Shoes and pedals

Paul Cassel said:

I note that most people I see who ride road bikes do so using Velcro strap
shoes and different sort of cleats which protrude significantly from the
sole of the shoe. Most of these shoes leave the wearer barely able to walk
from his truck to get the bicycle off the rack. The advantage of my
combination is that I can walk fairly well in these shoes. I’ve had to
walk ‘back’ as much as 4 miles several times when I suffered bicycle
breakdowns I was unable to address on site. While I’d not choose these
shoes / cleats for hiking, the walking wasn’t that much of a chore.

A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes / pedals, my
riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport).

Hint: Don't believe ANYTHING you read in Bicycling magazine!

Quoted message said:

What does one gain by moving to a shoe with the cleat protruding so far
from the shoe’s sole that walking is almost impossible?

A larger cleat that makes walking difficult, wears out fast, slips on wet
surfaces, and squeaks. Some will claim the "larger platform" eliminates
"hot spots," but good stiff SPD shoes will not cause hot spots either.

I rode Look pedals for many years (with Sidi Genius shoes) before switching
to SPD. I've seen no difference in on-bike performance, but a great
improvement in walking with the SPDs.

The weight difference is not enough to make any difference unless you're
attempting to set a new World Hour Record.

If you're going for the "look," get Look pedals and shoes/ (Hmm, is that
where they got the name?)

Otherwise:
http://bikemart.com/site/itemdetails.cfm?ID=947&Catalog=39&sort=Price

http://www.bikeworld.com/components/catalog/product.html?pid=545&cat=73

Art Harris

Paul Cassel said:

My first adult bicycle was a mountain style one. Following the advice of
the LBS where I bought it, I also got the bottom end Shimano SPD pedals
(very heavy and they don't spin very well) and lace up Cannondale brand
shoes. Later, when I added a road bike to my garage, I also bought an
identical set of pedals mostly because they fit these shoes. While the
road bike is fairly high end (by my standards) the pedals aren't. Even I
can see that.

I note that most people I see who ride road bikes do so using Velcro
strap shoes and different sort of cleats which protrude significantly
from the sole of the shoe. Most of these shoes leave the wearer barely
able to walk from his truck to get the bicycle off the rack. The
advantage of my combination is that I can walk fairly well in these
shoes. I've had to walk 'back' as much as 4 miles several times when I
suffered bicycle breakdowns I was unable to address on site. While I'd
not choose these shoes / cleats for hiking, the walking wasn't that much
of a chore.

Clearly I need to upgrade my kit to address the breakdowns, but my query
today is about the shoe / pedal combos. I'm curious to know what if
anything I'd gain by switching to full on road shoes with high end
pedals. A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes /
pedals, my riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport).
Is this true? What does one gain by moving to a shoe with the cleat
protruding so far from the shoe's sole that walking is almost impossible?

Specifically, the magazine recommended Shimano PD6601 (Ultegra) pedals
and Shimano R151 shoes. Currently I have, IIRC, SPD 520 pedals and some
Caonnondale brand shoe which I can't read any information off of any
more after several thousand miles of being in them.

My only restrictions are that I'd like a lighter pedal as my road bike
is lightweight so these pedals which feel like they mass more than 500 g
sort of run contrary to the spirit of the road bike. I also have a wide
forefoot so 'Italian style' shoes don't work for me at all. The
Cannondale shoes I have work ok. I've asked here so have a list of wider
brand shoes such as Shimano making this Bicycling recommendation seem
fairly reasonable.

So what does one gain by using those ungainly road style shoes? How does
one choose between the various cleat / pedal schemes which seem to be
out there? Would a recreational rider benefit from moving from the low
end SPD's to some higher end combination or would I best be served by
upgrading my road bike's pedals to high end SPD style? If I did that I
can keep the same shoes for all riding. TIA.

The times I have been forced to walk long distances with road shoes, I
have taken them off and walked in my socks. I use road pedals on my
road bike because they have a wider more stable platform. My shoes do
not wobble and the shoes are lighter which is a plus. And since I do
not plan on doing any walking when I go for a road ride, the duck-walk
isn't an issue.

When I ride my MTB I use SPD on MTB shoes. I do this because
walking/scrambling over logs, rocks, etc is a common occurrence on my
MTB rides, and this is only practical with MTB shoes. I also like the
"slop" in SPD which lets me wiggle around without releasing by
accident, as well as being able to just stomp on the pedal to engage
it. The only problem with SPD for me is the side-to-side wobble. It is
worth it in exchange for all the other plusses while MTB'ing for me,
but not worth it on the road, where I want a more stable pedal.

I would venture to say that what type of pedals and cleats a rider uses
have about zero to say for performance. I consider it a comfort,
preference issue. No reason not to use MTB pedals/shoes on a road bike
if you are comfortable that way.

Some (most?) MTB shoes tend to be less stiff than road shoes which
makes for a big difference in feel. But this isn't MTB vs road, it is
soft vs stiff.

Joseph

Paul Cassel said:

My first adult bicycle was a mountain style one. Following the advice of
the LBS where I bought it, I also got the bottom end Shimano SPD pedals
(very heavy and they don't spin very well) and lace up Cannondale brand
shoes. Later, when I added a road bike to my garage, I also bought an
identical set of pedals mostly because they fit these shoes. While the
road bike is fairly high end (by my standards) the pedals aren't. Even I
can see that.

I note that most people I see who ride road bikes do so using Velcro
strap shoes and different sort of cleats which protrude significantly
from the sole of the shoe. Most of these shoes leave the wearer barely
able to walk from his truck to get the bicycle off the rack. The
advantage of my combination is that I can walk fairly well in these
shoes. I've had to walk 'back' as much as 4 miles several times when I
suffered bicycle breakdowns I was unable to address on site. While I'd
not choose these shoes / cleats for hiking, the walking wasn't that much
of a chore.

Clearly I need to upgrade my kit to address the breakdowns, but my query
today is about the shoe / pedal combos. I'm curious to know what if
anything I'd gain by switching to full on road shoes with high end
pedals. A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes /
pedals, my riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport).
Is this true? What does one gain by moving to a shoe with the cleat
protruding so far from the shoe's sole that walking is almost impossible?

Rememeber that cycling shoes are for riding, not walking but road shoes
and pedals wouldn't make your ride any better. The shoe is stiffer,
which 'may' make for more eficient transfer of your pedaling action but
shoe fit, ease of use, a good cleat fit, that is the cleat in the right
place, is key. I would say unless your ledals are getting hard to spin
or hard to get into or out of, due to wear, leave them alone. If you
shoes fit and aren't falling apart, leave them alone as well. WE put
'MTB' pedals on road bikes all the time since many DO walk arond when
riding.

Quoted message said:

Specifically, the magazine recommended Shimano PD6601 (Ultegra) pedals
and Shimano R151 shoes. Currently I have, IIRC, SPD 520 pedals and some
Caonnondale brand shoe which I can't read any information off of any
more after several thousand miles of being in them.

Balderdash. Your pedals are good ones, not high Zoot, but good
reasonable pedals that do what tey are supposed to do.

Quoted message said:

My only restrictions are that I'd like a lighter pedal as my road bike
is lightweight so these pedals which feel like they mass more than 500 g
sort of run contrary to the spirit of the road bike.

Less mass probably is something you can't even tell, at the low speeds
of a bicycle and the low cadence. If ya gotta have lighter pedals, Time
makes some nice 'MTB' pedals, Not hugely expensive and lighter.

I also have a wide

Quoted message said:

forefoot so 'Italian style' shoes don't work for me at all. The
Cannondale shoes I have work ok. I've asked here so have a list of wider
brand shoes such as Shimano making this Bicycling recommendation seem
fairly reasonable.

So what does one gain by using those ungainly road style shoes? How does
one choose between the various cleat / pedal schemes which seem to be
out there? Would a recreational rider benefit from moving from the low
end SPD's to some higher end combination or would I best be served by
upgrading my road bike's pedals to high end SPD style? If I did that I
can keep the same shoes for all riding. TIA.

"Paul Cassel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

My first adult bicycle was a mountain style one. Following the advice of
the LBS where I bought it, I also got the bottom end Shimano SPD pedals
(very heavy and they don’t spin very well) and lace up Cannondale brand
shoes. Later, when I added a road bike to my garage, I also bought an
identical set of pedals mostly because they fit these shoes. While the
road bike is fairly high end (by my standards) the pedals aren’t. Even I
can see that.

I note that most people I see who ride road bikes do so using Velcro strap
shoes and different sort of cleats which protrude significantly from the
sole of the shoe. Most of these shoes leave the wearer barely able to walk
from his truck to get the bicycle off the rack. The advantage of my
combination is that I can walk fairly well in these shoes. I’ve had to
walk ‘back’ as much as 4 miles several times when I suffered bicycle
breakdowns I was unable to address on site. While I’d not choose these
shoes / cleats for hiking, the walking wasn’t that much of a chore.

