Taking Bets on a Julich Flop....

ronde chumpion said:

Ronde Chumpion (done Paris-Nice)

Right, me too (by TGV).

Nah, Riis is too knowledgable about preparation to let
that happen.

JT

On 03/11/2004 02:53 PM, in article
[email hidden], "ronde chumpion"

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

Define "implodes" ...

--
Steven L. Sheffield stevens at veloworks dot com veloworks
at worldnet dot ay tea tee dot net bellum pax est libertas
servitus est ignoratio vis est ess ay ell tea ell ay kay ee
sea aye tee why you ti ay aitch aitch tee tea pea colon [for
word] slash [four ward] slash double-you double-yew double-
ewe dot veloworks dot com [four word] slash

This is only P-N. I wouldn't be surprised if he pulls the
win out. Besides, he's got 2 teammates in front of him, so
there's no pressure.

CH

[email hidden] (ronde chumpion) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

[email hidden] (ronde chumpion) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

I predict that throughout the 2004 season Ronde Chumpion and
similar dorks will continue to bad mouth riders whose
abilities and accomplishments far exceed their own.

[email hidden] (ronde chumpion) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

I predict that throughout the 2004 season Ronde Chumpion and
similar dorks will continue to bad mouth riders whose
abilities and accomplishments far exceed their own.

Quoted message said:

in article 'ronde chumpion said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

Define "implodes" ...

He is sitting pretty in third place. The obvious result
normally would be he will lead the race and go on to win
when they hit the tough mountain stages ahead. I'm
predicting a collapse not only by 1st and 2nd, as expected,
but also by chronic whiner You-lick at that time. Some one
else will win. Probably CSC. He will not. This is HIS year,
after all.

Quoted message said:

in article 'ronde chumpion said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

Define "implodes" ...

He is sitting pretty in third place. The obvious result
normally would be he will lead the race and go on to win
when they hit the tough mountain stages ahead. I'm
predicting a collapse not only by 1st and 2nd, as expected,
but also by chronic whiner You-lick at that time. Some one
else will win. Probably CSC. He will not. This is HIS year,
after all.

"Only" Paris-Nice?

This is probably the 5th or 6th most important stage race in
cycling, behind the 3 Grand Tours and the Tour of
Switzerland ...

On 03/12/2004 06:15 AM, in article
[email hidden], "chris"

Quoted message said:

This is only P-N. I wouldn't be surprised if he pulls the
win out. Besides, he's got 2 teammates in front of him, so
there's no pressure.

CH

[email hidden] (ronde chumpion) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

--
Steven L. Sheffield stevens at veloworks dot com veloworks
at worldnet dot ay tea tee dot net bellum pax est libertas
servitus est ignoratio vis est ess ay ell tea ell ay kay ee
sea aye tee why you ti ay aitch aitch tee tea pea colon [for
word] slash [four ward] slash double-you double-yew double-
ewe dot veloworks dot com [four word] slash

"Only" Paris-Nice?

This is probably the 5th or 6th most important stage race in
cycling, behind the 3 Grand Tours and the Tour of
Switzerland ...

On 03/12/2004 06:15 AM, in article
[email hidden], "chris"

Quoted message said:

This is only P-N. I wouldn't be surprised if he pulls the
win out. Besides, he's got 2 teammates in front of him, so
there's no pressure.

CH

[email hidden] (ronde chumpion) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

--
Steven L. Sheffield stevens at veloworks dot com veloworks
at worldnet dot ay tea tee dot net bellum pax est libertas
servitus est ignoratio vis est ess ay ell tea ell ay kay ee
sea aye tee why you ti ay aitch aitch tee tea pea colon [for
word] slash [four ward] slash double-you double-yew double-
ewe dot veloworks dot com [four word] slash

On 03/12/2004 06:43 AM, in article
[email hidden], "ronde chumpion"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

On 03/11/2004 02:53 PM, in article "ronde chumpion"

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

Define "implodes" ...

He is sitting pretty in third place. The obvious result
normally would be he will lead the race and go on to win
when they hit the tough mountain stages ahead. I'm
predicting a collapse not only by 1st and 2nd, as
expected, but also by chronic whiner You-lick at that
time. Some one else will win. Probably CSC. He will not.
This is HIS year, after all.

What if he holds steady but Michael Rogers (an incredible
climber) goes on the attack and gains 90 seconds ... That
would put Rogers in yellow, and BJ would drop to 4th.

Is that an implosion?

Is an implosion "not winning"? Is an implosion "not
finishing on the podium"? Or is an implosion "cracking in
the mountains and losing 20 minutes"?

If it's merely "BJ won't win", then I want odds ... And good
ones. But if it's "cracking in the mountains and losing 20
minutes" then you just might have a bet.

--
Steven L. Sheffield stevens at veloworks dot com veloworks
at worldnet dot ay tea tee dot net bellum pax est libertas
servitus est ignoratio vis est ess ay ell tea ell ay kay ee
sea aye tee why you ti ay aitch aitch tee tea pea colon [for
word] slash [four ward] slash double-you double-yew double-
ewe dot veloworks dot com [four word] slash

Steven L. Sheffield said:

Define "implodes" ...

Hard to describe, but its ugly and messes up the helmet from
the inside out.

Curtis L. Russell Odenton, MD (USA) Just someone on
two wheels...

On 03/12/2004 06:43 AM, in article
[email hidden], "ronde chumpion"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

On 03/11/2004 02:53 PM, in article "ronde chumpion"

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

Define "implodes" ...

He is sitting pretty in third place. The obvious result
normally would be he will lead the race and go on to win
when they hit the tough mountain stages ahead. I'm
predicting a collapse not only by 1st and 2nd, as
expected, but also by chronic whiner You-lick at that
time. Some one else will win. Probably CSC. He will not.
This is HIS year, after all.

What if he holds steady but Michael Rogers (an incredible
climber) goes on the attack and gains 90 seconds ... That
would put Rogers in yellow, and BJ would drop to 4th.

Is that an implosion?

Is an implosion "not winning"? Is an implosion "not
finishing on the podium"? Or is an implosion "cracking in
the mountains and losing 20 minutes"?

If it's merely "BJ won't win", then I want odds ... And good
ones. But if it's "cracking in the mountains and losing 20
minutes" then you just might have a bet.

--
Steven L. Sheffield stevens at veloworks dot com veloworks
at worldnet dot ay tea tee dot net bellum pax est libertas
servitus est ignoratio vis est ess ay ell tea ell ay kay ee
sea aye tee why you ti ay aitch aitch tee tea pea colon [for
word] slash [four ward] slash double-you double-yew double-
ewe dot veloworks dot com [four word] slash

On 03/12/2004 06:43 AM, in article
[email hidden], "ronde chumpion"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

On 03/11/2004 02:53 PM, in article "ronde chumpion"

Quoted message said:

Hey,

A C-note Julich implodes at Paris-Nice. Any takers??

Thanks, Ronde Chumpion

(done Paris-Nice)

Define "implodes" ...

He is sitting pretty in third place. The obvious result
normally would be he will lead the race and go on to win
when they hit the tough mountain stages ahead. I'm
predicting a collapse not only by 1st and 2nd, as
expected, but also by chronic whiner You-lick at that
time. Some one else will win. Probably CSC. He will not.
This is HIS year, after all.

What if he holds steady but Michael Rogers (an incredible
climber) goes on the attack and gains 90 seconds ... That
would put Rogers in yellow, and BJ would drop to 4th.

Is that an implosion?

Is an implosion "not winning"? Is an implosion "not
finishing on the podium"? Or is an implosion "cracking in
the mountains and losing 20 minutes"?

If it's merely "BJ won't win", then I want odds ... And good
ones. But if it's "cracking in the mountains and losing 20
minutes" then you just might have a bet.

--
Steven L. Sheffield stevens at veloworks dot com veloworks
at worldnet dot ay tea tee dot net bellum pax est libertas
servitus est ignoratio vis est ess ay ell tea ell ay kay ee
sea aye tee why you ti ay aitch aitch tee tea pea colon [for
word] slash [four ward] slash double-you double-yew double-
ewe dot veloworks dot com [four word] slash

Steven L. Sheffield said:

"Only" Paris-Nice?

Quoted message said:

This is probably the 5th or 6th most important stage race
in cycling, behind the 3 Grand Tours and the Tour of
Switzerland ...

Hmmmm...

As I was pondering this if occurred to me that much of the
prestige of HC category stage races depends on their
realtionships to the nearest Grand Tour.

I think I'd put Switzerland and the Dauphine Libere after
the three Grand Tours because of the attention they get as
indicators of form for the Tour. Catalunya is shorter and
does not have as much history so is a little less important
as an indicator of pre-Tour fitness.

