ride. This can be exhausting
with 2 skinny tires, almost impossible with 3 fat ones.

Caveat; If you are going off-road, ignore the above and go for all the flotation you can get.

"Ken Huizenga" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I am in the process of spec'ing a new Trice with ICE. It will have 20"
(406) front wheels with Deore mechanical disk brakes and a 26" (559) rear wheel with a rear
parking brake. It is a new model called the Eclipse, which is basically an XL with a 26"
rear wheel instead of the third 20" wheel of the XL.

Ken,

Are you buying direct from Ice or from local bike dealer. Ice has quite a few new models that are
not listed on their web page. I believe the Eclipse is a nice machine. Other than the mesh seat, how
does it differ from the Meteor? Was the Meteor one of your options before settling on the Eclipse?

Andy

"Andy Manuel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ken,

Are you buying direct from Ice or from local bike dealer. Ice has quite a few new models that are
not listed on their web page. I believe the Eclipse is a nice machine. Other than the mesh seat,
how does it differ from the Meteor? Was the Meteor one of your options before settling on the
Eclipse?

Andy:

I'll be buying from a dealer, although there were no local dealers in Wisconsin, so I'll be going
out of state...to Ohio (Bicycle One) However, I have been getting advice on models, options, etc.
directly from Niel, the head sales & marketing guy at Trice.

According to Neil, the Eclipse is basically an XL with a 26" rear wheel. I haven't seen the full
specifications sheet yet.

I hadn't heard about the Meteor before, but a quick search indicates that the Meteor is an XXL with
a 26" rear wheel.

So, I'd assume that the primary differences between the Eclipse and the Meteor are the same as the
differences between the XL and the XXL, which in addtion to the seat difference would be that the
Eclipse is 4" wider, the seat doesn't lean back as much, the wheelbase and length aren't quite as
long, the seat is slightly higher in the Eclipse and the bottom bracket is slightly lower.

To answer your last question, I didn't know about the Meteor, so it wasn't one of my options. My
primary options were the Greenspeed GTO and the Trice Explorer, Classic and Ecslipse.

I was actually leaning towards the Explorer for a long time, but became convinced that I wanted a
pure derailleur system vs. having either an SRAM Dual Drive or Schumpf bottom bracket Mountain Drive
or Speed Drive. While those things are neat and they yield a great range of gears, I read too many
accounts of mechanical trouble and loss of drive train efficiency. (Not trying to start a debate...I
just decided on the "simpler" solution, although the Schlumpf advocates might argue that doing away
with the front derailleur would be even simpler.)

Once I decided on the straight derailleur system I didn't really like the gear range of the Explorer
with the 20" (406) rear wheel. Therefore, I started thinking about the Classic with the 26" (559)
rear wheel. With a 52-42-28 Ultegra in the front and a 11-34 Deore XT in the rear, I think I'll have
a very workable gear range for riding around in the Wisconsin dairyland (rolling hills) as well as
for touring.

When I then heard about the Eclipse, that sounded like an even cooler solution (lower to the ground,
a little more laid back) so I went with that. It still allows for four panniers to be mounted and
room for the sleeping bag on top of the rear rack. I'm looking forward to it and at this point am
just trying finalize my choice of rims, therefore my original question on this newgroup.

Ken

"Mark Stonich" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ken, Unless snow conditions are vastly different in Appleton than they are in Minneapolis, your
biggest problem will be that it's hard to find knobby tires narrow enough for winter riding on the
street in 406 and
559.

On my 2WD trike I started out with a 20" x 1-3/8" (451) on the front and 26" x 1.95" on the back.
After pushing all that rubber through the snow for a few days I swapped out the front for a 20" x
1" and found some old IRC All Terrain 26" x 1.4" for the back. I should have built it with 700s so
I could run 30 or 32mm cyclocross tires in the rear.

I believe I've found some fairly decent looking, narrow 26" knobbies at:

michelin-us.comwil mud.htmOpen ↗

These are Michelin WildGripper DH Mud tires. They are 30-559 and reasonably light weight also, at
430g. These might be worth as rear tires for on-road snowy conditions, right?

Mark, you sure are right about a lack of narrow knobbies for the 406, although I haven't looked very
long yet. I've found decent knobbies at 47mm, but nothing narrower, yet. In fact, the most tread
I've found on a 40-406 so far is the Schwalbe Marathons, and that's not much tread. I suppose the
Continental Top Touring 37-406 would another option for a reasonably narrow tire with SOME tread.
Anybody know of anything with more tread in the 30-35mm range for the 406?

Quoted message said:

Your conditions may vary, but here there are only a few days in the spring, when packed snow is
breaking up under you, that fat, low pressure tires would help.

The biggest problem is when cars mash new fallen snow into a compact dense mess that won't
support your weight, then they push it over to the edge where bikes ride. This can be exhausting
with 2 skinny tires, almost impossible with 3 fat ones.

When you say 2WD trike, are you saying yours is a delta trike with 2 wheels in the back and one in
front and that both rear wheeled are powered?

I wonder how that might effect the choice of tires for riding in snow, if at all, versus the tadpole
trike with two front wheels. I'd guess that it is equally important to have good traction in the
front and it probably makes sense in both cases to go fairly narrow in the front...anyway know
differently?

Quoted message said:

Caveat; If you are going off-road, ignore the above and go for all the flotation you can get.

OK...say, have you seen that there are 3 inch wide tires available. (But not in 406 as far as I can
tell) That was news to me. See:

nokiantyres.comindex.htmlOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

I've been thinking that a better option might be the Sun Rhyno Lite rims for the front with 22mm
inner rim width and Rhyno Lite XL rims which have a
23.5mm inner rim width. Opinions on Alex DV15's, the Rhynos or other suggestions would be very
welcome. Also, does anyone think I'm trying to cover too broad of a range of uses and tire
widths with one set of rims?