Clearly I need to upgrade my kit to address the breakdowns, but my query
today is about the shoe / pedal combos. I’m curious to know what if
anything I’d gain by switching to full on road shoes with high end pedals.
A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes / pedals, my
riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport). Is this
true? What does one gain by moving to a shoe with the cleat protruding so
far from the shoe’s sole that walking is almost impossible?

Specifically, the magazine recommended Shimano PD6601 (Ultegra) pedals and
Shimano R151 shoes. Currently I have, IIRC, SPD 520 pedals and some
Caonnondale brand shoe which I can’t read any information off of any more
after several thousand miles of being in them.

My only restrictions are that I’d like a lighter pedal as my road bike is
lightweight so these pedals which feel like they mass more than 500 g sort
of run contrary to the spirit of the road bike. I also have a wide
forefoot so ‘Italian style’ shoes don’t work for me at all. The Cannondale
shoes I have work ok. I’ve asked here so have a list of wider brand shoes
such as Shimano making this Bicycling recommendation seem fairly
reasonable.

So what does one gain by using those ungainly road style shoes? How does
one choose between the various cleat / pedal schemes which seem to be out
there? Would a recreational rider benefit from moving from the low end SPD’s
to some higher end combination or would I best be served by upgrading my
road bike’s pedals to high end SPD style? If I did that I can keep the
same shoes for all riding. TIA.

I have been riding SPD pedals and SIDI MTB shoes on my road bike for years.
It is easy to walk in them and the cleats never wear out. They are great for
long tours, centuries, etc. where you are off the bike a lot to eat brownies
and stuff. I also have some LOOK pedals and SIDI road shoes. They are harder
to walk in, dangerously slippery on smooth surfaces and the cleats wear out
faster than you would think. I use the looks when I am going for fast
workouts and won't be getting off the bike. For me, the advantages of the
Looks are: foot position is more stable, I find them easier to get into
without looking and they don't squeak as much. If I only had one set, I
would stick with the SPDs. I have also tried Speeplays and M2Racer Orbs.
Speedplays are pretty easy to get into and the metal plate last a long time
if you walk on them.

Paul Cassel said:

My first adult bicycle was a mountain style one. Following the advice of
the LBS where I bought it, I also got the bottom end Shimano SPD pedals
(very heavy and they don't spin very well) and lace up Cannondale brand
shoes. Later, when I added a road bike to my garage, I also bought an
identical set of pedals mostly because they fit these shoes. While the
road bike is fairly high end (by my standards) the pedals aren't. Even I
can see that.

Are ya comfy? Then stick with that combo and poke the eye of those that
insist you need road gear.

Look type bindings can feel a bit more stable depending on the model
and kind of shoe, but for the rider I'm assuming you are, a non-pro
just like me most--stick with spd. It's ubiquitous and you can walk the
the shoes.

I use cheap Wellgo/Nashbar pedals on my road bike, and they're as
smooth as the spendy models after a regreasing, but the low end
Shimanos are even nicer. If yours feel a bit rough, give them a
servicing.

You did the smart thing, getting identical pedals for both bikes. Why
complicate something for the sake of fashion.

Which Shimano pedals? Even the low-end jobbers don't weigh all that
much, and even the heaviest spds aren't anything to really obsess over.

Save your money and get a nice vintage wool jersey for this spring,
practice cursing in Italian, and you'll have a leg up on everybody come
summer.

"Paul Cassel" wrote...

Quoted message said:

My first adult bicycle was a mountain style one. Following the advice of
the LBS where I bought it, I also got the bottom end Shimano SPD pedals
(very heavy and they don’t spin very well) and lace up Cannondale brand
shoes. Later, when I added a road bike to my garage, I also bought an
identical set of pedals mostly because they fit these shoes. While the
road bike is fairly high end (by my standards) the pedals aren’t. Even I
can see that.

I note that most people I see who ride road bikes do so using Velcro strap
shoes and different sort of cleats which protrude significantly from the
sole of the shoe. Most of these shoes leave the wearer barely able to walk
from his truck to get the bicycle off the rack. The advantage of my
combination is that I can walk fairly well in these shoes. I’ve had to
walk ‘back’ as much as 4 miles several times when I suffered bicycle
breakdowns I was unable to address on site. While I’d not choose these
shoes / cleats for hiking, the walking wasn’t that much of a chore.

