Sleeping bag for mountain marathons

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 20:08:04 +0100, "Idris" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Anyone got any recomendations?

Hi there,

Well, I've not done a mountain marathon (yet - I need a partner) but
here are some nice v. light/compact bags I've read about.

Vango Venom
Marmot Hydrogen - I have this: it's lovely, but expensive
RAB Quantum 200

There are others, but that's some stuff to be going on with :-)

Good luck in the MM! Which one are you doing?

Best wishes,
--
Peewiglet

Peewiglet said:

Marmot Hydrogen - I have this: it's lovely, but expensive

So you bought it then? How long ago?

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk

Paul Saunders said:

Quoted message said:

Marmot Hydrogen - I have this: it's lovely, but expensive

So you bought it then? How long ago?

In London, about 3 weeks ago.

I took it up to the Lakes the following weekend, and it was really v.
nice indeed under particularly trying circumstances. It took a while
to warm up my feet (the weather was a nightmare) but once they were
warm I was just amazingly comfortable. It seems to have no weight at
all - just warmth! 🙂

Best wishes,
--
Peewiglet

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:15:30 +0100, Peewiglet <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 20:08:04 +0100, "Idris" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Anyone got any recomendations?

My Kimm q490 has just arrived, and it is a Thing Of Beauty.

500g. I slept in it at home for the first bit of last night, and it
was slightly too warm which is Good News. I'm taking it on a Bob
Graham recce at the end of the month, so I'm hoping that the fell
surroundings will be a bit like my bedroom.

PW meanwhile wrote " I've not done a mountain marathon (yet - I need a
partner)"

Hurrah, will you be my friend, next year it is then...?

Tom

This machine kills fascists

"Peewiglet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 20:08:04 +0100, "Idris" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Anyone got any recomendations?

Hi there,

Well, I've not done a mountain marathon (yet - I need a partner) but
here are some nice v. light/compact bags I've read about.

Vango Venom
Marmot Hydrogen - I have this: it's lovely, but expensive
RAB Quantum 200

I have the Venom, bought it about a year ago I think? Maybe a bit before...
It's rated as a three season and saw me through last winter in the
Cairngorms last January very comforatbly (although I thought the time I
spent there it was quite mild!) sleeping on top of a thermarest, which adds
a good layer of insulation from the ground anyway... Very warm (often too
warm) much of the year but you can always unzip and sleep half out! It has
just seen a section of the Pyrenees very comfortably (about three weeks ago)
camping between 1500m & 2000m. The mummy shape and length is good for me,
but then I'm not overly tall (5'7''😉. I didn't need liner, but I did find
that a thermal top helped to keep warm on particular night when the
temperature went below zero (not sure how far) but then we were at 2000m!
Only thing I would say is that there, it was mid September. It coped with
Scotland last winter fine for me, but wouldn't like to say what would be
good for anyone else... It's extreme rating is -15ºC, but I haven't gone
anywhere near that... The only thing that bugs me is the single drawstring
for the shoulder and head which got a bit irritating in the cold, trying to
draw the shape in, but it was only a minor niggle as once it was drawn in
comfortably over my face leaving a small gap for my nose, it was wonderful!

Hope that helped a bit (or was at least of a little interest)?

Gareth

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 22:48:20 +0100, Tom <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

500g. I slept in it at home for the first bit of last night, and it
was slightly too warm which is Good News. I'm taking it on a Bob
Graham recce at the end of the month, so I'm hoping that the fell
surroundings will be a bit like my bedroom.

Bob Graham recce? Exciting! Are you recceing it for yourself? Have
you seen "Feet in the Clouds"?

Quoted message said:

PW meanwhile wrote " I've not done a mountain marathon (yet - I need a
partner)"

Quoted message said:

Hurrah, will you be my friend, next year it is then...?

I think a Bob Graham person would be much too fast for me! 🙂

Best wishes,
--
Peewiglet

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 07:39:33 +0100, Peewiglet <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Bob Graham recce? Exciting! Are you recceing it for yourself? Have
you seen "Feet in the Clouds"?

I do have a vague plan at an attempt in 2006, after spending 2005
getting back into a bit of running and walking fitness. Meanwhile it
gives me an excuse to lurch up to the lakes every now and then, and
not have to bother about thinking "where shall I go today" once I'm
there.

