the latest surprise

andy gee said:

This is a new one on me; I thought I'd seen everything.

Truck is travelling slowly in the left hand travel lane, I'm riding in
the left hand parking lane (for NYC streets > 40' wide, cycles should be
as close to the right OR left curb as safety allows.) Traffic in the
lane to the right is moving a little faster. Two cars ahead of the
truck are signaling for a left turn, waiting for the pedestrians to
cross. The truck has no signal going -- he could be turning left,
changing lanes to the right, or waiting for the cars ahead to finish
their turns. As I'm coming up, I see what looks like a right turn
signal and the two cars make their left turns; great, I keep going
straight where I am.

What I thought was a right turn signal turned out to be the guy tapping
his brakes, but he had his left brake light out! And he was actually
turning left.

That's pretty easy to spot on a car or on a big rig (I rarely see a guy
with a CDL in a semi make a mistake or have an obvious safety violation)
but these step vans and mid-size trucks have all different
configurations.

What a koinky-dink!

My previous champion surprise is the "safety" storm drain grate. About
25 years ago, we replaced all the wide-aperture grates with grates that
are wide flush up against the curb, but narrow in the travel area.
Pretty cool for bikes, especially ones with skinny tires. BUT. About
4% of them were installed _backwards_.

--ag

I had a guy try to pass me on a narrow back road the other day and I was
coming up on a 'T' intersection, and it was clear that it was unsafe to
pass me, since one leg of the 'T' was obscured to him.

He goes around me even though I have my hand out to signal a left turn into
a parking lot.

Well he doesn't see this car speeding around the corner, but I can and try
to signal him, but he, being an [censored], speeds up and gets in the
opposite lane. Low and behold, he sees the car to late and slams on the
brakes, but still runs into the front bumper of the car speeding around the
corner.

At least they had time to brake so it was just a fender-bender. I passed
harmlessly behind the car ahead of me.

Doubt this will educate this dangerous dumbass. They had driven off by the
time I circled back through.

jj

andy gee said:

My previous champion surprise is the "safety" storm drain grate. About
25 years ago, we replaced all the wide-aperture grates with grates that
are wide flush up against the curb, but narrow in the travel area.
Pretty cool for bikes, especially ones with skinny tires. BUT. About
4% of them were installed _backwards_.

Here in Canada, they came up with a better idea, the grates are square,
so they simply picked them up, rotated them 90 degrees, and put them
back, now that the slots are perpendicular to the curb, rather then
parallel to the curb, no more problem......

W

"The Wogster" wrote: Here in Canada, they came up with a better idea, the
grates are square, so they simply picked them up, rotated them 90 degrees,
and put them back, (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah, but! What happens when someone pulls up a grate to do a cleanout, and
then puts it back wrong? Rectangular grates that are installed right are
foolproof.

Leo Lichtman asked:

Quoted message said:

"The Wogster" wrote: Here in Canada, they came up with a better idea, the
grates are square, so they simply picked them up, rotated them 90 degrees,
and put them back, (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah, but! What happens when someone pulls up a grate to do a cleanout, and
then puts it back wrong? Rectangular grates that are installed right are
foolproof.

They aren't really foolproof. I'm sure there are fools that have
forgotten to put them back altogether.

Austin (never underestimate the stupidity of anyone, or the ingenuity
of fools)

The Wogster said:

Here in Canada, they came up with a better idea, the grates are
square, so they simply picked them up, rotated them 90 degrees,
and put them back, now that the slots are perpendicular to the
curb, rather then parallel to the curb, no more problem......

The road-building folks used to claim that making the slots
perpendicular doesn't allow them to drain as well. At least, that was
their excuse for using the deadly parallel-bar grates.

One road near me was recently rebuilt without any grates at all. The
openings of the catch basins are in the curb, and the pavement dips a
bit to drain toward the curb opening. This seems like a nice system,
as long as the dips in the pavement aren't too abrupt. I'm sure
there's a reason why it's not more common.
--
Ray Heindl
(remove the Xs to reply)

jj<[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Well he doesn't see this car speeding around the corner, but I can and
try to signal him, but he, being an [censored], speeds up and gets in
the opposite lane. Low and behold, he sees the car to late and slams
on the brakes, but still runs into the front bumper of the car
speeding around the corner.

You just _know_ he's going to blame that crazy and foolhardy bicyclist for
that crash. I know it, you knows it, and he knows it.