Clearly I need to upgrade my kit to address the breakdowns, but my query
today is about the shoe / pedal combos. I’m curious to know what if
anything I’d gain by switching to full on road shoes with high end pedals.
A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes / pedals, my
riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport). Is this
true? What does one gain by moving to a shoe with the cleat protruding so
far from the shoe’s sole that walking is almost impossible?

Specifically, the magazine recommended Shimano PD6601 (Ultegra) pedals and
Shimano R151 shoes. Currently I have, IIRC, SPD 520 pedals and some
Caonnondale brand shoe which I can’t read any information off of any more
after several thousand miles of being in them.

My only restrictions are that I’d like a lighter pedal as my road bike is
lightweight so these pedals which feel like they mass more than 500 g sort
of run contrary to the spirit of the road bike. I also have a wide
forefoot so ‘Italian style’ shoes don’t work for me at all. The Cannondale
shoes I have work ok. I’ve asked here so have a list of wider brand shoes
such as Shimano making this Bicycling recommendation seem fairly
reasonable.

So what does one gain by using those ungainly road style shoes? How does
one choose between the various cleat / pedal schemes which seem to be out
there? Would a recreational rider benefit from moving from the low end SPD’s
to some higher end combination or would I best be served by upgrading my
road bike’s pedals to high end SPD style? If I did that I can keep the
same shoes for all riding. TIA.

I use MTB pedals on my touring/commuting bike for exactly the reasons you
mention, it's nice to be able to walk around off the bike once in a while. I
do own a road racing bike with road style pedals. The road shoes are nice
and stiff for optimum energy transfer, and the road pedals (Campagnolo
Chorus) are light and should last a long time, but I'm not convinced that
I'm gaining any performance advantage over a decent quality MTB pedal/shoe
combo. The velcro closure on the road shoes is convenient, but you can get
that on MTB shoes, too. There are also expensive MTB shoes with carbon fiber
soles that are probably every bit as stiff (and pricey) as the best road
shoes.

If you absolutely must spent buckets of cash on superlight pedals and
superstiff shoes, consider the Crank Brothers Eggbeater MTB pedals. Very
light, very well made, and the titanium version costs enough (~$300) to let
you hold your head up around the snootiest roadies. The steel version is a
good bit cheaper, but still quite light and very well made. Like the
mountain bike SPD cleats, the Eggbeater cleats are recessed so you can walk
around easily.
--
mark

Arthur Harris said:

"Paul Cassel" wrote:

<snipped>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes / pedals, my
riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport).

Hint: Don't believe ANYTHING you read in Bicycling magazine!

Especially if it involves $pending money on products that "just happen"
to be advertised in Buycycling magazine!

Paul Cassel said:

My first adult bicycle was a mountain style one. Following the advice of
the LBS where I bought it, I also got the bottom end Shimano SPD pedals
(very heavy and they don’t spin very well) and lace up Cannondale brand
shoes. Later, when I added a road bike to my garage, I also bought an
identical set of pedals mostly because they fit these shoes. While the
road bike is fairly high end (by my standards) the pedals aren’t. Even I
can see that.

I note that most people I see who ride road bikes do so using Velcro
strap shoes and different sort of cleats which protrude significantly
from the sole of the shoe. Most of these shoes leave the wearer barely
able to walk from his truck to get the bicycle off the rack. The
advantage of my combination is that I can walk fairly well in these
shoes. I’ve had to walk ‘back’ as much as 4 miles several times when I
suffered bicycle breakdowns I was unable to address on site. While I’d
not choose these shoes / cleats for hiking, the walking wasn’t that much
of a chore.

Clearly I need to upgrade my kit to address the breakdowns, but my query
today is about the shoe / pedal combos. I’m curious to know what if
anything I’d gain by switching to full on road shoes with high end
pedals. A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes /
pedals, my riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport).
Is this true? What does one gain by moving to a shoe with the cleat
protruding so far from the shoe’s sole that walking is almost impossible?

Specifically, the magazine recommended Shimano PD6601 (Ultegra) pedals
and Shimano R151 shoes. Currently I have, IIRC, SPD 520 pedals and some
Caonnondale brand shoe which I can’t read any information off of any
more after several thousand miles of being in them.

