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TR: Cnicht

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
27 April 2005
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4 May 2005
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Rudi Winter
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  1. Having picked up quite a few good ideas for walks and informed
    opinion on equipment here, I thought people might enjoy a trip report
    of a very pleasant (if somewhat strenuous) day spent in the Moelwyn
    range and on Cnicht last Sunday.

    I got to Maentwrog by quarter to twelve, parked on the little road
    from Tan y Bwlch station to Croesor (SH647421), and set off down the
    road towards the station, which was almost deserted despite the fine
    weather. From there, a short nature trail leads down to Llyn Mair,
    and after a few metres of road walking, I took a forest track
    (SH655413) skirting around y Garnedd, the hill that the Ffestiniog
    railway crosses in a tunnel. After a while, the path passes to the
    left of a cattle grid; from here on it is really pleasant walking
    through leafy forest and grassy hillside, always near the track of
    the railway. I met quite a long but almost empty train near Coed y
    Bleiddiau, the wolfs' wood. The beasts were not at home, though.
    Carrying on along the railway track, I came through Dduallt station,
    where there is a closed loop in the track to allow the railway to
    gain a few metres in height. A bit further up, it becomes obvious
    why this must have been built: A branch line goes straight into a
    dead-end tunnel south of Tanygrisiau reservoir. They must have
    decided to build the reservoir when the railway was half finished!
    I can imagine how some friendly words must have been exchanged at the
    time...

    I had lunch on a little hill just to the south of the lake while
    watching a father trying to steer his two kids around the lake
    despite all the thrilling stuff such as the railway crossing or the
    water gauge at the stream feeding into the reservoir.

    From here my plan was to follow the RoW shown on the OS map that goes
    from SH677438 near Tanygrisiau reservoir to Llyn Stwlan, the upper
    lake of the pump-storage system at Tanygrisiau. However, the
    only place that looks as it might be the start of a path up the hill
    is just after crossing a bridge on the lakeside path. This leads
    straight into very steep rocks, and it didn't look right to me. On a
    previous occasion, I had already found a way up there, but that
    involved very wet feet... So I just carried on towards the power
    station and followed its fence up the hill - quite steep without a
    path, but fairly good going. The massive dam of Llyn Stwlan can be
    climbed via a path through the rocks to the left. They had managed
    to drive a huge crane up the ridiculously steep access road to
    the dam on the opposite side!

    Approaching Bwlch Stwlan, the pass between Moelwyn Mawr and Bach, I
    was surprised by quite a strong wind - it had been very calm all the
    way up to Llyn Stwlan. The wind was so strong that I chickened out
    of the somewhat exposed bottom end of Craigysgafn and rather went
    round Moelwyn Mawr on the east side.

    From the top of the path near SH663449, I went on northwards between
    the quarried holes in the ground and down to Rhosydd quarry. The area
    has a peculiar atmosphere to it - it feels pretty isolated, but it
    must have been a very busy place in the early days of industrialisation.
    These days, unfortunately, the place is dug up by motorcycles. Two of
    them provided the fitting sound on Sunday afternoon, which could be
    heard from far away.

    Snowdon and Crib Goch firm in view, I made my way northwestward. The
    RoWs on the map aren't noticeable on the ground but it is fairly easy
    in good weather to head in the right direction, towards Llyn yr Adar
    at SH655480. Keep to high ground; the views are great, and the
    valley is cut out very deep!

    I had a long rest lying in the sun and staring down Cwm Croesor, and
    then moved towards Llyn yr Adar, turning left onto the long flat
    Cnicht ridge just before reaching the lake. Up onto Cnicht - the
    views down into Cwm Croesor getting even better from a bird's eye
    perspective. On the way down from Cnicht, I must have taken a wrong
    turn and found myself on the west side of the hill in frighteningly
    steep terrain and without any path. At one point I had to resort to
    sitting down as the places to step on were further apart than my legs
    are long. From below, I could see where I should have been - got to
    be more careful next time!

    After the day's work was done, there remained a short and enjoyable
    descent to Croesor, overlooking Tremadog bay, and a long and
    exhausting slog along the road back to the car. It was rather late
    (just before sunset actually), and I decided to go to Porthmadog to
    get some food and drink before driving home.

    It was quite an exhausting and long day, but with excellent weather
    and views. I could have done without the Cnicht adventure, though...
    My tracklog says I climbed 1280m although the highest point was below
    700m!

    --
    Rudi Winter, Aberystwyth, Wales

  2. On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 12:46:32 +0000 (UTC), [email hidden] (Rudi

    Winter) said:

    Having picked up quite a few good ideas for walks and informed
    opinion on equipment here, I thought people might enjoy a trip report
    of a very pleasant (if somewhat strenuous) day spent in the Moelwyn
    range and on Cnicht last Sunday.

    <sniplet>

    Great TR, thanks v. much :-)

    Best wishes,
    --
    ,,
    (**)PeeWiglet~~
    / \ / \ pee AT [guessthisbit].co.uk

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  3. The message <[email hidden]>
    from [email hidden] (Rudi Winter) contains these words:

    Quoted message said:

    Carrying on along the railway track, I came through Dduallt station,
    where there is a closed loop in the track to allow the railway to
    gain a few metres in height. A bit further up, it becomes obvious
    why this must have been built: A branch line goes straight into a
    dead-end tunnel south of Tanygrisiau reservoir. They must have
    decided to build the reservoir when the railway was half finished!
    I can imagine how some friendly words must have been exchanged at the
    time...

    Back in the early 70s I had a flatmate who was a volunteer on the
    Ffestiniog railway. He was an extensionist (or some similar name) - one
    of those who worked on extending the track back to Ffestiniog rather
    than playing with toy trains on the existing track. ISTR he said that
    the dam was built during the period between the original railway
    expiring and the conservationists reviving it. I think there was some
    compensation paid for blocking the original route which, like all
    railways, had been established by Act of Parliament.

    --
    Roger Chapman so far this year 34 summits
    New - 15 (Marilyns 4, Sweats 1, Outlying Fells 10)
    Repeats - 19 (Marilyns 5, Sweats 10, Wainwrights 12, Outlying Fells 0)

  4. Roger said:

    The message <[email hidden]>
    from [email hidden] (Rudi Winter) contains these words:

    than playing with toy trains on the existing track. ISTR he said that
    the dam was built during the period between the original railway
    expiring and the conservationists reviving it. I think there was some
    compensation paid for blocking the original route which, like all
    railways, had been established by Act of Parliament.

    I think the dam is on the northeast side of the lake, towards Tanygrisiau.
    The dead tunnel is in what looks rather like a natural hill at the south
    end. I don't think there ever was an exit towards where the lake is now.
    On the other hand, the existing track by the lake has clearly been built
    after the reservoir had been created.

    Anyway, all this doesn't help finding a direct way to walk up to Llyn
    Stwlan... I'll have another try in a while!

    --
    Rudi Winter, Aberystwyth, Wales

  5. Roger said:

    The message <[email hidden]>
    from [email hidden] (Rudi Winter) contains these words:

    Quoted message said:

    Carrying on along the railway track, I came through Dduallt station,
    where there is a closed loop in the track to allow the railway to
    gain a few metres in height. A bit further up, it becomes obvious
    why this must have been built: A branch line goes straight into a
    dead-end tunnel south of Tanygrisiau reservoir. They must have
    decided to build the reservoir when the railway was half finished!
    I can imagine how some friendly words must have been exchanged at the
    time...

    Back in the early 70s I had a flatmate who was a volunteer on the
    Ffestiniog railway. He was an extensionist (or some similar name) - one
    of those who worked on extending the track back to Ffestiniog rather
    than playing with toy trains on the existing track. ISTR he said that
    the dam was built during the period between the original railway
    expiring and the conservationists reviving it. I think there was some
    compensation paid for blocking the original route which, like all
    railways, had been established by Act of Parliament.