This time will be a pretty leisurely clockwise 4-dayer of Grasmere YH
- pick up route at Calf Crag - camp in Wasdale - Honister YH - camp nr
Mungrisdale Common - back to Grasmere.

PW also said

Quoted message said:

I think a Bob Graham person would be much too fast for me! 🙂

Ha! I can't run uphill, downhills hurt, I'm not at my best on the
flat and my navigation's an embarrassment. That's why a need a
friend....

Incidentally, as I understand it, the BGR isn't about brute speed,
it's rather more about Keeping Going - it's only 3 miles an hour after
all :-) - Billy Bland walked it! <fx Tom falls to floor and has to
lie down for a while>

Oh, and "Feet in the Clouds" is one of the best books I've read for
ages. Let me know if you ever see a copy of "Studmarks on the
Summits".

Tom

This machine kills fascists

The message <[email hidden]>
from Tom <[email hidden]> contains these words:

Quoted message said:

Incidentally, as I understand it, the BGR isn't about brute speed,
it's rather more about Keeping Going - it's only 3 miles an hour after
all :-) - Billy Bland walked it! <fx Tom falls to floor and has to
lie down for a while>

I wasn't aware anyone was actually so foolish as to have walked it but
many years ago I worked out that it was theoretically possible using
Chapmans Rule - a hour for every 4 miles and another for every 3000 feet
of ascent. I can't find my notes but ISTR that the height involved was
somewhere in the region of 17000 feet which was more than enough to put
me off trying it.

--
Roger Chapman so far this year 69 summits
New - 47 (Marilyns 13, Sweats 5, Outlying Fells 35)
Repeats - 22( Marilyns 7, Sweats 16, Wainwrights 16)

Thanks for all the suggestions, will check them out. Its not actually a
mountain marathon, have just done the Polaris Challenge and want to get some
better kit before doing it again.

Gerald

"Gareth Crawshaw" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Peewiglet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 20:08:04 +0100, "Idris" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Anyone got any recomendations?

Hi there,

Well, I've not done a mountain marathon (yet - I need a partner) but
here are some nice v. light/compact bags I've read about.

Vango Venom
Marmot Hydrogen - I have this: it's lovely, but expensive
RAB Quantum 200

I have the Venom, bought it about a year ago I think? Maybe a bit

before...

Quoted message said:

It's rated as a three season and saw me through last winter in the
Cairngorms last January very comforatbly (although I thought the time I
spent there it was quite mild!) sleeping on top of a thermarest, which

adds

Quoted message said:

a good layer of insulation from the ground anyway... Very warm (often too
warm) much of the year but you can always unzip and sleep half out! It has
just seen a section of the Pyrenees very comfortably (about three weeks

ago)

Quoted message said:

camping between 1500m & 2000m. The mummy shape and length is good for me,
but then I'm not overly tall (5'7''😉. I didn't need liner, but I did find
that a thermal top helped to keep warm on particular night when the
temperature went below zero (not sure how far) but then we were at 2000m!
Only thing I would say is that there, it was mid September. It coped with
Scotland last winter fine for me, but wouldn't like to say what would be
good for anyone else... It's extreme rating is -15ºC, but I haven't gone
anywhere near that... The only thing that bugs me is the single drawstring
for the shoulder and head which got a bit irritating in the cold, trying

to

Quoted message said:

draw the shape in, but it was only a minor niggle as once it was drawn in
comfortably over my face leaving a small gap for my nose, it was

wonderful!

Quoted message said:

Hope that helped a bit (or was at least of a little interest)?

Gareth

How about that 🙂
I was sleeping in my Venom in the Pyrenees three weeks ago too. I have
to say it was particularly warm this year and I was too warm on some
occasions. I've used the Venom to about -5 and it started to get chilly,
wouldn't want to use it below that, which is why I got a Jagbag liner.
We're talking about a Venom 300 yes, not the 400? (which I wish I'd
bought instead 🙂
BTW Paul, how's the ME bag doing?
Cheers
Graham

"Gareth Crawshaw" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I have the Venom, bought it about a year ago I think? Maybe a bit

before...