My only restrictions are that I’d like a lighter pedal as my road bike
is lightweight so these pedals which feel like they mass more than 500 g
sort of run contrary to the spirit of the road bike. I also have a wide
forefoot so ‘Italian style’ shoes don’t work for me at all. The
Cannondale shoes I have work ok. I’ve asked here so have a list of wider
brand shoes such as Shimano making this Bicycling recommendation seem
fairly reasonable.

So what does one gain by using those ungainly road style shoes? How does
one choose between the various cleat / pedal schemes which seem to be
out there? Would a recreational rider benefit from moving from the low
end SPD’s to some higher end combination or would I best be served by
upgrading my road bike’s pedals to high end SPD style? If I did that I
can keep the same shoes for all riding. TIA.

Hi, I started with SPDs and a pair of Shimano lace up mtb shoes. i
still use the shoes every week at my spin class and when I ride my
older bike.
On my LeMond I have SPD-SL the Ultegra model, with Sidi Genuis 4s. As
others have said, they are not for walking, and will wear quickly, if
you do walk in them. But I don't care about the walking problem, for
the riding I do.
I really like my SPD-SL pedals, they are easy to enter and exit, with
the Sidi shoes, my feet never bother me.

The Sidi shoes come in wide sizes and half sizes, very comfy. The Look
pedals have a reputation for squeeking, my Shimanos are quiet. If I
was starting from scratch, I might consider the new Looks, the Keo, I
think it is. But otherwise the DA version if money no object and the
105 version, I think it is the 520, if on a budget.But, the Ultegra is
just fine. All three models use the same cleats. My LBS sells the
Shimano cleats for $20, and I wait for a sale, usually paying $16-17 a
set. I buy two or three sets at a time.

Jeffrey Starr
All rights to the above text is reserved. No use
outside of rec.bicycle.tech, without express written
permission.

Thanks to everybody for this very informative set of replies. Just as a
note, the pedals on my road bike do seem to be excessively worn. I say
this because no matter how hard I try to spin them, I can't get a single
rotation before they grind to a halt.

That implies to me that the bearings aren't what the should be. Thus,
with a need to buy new pedals anyway, I figured to cast about for a
different set.

One thing which you posters hit on but which I left out is that since I
got these bikes I've been using them for actual transportation. They are
more than recreational devices since I live within a few miles of
stores, libraries, and even work. Having a set of biking shoes I can
walk around in the store while shopping is a necessity, but that article
had me thinking that I was losing 25% or so of my pedaling efficiency to
gain the ability to walk around the supermarket.

The current shoes never worked all that well for me anyway as they
aren't wide enough at the forefoot. My feet go numb (even in warm
weather) after about 10 miles due to compression. This wasn't much of a
deal when I started out because 10 miles was a major event which blew me
out for the day. However, I'm better at it now and even planning an
organized century ride this May.

I am going to follow the group's guidance here and look for a new set of
SPD pedals, but lighter ones. I stumbled onto a road bike which is way
above my level of riding. I'm sort of in a position of a guy who has a
Porsche. Even if he never goes above 80 mph with it, he doesn't want to
put H rated tires.

I'll also look for a set of stiffer mtn bike shoes, but this time my
size. The current ones I got 1.5 sizes too long to try and make up for
the lack of width.

Again, thanks to all for the informative and courteous replies.

-paul

Paul Cassel said:

My first adult bicycle was a mountain style one. Following the advice of
the LBS where I bought it, I also got the bottom end Shimano SPD pedals
(very heavy and they don't spin very well) and lace up Cannondale brand
shoes. Later, when I added a road bike to my garage, I also bought an
identical set of pedals mostly because they fit these shoes. While the
road bike is fairly high end (by my standards) the pedals aren't. Even I
can see that.

I note that most people I see who ride road bikes do so using Velcro
strap shoes and different sort of cleats which protrude significantly
from the sole of the shoe. Most of these shoes leave the wearer barely
able to walk from his truck to get the bicycle off the rack. The
advantage of my combination is that I can walk fairly well in these
shoes. I've had to walk 'back' as much as 4 miles several times when I
suffered bicycle breakdowns I was unable to address on site. While I'd
not choose these shoes / cleats for hiking, the walking wasn't that much
of a chore.

Clearly I need to upgrade my kit to address the breakdowns, but my query
today is about the shoe / pedal combos. I'm curious to know what if
anything I'd gain by switching to full on road shoes with high end
pedals. A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes /
pedals, my riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport).
Is this true? What does one gain by moving to a shoe with the cleat
protruding so far from the shoe's sole that walking is almost impossible?

