time to replace cartridge bearings?

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Boris

Foelsch) said:

My WTB hub cartridge bearings are feeling loose.

...snip....

Quoted message said:

Is there any harm in just running these until they don't run smoothly?

Can they be tightened without replacing them?

In 1997 I bought a bicycle with Sachs Quartz (or Quarz?) hubs. The front wheel was loose from the
start, with noticeable play. The generally very competent LBS said this was normal for cartridge
bearing hubs, and that eliminating play would put lateral force on the bearings for which they
weren't designed. Six years and maybe 18,000 service-free km later the front wheel still works fine,
if anything spinning more freely than at the beginning. (The back wheel was a disappointment: The
right and left halves of the freehub decided to part company, and it seemed that they were just a
press fit rather than held together with a hollow bolt as are the Shimano hubs.)

--
Ned Mantei Department of Cell Biology, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology CH-8093 Zurich,
Switzerland

It's true that almost all sealed bearing hubs are better off with a touch of play. Bearings that
are too tight have no play. If you have no play, how do you know if your bearings are too tight?
You don't!

Phil Wood, Bullseye, Specialized, Zipp Ballistic, TNT (some of these are 1980's hubs), and now
Velomax, Mavic, Cane Creek ... all are better off with a trace of play. That way you can be sure the
bearing isn't overloaded.

"kapers" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hiya, If anyone has an old Catalogue from Bullseye Industries with the article innit by Roger
Durham about Cartridge bearings and their "need" for play could they please post it. I'll look for
a copy in my "files" but if one turns up here beforehand that would be great. Very informative and
a good read. Be Well. Keith.

*------------------------------------------------*
* *
* "The knack lies in learning to throw yourself *
* -at the ground and miss" *
* D. Adams. *
* * *----------------------
-------------------------
---*

"Ned Mantei" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Boris

Foelsch) said:

My WTB hub cartridge bearings are feeling loose.

...snip....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Is there any harm in just running these until they don't run smoothly?

Can they be tightened without replacing them?

In 1997 I bought a bicycle with Sachs Quartz (or Quarz?) hubs. The front wheel was loose from
the start, with noticeable play. The generally very competent LBS said this was normal for
cartridge bearing hubs, and that eliminating play would put lateral force on the bearings for
which they weren't designed. Six years and maybe 18,000 service-free km later the front wheel
still works fine, if anything spinning more freely than at the beginning. (The back wheel was a
disappointment: The right and left halves of the freehub decided to part company, and it seemed
that they were just a press fit rather than held together with a hollow bolt as are the Shimano
hubs.)

--
Ned Mantei Department of Cell Biology, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology CH-8093 Zurich,
Switzerland

I've always read that you want to have no play and you tell it they're too tight by spinning them --
they should spin freely and have no play.

David

almost fast said:

It's true that almost all sealed bearing hubs are better off with a touch of play. Bearings that
are too tight have no play. If you have no play, how do you know if your bearings are too tight?
You don't!

Phil Wood, Bullseye, Specialized, Zipp Ballistic, TNT (some of these are 1980's hubs), and now
Velomax, Mavic, Cane Creek ... all are better off with a trace of play. That way you can be sure
the bearing isn't overloaded.

"kapers" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hiya, If anyone has an old Catalogue from Bullseye Industries with the article innit by Roger
Durham about Cartridge bearings and their "need" for play could they please post it. I'll look for
a copy in my "files" but if one turns up here beforehand that would be great. Very informative and
a good read. Be Well. Keith.

*------------------------------------------------*
* *
* "The knack lies in learning to throw yourself *
* -at the ground and miss" *
* D. Adams. *
* * *----------------------
-------------------------
---*

"Ned Mantei" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Boris
Foelsch) wrote:

>My WTB hub cartridge bearings are feeling loose.

...snip....

Quoted message said:

>Is there any harm in just running these until they don't run smoothly?
>
>Can they be tightened without replacing them?
>

In 1997 I bought a bicycle with Sachs Quartz (or Quarz?) hubs. The front wheel was loose from
the start, with noticeable play. The generally very competent LBS said this was normal for
cartridge bearing hubs, and that eliminating play would put lateral force on the bearings for
which they weren't designed. Six years and maybe 18,000 service-free km later the front wheel
still works fine, if anything spinning more freely than at the beginning. (The back wheel was
a disappointment: The right and left halves of the freehub decided to part company, and it
seemed that they were just a press fit rather than held together with a hollow bolt as are the
Shimano hubs.)

--
Ned Mantei Department of Cell Biology, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology CH-8093 Zurich,
Switzerland

"Boris Foelsch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

My WTB hub cartridge bearings are feeling loose. I didn't realize they were cartridge bearings
until I couldn't find cones to tighten. They spin smooth and long my LBS recently told me that
they didn't need to be replaced. I thought it was time just based on abuse and mileage, but they
said it was up to me and not strictly necessary. A special tool is apparently required to press
them in and I don't have it.

Anyway, the looseness is something I'm uncomfortable with since I'm used to cone type bearings.

Is there any harm in just running these until they don't run smoothly?

Can they be tightened without replacing them?

The normally helpful www.parktool.com has nothing on cartridge bearings.

Yes those series of bearings should be readliy available at any competent LBS or your local bearing
supply. Prices ( and quality) range from $3 to $15 each.

The size is on the seal - something like 6002, 6003, etc, followed by letters denoting the shield
type. You do not necessarily need both sides shielded since there's no water coming at it from
the inside!

This type of bearing is normally delivered with oil - enough to keep the balls from rusting and no
more. Lift the outer shield carfully with a jeweler's screwdriver or a pick and fill the space with
a good bearing grease. Any of a wide range of products will be fine ( our preference is Lubriplate
130AA) but do add some grease before installation. Reseat the seal carrefully so as not to crimp it.

Some amount of sideplay is normal and in fact inherent to this type of bearing. It can be minimized
but not eliminated.

Installation tools can be easily fabricated from a large bolt and spacers. Ensure you press on the
outer case and arrange things so you do not press _across_ the bearing ( for example pushing on the
inner case to mount the outside in a snug bore)

Running the bearing until it is dead won't hurt anything. Even a very rough/worn bearing is of
minimal import to the overall efficiency of a bicycle. And a worn/damaged cartridge bearing doesn't
affect anything else so you needn't hurry .
--
Andrew Muzi yellowjersey.orgyellowjersey.orgOpen ↗ Open every day since 1 April 1971

Hiya, If anyone has an old Catalogue from Bullseye Industries with the article innit by Roger Durham
about Cartridge bearings and their "need" for play could they please post it. I'll look for a copy
in my "files" but if one turns up here beforehand that would be great. Very informative and a good
read. Be Well. Keith.

*------------------------------------------------*
* *
* "The knack lies in learning to throw yourself *
* -at the ground and miss" *
* D. Adams. *
* * *------------------------
-------------------------*

"Ned Mantei" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Boris

Foelsch) said:

My WTB hub cartridge bearings are feeling loose.

...snip....

Quoted message said:

Is there any harm in just running these until they don't run smoothly?

Can they be tightened without replacing them?

In 1997 I bought a bicycle with Sachs Quartz (or Quarz?) hubs. The front wheel was loose from
the start, with noticeable play. The generally very competent LBS said this was normal for
cartridge bearing hubs, and that eliminating play would put lateral force on the bearings for
which they weren't designed. Six years and maybe 18,000 service-free km later the front wheel
still works fine, if anything spinning more freely than at the beginning. (The back wheel was
a disappointment: The right and left halves of the freehub decided to part company, and it
seemed that they were just a press fit rather than held together with a hollow bolt as are the
Shimano hubs.)

--
Ned Mantei Department of Cell Biology, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology CH-8093 Zurich,
Switzerland

Yes, "freely" is how you want bearings to spin. And there is sometimes a "perfect" adjustment, with
no play and near-zero preload (say, less than about 5 pounds, depending on the size of the bearing
and other factors like degree of misalignment).

But slightly overload the bearings (for example, when the skewer tightens), and they still spin
"freely" ... for a little while! ;-)

When there is a trace of play, then you *know* it's not overloaded.

David Kunz <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I've always read that you want to have no play and you tell it they're too tight by spinning them
-- they should spin freely and have no play.

David

almost fast said:

It's true that almost all sealed bearing hubs are better off with a touch of play. Bearings that
are too tight have no play. If you have no play, how do you know if your bearings are too tight?
You don't!

Phil Wood, Bullseye, Specialized, Zipp Ballistic, TNT (some of these are 1980's hubs), and now
Velomax, Mavic, Cane Creek ... all are better off with a trace of play. That way you can be sure
the bearing isn't overloaded.