Quoted message said:

It's rated as a three season and saw me through last winter in the
Cairngorms last January very comforatbly (although I thought the time

I

Quoted message said:

spent there it was quite mild!) sleeping on top of a thermarest, which

adds

Quoted message said:

a good layer of insulation from the ground anyway... Very warm (often

too

Quoted message said:

warm) much of the year but you can always unzip and sleep half out! It

has

Quoted message said:

just seen a section of the Pyrenees very comfortably (about three

weeks ago)

Quoted message said:

camping between 1500m & 2000m. The mummy shape and length is good for

me,

Quoted message said:

but then I'm not overly tall (5'7''😉. I didn't need liner, but I did

find

Quoted message said:

that a thermal top helped to keep warm on particular night when the
temperature went below zero (not sure how far) but then we were at

2000m!

Quoted message said:

Only thing I would say is that there, it was mid September. It coped

with

Quoted message said:

Scotland last winter fine for me, but wouldn't like to say what would

be

Quoted message said:

good for anyone else... It's extreme rating is -15ºC, but I haven't

gone

Quoted message said:

anywhere near that... The only thing that bugs me is the single

drawstring

Quoted message said:

for the shoulder and head which got a bit irritating in the cold,

trying to

Quoted message said:

draw the shape in, but it was only a minor niggle as once it was drawn

in

Quoted message said:

comfortably over my face leaving a small gap for my nose, it was

wonderful!

Quoted message said:

Hope that helped a bit (or was at least of a little interest)?

Gareth

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graham blamey said:

BTW Paul, how's the ME bag doing?

Still haven't used it yet I'm sad to say!

Last winter I suffered for 10 weeks with the longest lasting mega-cold
I've ever had. Completely ruined my winter. Must get my flu jab this
year. Was booked in for tomorrow but I've just caught a damn cold so
I've had to postpone it for another couple of weeks. Really trying to
fight it this time with loads of C, zinc and garlic. I don't want
another winter stuck indoors like last year.

Rumour has it that we might be in for a really ultra cold winter this
year! (link courtesy of SteMC)
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/041013/344/f4gd5.html

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk

"graham blamey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

How about that 🙂
I was sleeping in my Venom in the Pyrenees three weeks ago too.

Whereabouts? I did a section of the GR10, between La Gourette & Luchon.
Fantastic weather, uncharacteristic for this late in the year... (great
wildlife - we were lucky enough to see lammergeiers twice.) Great trip
though. First time in the Pyrenees for me...

Quoted message said:

I have
to say it was particularly warm this year and I was too warm on some
occasions. I've used the Venom to about -5 and it started to get chilly,
wouldn't want to use it below that, which is why I got a Jagbag liner.
We're talking about a Venom 300 yes, not the 400? (which I wish I'd
bought instead 🙂

Yep, a 300... I found that it was on the warm side, but I sometimes found
the nights to be a little damp which could lead to a chill, so it was a bit
up and down... Only one, maybe two night(s) did I resort to wearing a
thermal top, but that was a cold night!

g.

Quoted message said:

Whereabouts? I did a section of the GR10, between La Gourette &

Luchon.

Quoted message said:

Fantastic weather, uncharacteristic for this late in the year...

(great

Quoted message said:

wildlife - we were lucky enough to see lammergeiers twice.) Great trip
though. First time in the Pyrenees for me...

### seventh for us 😉 we always go this time of year and the
weather has always been reasonable. We were at Canfranc in Spain for a
few days
then around Lescun for a bit and then on to Cauterets for a few days.
graham

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"Tom" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

........ Let me know if you ever see a copy of "Studmarks on the

Quoted message said:

Summits".

I've seen and sold three copies of this in about five years so it doesn't
crop up
very often. I will buy any copy I see unless it's at a ridiculous price.
Keep an
eye on the catalogue on my web site from time to time. You will find there
also
some Bob Graham summit times you might find of interest.

Tony Simpkins
http://www.mountainlakesbooks.co.uk

"Roger" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I wasn't aware anyone was actually so foolish as to have walked it but
many years ago I worked out that it was theoretically possible using
Chapmans Rule - a hour for every 4 miles and another for every 3000 feet
of ascent. I can't find my notes but ISTR that the height involved was
somewhere in the region of 17000 feet which was more than enough to put
me off trying it.

Billy Bland is a walker only in the sense that Don Thompson was a
walker.
The height involved is more like 28000 feet !

Tony Simpkins

The message <[email hidden]>
from "Tony Simpkins" <[email hidden]> contains these words:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I wasn't aware anyone was actually so foolish as to have walked it but
many years ago I worked out that it was theoretically possible using
Chapmans Rule - a hour for every 4 miles and another for every 3000 feet
of ascent. I can't find my notes but ISTR that the height involved was
somewhere in the region of 17000 feet which was more than enough to put
me off trying it.

Quoted message said:

Billy Bland is a walker only in the sense that Don Thompson was a
walker.
The height involved is more like 28000 feet !

Fading memory must account for the lost 10000 feet. I still haven't
found my calculations but (faintly in pencil) I once wrote on my list of
the Bob Graham Round "72 27000" and below "? 60.6 and 26125" which
suggests to me that the person who gave me the list had said the circuit
was 72 miles with 27000 feet of ascent and that I had calculated it as
somewhat shorter. The difference in distance is quite amazing but I must
have believed my version at one time as the longer one would take 27
hours using Chapmans Rule while the shorter one 23 hours 51.5 minutes.

--
Roger Chapman so far this year 69 summits
New - 47 (Marilyns 13, Sweats 5, Outlying Fells 35)
Repeats - 22( Marilyns 7, Sweats 16, Wainwrights 16)

Have had a look at the specs of those recomended, my biggest difficulty is
deciding on the temperature rating, how do I go about deciding on whats
appropriate, I can only afford one bag so it will have to do all year round
uk use.

Gerald
"graham blamey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Whereabouts? I did a section of the GR10, between La Gourette &

Luchon.

Quoted message said:

Fantastic weather, uncharacteristic for this late in the year...

(great

Quoted message said:

wildlife - we were lucky enough to see lammergeiers twice.) Great trip
though. First time in the Pyrenees for me...

### seventh for us 😉 we always go this time of year and the
weather has always been reasonable. We were at Canfranc in Spain for a
few days
then around Lescun for a bit and then on to Cauterets for a few days.
graham

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"Idris" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Have had a look at the specs of those recomended, my biggest

difficulty is

Quoted message said:

deciding on the temperature rating, how do I go about deciding on

whats

Quoted message said:

appropriate, I can only afford one bag so it will have to do all year

round

Quoted message said:

uk use.
Gerald

### if only it were that simple 🙂
There are a lot of things to be factored in. Age (this often combines
with things like) Fitness, type of activities, do you sleep hot or cold?
What food you're eating? Over what period will you be using it? Do you
want synthetic or down? (this is often determined by where and in what
conditions you'll be using it). Do you want a 3/4 length zip? a full
length zip? no zip? Are you prepared to get something that's on the
light side but you'll make up by wearing clothing or would you prefer to
have something that's warmer (but heavier) than you need on the basis
that you'll probably never be cold thus ensuring a good nights sleep?
I've used a Vango Venom down to -5 C with a thermal sleeping suit and
below that with a Jagbag liner. OTOH one time it got slightly damp and I
froze all night at 0 C.
One bag won't do all year round UK use (I have 3 and would like more 🙂
if you mean from lowland camping in summer to mountain camping in winter
and every combination in between, any more than one pair of boots or
jacket or any bit of kit come to that.
On the light side there's the Kimmlite bags (they do two bags and the
warmer one looks good), the Vango bag and probably lot's more. The
Marmot Helium in a fantastic bag IMO, weight/warmth, but it's filled
with 900 quality down, rated to -9 C and weighs 907 grammes and is
costly. The Mountain Equipment bags are good (the ME bag Paul bought
from me is superb, but wasted unless you're going to be out at below
about -5 it's just too warm).
You could check out the KIMM site forums or look at the bag reviews on
www.BackpackGearTest.org just to get a feel of how a variety of bags
perform and how people have been analytical about their requirements
from a bag,
Cheers
Graham

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Idris said:

Have had a look at the specs of those recomended, my biggest
difficulty is deciding on the temperature rating, how do I go about
deciding on whats appropriate, I can only afford one bag so it will
have to do all year round uk use.

Well if you buy a winter bag it will be too hot in summer, so if you
really only want one bag I'd recommend a 3 season bag and use a
fleece/fibre-pile liner with it in the winter. I've got a down vest
(jacket without sleeves or hood) and that's good for wearing inside a
sleeping bag when it isn't warm enough.

As for temperature ratings, the more expensive the bag the more
believeable the ratings are. Cheap bags often state silly numbers,
don't believe 'em.

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk