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Things drivers get up to ...

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UK and Europe
Published
18 April 2007
Last activity
19 April 2007
Original author
Nick Kew
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25
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  1. Monday's brief started at five-something p.m., a potentially
    busy time on the main roads. Avoiding the main roads, I counted
    about two other moving vehicles per mile.

    The first was more-or-less immediate. As I set off up the hill,
    I have to move out to pass a row of parked cars. The white van
    behind me could have cut me up by accelerating into that space
    before me, but instead, he patiently slowed down until the
    far end of the parked cars.

    A little higher up the hill, it goes under a railway bridge,
    with a narrowing and a sign giving priority to traffic going
    my direction. In fact there's ample room to meet there, so
    the red van coming the other way needn't have stopped and
    waited at all. But he did. All very cheery.

    Further up again, vehicle #3 was a clapped out old hippiemobile
    coming in the opposite direction. She too could have passed
    the parked car on her side before we met, but held back until
    after I'd passed.

    It was near the two mile mark, on the next uphill after a flat
    stretch, that vehicle #4 was the first not to go out of its way
    in some minor manor to show courtesy. There was ample clear
    space to pass safely, so he did.

    After that I counted vehicles. Number 18, several miles later,
    was the first to pass a little closer than strictly comfortable.
    Next one (#19) was the first fellow cyclist:-)

    To those who notice only the bad (like, some who post here),
    try this experiment sometime. Count individual road users of
    all types, and class them as good, neutral or bad. You might
    be pleasantly surprised!

    --
    not me guv

    I'm able-bodied. Why should I want a car?

  2. Nick Kew said the following on 18/04/2007 14:26:

    Quoted message said:

    To those who notice only the bad (like, some who post here),
    try this experiment sometime. Count individual road users of
    all types, and class them as good, neutral or bad. You might
    be pleasantly surprised!

    Just curious - what part of the country are you in? I notice a hell of
    a difference between cycling in Somerset (bad) and east-ish of Lincoln
    (good).

    --
    Paul Boyd
    http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

  3. Nick Kew said:

    To those who notice only the bad (like, some who post here),
    try this experiment sometime. Count individual road users of
    all types, and class them as good, neutral or bad. You might
    be pleasantly surprised!

    Yesterday, as I came up to a miniroundabout I had to stop for a vehicle
    approaching rapidly to my left - who proceeded to turn left without a hint of an
    indication. A 'fellow' cyclist (complete with lycra and helmet, riding a racing
    bike).

    A little later going down a road with cars parked down both sides two WVM
    stopped to let me through.

    The number of times car drivers go out of their way to be helpful/extra safe far
    outweighs the occasional time one acts like an idiot.

  4. "Ziggy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    The number of times car drivers go out of their way to be helpful/extra
    safe far
    outweighs the occasional time one acts like an idiot.

    It's true, there's a lot of good drivers out there. Unfortunately I'd say
    most people (me included) only notice or remember the bad things.

    It's the same with everything railways, supermarkets etc.
    --
    peter

    Cheap train tickets database
    http://www.petereverett.co.uk/tickets/

    Email sent to this address is generally deleted upon arrival
    Visit website if you want to contact me

  5. Nick Kew said:

    To those who notice only the bad (like, some who post here),
    try this experiment sometime. Count individual road users of
    all types, and class them as good, neutral or bad. You might
    be pleasantly surprised!

    Right now my regular commute involves only one busy road onto which I
    must turn right. Vans and lorries frequently slow and wave to let me
    cross.

  6. In article <[email hidden]>,
    Nick Kew <[email hidden]> writes:
    |>
    |> To those who notice only the bad (like, some who post here),
    |> try this experiment sometime. Count individual road users of
    |> all types, and class them as good, neutral or bad. You might
    |> be pleasantly surprised!

    I did, erratically, for a decade - both around Cambridge and in some
    places elsewhere. One of the lesser reasons that I gave up commuting
    was that the number of bad had got far higher than elsewhere, and
    that the number that were actively malicious was increasing rapidly.
    It is the last category that scared me and eventually injured me.

    Regards,
    Nick Maclaren.

  7. On Wed, 18 Apr 2007 15:07:50 +0100

    Paul Boyd usenet.dont.work@plusnet said:

    Nick Kew said the following on 18/04/2007 14:26:

    Quoted message said:

    To those who notice only the bad (like, some who post here),
    try this experiment sometime. Count individual road users of
    all types, and class them as good, neutral or bad. You might
    be pleasantly surprised!

    Just curious - what part of the country are you in?

    West Devon. The ride I mentioned was partly in the area best
    known as Dartmoor, partly in the rather narrow strip between
    that and cornish border.

    --
    not me guv

    I'm able-bodied. Why should I want a car?

  8. naked_draughtsman said the following on 18/04/2007 15:16:

    Quoted message said:

    It's the same with everything railways, supermarkets etc.

    This is why newspapers carry stories like "man gets ripped off on eBay"
    instead of "millions of people happy with eBay purchases", for instance.

    People seem to like to hear and talk about bad news, which is why the
    media is full of it. Any good news is presented as a light-hearted "oh,
    by the way..." at the end :-)

    --
    Paul Boyd
    http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

  9. Paul Boyd usenet.dont.work@plusnet said:

    naked_draughtsman said the following on 18/04/2007 15:16:

    Quoted message said:

    It's the same with everything railways, supermarkets etc.

    This is why newspapers carry stories like "man gets ripped off on eBay"
    instead of "millions of people happy with eBay purchases", for instance.

    Unfortunately, thousands of people get ripped off on ebay.

    Whilst I'd agree with you in general, I think it's important that the dangers of
    ebay are publicised because it's a haven for scam artists.

    It's true that the vast majority of transactions go off without a hitch but
    people do need to be made aware of the dangers.

  10. (Ziggy) said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    It's the same with everything railways, supermarkets etc.


    Unfortunately, thousands of people get ripped off on ebay.
    Whilst I'd agree with you in general, I think it's important that the dangers of
    ebay are publicised because it's a haven for scam artists.
    It's true that the vast majority of transactions go off without a hitch but
    people do need to be made aware of the dangers.

    Just like cycling then

  11. Nick Kew said:

    To those who notice only the bad (like, some who post here),
    try this experiment sometime. Count individual road users of
    all types, and class them as good, neutral or bad. You might
    be pleasantly surprised!

    As a side point, I find that the sex and age of drive matters.
    Generally, women are better at overtaking but overall, the middle-aged
    are the best. By 'best' I mean leaving sufficient margin between car
    and bike, not driving too fast, and not swerving excessively. At the
    bottom are young men in not-so-new cars.
    (Note, this is from my daily commute 'around' Reading University
    campus which includes narrow but relatively busy roads. I've cycled a
    bit in Durham and Cambridge on similar, and generally these were
    better, and in London which is usually a dire experience.)

    Ali

  12. Some of the best an most considerate driving I have seen is by those
    who drive for a living (including WMV, though I must admit, not
    usually taxis) maybe 'cos they are very experienced drivers.
    Motorcyclists too - perhaps because they better understand your
    position on the road and how much overtaking space is needed to pass a
    two wheeler, better than drivers with four wheels. I think that the
    less experienced drivers are the ones who are more likely to do silly
    things. Thinking about it, I reckon I have been mostly cut up or
    overtaken too close and at the worst possible place on the road, by
    younger men and women, rather than older and possibly more experienced
    ones.

    IIRC, the VERY FEW deliberate attempts to force me off the road, or to
    not let me pass, and most leering from windows has been either from
    young-ish chavs and idiot-boyz in clapped out old bangers or I have
    had the occasional older and posher BMW (man) deliberately blocking my
    path, although they tend not to also leer and throw things from the
    window whilst doing it. Basically anyone can be deliberately rude and
    dangerous, but it's more likely to be the inexperienced who just make
    mistakes.