    I believe it was a pretty close run thing whether they got the dam
    built or kept the original route of the railway. I think the railway
    people tried to run a train up to Blaenau Ffestiniog to prove that the
    railway was still operational and were pelted with stones by the
    locals who wanted the money from the jobs on the dam.

    The joke about the Little Trains of Wales used to be that they didn't
    run to where they said they did. The Talyllyn doesn't go "there" and
    the Ffestiniog didn't either.
    --
    Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

  6. Rudi Winter said:
    Roger said:

    The message <[email hidden]>
    from [email hidden] (Rudi Winter) contains these words:

    than playing with toy trains on the existing track. ISTR he said that
    the dam was built during the period between the original railway
    expiring and the conservationists reviving it. I think there was some
    compensation paid for blocking the original route which, like all
    railways, had been established by Act of Parliament.

    I think the dam is on the northeast side of the lake, towards Tanygrisiau.
    The dead tunnel is in what looks rather like a natural hill at the south
    end. I don't think there ever was an exit towards where the lake is now.
    On the other hand, the existing track by the lake has clearly been built
    after the reservoir had been created.

    The dam wall is indeed at the north of the lake but the old tunnel is
    on a rising gradient into the lake. Remove the plug and a lot of water
    will flow out of it.

    The Ffestiniog was originally a gravity railway. Trains of wagons full
    of slate would be run down the hill with brakemen to Porthmadog and
    then horsepower was used to haul the empties back up.

    http://www.festrail.co.uk/News/slatetosea.htm
    --
    Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

  7. The message <[email hidden]>
    from [email hidden] (Rudi Winter) contains these words:

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    than playing with toy trains on the existing track. ISTR he said that
    the dam was built during the period between the original railway
    expiring and the conservationists reviving it. I think there was some
    compensation paid for blocking the original route which, like all
    railways, had been established by Act of Parliament.

    Quoted message said:

    I think the dam is on the northeast side of the lake, towards Tanygrisiau.

    According to the 1" it is at the North end of the lake, facing due East.

    Quoted message said:

    The dead tunnel is in what looks rather like a natural hill at the south
    end. I don't think there ever was an exit towards where the lake is now.

    Oh come on, where on earth would the tunnel have come out if not in the
    valley immediately the other side of the ridge. Even the replacement
    track has a short tunnel through that same ridge.

    The 1" (1967) shows the situation as it was at the time. Track up to the
    beginning of the tunnel (course of disused tunnel shown right to waters
    edge and track again from the then disused station at Tanygrisiau. The
    reason the track had to be diverted was because the valley was flooded
    to above the level of the North end of the tunnel.

    Incidentally there was no station then between the last open one at
    Creuau and the South end of the tunnel.

    Quoted message said:

    On the other hand, the existing track by the lake has clearly been built
    after the reservoir had been created.

    Yes.

    Quoted message said:

    Anyway, all this doesn't help finding a direct way to walk up to Llyn
    Stwlan... I'll have another try in a while!

    Can't help you there although if the 1" is to be trusted you should be
    able to wend you way up the hill almost anywhere North of the path you
    couldn't find even if you can't locate either of the other paths shown
    on the map.

    --
    Roger Chapman so far this year 34 summits
    New - 15 (Marilyns 4, Sweats 1, Outlying Fells 10)
    Repeats - 19 (Marilyns 5, Sweats 10, Wainwrights 12, Outlying Fells 0)

  8. Roger said:

    Oh come on, where on earth would the tunnel have come out if not in the
    valley immediately the other side of the ridge. Even the replacement

    Well, nowhere - I thought it had never been finished. But from what
    you say based on the old map, and from what Phil says it's clear that
    it's just been filled up when the reservoir was built. Thanks, both!

    Quoted message said:

    Can't help you there although if the 1" is to be trusted you should be
    able to wend you way up the hill almost anywhere North of the path you
    couldn't find even if you can't locate either of the other paths shown
    on the map.

