Strada questions/obervations

"Jon Meinecke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed to
be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way... Is
this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly
quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

In my humble opinion (although my opinions are NEVER
humble), no SWB is a suitable bike for touring. Forget about
the Strada and the Volae. Instead get a proper touring bike.
Almost any LWB will be better. Why? More control and overall
easier to handle. All SWB are quirky and will trip you up
when you least expect it. SWB is for sport riding, not for
touring. Be warned. Thus spake Zarathustra!

--
Ed Dolan - Minnesota

Hi, Ed. As you say, your opinions about touring recumbents are fairly categorical, and to better put them in context I'd like to know about your tours and the bikes you used. Is it still chilly up there? Brian Pottorff from New Mexico. Southern New Mexico.

"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed
to be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way...
Is this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly
quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

Jon: This comparison has been discussed a lot on both this
site and on Bentrideronline.com. You might want to read up
on those comments. My opinion, based on the comments I have
read, is this:

1. If you own a Bacchetta a Bacchetta is better.
2. If you own a Volae a Volae is better.
3. If you have a local dealer who stocks Bacchetta then a
Bacchetta is better.
4. If you have no local source for Bacchetta (and Bacchetta
can only be bought from a dealer) then Volae (which is
sold primarily by mail order) is better.
5. If you are always removing the seat for transportation
the Volae set up is better.
6. If you like a padded seat as opposed to a hardshell the
Bacchetta has more models it offers it on (I think) so
the Bacchetta is better.

While this sounds facetious, it is intended to show that
they are both fine bikes from fine, responsive companies,
and each has loyal ownership. I have ridden both company's
offerings and own neither as I am shorter so a dual 26 inch
wheeled bike is a little tall, I don't like the tweener bars
(although the bars from each company are different your
knees still come up behind the bars) and I like my current
performance bike (Barcroft Virginia) too much to get rid of
it. Do whatever you can to have your son ride them both and
let him decide based on what feels good to him. You
can't go wrong with either.

I might also add that while I won't unequivocably say don't
get either for touring, I don't believe any of these bikes
other than perhaps their 26/20 offerings would count touring
as their strong selling point. Not to say they can't tour,
but they are more performance, go fast bikes. To me, putting
a rack and panniers on a dual 26 Volae or a Strada or Corsa
would be like putting ketchup on a steak. You can do it, it
just doesn't seem right. My opinion only.

Mike S. St. Louis, Mo.

Vcubed <[email hidden]> wrote in news:bdXnc.39363
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Hi, Ed. As you say, your opinions about touring recumbents
are fairly categorical, and to better put them in context
I'd like to know about your tours and the bikes you used.
Is it still chilly up there? Brian Pottorff from New
Mexico. Southern New Mexico.

--

Hi, Who is this "ed" of which you speak? Oh well...
www.crazyguyonabike.com might be a place to investigate.

If you're going to tour on a given bike, you want to be able
to fit it with wide tires, low gears (lower than that,
really), and racks, although a Nomad or a Bob ought to work.
A whole lot of bikes will do this, but not all equally well.
Fenders are a really nice accessory, especially if there
will be two of you riding together, but probably not a
necessity. These are the objective things.

Subjectively, there's handling, comfort and looks. My
opinions on these are worthless to you, so I'll spare you.

Lots of long trips have been made on SWB bikes, including
things like PBP, so don't let that throw you.

I've not seen one, but RANs claims the Force 5 will take
fenders. Interesting. H

"Vcubed" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hi, Ed. As you say, your opinions about touring recumbents
are fairly categorical, and to better put them in context
I'd like to know about your tours and the bikes you used.
Is it still chilly up there? Brian Pottorff from New
Mexico. Southern New Mexico.

Brian, I have done many week long organized group bike
tours. I started out riding my Vision SWB, but after the
first year I gave it up. It was simply too exhausting to
have to pay that much attention to the road because of its
quirkiness. I have a few other SWB too and I just do not
like them for anything other than sport riding for short
periods of time.