  13. zvesda said the following on 19/04/2007 10:05:

    Quoted message said:

    As a side point, I find that the sex and age of drive matters.
    Generally, women are better at overtaking but overall, the middle-aged
    are the best. By 'best' I mean leaving sufficient margin between car
    and bike, not driving too fast, and not swerving excessively. At the
    bottom are young men in not-so-new cars.

    Around Weston-super-Mare, I would rate young girls in relatively new
    cars pretty close to the bottom for dangerous driving. Mind you, I
    would also rate oldies in Nissan Micras not far off the bottom as well -
    these seem to have supplanted beige Metros!

    I saw an amusing incident the other week, which has no relevance to
    cycling! A bus was stopped at a bus stop lay-by, as they do. A car
    driven by someone of distinctly pensionable age parked behind the bus,
    then perhaps realised they shouldn't be there. So she pulled out to
    rejoin the road. Except that she didn't actually seem to understand how
    wide the bus was and caught her front wing on the corner. Then kept
    going, slowly, steering into the bus, and apparently ignoring the loud
    shrieks of tortured metal and squeal of tyres being pushed sideways.
    The bus had a scuff, the car had deep denting all down the wing and both
    nearside doors, with bits of trim hanging off all over the place. She
    eventually decided that perhaps she really ought to stop. Whoops!

    --
    Paul Boyd
    http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

  14. Ziggy said the following on 19/04/2007 10:58:

    Quoted message said:

    If it was such a bad example (which, IMO, it was), wouldn't it have been better
    to change the example to one that was less contentious?

    Not really, no. It was not a bad example, and isn't particularly
    contentious in a cycling forum. It was just a neutral (in this forum)
    illustration of how the media pick up on the bad things and not the
    good. If I'd used the example "cyclist dies because he wasn't wearing a
    helmet" vs "lots of cyclists continue to live despite not wearing
    helmets" then that could be contentious here.

    The reason I deleted the line was that I didn't think anyone would
    actually bother picking up on it. If you want to discuss eBay security
    issues, then their discussion forums are the place to do that.

    --
    Paul Boyd
    http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

  15. Paul Boyd usenet.dont.work@plusnet said:

    Ziggy said the following on 19/04/2007 10:58:

    Quoted message said:

    If it was such a bad example (which, IMO, it was), wouldn't it have been better
    to change the example to one that was less contentious?

    Not really, no. It was not a bad example, and isn't particularly
    contentious in a cycling forum.

    It is a bad example because there are a lot of people being caught out on ebay
    *because they are not being made sufficiently aware of the dangers*.

    Some of those people will be cyclists.

    A better example would have been one where the dangers were well known but the
    media continue to highlight them to a disproportionate extent.

    Quoted message said:

    The reason I deleted the line was that I didn't think anyone would
    actually bother picking up on it.

    If you didn't think that, then you would not have inserted the line in the first
    place.

    You obviously knew there was room for disagreement with your example but you
    posted it anyway.

    This may be because you are unaware of the extent of the dangers of using ebay.

    Quoted message said:

    If you want to discuss eBay security
    issues, then their discussion forums are the place to do that.

    That's up to you, really, isn't it?

    I didn't want to discuss them. I simply wanted to make sure people knew that
    there *are* very real dangers in dealing on ebay - someting that your original
    post might have lead them to believe was not te case.

    *You* are making a discussion out of it. You could have simply let my comment
    stand, but decided to start a debate :-)

  16. You have just joined Matt B.

    Bye!

    --
    Paul Boyd
    http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

  17. Paul Boyd usenet.dont.work@plusnet said:

    You have just joined Matt B.

    Bye!

    That's right, little fellow.

    If you start something you can't finish, just run away.

  18. Nick Kew said:

    To those who notice only the bad (like, some who post here),
    try this experiment sometime. Count individual road users of
    all types, and class them as good, neutral or bad. You might
    be pleasantly surprised!

    --


    'Tis generally true, most motorists are courteous and considerate. I
    always try to acknowledge and reward considerate driving. Just as
    I'll 'phone up a bus company whose driver has just cut in on me before
    completing his overtaking manoevre, I'll do the same to the haulage
    company whose lorry has patiently waited behind me for 400m rather
    than risk overtaking when there's on-coming traffic.

    Unfortunately it only takes one to completely ruin your life. I
    nearly met this one approaching a mini roundabout from my left on
    Sunday afternoon. The roundabout was clear, I entered it, being
    conscious of the engine noise out of sight on my left. Eventually he
    came into view, heading straight onto the roundabout. Oh dear, the
    bit of tarmac for which he was heading was exactly the same as the one
    for which I was heading. In fact, by this time I was on the bit of
    tarmac, and he was about to arrive at it.

    I turned to my right, into the inside of the roundabout, and luckily
    at the last minute he saw me (I was the big guy on a big bike 10m
    directly in front of his windscreen in bright sunshine at 3.00pm, so
    obviously was pretty difficult to spot). and swerved to his left, to
    the outside of the roundabout. An apologetic wave of the hand and he
    was off, having completed his manoeuvre at about 30mph. I in the
    meantime, was leaning on the AirZound (haven't had to use it for
    weeks; it holds its pressure brilliantly) and using language such that
    I would condemn my kids for using.

    This roundabout has bad vibes for me. My son was knocked off his bike
    there 18 months ago, in a slow-speed version of what I've just
    described.

    Deep breaths, curses for not noting number plate, but anyway,
    hopefully he'll be awake next time.
    <switch to parallel universe inhabited by "safespeed" (sic)>
    I blame the fact that there's a speed camera 2 miles away, and by
    drawing his attention to that he was unable to find bandwidth in his
    brain to work out what has happening in front of him. Clearly if all
    the speed cameras were removed, he would have seen me, the roads would
    be safer and all road accidents would be eliminated.
    <switch back to Planet Earth>
    Peter.

  19. Paul Boyd usenet.dont.work@plusnet said:

    I saw an amusing incident the other week, which has no relevance to
    cycling! A bus was stopped at a bus stop lay-by, as they do. A car
    driven by someone of distinctly pensionable age parked behind the bus,
    then perhaps realised they shouldn't be there. So she pulled out to
    rejoin the road. Except that she didn't actually seem to understand how
    wide the bus was and caught her front wing on the corner. Then kept
    going, ...

    These are the ones who worry me most. For my money they're the ones
    most likely to run you over from behind while executing a steeringless
    overtake or simply drive into the side of you at a junction.

    --
    Dave...

  20. Paul Boyd usenet.dont.work@plusnet said:

    Around Weston-super-Mare, I would rate young girls in relatively new
    cars pretty close to the bottom for dangerous driving. Mind you, I
    would also rate oldies in Nissan Micras not far off the bottom as well -

    My first (very minor) collision for a while was an oldie driving a
    Ford Escort. He pulled into a car park at the top of the rise and
    I pulled in beside him. He pointedly ignored me and his passenger
    (who clearly told him I was waiting there) and kept fiddling with his
    sat nav. Well, I wonder why he clipped me(!)

    Most bad drivers seem to be oldies in Nissans or Fords, followed by
    30-somethings in German saloons and School Run Minibuses. Not had any
    trouble with young girl drivers, but I suspect my coastal road gets
    far more oldies and far fewer young girls than Paul's usual route.

    First's drivers on Route 1 seem very good (but they'll look silly if
    a bus crashes here, just like Towens did - sadly the photo isn't online
    yet: http://www.westonandworlenews.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=151374&command=displayContent&sourceNode=151359&contentPK=17134040&folderPk=84808&pNodeId=151409
    ) but Welsh and French tour coaches have been particularly bad!

    Regards,
    --
    MJ Ray - see/vidu http://mjr.towers.org.uk/email.html
    Experienced webmaster-developers for hire http://www.ttllp.co.uk/
    Also: statistician, sysadmin, online shop builder, workers co-op.
    Writing on koha, debian, sat TV, Kewstoke http://mjr.towers.org.uk/

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