Strada questions/obervations

"Jon Meinecke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed
to be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way...
Is this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

In my humble opinion (although my opinions are NEVER humble), no SWB is a
suitable bike for touring. Forget about the Strada and the Volae. Instead
get a proper touring bike. Almost any LWB will be better. Why? More control
and overall easier to handle. All SWB are quirky and will trip you up when
you least expect it. SWB is for sport riding, not for touring. Be warned.
Thus spake Zarathustra!

--
Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed
to be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way...
Is this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

Jon: This comparison has been discussed a lot on both this site and on
Bentrideronline.com. You might want to read up on those comments. My
opinion, based on the comments I have read, is this:

1. If you own a Bacchetta a Bacchetta is better.
2. If you own a Volae a Volae is better.
3. If you have a local dealer who stocks Bacchetta then a Bacchetta is
better.
4. If you have no local source for Bacchetta (and Bacchetta can only
be bought from a dealer) then Volae (which is sold primarily by mail
order) is better.
5. If you are always removing the seat for transportation the Volae
set up is better.
6. If you like a padded seat as opposed to a hardshell the Bacchetta
has more models it offers it on (I think) so the Bacchetta is better.

While this sounds facetious, it is intended to show that they are both
fine bikes from fine, responsive companies, and each has loyal
ownership. I have ridden both company's offerings and own neither as
I am shorter so a dual 26 inch wheeled bike is a little tall, I don't
like the tweener bars (although the bars from each company are
different your knees still come up behind the bars) and I like my
current performance bike (Barcroft Virginia) too much to get rid of
it. Do whatever you can to have your son ride them both and let him
decide based on what feels good to him. You can't go wrong with
either.

I might also add that while I won't unequivocably say don't get either
for touring, I don't believe any of these bikes other than perhaps
their 26/20 offerings would count touring as their strong selling
point. Not to say they can't tour, but they are more performance, go
fast bikes. To me, putting a rack and panniers on a dual 26 Volae or
a Strada or Corsa would be like putting ketchup on a steak. You can
do it, it just doesn't seem right. My opinion only.

Mike S.
St. Louis, Mo.

Hi, Ed. As you say, your opinions about touring recumbents are fairly
categorical, and to better put them in context I'd like to know about
your tours and the bikes you used. Is it still chilly up there? Brian
Pottorff from New Mexico. Southern New Mexico.

--

Vcubed <[email hidden]> wrote in news:bdXnc.39363
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Hi, Ed. As you say, your opinions about touring recumbents are fairly
categorical, and to better put them in context I'd like to know about
your tours and the bikes you used. Is it still chilly up there? Brian
Pottorff from New Mexico. Southern New Mexico.

--

Hi,
Who is this "ed" of which you speak?
Oh well...
www.crazyguyonabike.com might be a place to investigate.

If you're going to tour on a given bike, you want to be able to fit it
with wide tires, low gears (lower than that, really), and racks, although
a Nomad or a Bob ought to work. A whole lot of bikes will do this, but
not all equally well. Fenders are a really nice accessory, especially if
there will be two of you riding together, but probably not a necessity.
These are the objective things.

Subjectively, there's handling, comfort and looks. My opinions on these
are worthless to you, so I'll spare you.

Lots of long trips have been made on SWB bikes, including things like
PBP, so don't let that throw you.

I've not seen one, but RANs claims the Force 5 will take fenders.
Interesting.
H

"Vcubed" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hi, Ed. As you say, your opinions about touring recumbents are fairly
categorical, and to better put them in context I'd like to know about
your tours and the bikes you used. Is it still chilly up there? Brian
Pottorff from New Mexico. Southern New Mexico.

Brian, I have done many week long organized group bike tours. I started out
riding my Vision SWB, but after the first year I gave it up. It was simply
too exhausting to have to pay that much attention to the road because of its
quirkiness. I have a few other SWB too and I just do not like them for
anything other than sport riding for short periods of time.

I set up my Vision LWB and I have never looked back. It just handles so much
better and I find that I do not have to pay so much attention to the
vagaries of the road with it. In other words, I can day dream more and am
altogether more relaxed on it. I know of course that others prefer SWB for
all kinds of riding, but I am a very strong partisan for LWB, especially for
touring when you are going to be on the bike for over 6 hours a day for
weeks at a time.

There is a lot to be said for LWB with the crank fairly low in relationship
to the seat. It is not ideal for absolute comfort, but it is ideal for ease
of handling. Ease of handling counts for a lot with me. I find that I am
riding my home made Tour Easy almost exclusively around town these days
because of that factor alone. If and when I ever fall on a bike, it is an
occasion for deep think. I do no need any broken bones to go along with my
many other ailments.

--
Regards,

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"Howard" <bishop(1199bitshiftleft1)@yazhooz.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
[...]

Quoted message said:

If you're going to tour on a given bike, you want to be able to fit it
with wide tires, low gears (lower than that, really), and racks, although
a Nomad or a Bob ought to work. A whole lot of bikes will do this, but
not all equally well. Fenders are a really nice accessory, especially if
there will be two of you riding together, but probably not a necessity.
These are the objective things.

Subjectively, there's handling, comfort and looks. My opinions on these
are worthless to you, so I'll spare you.

Looks do not count for anything with me. Comfort counts for very much
because one spends a lot of hours in the seat when one is touring by
bicycle. However, handling is absolutely critical on a long tour. The
handling has to be second nature to the extent that you do not even have to
think about it. If you have to think about it, then you need an easier
handling bike.

Quoted message said:

Lots of long trips have been made on SWB bikes, including things like
PBP, so don't let that throw you.

That is true, but when I tour for many hours a day for many days in
succession, I like to be relaxed and enjoy the ride. I do not want to even
have to think about the bike. With SWB, I am always having to think about
the bike and how it handles with respect to the vagaries of the road,
traffic and other riders. In other words I have to pay attention. That can
really get exhausting after a couple of days. With LWB I can ignore most
everything because I know I can depend on the bike to be forgiving of
mistakes and inattention.

--
Regards,

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"mike s" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Jon: This comparison has been discussed a lot on both this
site and on Bentrideronline.com.

Thanks for the response.

Since you've ridden both, how do you compare the steering?

Quoted message said:

You might want to read up on those comments. My
opinion, based on the comments I have read, is this:

1. If you own a Bacchetta a Bacchetta is better.
2. If you own a Volae a Volae is better.
[...]
Do whatever you can to have your son ride them both and let him
decide based on what feels good to him. You can't go wrong with
either.

Yes, that's my impression. B's and V's are quite similar in character
and quality. But before I spend $70 to try the Volae, I'm hoping to
benefit from the insight of people who have ridden both (such as you,
thanks) to help decide if there's enough difference to matter. I'll
likely give Hostel Shoppe a call to check availability and get their
spin. %^)

My son also test rode a few upright bikes that can "take a rack",--
some more suitable for touring than others. The Bianchi Volpe seems
to be a decent bike for the price. Novara Randonee also... Yes, he
gets to decide.

Quoted message said:

I might also add that while I won't unequivocally say don't get either
for touring, [...] they are more performance, go fast bikes.

I already have a recumbent bike with "Tour" in its name... %^) I
wouldn't mind getting a more performance-oriented bike (Fast
Freddie bait) to add to the "stable" that can also be used for the
middle distance tour with my son. I'm watching the used bike
lists...

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

"Howard" <bishop(1199bitshiftleft1)@yazhooz.com>

Quoted message said:

www.crazyguyonabike.com might be a place to investigate.

Yes, excellent cite of excellent site. I've spent many enjoyable
hours touring vicariously through the reports there.

Quoted message said:

Subjectively, there's handling, comfort and looks.

Balancing all these for a 17 year old, too. He's methodical
and analytical.

Quoted message said:

My opinions on these are worthless to you, so I'll spare you.

If you've ridden one or the other, I wouldn't presume your
comments worthless absent some pattern of Ed-illogical
posting. %^)

Quoted message said:

Lots of long trips have been made on SWB bikes, including things like
PBP, so don't let that throw you.

Yes. I've read a number of trip reports. None I've seen so
far on dual "big wheel" SWBs.

Quoted message said:

I've not seen one, but RANs claims the Force 5 will take fenders.
Interesting.

Force 5 does look worth considering. Wish there were local
RANS dealer.

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

"Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

In my humble opinion (although my opinions are NEVER humble), no SWB is a
suitable bike for touring. Forget about the Strada and the Volae. Instead
get a proper touring bike. Almost any LWB will be better. Why? More control
and overall easier to handle. All SWB are quirky and will trip you up when
you least expect it. SWB is for sport riding, not for touring. Be warned.
Thus spake Zarathustra!

Ed, I met I guy two years ago in SW Missouri that was heading across
country on a RANS Rocket towing a BOB. He went coast to coast! But a
Rocket is a very different bike than a high racer. From the dual 20s
to the triangulated frame to the gearing. For me, I agree with your
LWB assessment. My friends and I are planning a week long loaded tour
in August around the Finger Lakes of western NY. I have a 99 Stratus
and an 03 Strada. It's a no brainer. I am loading the Stratus. The
long frame, the more upright riding position, the low bb, and the low
gearing (52-39-26 with a 11-34 cassette) all make my Stratus the right
bike for this ride. I am going to add a midship rack to my rear rack
and load two sets of panniers. This will allow me the option to use
my fairing up front if I choose.

Regards,
Jim Reilly

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

Since baking while on tour is very difficult, I'd say go for a
compatible pan fry instead.

BentJay

"BentJay" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

Since baking while on tour is very difficult, I'd say go for a
compatible pan fry instead.

Baking on tour isn't that difficult: Try Outback Oven from
Backpacker's Pantry.

http://www.backpackerspantry.com/

It *is* also, by the way, a frying pan. "But wait, now how much would
you pay!?" You also get a heat diffuser plate that makes simmering
a snap even on that blow-torch Whisperlite stove! %^)

We've made pizza, quiche, ginger bread, brownies, spice cake,
etc... A dutch oven top browns better, but the Outback Oven
"carries" better.

I often "bake" when biking in the summer even without the
benefit of such devices. Riding in 107F isn't completely
unbearable here. Only slightly further south the effect is
much like a steam injection oven. Slightly north, they have
a ride they call Hotter 'n Hell. It's been a "killer ride" literally
in some years.

But back to my question:

We're looking for a bike for my son that's reasonably well suited
for touring, but not necessarily dedicated to that use. We hope
not to "bake" ourselves in northern New Mexico high-country
in July/August. Whoever has the most efficient bike/muscle
combination gets to carry the tent up the mountain roads.

Anyone done the Taos upper/lower loops on a recumbent?

Jon Meinecke

"Jon Meinecke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed
to be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way...
Is this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke

Hi Jon

I recently test rode a Strada and noticed the "springy" feeling in the
front end. It almost felt like the front end was loose. I like Jon,
would like to know if this is from the tilt adjustable stem or is it
just the way 26/26 wheel bikes behave?

I was all set to purchase this bike but this "springy" feeling in the
front end made me have second thoughts. I'm now waiting until the
Rans Force 5 comes out to see if it has the same feel.

I don't think the Strada would be very good for touring. I would be
afraid to ride this bike down the occasional gravel/bad road that you
might encounter on those skinny tires.

Dan

"Bikerchief" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I recently test rode a Strada and noticed the "springy" feeling in the
front end. It almost felt like the front end was loose. I like Jon,
would like to know if this is from the tilt adjustable stem or is it
just the way 26/26 wheel bikes behave?

Good to know it wasn't just something in the setup of the bike
we tried. Anyone comment on whether the Volae steering
is similar?

Quoted message said:

I don't think the Strada would be very good for touring. I would be
afraid to ride this bike down the occasional gravel/bad road that you
might encounter on those skinny tires.

They offer a "midship" rack for the Bacchetta bikes. I presume this
means they think there's a demand for such, but am not sure
whether they think many people will tour with them...

What's the widest tire that one can reasonably use on a Strada?

If riding gravel roads is a factor, my BikeE is better pretty
good at that,-- better than my Tour Easy.

Jon Meinecke

"stratrider" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

In my humble opinion (although my opinions are NEVER humble), no SWB is

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

suitable bike for touring. Forget about the Strada and the Volae.

Instead

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

get a proper touring bike. Almost any LWB will be better. Why? More

control

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and overall easier to handle. All SWB are quirky and will trip you up

when

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

you least expect it. SWB is for sport riding, not for touring. Be

warned.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Thus spake Zarathustra!

Ed, I met I guy two years ago in SW Missouri that was heading across
country on a RANS Rocket towing a BOB. He went coast to coast! But a
Rocket is a very different bike than a high racer. From the dual 20s
to the triangulated frame to the gearing. For me, I agree with your
LWB assessment. My friends and I are planning a week long loaded tour
in August around the Finger Lakes of western NY. I have a 99 Stratus
and an 03 Strada. It's a no brainer. I am loading the Stratus. The
long frame, the more upright riding position, the low bb, and the low
gearing (52-39-26 with a 11-34 cassette) all make my Stratus the right
bike for this ride. I am going to add a midship rack to my rear rack
and load two sets of panniers. This will allow me the option to use
my fairing up front if I choose.

Regards,
Jim Reilly

Jim, I also think it is a no brainer to choose between a SWB and a LWB for
touring . Your Stratus should be ideal for your tour. Be careful you do not
get loaded down with too much weight. Anything over 40 pounds or so can get
to feel like too much. But I am and always have been a wimp.

I think the Finger Lakes region has some pretty big hills to get over when
you are going from one string of lakes and crossing over to another string
of lakes. Your gearing appears to be fine. With a weighted bike you most
likely would not need a fairing for anything other than weather protection.
But I never ride when the weather is bad. I just hunker down and wait it
out. Except on those week long organized type of group tours where you have
to go regardless of the weather. I simply can't ride in the rain. I get
chilled and come down with hypothermia, teeth chattering and all.

Best of good luck to you on your tour this summer.

--
Regards,

Ed Dolan - Minnesota

"Jon Meinecke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed
to be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way...
Is this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon,

I've ridden both types of SWB's: The highracer Strada and the
somewhat lower BB V-REX, Bike SAT R DAY and Bike E.

For a long distance tour I think either might be fine, DEPENDING on
how the rider feels. I say on a tour as opposed to riding around the
city or a town or casual riding. For that I think the lower BB
position of a V-REX type SWB instead of a STRADA allows you to feel
more comfortable in traffic, stop and go, etc. For my casual riding,
town riding, city riding, I'll use the SAT R DAY instead of the
Strada.

For longer rides I speak from personal experience having gone to PBP
and ridden there on my V-REX. I never had one bit of physical
discomfort or unsure feeling on the bike. In qualifying for PBP, I
rode the V-REX for almost 32 hours over a distance of 360 miles
without sleeping and felt confident of how the bike handled on all
kinds of road conditions in all kinds of weather.

On a tour you're typically on the road cycling for long distances so
how you feel on the bike is more important than what others think.
You've got to fit the bike and vice versa.

I've only ridden a SWB so can't opine on a LWB, but for those who have
the Tour Easy or GRR, everyone I know loves them. I've tried them,
but just don't feel as good on one as I do on a SWB. Different
strokes...etc. I find the handling of a LWB "wierd".

Most folks have said they would not recommend a STRADA as a first
recumbent. I second that. If you like a SWB because of the ease of
transportation, style, feel,handling etc. I'd go for a SWB like a
V-REX, GIRO or a similar one for touring. I'd leave the STRADA for
fast centuries.

Hope some of this helps...

Slow Joe Recumbo

Quoted message said:

Jon Meinecke

"Joe Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
[...]

Quoted message said:

I've only ridden a SWB so can't opine on a LWB, but for those who have
the Tour Easy or GRR, everyone I know loves them. I've tried them,
but just don't feel as good on one as I do on a SWB. Different
strokes...etc. I find the handling of a LWB "wierd".

Most folks have said they would not recommend a STRADA as a first
recumbent. I second that. If you like a SWB because of the ease of
transportation, style, feel,handling etc. I'd go for a SWB like a
V-REX, GIRO or a similar one for touring. I'd leave the STRADA for
fast centuries.

I have noted in talking to many SWB cyclists like Joe that the RANS V-Rex
appears to be the SWB by which all others are measured and compared. Some
others may be faster, but for all-around good handling and comfort it is
hard to beat a V-Rex apparently. I am mostly a LWB fan myself but I have
also extensively ridden SWB. The one thing I will say is that we can quickly
adapt and learn to ride any of these contraptions known as recumbent
bicycles no matter their configuration, but when the road gets tricky and
traffic gets difficult I have always found LWB to be more forgiving of rider
error and inattention. It amazes me that Joe would find a LWB to have
"weird" handling.

--
Ed Dolan - Minnesota

[email hidden] (Joe Keenan) wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I've ridden both types of SWB's: The highracer Strada and the
somewhat lower BB V-REX, Bike SAT R DAY and Bike E.

...
Hope some of this helps...

Slow Joe Recumbo

Quoted message said:

Jon Meinecke

Very good post.

"Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Joe Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
[...]

Quoted message said:

I've only ridden a SWB so can't opine on a LWB, but for those who have
the Tour Easy or GRR, everyone I know loves them. I've tried them,
but just don't feel as good on one as I do on a SWB. Different
strokes...etc. I find the handling of a LWB "wierd".

Most folks have said they would not recommend a STRADA as a first
recumbent. I second that. If you like a SWB because of the ease of
transportation, style, feel,handling etc. I'd go for a SWB like a
V-REX, GIRO or a similar one for touring. I'd leave the STRADA for
fast centuries.

I have noted in talking to many SWB cyclists like Joe that the RANS V-Rex
appears to be the SWB by which all others are measured and compared. Some
others may be faster, but for all-around good handling and comfort it is
hard to beat a V-Rex apparently. I am mostly a LWB fan myself but I have
also extensively ridden SWB. The one thing I will say is that we can quickly
adapt and learn to ride any of these contraptions known as recumbent
bicycles no matter their configuration, but when the road gets tricky and
traffic gets difficult I have always found LWB to be more forgiving of rider
error and inattention. It amazes me that Joe would find a LWB to have
"weird" handling.

Someone said a SWB felt like driving a sports car and a LWB felt like
driving a cadillac. With that analogy, I'd say that I liked the
sporty feeling of the SWB but didn't like the truck like feeling of a
LWB. The ride I'm sure may be a bit more stable feeling, but it's the
handlig of the SWB that tickles me fancy.

Slow Joe

I've ridden a Strada about 1K miles and am aware of the "springiness" you
speak of. It really doesn't impair the bike's handling, but I believe the
Glideflex hinged stem clamp is probably the cause. It's possible to mount a
rigid stem clamp on the Strada and this would probably eliminate the
springiness. Replacing the aluminum fork might also help.

"Jon Meinecke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We're looking for a touring compatible bake for my son.

We test rode a Strada this weekend. We both noted the
handle bars seemed, for lack of a better word, "springy"
when starting. This was not forward to back, but seemed
to be rotational,-- not as noticeable once under way...
Is this an artifact of the tilt adjustable stem?

The bike was very easily ridden at low speed except for
heel strike. I presume one learns to avoid this fairly quickly.

On these two issues, how does the Strada compare with a
Volae model (Tour 26 for instance).

Any other general comments on using bikes such as these
for touring?

Thanks,

Jon Meinecke