You might want to check out this link to Sheldon Brown's dissertation on wheels and tires. Scroll
down near the bottom to the technicolor chart. Genuflecting is optional.

"Ken Huizenga" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Mark, you sure are right about a lack of narrow knobbies for the 406, although I haven't looked
very long yet. I've found decent knobbies at 47mm, but nothing narrower, yet. In fact, the most
tread I've found on

a

Quoted message said:

40-406 so far is the Schwalbe Marathons, and that's not much tread. I suppose the Continental Top
Touring 37-406 would another option for a reasonably narrow tire with SOME tread. Anybody know of
anything with

more

Quoted message said:

tread in the 30-35mm range for the 406?

Did a little search on the net and came up with what looks like a decent possibility:

Maxxis Holy Roller, available in both 20 x 1 1/8 and 20 x 1 3/8 (and many wider sizes)
jrbicycles.commaxxisholyrollertires.htmOpen ↗

I would guess these are 406's but not sure. Maybe 28-406 and 35-460?

Ken

Ken Huizenga said:

... Did a little search on the net and came up with what looks like a decent possibility:

Maxxis Holy Roller, available in both 20 x 1 1/8 and 20 x 1 3/8 (and many wider sizes)
jrbicycles.commaxxisholyrollertires.htmOpen ↗

I would guess these are 406's but not sure. Maybe 28-406 and 35-460?

If they are following convention, the two tires are ISO 451-mm size. See
Mr. Brown's web page for more information. [1]

In my opinion, the lack of ISO sizing information on tires, rims, catalogs and websites is
unconscionable.

[1] <http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire_sizing.html>

Tom Sherman - Planet Earth

Mark Stonich <[email hidden]> wrote:
: Ken, Unless snow conditions are vastly different in Appleton than they are in Minneapolis, your
: biggest problem will be that it's hard to find knobby tires narrow enough for winter riding on the
: street in 406 and
: 559.

Maybe those Conti TT2000s have a use after all? Winter was what I had in mind when buying them,
actually...

The smooth threadless center might be a problem though?

: On my 2WD trike I started out with a 20" x 1-3/8" (451) on the front and 26" x 1.95" on the
: back. After pushing all that rubber through the snow for a few days I swapped out the front for
: a 20" x 1" and

Which tire is that 20"x1"?

--
Risto Varanka | helsinki.fihpv.htmlOpen ↗ varis at no spam please iki fi

Sounds a lot like my Classic. Are we going round in circles with spec. The new Trice (plural) all
seem to be going for a 26" rear wheel and that's what the original Trice had when it was taken over
by Neil and Chris! Hope you enjoy your new trike and my feeling is to put your trust in the ICE
guys. My experiance says they know what they are about.

SW

"Ken Huizenga" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I am in the process of spec'ing a new Trice with ICE. It will have 20"
(406) front wheels with Deore mechanical disk brakes and a 26" (559) rear wheel with a rear
parking brake. It is a new model called the Eclipse, which is basically an XL with a 26"
rear wheel instead of the third 20" wheel of the XL.

My apologies, here is the link:

sheldonbrown.comtire sizing.htmlOpen ↗

[email hidden] wrote

Quoted message said:

Which tire is that 20"x1"?

Oops my bad, I just checked and it's nominally a 1-1/8". However, it measures just under an inch.
It's an AAPro, a brand I'd never heard of. But I got it for $3 at a close out sale.

A much better tire, is the Tioga (or Mitsubishi) Comp III. It's available in 1-1/8" & 1-3/8". I ran
the 1-3/8" for years on my old 2 wheel commuter. Didn't work bad on dry pavement either. I wouldn't
remove it in the spring till I got a flat tire. Some years I used it all summer.

"Ken Huizenga" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I believe I've found some fairly decent looking, narrow 26" knobbies at:

michelin-us.comwil mud.htmOpen ↗

Neat, haven't seen that before.

Quoted message said:

Mark, you sure are right about a lack of narrow knobbies for the 406, although I haven't looked
very long yet. I've found decent knobbies at 47mm, but nothing narrower, yet. In fact, the most
tread I've found onthe a 40-406 so far is the Schwalbe Marathons, and that's not much tread. I
suppose the Continental Top Touring 37-406 would another option for a reasonably narrow tire with
SOME tread. Anybody know of anything with more tread in the 30-35mm range for the 406?

No, but the TT should work. A bit wide, but the Tioga Comp III is available in 1.5" and has a tread
that works well in a variety of conditions.

Quoted message said:

When you say 2WD trike, are you saying yours is a delta trike with 2 wheels in the back and one in
front and that both rear wheeled are powered?

Yes

Quoted message said:

I wonder how that might effect the choice of tires for riding in snow, if at all, versus the
tadpole trike with two front wheels.

With almost 80% of the weight on the driving wheels, I don't have to sacrifice ride or rolling
resistance to maximize traction.

Quoted message said:

I'd guess that it is equally important to have good traction in the front and it probably makes
sense in both cases to go fairly narrow in the front...anyway know differently?

Most people I know who ride trikes in winter don't worry as much about traction in the front.

I forgot to ask you one question about Appleton. Don't they salt the streets there? If so, ARE YOU
NUTS? I'd never expose a new Trice (The only tadpoles I have any respect for) to road salt. I've 35
winter's of biking experience, and the one constant battle is corrosion.

Save your Trice. Buy an EZ-3 for winter.