--ag

andy gee said:

jj<[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Well he doesn't see this car speeding around the corner, but I can and
try to signal him, but he, being an [censored], speeds up and gets in
the opposite lane. Low and behold, he sees the car to late and slams
on the brakes, but still runs into the front bumper of the car
speeding around the corner.

You just _know_ he's going to blame that crazy and foolhardy bicyclist for
that crash. I know it, you knows it, and he knows it.

--ag

It's strange, in the area where I ride it's usually low traffic and no thru
roads coming in from my left. It goes along the stockyards, so there are a
few dead ends and gated entrances to the low traffic stock yards. So most
traffic is straight ahead on this variable width road (narrows and widens
in places).

But just this week there have been seven or eight different instances like
this - near misses, (or near hits, lol).

Today, some lady came up to a turn into the trailer park to my right, and,
it appeared, that she saw me and lurched to a stop. Just as I got to her
she slowly turns in front of me. I had to go around her on the wrong side.
She appeared dazed (at 4pm in the afternoon).

Two different ordinary looking, unassuming, almost docile looking women
buzzed me at more than 30mph over the speed limit (!), doing 55 in a 25. I
mean we're not talking wild and crazy teenagers on cellphones, here! ;-)

One woman didn't stop at her four-way stop sign and she was coming from the
point of -least- visibility. All three other corners have excellent
vista-view visibility. Yet -she- doesn't stop, doesn't even slow down and I
can see her shoulders up as though 'I'm going through, can't see, and may
get hit, so I'm getting ready to duck'. Durn! What kind of moron drives
like that? She lurches to a stop finally in the middle of the intersection
and lets me get by. I was debating whether to wave her on thinking she
might suddenly spasz out and floor it. LOL.

Oh, and some guy doing about 30 in a little parking lot surrounding a
condominium almost runs into me; well -duh- because he's on the wrong side
of the road. Fortunately I was around the corner and able to weave into
some vacant parking spaces before he could get me.

So that's five in one day.

On monday some woman doing at least 20miles an hour over the speed limit,
going _uphill_, almost runs into me as I cross a 'Y' intersection coming in
at the upper right y, and her from the bottom, going left. She has a yield.
Her passenger has the never to yell at -me-. What kind of driver isn't
aware when they're doing 50 or 55 in a back neighborhood with school kids
and children playing? Could they really be thinking 'I'm doing 55 and -you-
almost made me hit you?' My fault?

Must be a full moon or something...I almost never see anything but big (yet
friendly) trucks. Now I'm getting mini-hordes of homicidal females! <g>

<shaking head in bewilderment>

The good thing is, because of the lay-out, I'm in a good position to see
these kinds of things long before they become critical and can slow down or
ride around them - so it's really not -quite- as dangerous as it sounds.
95% of the time the people actually ride about 200 feet back from me and
let me get to my turnoff and don't even try to pass me. Heh. I hope to go
back to my more sedate surroundings starting tomorrow.

jj

Leo Lichtman said:

"The Wogster" wrote: Here in Canada, they came up with a better idea, the
grates are square, so they simply picked them up, rotated them 90 degrees,
and put them back, (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah, but! What happens when someone pulls up a grate to do a cleanout, and
then puts it back wrong? Rectangular grates that are installed right are
foolproof.

They don't usually take them out, they either tilt them on one side, or
flip them over onto the right lane of road. What's really fullproof
would be to design the grate and frame so that one corner is cut off,
and the frame has a similar shape, then you can't put them in wrong....

W

andy gee <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

This is a new one on me; I thought I'd seen everything.

Truck is travelling slowly in the left hand travel lane, I'm
riding in the left hand parking lane (for NYC streets > 40' wide,
cycles should be as close to the right OR left curb as safety
allows.

Safety dictates that you do not ride in the "left hand parking lane" if
you are going straight through an intersection.

--
Mike Nitabach

Michael Nitabach <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

andy gee <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

This is a new one on me; I thought I'd seen everything.

Truck is travelling slowly in the left hand travel lane, I'm
riding in the left hand parking lane (for NYC streets > 40' wide,
cycles should be as close to the right OR left curb as safety
allows.

Safety dictates that you do not ride in the "left hand parking lane"
if you are going straight through an intersection.

Sorry, let me be a little more clear. During rush hours, the midtown
avenue parking lanes are typically bus lanes on the right side or travel
lanes on the left; but they're also used for illegaly standing cars and
delivery trucks, so most non-taxi vehicles don't travel in them, leaving
them clear for bikes. Most of the cross streets are one way, as are all
but one of the Midtown avenues. If a car is ahead of a bike and is
making a left turn, the bike is required to stop or, if safety allows,
change lanes to the right. A car passing me on my right to turn left
has committed a "reckless manouvre" and in general turning cars yield to
bikes. It's an intricate ballet but it _usually_ works which is why I
was so surprised at the cascade of f-ups leading to the posted
situation. The city code is quite clear, though, left or right on wide
streets and avenues.

--ag

andy gee said:

The Wogster <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Leo Lichtman said:

"The Wogster" wrote: Here in Canada, they came up with a better
idea, the grates are square, so they simply picked them up, rotated
them 90 degrees, and put them back, (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah, but! What happens when someone pulls up a grate to do a
cleanout, and then puts it back wrong? Rectangular grates that are
installed right are foolproof.

They don't usually take them out, they either tilt them on one side,
or flip them over onto the right lane of road. What's really
fullproof would be to design the grate and frame so that one corner is
cut off, and the frame has a similar shape, then you can't put them in
wrong....

W

How long did it take to make memory chips that couldn't be put in
backwards? Not that long? So the grate debate must rest on the
assumption that someone cares about bicyclists!

More likely someone doesn't want to get sued, imagine some idiot puts
the grate in wrong, and a cyclist takes a header, and sues city for
$40,000,000, plus the grate and frame maker. They win said suit.

You could also make the bars narrower and in a cross pattern, at a
45degree angle, so that no matter how the grate is installed, it will
simply allow a bike tire to pass over.

There are probably 25 ways to design a sewer grate, so that it doesn't
suck in a bicycle tire, but still does the job intended.

Some, like the keyed grate (can't be installed in non-bike friendly
way), would require new frames, others would not (like the one described
here).

W

andy gee said:

The Wogster <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Leo Lichtman said:

"The Wogster" wrote: Here in Canada, they came up with a better
idea, the grates are square, so they simply picked them up, rotated
them 90 degrees, and put them back, (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah, but! What happens when someone pulls up a grate to do a
cleanout, and then puts it back wrong? Rectangular grates that are
installed right are foolproof.

They don't usually take them out, they either tilt them on one side,
or flip them over onto the right lane of road. What's really
fullproof would be to design the grate and frame so that one corner is
cut off, and the frame has a similar shape, then you can't put them in
wrong....

W

How long did it take to make memory chips that couldn't be put in
backwards? Not that long? So the grate debate must rest on the
assumption that someone cares about bicyclists!

More on grates, just went out and looked at some, seem to be 4 different
styles:

1) Drop in square parallel grates, all turned so that bars are
prependicular to the curb - oldest date 1965.
2) Drop in square V grates, these have V shaped openings, no matter how
you turn them, a bike wheel should not stick, look like about a 20mm
opening, I think these replace the parallel ones, when they need
replacing, if the road doesn't need work at the same time.
3) Hinged V grates, these are hinged on one edge, same shape as the drop
in V grates, saw the year 2001 on one of them, so they are fairly new.
4) Round V grates, the covers are round, the outside of the frame is
square, the inside round, on a major street, so probably not that old.

So they seem to be moving to the V style opening, at least around here....

W

andy gee <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Michael Nitabach <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

andy gee <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

This is a new one on me; I thought I'd seen everything.

Truck is travelling slowly in the left hand travel lane, I'm
riding in the left hand parking lane (for NYC streets > 40'
wide, cycles should be as close to the right OR left curb as
safety allows.

Safety dictates that you do not ride in the "left hand parking
lane" if you are going straight through an intersection.

Sorry, let me be a little more clear. During rush hours, the
midtown avenue parking lanes are typically bus lanes on the right
side or travel lanes on the left; but they're also used for
illegaly standing cars and delivery trucks, so most non-taxi
vehicles don't travel in them, leaving them clear for bikes. Most
of the cross streets are one way, as are all but one of the
Midtown avenues. If a car is ahead of a bike and is making a left
turn, the bike is required to stop or, if safety allows, change
lanes to the right. A car passing me on my right to turn left has
committed a "reckless manouvre" and in general turning cars yield
to bikes. It's an intricate ballet but it _usually_ works which
is why I was so surprised at the cascade of f-ups leading to the
posted situation. The city code is quite clear, though, left or
right on wide streets and avenues.