I set up my Vision LWB and I have never looked back. It just
handles so much better and I find that I do not have to pay
so much attention to the vagaries of the road with it. In
other words, I can day dream more and am altogether more
relaxed on it. I know of course that others prefer SWB for
all kinds of riding, but I am a very strong partisan for
LWB, especially for touring when you are going to be on the
bike for over 6 hours a day for weeks at a time.

There is a lot to be said for LWB with the crank fairly low
in relationship to the seat. It is not ideal for absolute
comfort, but it is ideal for ease of handling. Ease of
handling counts for a lot with me. I find that I am riding
my home made Tour Easy almost exclusively around town these
days because of that factor alone. If and when I ever fall
on a bike, it is an occasion for deep think. I do no need
any broken bones to go along with my many other ailments.

--
Regards,

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"Howard" <bishop(1199bitshiftleft1)@yazhooz.com> wrote
in message
"]news:[email hidden]... [...]

Quoted message said:

If you're going to tour on a given bike, you want to be
able to fit it with wide tires, low gears (lower than
that, really), and racks, although a Nomad or a Bob
ought to work. A whole lot of bikes will do this, but
not all equally well. Fenders are a really nice
accessory, especially if there will be two of you riding
together, but probably not a necessity. These are the
objective things.

Subjectively, there's handling, comfort and looks. My
opinions on these are worthless to you, so I'll spare you.

Looks do not count for anything with me. Comfort counts for
very much because one spends a lot of hours in the seat when
one is touring by bicycle. However, handling is absolutely
critical on a long tour. The handling has to be second
nature to the extent that you do not even have to think
about it. If you have to think about it, then you need an
easier handling bike.

Quoted message said:

Lots of long trips have been made on SWB bikes, including
things like PBP, so don't let that throw you.

That is true, but when I tour for many hours a day for many
days in succession, I like to be relaxed and enjoy the ride.
I do not want to even have to think about the bike. With
SWB, I am always having to think about the bike and how it
handles with respect to the vagaries of the road, traffic
and other riders. In other words I have to pay attention.
That can really get exhausting after a couple of days. With
LWB I can ignore most everything because I know I can depend
on the bike to be forgiving of mistakes and inattention.

--
Regards,

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

In my humble opinion (although my opinions are NEVER
humble), no SWB is a suitable bike for touring. Forget
about the Strada and the Volae. Instead get a proper
touring bike. Almost any LWB will be better. Why? More
control and overall easier to handle. All SWB are quirky
and will trip you up when you least expect it. SWB is for
sport riding, not for touring. Be warned. Thus spake
Zarathustra!

Ed, I met I guy two years ago in SW Missouri that was
heading across country on a RANS Rocket towing a BOB. He
went coast to coast! But a Rocket is a very different bike
than a high racer. From the dual 20s to the triangulated
frame to the gearing. For me, I agree with your LWB
assessment. My friends and I are planning a week long loaded
tour in August around the Finger Lakes of western NY. I have
a 99 Stratus and an 03 Strada. It's a no brainer. I am
loading the Stratus. The long frame, the more upright riding
position, the low bb, and the low gearing (52-39-26 with a
11-34 cassette) all make my Stratus the right bike for this
ride. I am going to add a midship rack to my rear rack and
load two sets of panniers. This will allow me the option to
use my fairing up front if I choose.

Regards, Jim Reilly

"mike s" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Jon: This comparison has been discussed a lot on both this
site and on Bentrideronline.com.

Thanks for the response.

Since you've ridden both, how do you compare the steering?

Quoted message said:

You might want to read up on those comments. My
opinion, based on the comments I have read, is this:

1. If you own a Bacchetta a Bacchetta is better.
2. If you own a Volae a Volae is better. [...] Do whatever
you can to have your son ride them both and let him
decide based on what feels good to him. You can't go
wrong with either.

Yes, that's my impression. B's and V's are quite similar in
character and quality. But before I spend $70 to try the
Volae, I'm hoping to benefit from the insight of people who
have ridden both (such as you, thanks) to help decide if
there's enough difference to matter. I'll likely give Hostel
Shoppe a call to check availability and get their spin. %^)

My son also test rode a few upright bikes that can "take a
rack",-- some more suitable for touring than others. The
Bianchi Volpe seems to be a decent bike for the price.
Novara Randonee also... Yes, he gets to decide.

Quoted message said:

I might also add that while I won't unequivocally say
don't get either for touring, [...] they are more
performance, go fast bikes.

I already have a recumbent bike with "Tour" in its name...
%^) I wouldn't mind getting a more performance-oriented bike
(Fast Freddie bait) to add to the "stable" that can also be
used for the middle distance tour with my son. I'm watching
the used bike lists...

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

"Howard" <bishop(1199bitshiftleft1)@yazhooz.com>

Quoted message said:

www.crazyguyonabike.com might be a place to investigate.

Yes, excellent cite of excellent site. I've spent many
enjoyable hours touring vicariously through the
reports there.

Quoted message said:

Subjectively, there's handling, comfort and looks.

Balancing all these for a 17 year old, too. He's methodical
and analytical.

Quoted message said:

My opinions on these are worthless to you, so I'll
spare you.

If you've ridden one or the other, I wouldn't presume your
comments worthless absent some pattern of Ed-illogical
posting. %^)

Quoted message said:

Lots of long trips have been made on SWB bikes, including
things like PBP, so don't let that throw you.

Yes. I've read a number of trip reports. None I've seen so
far on dual "big wheel" SWBs.

Quoted message said:

I've not seen one, but RANs claims the Force 5 will take
fenders. Interesting.

Force 5 does look worth considering. Wish there were local
RANS dealer.

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

Since baking while on tour is very difficult, I'd say go for
a compatible pan fry instead.

BentJay

"BentJay" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

Since baking while on tour is very difficult, I'd say go
for a compatible pan fry instead.

Baking on tour isn't that difficult: Try Outback Oven from
Backpacker's Pantry.

backpackerspantry.combackpackerspantry.comOpen ↗

It *is* also, by the way, a frying pan. "But wait, now how
much would you pay!?" You also get a heat diffuser plate
that makes simmering a snap even on that blow-torch
Whisperlite stove! %^)

We've made pizza, quiche, ginger bread, brownies, spice
cake, etc... A dutch oven top browns better, but the Outback
Oven "carries" better.

I often "bake" when biking in the summer even without the
benefit of such devices. Riding in 107F isn't completely
unbearable here. Only slightly further south the effect is
much like a steam injection oven. Slightly north, they have
a ride they call Hotter 'n Hell. It's been a "killer ride"
literally in some years.

But back to my question:

We're looking for a bike for my son that's reasonably well
suited for touring, but not necessarily dedicated to that
use. We hope not to "bake" ourselves in northern New Mexico
high-country in July/August. Whoever has the most efficient
bike/muscle combination gets to carry the tent up the
mountain roads.

Anyone done the Taos upper/lower loops on a recumbent?

Jon Meinecke

"Jon Meinecke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed to
be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way... Is
this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly
quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

Hi Jon

I recently test rode a Strada and noticed the "springy"
feeling in the front end. It almost felt like the front end
was loose. I like Jon, would like to know if this is from
the tilt adjustable stem or is it just the way 26/26 wheel
bikes behave?

I was all set to purchase this bike but this "springy"
feeling in the front end made me have second thoughts. I'm
now waiting until the Rans Force 5 comes out to see if it
has the same feel.

I don't think the Strada would be very good for
touring. I would be afraid to ride this bike down the
occasional gravel/bad road that you might encounter on
those skinny tires.

Dan

"Bikerchief" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I recently test rode a Strada and noticed the "springy"
feeling in the front end. It almost felt like the front
end was loose. I like Jon, would like to know if this is
from the tilt adjustable stem or is it just the way 26/26
wheel bikes behave?

Good to know it wasn't just something in the setup of the
bike we tried. Anyone comment on whether the Volae steering
is similar?

Quoted message said:

I don't think the Strada would be very good for
touring. I would be afraid to ride this bike down the
occasional gravel/bad road that you might encounter on
those skinny tires.

They offer a "midship" rack for the Bacchetta bikes. I
presume this means they think there's a demand for such,
but am not sure whether they think many people will tour
with them...

What's the widest tire that one can reasonably use on a
Strada?

If riding gravel roads is a factor, my BikeE is better
pretty good at that,-- better than my Tour Easy.

Jon Meinecke

"stratrider" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

In my humble opinion (although my opinions are NEVER
humble), no SWB is

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

suitable bike for touring. Forget about the Strada and
the Volae.

Instead

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

get a proper touring bike. Almost any LWB will be
better. Why? More

control

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and overall easier to handle. All SWB are quirky and
will trip you up

when

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

you least expect it. SWB is for sport riding, not for
touring. Be

warned.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Thus spake Zarathustra!

Ed, I met I guy two years ago in SW Missouri that was
heading across country on a RANS Rocket towing a BOB. He
went coast to coast! But a Rocket is a very different bike
than a high racer. From the dual 20s to the triangulated
frame to the gearing. For me, I agree with your LWB
assessment. My friends and I are planning a week long
loaded tour in August around the Finger Lakes of western
NY. I have a 99 Stratus and an 03 Strada. It's a no
brainer. I am loading the Stratus. The long frame, the
more upright riding position, the low bb, and the low
gearing (52-39-26 with a 11-34 cassette) all make my
Stratus the right bike for this ride. I am going to add a
midship rack to my rear rack and load two sets of
panniers. This will allow me the option to use my fairing
up front if I choose.

Regards, Jim Reilly

Jim, I also think it is a no brainer to choose between a SWB
and a LWB for touring . Your Stratus should be ideal for
your tour. Be careful you do not get loaded down with too
much weight. Anything over 40 pounds or so can get to feel
like too much. But I am and always have been a wimp.

I think the Finger Lakes region has some pretty big hills to
get over when you are going from one string of lakes and
crossing over to another string of lakes. Your gearing
appears to be fine. With a weighted bike you most likely
would not need a fairing for anything other than weather
protection. But I never ride when the weather is bad. I just
hunker down and wait it out. Except on those week long
organized type of group tours where you have to go
regardless of the weather. I simply can't ride in the rain.
I get chilled and come down with hypothermia, teeth
chattering and all.

Best of good luck to you on your tour this summer.

--
Regards,

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"Jon Meinecke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed to
be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way... Is
this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly
quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon,

I've ridden both types of SWB's: The highracer Strada and
the somewhat lower BB V-REX, Bike SAT R DAY and Bike E.

For a long distance tour I think either might be fine,
DEPENDING on how the rider feels. I say on a tour as
opposed to riding around the city or a town or casual
riding. For that I think the lower BB position of a V-REX
type SWB instead of a STRADA allows you to feel more
comfortable in traffic, stop and go, etc. For my casual
riding, town riding, city riding, I'll use the SAT R DAY
instead of the Strada.

For longer rides I speak from personal experience having
gone to PBP and ridden there on my V-REX. I never had one
bit of physical discomfort or unsure feeling on the bike. In
qualifying for PBP, I rode the V-REX for almost 32 hours
over a distance of 360 miles without sleeping and felt
confident of how the bike handled on all kinds of road
conditions in all kinds of weather.

On a tour you're typically on the road cycling for long
distances so how you feel on the bike is more important
than what others think. You've got to fit the bike and
vice versa.

I've only ridden a SWB so can't opine on a LWB, but for
those who have the Tour Easy or GRR, everyone I know loves
them. I've tried them, but just don't feel as good on one as
I do on a SWB. Different strokes...etc. I find the handling
of a LWB "wierd".

Most folks have said they would not recommend a STRADA as a
first recumbent. I second that. If you like a SWB because of
the ease of transportation, style, feel,handling etc. I'd go
for a SWB like a V-REX, GIRO or a similar one for touring.
I'd leave the STRADA for fast centuries.

Hope some of this helps...

Slow Joe Recumbo

Quoted message said:

Jon Meinecke

"Joe Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...
[...]

Quoted message said:

I've only ridden a SWB so can't opine on a LWB, but for
those who have the Tour Easy or GRR, everyone I know loves
them. I've tried them, but just don't feel as good on one
as I do on a SWB. Different strokes...etc. I find the
handling of a LWB "wierd".

Most folks have said they would not recommend a STRADA as
a first recumbent. I second that. If you like a SWB
because of the ease of transportation, style,
feel,handling etc. I'd go for a SWB like a V-REX, GIRO or
a similar one for touring. I'd leave the STRADA for fast
centuries.

I have noted in talking to many SWB cyclists like Joe that
the RANS V-Rex appears to be the SWB by which all others are
measured and compared. Some others may be faster, but for
all-around good handling and comfort it is hard to beat a
V-Rex apparently. I am mostly a LWB fan myself but I have
also extensively ridden SWB. The one thing I will say is
that we can quickly adapt and learn to ride any of these
contraptions known as recumbent bicycles no matter their
configuration, but when the road gets tricky and traffic
gets difficult I have always found LWB to be more forgiving
of rider error and inattention. It amazes me that Joe would
find a LWB to have "weird" handling.

--
Ed Dolan - Minnesota

[email hidden] (Joe Keenan) wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I've ridden both types of SWB's: The highracer Strada and
the somewhat lower BB V-REX, Bike SAT R DAY and Bike E.

... Hope some of this helps...

Slow Joe Recumbo

Quoted message said:

Jon Meinecke

Very good post.

"Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Joe Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
.-"]news:[email hidden].-
.. [...]

Quoted message said:

I've only ridden a SWB so can't opine on a LWB, but for
those who have the Tour Easy or GRR, everyone I know
loves them. I've tried them, but just don't feel as good
on one as I do on a SWB. Different strokes...etc. I find
the handling of a LWB "wierd".

Most folks have said they would not recommend a STRADA
as a first recumbent. I second that. If you like a SWB
because of the ease of transportation, style,
feel,handling etc. I'd go for a SWB like a V-REX, GIRO
or a similar one for touring. I'd leave the STRADA for
fast centuries.

I have noted in talking to many SWB cyclists like Joe that
the RANS V-Rex appears to be the SWB by which all others
are measured and compared. Some others may be faster, but
for all-around good handling and comfort it is hard to
beat a V-Rex apparently. I am mostly a LWB fan myself but
I have also extensively ridden SWB. The one thing I will
say is that we can quickly adapt and learn to ride any of
these contraptions known as recumbent bicycles no matter
their configuration, but when the road gets tricky and
traffic gets difficult I have always found LWB to be more
forgiving of rider error and inattention. It amazes me
that Joe would find a LWB to have "weird" handling.

Someone said a SWB felt like driving a sports car and a LWB
felt like driving a cadillac. With that analogy, I'd say
that I liked the sporty feeling of the SWB but didn't like
the truck like feeling of a LWB. The ride I'm sure may be a
bit more stable feeling, but it's the handlig of the SWB
that tickles me fancy.

Slow Joe

I've ridden a Strada about 1K miles and am aware of the
"springiness" you speak of. It really doesn't impair the
bike's handling, but I believe the Glideflex hinged stem
clamp is probably the cause. It's possible to mount a
rigid stem clamp on the Strada and this would probably
eliminate the springiness. Replacing the aluminum fork
might also help.

"Jon Meinecke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed to
be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way... Is
this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly
quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke