TDF TT strategy

NEPTUNIUM said:

when I read everybody's post today I cannot believe that all you want to do is gloat about Lance
loosing out to Jan. But the point is that what you did today reflects what you will do tomorrow.
there was a mention on OLN coverage of the race, and it was Phil that mentioned Lance's tempo, "He
has perfect tempo". To get that extra 1:36 Jan must have had the best TT of his life and he
certainly deserves credit. But tomorrow I question if he will have paid the price for it when it
comes to the mountains. I expect that Roberto will carry Lance up to the last 5-6 km and then he
will sprint out to gain 2 minutes back over Jan tomorrow.

Tomorrow the Loud Mouth will find out all about the Alamo

I agree completely. Lance is too good a tactician, and I suspect he knew Ullrich was going to go all
out, especailly since it was reported (in Cycle Sport among other places) that Ullrich was trying to
emulate Lance's high cadence pedaling style, which is very suitable for a TT. I believe Lance wanted
to make sure he kept it close, and once he saw Ullrich's time (via radio) he knew what he had to do
to stay with it and keep the yellow and not kill himself, and save it for the mountains and the
final TT. Now Lance has a team that Ullrich does not to blow him apart in the mountains after he
went all out today. I have a feeling tomorrow will be an outrageous race to watch. Heras, Pena,
Beltran and Rubiera all working to burn up Ullrich while Lance watches and waits for his moment...

--
Dave [email hidden] "NEPTUNIUM" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

when I read everybody's post today I cannot believe that all you want to

do is

Quoted message said:

gloat about Lance loosing out to Jan. But the point is that what you did

today

Quoted message said:

reflects what you will do tomorrow. there was a mention on OLN coverage of

the

Quoted message said:

race, and it was Phil that mentioned Lance's tempo, "He has perfect

tempo".

Quoted message said:

To get that extra 1:36 Jan must have had the best TT of his life and he certainly deserves credit.
But tomorrow I question if he will have paid

the

Quoted message said:

price for it when it comes to the mountains. I expect that Roberto will

carry

Quoted message said:

Lance up to the last 5-6 km and then he will sprint out to gain 2 minutes

back

Quoted message said:

over Jan tomorrow.

Traditionally, GC contenders don't hold back during time trials. It's not worth it.

I just think Ullrich handled the heat well. Maybe Armstrong didn't. Armstrong still rode a solid
time trial. Take Ullrich out of the standings, and the results look at least as good as last
year's ITTs:

www-tcad.stanford.eduITT1.pdfOpen ↗ (revised)

Dan

Dave said:

I agree completely. Lance is too good a tactician, and I suspect he knew Ullrich was going to go
all out, especailly since it was reported (in Cycle Sport among other places) that Ullrich was
trying to emulate Lance's high cadence pedaling style, which is very suitable for a TT. I believe
Lance wanted to make sure he kept it close, and once he saw Ullrich's time (via radio) he knew
what he had to do to stay with it and keep the yellow and not kill himself, and save it for the
mountains and the final TT. Now Lance has a team that Ullrich does not to blow him apart in the
mountains after he went all out today. I have a feeling tomorrow will be an outrageous race to
watch. Heras, Pena, Beltran and Rubiera all working to burn up Ullrich while Lance watches and
waits for his moment...

In article <[email hidden]>, Daniel Connelly

Quoted message said:

Traditionally, GC contenders don't hold back during time trials. It's not worth it.

Agree completely. Trying to get back the 1:35 Lance lost can be much harder on a climb when Ullrich
knows he only has to stay on Lance's wheel (or claw his way back to it). These guys won't have any
trouble recovering from the TT before tomorrow.

-WG

Dave said:

I agree completely. Lance is too good a tactician, and I suspect he knew Ullrich was going to go
all out, especailly since it was reported (in Cycle Sport among other places) that Ullrich was
trying to emulate Lance's high cadence pedaling style, which is very suitable for a TT.

He hasn't done it. LA wasn't able to get into his high cadence, though.

Quoted message said:

went all out today. I have a feeling tomorrow will be an outrageous race to watch. Heras, Pena,
Beltran and Rubiera all working to burn up Ullrich while Lance watches and waits for his moment...

... and Ullrich will only watch Lance and let Heras, Pena et al. do whatever they want. He would
take at least 5 minutes out of them in the next ITT anyway, so why hother.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

when I read everybody's post today I cannot believe that all you want to do is gloat about Lance
loosing out to Jan. But the point is that what you did today reflects what you will do tomorrow.
there was a mention on OLN coverage of the race, and it was Phil that mentioned Lance's tempo, "He
has perfect tempo".

I wouldn't put any stock in that.

Quoted message said:

To get that extra 1:36 Jan must have had the best TT of his life and he certainly deserves credit.
But tomorrow I question if he will have paid the price for it when it comes to the mountains. I
expect that Roberto will carry Lance up to the last 5-6 km and then he will sprint out to gain 2
minutes back over Jan tomorrow.

That is certainly possible, and we'll know within 14 hours.

Rick

(NEPTUNIUM) said:

when I read everybody's post today I cannot believe that all you want to do is gloat about Lance
loosing out to Jan. But the point is that what you did today reflects what you will do tomorrow.
there was a mention on OLN coverage of the race, and it was Phil that mentioned Lance's tempo, "He
has perfect tempo". To get that extra 1:36 Jan must have had the best TT of his life and he
certainly deserves credit. But tomorrow I question if he will have paid the price for it when it
comes to the mountains. I expect that Roberto will carry Lance up to the last 5-6 km and then he
will sprint out to gain 2 minutes back over Jan tomorrow.

That's you right? Doesn't sound at all like Phil to make such a "predictive" comment. If anything
Heras hasn't been up to much good this year unlike last year. He gets dropped much too early to be
much of a factor. Good thing Beloki isn't here anymore to take over when Heras drops out.

On top of that tomorrow's single Cat1 climb is 20+km from the top, so what you write doesn't make a
lot of sense...

Java Man (Espressopithecus) said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

when I read everybody's post today I cannot believe that all you want to do is gloat about Lance
loosing out to Jan. But the point is that what you did today reflects what you will do tomorrow.
there was a mention on OLN coverage of the race, and it was Phil that mentioned Lance's tempo,
"He has perfect tempo".

I wouldn't put any stock in that.

Quoted message said:

To get that extra 1:36 Jan must have had the best TT of his life and he certainly deserves
credit. But tomorrow I question if he will have paid the price for it when it comes to the
mountains. I expect that Roberto will carry Lance up to the last 5-6 km and then he will sprint
out to gain 2 minutes back over Jan tomorrow.

That is certainly possible, and we'll know within 14 hours.

Make that 36, tomorrow's stage is NOT a mountain top finish. You guys should look at the stage
profile...

Quoted message said:

Rick

warren said:

Trying to get back the 1:35 Lance lost can be much harder on a climb when Ullrich knows he only has
to stay on Lance's wheel (or claw his way back to it).

Assuming for the sake of argument that the next TT plays out exactly the same as today's, Lance
needs to put over 1'02" on Ullrich in the mountains before then to keep the yellow from Ullrich, and
Vinokourov needs 2'23" over Ullrich and 1'21" over Armstrong. So Ullrich just needs to limit his
loses to Armstrong and Vino; Armstrong needs to attack Ullrich and limit his loses to Vino; and Vino
needs to attack the other two.

--
EWC

"Keith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

<snip> Make that 36, tomorrow's stage is NOT a mountain top finish. You guys

Quoted message said:

should look at the stage profile...

Quoted message said:

Rick

Huh? One mountain up, then down and up a second one to finish at the top? What do you call that?

EWC said:

warren said:

Trying to get back the 1:35 Lance lost can be much harder on a climb when Ullrich knows he only
has to stay on Lance's wheel (or claw his way back to it).

Assuming for the sake of argument that the next TT plays out exactly the same as today's, Lance
needs to put over 1'02" on Ullrich in the mountains before then to keep the yellow from Ullrich,
and Vinokourov needs 2'23" over Ullrich and 1'21" over Armstrong. So Ullrich just needs to limit
his loses to Armstrong and Vino; Armstrong needs to attack Ullrich and limit his loses to Vino;
and Vino needs to attack the other two.

--
EWC

In other words...

We are going to see a bloodbath the next three days in the Pyrenees!

Jow
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1.5 196.0 D.820 Bonascre
==================
.0 197.5 AX 3 DOMAINES Finish 1e Sprint B
==================
it looks like they will be in a tremendous climb. there is a sprint coming at the finish, a strategy
could play out like this. lance knowing that the sprint is near will lead off and away from the
leaders possibly by himself. 5 km is roughly 3 miles. by taking off at this point that would mean
1.5 miles of accelerated climb. this burns out any competition with aching legs. the heat, the
strain, weakens anybody following. 1.5 miles of sprint left, while others are still climbing lance
is speeding away to the finish.

(NEPTUNIUM) said:

1.5 196.0 D.820 Bonascre
==================
.0 197.5 AX 3 DOMAINES Finish 1e Sprint B
==================
it looks like they will be in a tremendous climb. there is a sprint coming at the finish, a
strategy could play out like this.

This is a BONUS sprint, none of the GC contenders pay attention to these ?!

Quoted message said:

lance knowing that the sprint is near will lead off and away from the leaders possibly by
himself. 5 km is roughly 3 miles. by taking off at this point that would mean 1.5 miles of
accelerated climb. this burns out any competition with aching legs. the heat, the strain, weakens
anybody following. 1.5 miles of sprint left, while others are still climbing lance is speeding
away to the finish.

What are you on ?!

Nick Burns said:

"Keith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

<snip> Make that 36, tomorrow's stage is NOT a mountain top finish. You guys

Quoted message said:

should look at the stage profile...

Quoted message said:

Rick

Huh? One mountain up, then down and up a second one to finish at the top? What do you call that?

I think you should visit an eye doctor - Today's stage - makeashorterlink.commakeashorterlink.comOpen ↗
Tomorrow's stage - makeashorterlink.commakeashorterlink.comOpen ↗ Which one do you think will create the
largest gaps...

(NEPTUNIUM) said:

But tomorrow I question if he will have paid the price for it when it comes to the mountains.

You think armstrong didn't ride a 100% effort?

"Joseph Cipale" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

EWC said:

warren said:

Trying to get back the 1:35 Lance lost can be much harder on a climb when Ullrich knows he only
has to stay on Lance's wheel (or claw his way back to it).

Assuming for the sake of argument that the next TT plays out exactly the same as today's, Lance
needs to put over 1'02" on Ullrich in the mountains before then to keep the yellow from Ullrich,
and Vinokourov needs 2'23" over Ullrich and 1'21" over Armstrong. So Ullrich just needs to limit
his loses to Armstrong and Vino; Armstrong needs to attack Ullrich and limit his loses to Vino;
and Vino needs to attack the other two.

--
EWC

In other words...

We are going to see a bloodbath the next three days in the Pyrenees!

This has the potential to be great. About time. Haven't had an exciting Tour since 1989.

"Keith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Nick Burns said:

"Keith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

<snip> Make that 36, tomorrow's stage is NOT a mountain top finish. You guys

Quoted message said:

should look at the stage profile...
>
>Rick

Huh? One mountain up, then down and up a second one to finish at the top? What do you call that?

I think you should visit an eye doctor - Today's stage - makeashorterlink.commakeashorterlink.comOpen ↗
Tomorrow's stage - makeashorterlink.commakeashorterlink.comOpen ↗ Which one do you think will create the
largest gaps...

Dude, the first mountain is 2000 meters or more than 6000 feet! It is a ranked category 1 only
because it is the first climb. It would be an HC if it was other than the first. Of the three, it is
the easiest but that does not mean it is not a mountain stage. What kind of logic is that? You said:

Make that 36, tomorrow's stage is NOT a mountain top finish. You guys

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

should look at the stage profile...

Duh. It is a MOUNTAIN TOP FINISH.

(and then he told me to get glasses...[censored])

keith: take a chill pill. I don't claim to know everything. Of course you know more but that is how
I am learning things. Your so mad that people don't know as much as you. Well God bless you man. I
didn't know what sprint B meant until you said so. It's a bonus sprint. We got people talking about
the Tour, mainly that is what is going on here.

spot: Lance did try 100% no doubt about that but his mouth was dry as cardboard and his tongue stuck
to the roof of his mouth. Is that a valid excuse? could be. so is a puncture, or chain derailing, or
running into a spectator. the time you come in with is the time you get

Davey Crockett said:

NEPTUNIUM said:

when I read everybody's post today I cannot believe that all you want to do is gloat about Lance
loosing out to Jan. But the point is that what you did today reflects what you will do tomorrow.
there was a mention on OLN coverage of the race, and it was Phil that mentioned Lance's tempo,
"He has perfect tempo". To get that extra 1:36 Jan must have had the best TT of his life and he
certainly deserves credit. But tomorrow I question if he will have paid the price for it when it
comes to the mountains. I expect that Roberto will carry Lance up to the last 5-6 km and then he
will sprint out to gain 2 minutes back over Jan tomorrow.

Tomorrow the Loud Mouth will find out all about the Alamo

After the Alamo came San Jacinto....