Romandie has a similar relationship with the Giro but
suffers from the fact that if you are not Italian or
riding for an Italian team then you really don't care
about the Giro.

So I guess I am in the "only" Paris-Nice camp. It is a great
race with a great history. But people are there building
their fitness for the season ahead as opposed to sharpening
it in preparation for a major goal.

To put it another way, if you win one of the later HC stage
races, especially one of the ones before the Tour, you have
established yourself as a guy that can contend for a Grand
Tour. The supply of people like that is so short (think of
how long Berzin's career lasted after he hit the skids) that
even if you fall apart in the Tour you are still a hotter
property than you were before.

A win in Paris-Nice doesn't do that.

Bob Schwartz [email hidden]

Does it matter, really? P-N, as with most great races are
nothing (not my opinion) compared with the Tour; is anything
really? My comment, though, referred to the pressure to win
here isn't quite so large.

CH

Bob Schwartz <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Steven L. Sheffield said:

"Only" Paris-Nice?

Quoted message said:

This is probably the 5th or 6th most important stage
race in cycling, behind the 3 Grand Tours and the Tour
of Switzerland ...

Hmmmm...

As I was pondering this if occurred to me that much of the
prestige of HC category stage races depends on their
realtionships to the nearest Grand Tour.

I think I'd put Switzerland and the Dauphine Libere after
the three Grand Tours because of the attention they get as
indicators of form for the Tour. Catalunya is shorter and
does not have as much history so is a little less
important as an indicator of pre-Tour fitness.

Romandie has a similar relationship with the Giro but
suffers from the fact that if you are not Italian or
riding for an Italian team then you really don't care
about the Giro.

So I guess I am in the "only" Paris-Nice camp. It is a
great race with a great history. But people are there
building their fitness for the season ahead as opposed to
sharpening it in preparation for a major goal.

To put it another way, if you win one of the later HC
stage races, especially one of the ones before the Tour,
you have established yourself as a guy that can contend
for a Grand Tour. The supply of people like that is so
short (think of how long Berzin's career lasted after he
hit the skids) that even if you fall apart in the Tour you
are still a hotter property than you were before.

A win in Paris-Nice doesn't do that.

Bob Schwartz [email hidden]

Bob Schwartz <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

To put it another way, if you win one of the later HC
stage races, especially one of the ones before the Tour,
you have established yourself as a guy that can contend
for a Grand Tour. The supply of people like that is so
short (think of how long Berzin's career lasted after he
hit the skids) that even if you fall apart in the Tour you
are still a hotter property than you were before.

A win in Paris-Nice doesn't do that.

Bob Schwartz [email hidden]

Dude, go to the list of past winners and point out a
sucky rider.

"jim gravity" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Bob Schwartz <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

To put it another way, if you win one of the later HC
stage races, especially one of the ones before the Tour,
you have established

yourself

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

as a guy that can contend for a Grand Tour. The supply
of people like

that

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

is so short (think of how long Berzin's career lasted
after he hit the skids) that even if you fall apart in
the Tour you are still a hotter property than you were
before.

A win in Paris-Nice doesn't do that.

Bob Schwartz [email hidden]

Dude, go to the list of past winners and point out a
sucky rider.

Since its inception, there have been 8 P-N winners who were
also winners of the Tour de France (not necessarily in the
same year. Indurain was the last in this line. You can also
add some others, like Romminger, who won P-N and a major
tour other than the TdF.

I quickly spotted at least 13 classics winners amongst the
P-N champions. There are probably a few more, but I'm not
that familiar with some of the Belgian and French riders
from the early years.

jim gravity said:

Dude, go to the list of past winners and point out a
sucky rider.

Go to the list of past winners and point out one that had
Paris-Nice as a major goal for the year.

All the HC stage races are races you go through on the way
to somewhere else. My point is that the ones that are closer
to somewhere else are a bigger deal because the fields are
packed with people approaching the peak of their fitness.
And because the fans are more energized because of the
approach of a race that represents a greater goal.

Let's suppose the Jaksche has a twin, and that Jorg holds on
to win Paris-Nice while his twin takes the Dauphine Libere
or Switzerland.

As the Tour approaches the Pyrenees, who is LANCE paying
closer attention to?

Let's say neither one wins much over the remainder of the
year. Which one is the hotter prospect at contract time?

Bob Schwartz [email hidden]