    Yes, I did some time last year, starting from about halfway between the
    abandoned mine and the power station. This was quite nice higher up but
    the bottom section was very boggy and steep, making me slide back half
    the way each step for a while. Last weekend I noticed that the current
    OS map isn't very accurate in the area: There is another area belonging
    to the power station which is fenced off higher up the hill.
    --
    Rudi Winter, Aberystwyth, Wales

  9. Stuart Mann said:

    The old north tunnel entrance and trackbed are sometimes accessible when the
    water level is low. There was a junction there too - for a branch to the
    quarry east of the reservoir - and the site of an old house by the junction.

    The first trackbed in the area actually went over the hill rather than
    through it, via a water-powered incline. The remains of a small dam are up
    there somewhere.

    I must have a closer look when I'm in the area next! This sounds quite
    interesting, historically.

    Quoted message said:

    I came down that hillside from the Stwlan dama few years ago using a series
    of old wagon inclines. I can't be sure exactly where they are from the
    1:25000 map but I think they correspond to the double dotted line running W-
    E, coming out just south of the power station. The dog-legs and straight
    sections look about right.

    Yes, the double line is the old incline, but some of that area is fenced
    off now. The upper section is fine, though.
    --
    Rudi Winter, Aberystwyth, Wales

  10. [email hidden] (Rudi Winter) wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    The first trackbed in the area actually went over the hill rather than
    through it, via a water-powered incline. The remains of a small dam
    are up there somewhere.

    I must have a closer look when I'm in the area next! This sounds quite
    interesting, historically.


    You've got me going now! I've blown the dust of some references I collected
    years ago and discover that the inclines were only in use for 8 years or so,
    prior to completion of the tunnel in 1842. They were rebuilt once in those 8
    years as they didn't work too well! There are records of the dam being
    partially dismantled - but something must have been left as I remember
    seeing it in my childhood (a little more recent than 1842).

    I've also found a cutting with some superb old pictures of Tunnel North, and
    the old zinc mines nearby when intact. email me at stuart dot mann at
    lineone dot net if you'd like to see them.

    There's so much industrial history lying around in Snowdonia beyond the
    obvious "heritage" stuff and the piles of slate. Spotting and interpreting
    it adds an extra dimension of interest to the pleasure of walking. The walls
    above Llyn Ystradllyn, for example, contain numerous stone sleeper blocks
    from the pre-locomotive days of the railway.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I came down that hillside from the Stwlan dama few years ago using a
    series of old wagon inclines. I can't be sure exactly where they are
    from the 1:25000 map but I think they correspond to the double dotted
    line running W- E, coming out just south of the power station. The
    dog-legs and straight sections look about right.

    Yes, the double line is the old incline, but some of that area is
    fenced off now. The upper section is fine, though.

    Have you walked in Cwm Cwmorthin, near TanyGrisiau? There's an incline up
    there not to be missed. Climb up to the west to Wrysgan quarry and descend
    the incline towards the Power Station. It's one of the steepest in the area
    and goes through a tunnel at the top! DON'T go underground in the mine
    itself - sections of all the mines in that area are in a state of collapse -
    but the very short tunnel on the incline itself is a most entertaining way
    off the hill! It's very obvious from below.

    Stuart

  11. Stuart Mann said:

    There's so much industrial history lying around in Snowdonia beyond the
    obvious "heritage" stuff and the piles of slate. Spotting and interpreting
    it adds an extra dimension of interest to the pleasure of walking. The walls

    That's the thing - I don't know much detail about early Snowdonian industry,
    but the ruins and inclines and holes in the ground do seem to tell a few
    interesting stories.

    Quoted message said:

    Have you walked in Cwm Cwmorthin, near TanyGrisiau? There's an incline up
    there not to be missed. Climb up to the west to Wrysgan quarry and descend
    the incline towards the Power Station. It's one of the steepest in the area
    and goes through a tunnel at the top! DON'T go underground in the mine
    itself - sections of all the mines in that area are in a state of collapse -
    but the very short tunnel on the incline itself is a most entertaining way
    off the hill! It's very obvious from below.

    The tunnel with the big step in the middle? Yes, I went up there a while
    ago on the way up to Moel yr Hydd I think. Quite entertaining indeed!
    --
    Rudi Winter, Aberystwyth, Wales

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