I understand all of this; I live in Manhattan and ride its streets
all the time. The bottom line is that you should take your safety in
your own hands. If you allow yourself to get in a position where a
motor vehicle can turn across your path, then you are not doing a
good job of reading the traffic and positioning yourself accordingly.
To expect a turning vehicle to yield to a through vehicle on the
inside of the turn is a recipe for disaster.

For example, if you are at an intersection where you know that motor
vehicles use more than one lane for turning, then you must position
yourself to the outside edge of their outermost turning lane. This is
the case regardless of whether those vehicles are themselves
violating the law, and regardless of the "city code". If you continue
to expect turning traffic to yield to through traffic on its inside,
it is only a matter of time before you get hit.

--
Mike Nitabach

Michael Nitabach <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I understand all of this; I live in Manhattan and ride its streets
all the time. The bottom line is that you should take your safety in
your own hands. If you allow yourself to get in a position where a
motor vehicle can turn across your path, then you are not doing a
good job of reading the traffic and positioning yourself accordingly.

This is true. I live or die out there based on my ability to tell
whether a vehicle is going to turn regardless of whether he is signaling
or not. If you recall, though, this is a rare case where the vehicle
appeared to be signaling the _opposite_ turn.

Quoted message said:

To expect a turning vehicle to yield to a through vehicle on the
inside of the turn is a recipe for disaster.

If a car is actually turning across my path, of course, I either get
positive eye contact for the yield or i move right if possible.

Quoted message said:

For example, if you are at an intersection where you know that motor
vehicles use more than one lane for turning, then you must position
yourself to the outside edge of their outermost turning lane. This is
the case regardless of whether those vehicles are themselves
violating the law, and regardless of the "city code". If you continue
to expect turning traffic to yield to through traffic on its inside,
it is only a matter of time before you get hit.

Oh, I see you are familiar with 1st Avenue from 14th to 23rd, the
amazing need for three lanes to turn left. I'm way out in the middle on
that stretch.

Quoted message said:

Andy Gee <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Michael Nitabach <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I understand all of this; I live in Manhattan and ride its
streets all the time. The bottom line is that you should take
your safety in your own hands. If you allow yourself to get in a
position where a motor vehicle can turn across your path, then
you are not doing a good job of reading the traffic and
positioning yourself accordingly.

This is true. I live or die out there based on my ability to tell
whether a vehicle is going to turn regardless of whether he is
signaling or not. If you recall, though, this is a rare case
where the vehicle appeared to be signaling the _opposite_ turn.

Quoted message said:

To expect a turning vehicle to yield to a through vehicle on the
inside of the turn is a recipe for disaster.

If a car is actually turning across my path, of course, I either
get positive eye contact for the yield or i move right if
possible.

Quoted message said:

For example, if you are at an intersection where you know that
motor vehicles use more than one lane for turning, then you must
position yourself to the outside edge of their outermost turning
lane. This is the case regardless of whether those vehicles are
themselves violating the law, and regardless of the "city code".
If you continue to expect turning traffic to yield to through
traffic on its inside, it is only a matter of time before you get
hit.

Oh, I see you are familiar with 1st Avenue from 14th to 23rd, the
amazing need for three lanes to turn left. I'm way out in the
middle on that stretch.

One thing the City has done to ameliorate this issue is to put
plastic pylons between through lanes and turn lanes leading up to
intersections. They have done this at the left turns from 2nd Avenue
into the Midtown Tunnel and onto 34th Street. They should do this
more.

--
Mike Nitabach

Michael Nitabach <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

One thing the City has done to ameliorate this issue is to put
plastic pylons between through lanes and turn lanes leading up to
intersections. They have done this at the left turns from 2nd Avenue
into the Midtown Tunnel and onto 34th Street. They should do this
more.

This was a good move, except for the fact the pedestrians at 36th St are
fair game. You can be in a crosswalk with a green light and white walk
symbol, and cars can be turning left into you at gearing-up-to-highway
speed. I believe the key in all of these legitimate issues and cases
we're discussing is that people who "can't be trusted" are operating
high-speed, high-weight equipment inches from unprotected flesh. Second
Avenue is a perfect example; it's a perfect run down from Harlem or The
Bronx until you hit the 60s, then you just bounce back and forth between
people exiting and entering high speed roads. My Indian friend tells me
that in parts of India, they can't expect people to follow regulations
and they can't afford more lights or signs or more cops anyway, so they
just put speed bumps everywhere as a traffic-calming measure.

--ag