Specifically, the magazine recommended Shimano PD6601 (Ultegra) pedals
and Shimano R151 shoes. Currently I have, IIRC, SPD 520 pedals and some
Caonnondale brand shoe which I can't read any information off of any
more after several thousand miles of being in them.

Was there a full page Shimano advertisement for these cleats and shoes
strategically placed near the article text?

Quoted message said:

My only restrictions are that I'd like a lighter pedal as my road bike
is lightweight so these pedals which feel like they mass more than 500 g
sort of run contrary to the spirit of the road bike. I also have a wide
forefoot so 'Italian style' shoes don't work for me at all. The
Cannondale shoes I have work ok. I've asked here so have a list of wider
brand shoes such as Shimano making this Bicycling recommendation seem
fairly reasonable.

Here is an Italian shoe that fits wide northern European feet that also
takes recessed Shimano cleats. It also has a stiff sole so it will
perform as well as a "road shoe": Dominator 5 Mega Lorica® Mountain
Bike Shoes [1]. Note that you would need the "Mega" version, as the
standard width SiDi shoes do not fit wide feet.

Quoted message said:

So what does one gain by using those ungainly road style shoes? How does
one choose between the various cleat / pedal schemes which seem to be
out there? Would a recreational rider benefit from moving from the low
end SPD's to some higher end combination or would I best be served by
upgrading my road bike's pedals to high end SPD style? If I did that I
can keep the same shoes for all riding. TIA.

Road shoes with protruding cleats will make you miserable if you ever
have a mechanical problem (or worse, have your bike stolen) and have to
walk somewhere. Like brifters and low spoke count wheels, they are best
left to racers who can count on the support car showing up if they have
serious problems. Stiff sole ATB shoes with higher quality pedals will
provide 99 and 44/100% of the performance of road shoes and pedals
during road riding without the detriments that occur when off the bike.

[1]
<http://www.sidisport.com/eng/cycling/art_d.asp?ATp_ID=C02&Art_ID=MCDOM5>.

--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley

Quoted message said:

...
The times I have been forced to walk long distances with road shoes, I
have taken them off and walked in my socks....

This would be great fun during the rain, on cold days or on areas with
thorns or "puncture vine". An ugly scenario would be frostbite during
the winter.

No thanks.

--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley

Qui si parla Campagnolo aka Peter Chisholm said:

Paul Cassel said:

My first adult bicycle was a mountain style one. Following the advice of
the LBS where I bought it, I also got the bottom end Shimano SPD pedals
(very heavy and they don't spin very well) and lace up Cannondale brand
shoes. Later, when I added a road bike to my garage, I also bought an
identical set of pedals mostly because they fit these shoes. While the
road bike is fairly high end (by my standards) the pedals aren't. Even I
can see that.

I note that most people I see who ride road bikes do so using Velcro
strap shoes and different sort of cleats which protrude significantly
from the sole of the shoe. Most of these shoes leave the wearer barely
able to walk from his truck to get the bicycle off the rack. The
advantage of my combination is that I can walk fairly well in these
shoes. I've had to walk 'back' as much as 4 miles several times when I
suffered bicycle breakdowns I was unable to address on site. While I'd
not choose these shoes / cleats for hiking, the walking wasn't that much
of a chore.

Clearly I need to upgrade my kit to address the breakdowns, but my query
today is about the shoe / pedal combos. I'm curious to know what if
anything I'd gain by switching to full on road shoes with high end
pedals. A recent Bicycling magazine said that by moving to road shoes /
pedals, my riding would be vastly improved (like an entirely new sport).
Is this true? What does one gain by moving to a shoe with the cleat
protruding so far from the shoe's sole that walking is almost impossible?

Rememeber that cycling shoes are for riding, not walking but road shoes
and pedals wouldn't make your ride any better. The shoe is stiffer,
which 'may' make for more eficient transfer of your pedaling action but
shoe fit, ease of use, a good cleat fit, that is the cleat in the right
place, is key. I would say unless your ledals are getting hard to spin
or hard to get into or out of, due to wear, leave them alone. If you
shoes fit and aren't falling apart, leave them alone as well. WE put
'MTB' pedals on road bikes all the time since many DO walk arond when
riding.

Quoted message said:

Specifically, the magazine recommended Shimano PD6601 (Ultegra) pedals
and Shimano R151 shoes. Currently I have, IIRC, SPD 520 pedals and some
Caonnondale brand shoe which I can't read any information off of any
more after several thousand miles of being in them.

Balderdash. Your pedals are good ones, not high Zoot, but good
reasonable pedals that do what tey are supposed to do.

Quoted message said:

My only restrictions are that I'd like a lighter pedal as my road bike
is lightweight so these pedals which feel like they mass more than 500 g
sort of run contrary to the spirit of the road bike.

Less mass probably is something you can't even tell, at the low speeds
of a bicycle and the low cadence....

Hey! I agree with Peter.

--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley

Paul Cassel said:

I am going to follow the group's guidance here and look for a new set of
SPD pedals, but lighter ones. I stumbled onto a road bike which is way
above my level of riding. I'm sort of in a position of a guy who has a
Porsche. Even if he never goes above 80 mph with it, he doesn't want to
put H rated tires.

There you go again...

Quoted message said:

I'll also look for a set of stiffer mtn bike shoes, but this time my size.
The current ones I got 1.5 sizes too long to try and make up for the lack
of width.

Not all SPD shoes are MTB type. The Shimano T092 shoes that I use look like
a regular road shoe (they don't have the heavy lugged soles typical of MTB
shoes), but are stiff, do have a recessed cleat for easy walking, and triple
velcro closure. See:
http://bikemart.com/site/itemdetails.cfm?ID=947&Catalog=39&sort=Price

Art Harris

Johnny Sunset said:

Paul Cassel wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Specifically, the magazine recommended Shimano PD6601 (Ultegra) pedals
and Shimano R151 shoes. Currently I have, IIRC, SPD 520 pedals and some
Caonnondale brand shoe which I can't read any information off of any
more after several thousand miles of being in them.

Was there a full page Shimano advertisement for these cleats and shoes
strategically placed near the article text?

I get your point. Others here in this thread have said similar. AFAIK,
there was no close ad. You here may find Bicycling to be silly, but
bicycling as a hobby / sport is like any other. I need to start with
some information as a base. I can then grow from there.

I once thought this was buy a bike, hop on and pedal. I failed several
attempts at this. My being able to ride comes from a friend who used to
be a pro who fitted me. Prior to that, I didn't even KNOW that you were
fitted to a bike.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Here is an Italian shoe that fits wide northern European feet that also
takes recessed Shimano cleats. It also has a stiff sole so it will
perform as well as a "road shoe": Dominator 5 Mega Lorica® Mountain
Bike Shoes [1]. Note that you would need the "Mega" version, as the
standard width SiDi shoes do not fit wide feet.

Thanks for the specific recommendation. I am with you on walking home.
Today my water bottle froze solid during my ride. A walk home barefooted
would be, well, difficult.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So what does one gain by using those ungainly road style shoes? How does
one choose between the various cleat / pedal schemes which seem to be
out there? Would a recreational rider benefit from moving from the low
end SPD's to some higher end combination or would I best be served by
upgrading my road bike's pedals to high end SPD style? If I did that I
can keep the same shoes for all riding. TIA.

Road shoes with protruding cleats will make you miserable if you ever
have a mechanical problem (or worse, have your bike stolen) and have to
walk somewhere. Like brifters and low spoke count wheels, they are best
left to racers who can count on the support car showing up if they have
serious problems. Stiff sole ATB shoes with higher quality pedals will
provide 99 and 44/100% of the performance of road shoes and pedals
during road riding without the detriments that occur when off the bike.

[1]
<http://www.sidisport.com/eng/cycling/art_d.asp?ATp_ID=C02&Art_ID=MCDOM5>.

I think I have brifters, but I"m unsure. They are plastic. I do have
those low spoke count wheels where the spokes are blades - not
cylinders. Others here such as Art and Jobst have already poked well
deserved fun at me for these things. My only defense is that I didn't
pay a premium for them - they came with the bike which I got for a
reasonable beginner price.

Quoted message said:

I'll have a look at the Megas. No sense in me going from a 2 time fool
to a 3 time one.

-paul

Dans le message de news:[email hidden],
Jeff Starr <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :

[snipped, having no rights of reproduction]

Quoted message said:

Jeffrey Starr
All rights to the above text is reserved. No use
outside of rec.bicycle.tech, without express written
permission.

The trick is, you have to hire us lawyers to enforce these feeble rights !
Yea ! The Brotherhood [generically including Sisterhood]

And only after these rights are infringed. It's not a criminal deal, where
you go to the cop store and tell them you want an IP warrant enforced.

--
--
Sandy

--
Si les autres parties du monde ont des singes ; l'Europe a des Français.
Cela se compense.
[Arthur Schopenhauer]

Qui si parla Campagnolo wrote:
reasonable pedals that do what tey are supposed to do.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My only restrictions are that I'd like a lighter pedal as my road bike
is lightweight so these pedals which feel like they mass more than 500 g
sort of run contrary to the spirit of the road bike.

Less mass probably is something you can't even tell, at the low speeds
of a bicycle and the low cadence. If ya gotta have lighter pedals, Time
makes some nice 'MTB' pedals, Not hugely expensive and lighter.

Well, folks sure seem to spend a lot of money to go that way. I have to
be skeptical here. My friend bought a 'comfort' bike which weighs maybe
40 lbs or so it feels. We went out riding. After she got exhausted, she
switched with my daughter who has a decent bike I got at a swap for $15.
It's a specialized hybrid weighing perhaps, 24 lbs. My friend and
daughter said the difference, especially on hills was enormous. It sort
of ruined my buddy's new comfort bike for her.

I know I haven't isolated for mass alone there, but I think there must
be something to this or many folks are fools.

Arthur Harris said:

Paul Cassel said:

I am going to follow the group's guidance here and look for a new set of
SPD pedals, but lighter ones. I stumbled onto a road bike which is way
above my level of riding. I'm sort of in a position of a guy who has a
Porsche. Even if he never goes above 80 mph with it, he doesn't want to
put H rated tires.

There you go again...

? Are you giving me some razz again about my bladed spokes and I'm not
getting it?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'll also look for a set of stiffer mtn bike shoes, but this time my size.
The current ones I got 1.5 sizes too long to try and make up for the lack
of width.

Not all SPD shoes are MTB type. The Shimano T092 shoes that I use look like
a regular road shoe (they don't have the heavy lugged soles typical of MTB
shoes), but are stiff, do have a recessed cleat for easy walking, and triple
velcro closure. See:
http://bikemart.com/site/itemdetails.cfm?ID=947&Catalog=39&sort=Price

I like the general look and design of those Sidi Mega Dominators that
Johnny mentioned. I'm ok with mtb style. I'll also be using them for mtn
bike riding - espcially if I get the Megas. They cost $200! Yikes.

Johnny Sunset said:

Quoted message said:

...
The times I have been forced to walk long distances with road shoes, I
have taken them off and walked in my socks....

This would be great fun during the rain, on cold days or on areas with
thorns or "puncture vine". An ugly scenario would be frostbite during
the winter.

No thanks.

--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley

Late fall in Norway, in the rain, about 10km. What doesn't kill me,
makes me stonger! :-) This was before the days of cell phones, so I
couldn't call in the cavalry.

It's a question of probablilities. I do not intend to do any walking at
all on my road rides, and if I do, it is an extreme circumstance that I
don't want to deal with the downside of the other 99.999% of the time.
The downside is not having the wide stable platform of SPD-SL (Ultegra
style) cleats. Look cleats in my opinion are no good because the wear
so quickly and that affects the stability of the platform.

That said, I use MTB shoes for my MTB and agree with everyone else here
that road shoes are not a performance enhancer in any way (other than
weight, which is minimal). It's a comfort issue. I'd rather be
comfortable when I am pedaling vs being comfortable while I am walking.
Comfort for me means a solid stable platform with no "yaw" wobble. All
the MTB shoes I have tried have some wobble. I like the wobble while
MTB'ing because it allows more "english" without disengaging or feeling
strained, but it is irritating for me on long road rides.

Joseph

Paul Cassel said:

Well, folks sure seem to spend a lot of money to go that way. I have to be
skeptical here. My friend bought a 'comfort' bike which weighs maybe 40
lbs or so it feels. We went out riding. After she got exhausted, she
switched with my daughter who has a decent bike I got at a swap for $15.
It's a specialized hybrid weighing perhaps, 24 lbs. My friend and daughter
said the difference, especially on hills was enormous.

A bike that's 16 pounds heavier than another is certainly going to make a
difference in the hills. But how much lighter are your new pedals going to
be compared to the old ones? Maybe 75 grams? (1 pound = 454 grams)

Art Harris