Serious question

In article <[email hidden]>,

Paul Cassel said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Did you miss the mention of "Nubain" in the OP's post???

I thought it was a different sort of steroid. What do I know? I don't
even drink alcohol.

Google is your friend. ;-)

Granted, I only know about 'bain because I read a regular body building
rag.

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Ranieri' nah said:

Quoted message said:

Don't you ever ask yourself, "Why do we have the enzyme alcohol
dehydrogenase?"

Use it or lose it, baby.

<lol>
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

Ah, that would make sense ;o)

--
Will~

"... so that's how liberty ends, in a round of applause."

Queen Amidala, The revenge of the Syth.

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Willow said:

Ok, I'm the dummy who doesn't know a thing about Steroids, is it that
addictive anyway?
--
Will~

AFAIK, only psychologically..... ;-)

The whole "reverse Anorexia" thing.

("Help me, I'm MELting!!!!!!!!!"😉
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack

Nicholson

Willow said:

Ah, that would make sense ;o)

There is a bit more to it than that, in that if you're depressed
removing the euphoric effects of anabolic steroids can make you feel a
lot worse. It's part of why steroids are blamed for suicides: people
with depression and self image problems try and fix things by getting
muscular using anabolic steroids. The problem is, this doesn't cure
their depression or their self image problems, because it doesn't matter
how they look they will still be depressed with self image problems
until the condition self resolves or they get treatment. So, after all
the steroids and working out doesn't work, they get even more depressed
and desperate and the results are not good. As I said above, withdrawing
the steroids and the euphoric effects they can induce let's the person
who was already depressed (and with self image problems, which is why
they started using the steroids) feel the full weight of the clinical
depression with sometimes fatal results. It's not the steroids that're
causing the suicides, it's untreated clinical depression.

Bakc to the original post: the OP mentions her friend is going to use
'nubain', which is an opiate pain killer (same family as morphine). You
get more aches and pains when stopping or reducing deca durabolin if you
have pre existing injuries that deca was masking just a bit, but not
nearly enough to need anything more than the occaisional tylenol (which,
with old injuries, you would probably be taking anyway with or without
steroids). So, basically, the way I understand it is that the OP's
friend is an addict (as David Cohen pointed out) and is using an excuse
to abuse opiate based painkillers.

Please correct any misapprehensions I may have typed in this post.

Ari

--
spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/

On Thu, 19 Jan 2006 02:33:32 +0800, spodosaurus

spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com said:

Willow said:

Ah, that would make sense ;o)

There is a bit more to it than that, in that if you're depressed
removing the euphoric effects of anabolic steroids can make you feel a
lot worse. It's part of why steroids are blamed for suicides: people
with depression and self image problems try and fix things by getting
muscular using anabolic steroids. The problem is, this doesn't cure
their depression or their self image problems, because it doesn't matter
how they look they will still be depressed with self image problems
until the condition self resolves or they get treatment. So, after all
the steroids and working out doesn't work, they get even more depressed
and desperate and the results are not good. As I said above, withdrawing
the steroids and the euphoric effects they can induce let's the person
who was already depressed (and with self image problems, which is why
they started using the steroids) feel the full weight of the clinical
depression with sometimes fatal results. It's not the steroids that're
causing the suicides, it's untreated clinical depression.

Bakc to the original post: the OP mentions her friend is going to use
'nubain', which is an opiate pain killer (same family as morphine). You
get more aches and pains when stopping or reducing deca durabolin if you
have pre existing injuries that deca was masking just a bit, but not
nearly enough to need anything more than the occaisional tylenol (which,
with old injuries, you would probably be taking anyway with or without
steroids). So, basically, the way I understand it is that the OP's
friend is an addict (as David Cohen pointed out) and is using an excuse
to abuse opiate based painkillers.

Please correct any misapprehensions I may have typed in this post.

Ari

Thank you for your forthright response.
I can tell you that he has cycled for 15 plus years. We live in SoCal,
and have had easy access to Mex for a long time. I know that he
started out with merely the steroids, but in the last several years,
his substance abuse has grown to include G, and now Nubain. True, it
may be an all encompassing "drug" habit, but at the core is his
steroid addiction, which he is now choosing to give up due to horrible
LFT's and other [censored]-poor lab results. He's also geting married, and
for the first time, is looking at his health through the eyes of his
fiancee. He has loved the way the steroids have made him feel, and his
description has been, "when I'm cycling, I'm Superman. Now I just feel
like Clark Kent". Reading up about detoxing from the drugs has been,
to say the least, frightening. Depression, suicidal thoughts, etc. As
I said-he has a high profile job that does not afford him the ability
to enter a drug treatment program to help with his rehab. Besides, IS
there a rehab for steroid users? I didn't think so, not do I believe
he'd go, anayway. Guess what I was looking for was driection to a
newsgroup, or website, or ANYTHING where other guys have decided to go
off the system, and maybe ask for their ideas/advice/input on what to
do, to expect-WHATEVER. Most of his friends that lift have zero
experience with someone wanting to bail on it. I'm trying to find
anything to help him.

Thanks again for taking me seriously, Ari. It was greatly appreciated.

~Lola

Hellina Handbasket said:

On Thu, 19 Jan 2006 02:33:32 +0800, spodosaurus

spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com said:

Willow said:

Ah, that would make sense ;o)

There is a bit more to it than that, in that if you're depressed
removing the euphoric effects of anabolic steroids can make you feel a
lot worse. It's part of why steroids are blamed for suicides: people
with depression and self image problems try and fix things by getting
muscular using anabolic steroids. The problem is, this doesn't cure
their depression or their self image problems, because it doesn't matter
how they look they will still be depressed with self image problems
until the condition self resolves or they get treatment. So, after all
the steroids and working out doesn't work, they get even more depressed
and desperate and the results are not good. As I said above, withdrawing
the steroids and the euphoric effects they can induce let's the person
who was already depressed (and with self image problems, which is why
they started using the steroids) feel the full weight of the clinical
depression with sometimes fatal results. It's not the steroids that're
causing the suicides, it's untreated clinical depression.

Bakc to the original post: the OP mentions her friend is going to use
'nubain', which is an opiate pain killer (same family as morphine). You
get more aches and pains when stopping or reducing deca durabolin if you
have pre existing injuries that deca was masking just a bit, but not
nearly enough to need anything more than the occaisional tylenol (which,
with old injuries, you would probably be taking anyway with or without
steroids). So, basically, the way I understand it is that the OP's
friend is an addict (as David Cohen pointed out) and is using an excuse
to abuse opiate based painkillers.

Please correct any misapprehensions I may have typed in this post.

Ari

Thank you for your forthright response.
I can tell you that he has cycled for 15 plus years. We live in SoCal,
and have had easy access to Mex for a long time. I know that he
started out with merely the steroids, but in the last several years,
his substance abuse has grown to include G, and now Nubain. True, it
may be an all encompassing "drug" habit, but at the core is his
steroid addiction, which he is now choosing to give up due to horrible
LFT's and other [censored]-poor lab results. He's also geting married, and
for the first time, is looking at his health through the eyes of his
fiancee. He has loved the way the steroids have made him feel, and his
description has been, "when I'm cycling, I'm Superman. Now I just feel
like Clark Kent". Reading up about detoxing from the drugs has been,
to say the least, frightening. Depression, suicidal thoughts, etc. As
I said-he has a high profile job that does not afford him the ability
to enter a drug treatment program to help with his rehab. Besides, IS
there a rehab for steroid users? I didn't think so, not do I believe
he'd go, anayway. Guess what I was looking for was driection to a
newsgroup, or website, or ANYTHING where other guys have decided to go
off the system, and maybe ask for their ideas/advice/input on what to
do, to expect-WHATEVER. Most of his friends that lift have zero
experience with someone wanting to bail on it. I'm trying to find
anything to help him.

Thanks again for taking me seriously, Ari. It was greatly appreciated.

~Lola

Your friend needs to be under the care of a clinical psychologist who
specialises in treating patients with addiction problems, and probably a
psychiatrist as well (or at least a General Practitioner who is not
averse to communicating with the psychologist and probably writing a
prescription for anti-depressants). Like I described, it sounds like
your friend has bigger issues than long term steroid use, and these can
be dangerous, even deadly, if not treated. He's been self medicating
with drugs, including opiates now if he does not have a serious chronic
pain problem, and trying to 'go it alone' can have very unfortunate
consequences in such cases. He can get better, but there'll likely be
relapses into drug use along the way, and it'll be a (sometimes) long
process where his committment to getting clean will be tested many times
along the way.

Ari

--
spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/

Hellina Handbasket said:

I know that he started out with merely the steroids, but in the last several years,
his substance abuse has grown to include G, and now Nubain...

Quoted message said:

He's also geting married, and
for the first time, is looking at his health through the eyes of his
fiancee. He has loved the way the steroids have made him feel, and his
description has been, "when I'm cycling, I'm Superman. Now I just feel
like Clark Kent".

I have some advice but it's not for his it's for his fiancee. RUN!

Stephen ---> and I do mean run...

In article <[email hidden]>, inahandbasket77
@yahoo.com says...

Quoted message said:

I can tell you that he has cycled for 15 plus years. We live in SoCal,
and have had easy access to Mex for a long time. I know that he
started out with merely the steroids, but in the last several years,
his substance abuse has grown to include G, and now Nubain.

I guess I'm pretty sheltered when it comes to drugs as I don't even know
what Mex, G or Nubain is.

Quoted message said:

I said-he has a high profile job that does not afford him the ability
to enter a drug treatment program to help with his rehab.

I would think there would be some one on one therepists who protect
patient confidentiality.

John Black

Hellina Handbasket said:

Unfortunately, I'm not a troll. Honestly looking for some real help.

You're getting it, aren't you?

Quoted message said:

I obviously came to the wrong place.

Why is this obvious? Have you never been on usenet before? You get
wheat with the chaff. It's usually fairly easy to spot. When someone
says something blatantly wrong there's usually a chorus jumping on it to
correct them. When someone says something blatantly offensive we just
ignore them.

Quoted message said:

Sorry if I offended all your sensibilities. Not exactly a subject one
can breach with their general practitioner or pal that doesn't lift,
ya know?
Again, sorry I brought it here.

I suspect you're replying to a kill-filed troll because I don't
understand why you're upset. It seems like people are taking your
question seriously.

Dally

On Thu, 19 Jan 2006 03:22:14 +0800, spodosaurus

spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com said:

Your friend needs to be under the care of a clinical psychologist who
specialises in treating patients with addiction problems, and probably a
psychiatrist as well (or at least a General Practitioner who is not
averse to communicating with the psychologist and probably writing a
prescription for anti-depressants). Like I described, it sounds like
your friend has bigger issues than long term steroid use, and these can
be dangerous, even deadly, if not treated. He's been self medicating
with drugs, including opiates now if he does not have a serious chronic
pain problem, and trying to 'go it alone' can have very unfortunate
consequences in such cases. He can get better, but there'll likely be
relapses into drug use along the way, and it'll be a (sometimes) long
process where his committment to getting clean will be tested many times
along the way.

Ari

I completely agree with your take on this. He's going to need help
with the changes that will occur in his body when he goes "natural",
and will obviously need psych help to do that-if we can get him to go
to one. He's pretty massive, and always has been. Acadaemia and
lifting have always been his passions, and the things for which he's
received praise, glory and attention. Can I ask, though, if you have
any advice for those of us that will be around as he's going through
this? I mean, do his fiancee and I need to look at this as attending
to a drug addict, as opposed to a bodybuilding addict? I guess I'm
answering my own question as I write, but it's so complicated. Any
ideas for ng's or forums online that can help? I've been to getbig.com
and the like, but it's prety much all about Titus and Ryan in there.
It's different than just watching someone get off booze or other
drugs-the change in his body is going to be distressing for him-even
though the rest of us will barely be able to notice the difference. I
dunno. I'm freaking out, I guess. Going to e-mail him now re the
therapist suggestion. Thanks.

~Lola

Hellina Handbasket said:

It's different than just watching someone get off booze or other
drugs-the change in his body is going to be distressing for him-even
though the rest of us will barely be able to notice the difference.

I think there are going to be things different about his case, but so
much will be the same as other addictions that it isn't fruitful to
concentrate on the other differences.

Treating this as a drug addiction makes the most sense to me. You
protest that he's too high profile to be treated, but that's
nonsensical. He's too high profile to HAVE a drug problem. Getting
treated is his only real option.

I'm sorry for his fiancee. What a world of hurt she's in for. Drug
treatment isn't an easy thing to watch. Perhaps she can find an Al-Anon
or similar group to hang out in? I'd think the helplessness of watching
someone you love make bad choices would be the main problem.

Dally

In article <[email hidden]>,

Hellina Handbasket said:

On Thu, 19 Jan 2006 03:22:14 +0800, spodosaurus

spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com said:

Your friend needs to be under the care of a clinical psychologist who
specialises in treating patients with addiction problems, and probably a
psychiatrist as well (or at least a General Practitioner who is not
averse to communicating with the psychologist and probably writing a
prescription for anti-depressants). Like I described, it sounds like
your friend has bigger issues than long term steroid use, and these can
be dangerous, even deadly, if not treated. He's been self medicating
with drugs, including opiates now if he does not have a serious chronic
pain problem, and trying to 'go it alone' can have very unfortunate
consequences in such cases. He can get better, but there'll likely be
relapses into drug use along the way, and it'll be a (sometimes) long
process where his committment to getting clean will be tested many times
along the way.

Ari

I completely agree with your take on this. He's going to need help
with the changes that will occur in his body when he goes "natural",
and will obviously need psych help to do that-if we can get him to go
to one. He's pretty massive, and always has been. Acadaemia and
lifting have always been his passions, and the things for which he's
received praise, glory and attention. Can I ask, though, if you have
any advice for those of us that will be around as he's going through
this?

Going through what exactly? I am still unclear what you or he expect to
happen. You said he has cycled for 15 years. Cycle = being on for a
period of time followed by being off for a period of time. Thus, he
knows what "off" feels like. As a scientist, I assume he is smart enough
to know what to do to get his system (his HPTA) back up and running
which will make his transition from "on" to "off" easier. From the way
you are going on, it sounds more like he has been on for 15 straight
years without any actual cycles, in which case he's f-ed. Kidding, sort
of.... Bottom line here is millions of athletes have gone "clean" after
using AAS for many years and survived. It's not a freakin morphine habit
he's trying to kick here. If he stays off long enough, he will see a big
drop in his strength and his size, and that sucks to be sure, but that's
life. If he is experiencing no health related issues, not sure why he
needs to go "clean" anyway if lifting and being huge is what matters so
much to him, which only leads back to what others have said: he does not
need a rehab center he needs a shrink.

--
Will Brink @ http://www.brinkzone.com/

What is "G" and why won't this person say what it is if they are willing to
mention Nubain and steroids?

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

What is "G" and why won't this person say what it is if they are willing to
mention Nubain and steroids?

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

TBR said:

Paul Cassel said:

Withdrawal from steroids == drug addict? I think they are different, but
then again, I'm hardly an expert.

You're a moron too. You don't think roids are drugs???

/ ~ .\
|\__/
| |
| . |
| `.` |
__| `` | `.` |/~~\
/ | | | `` |/~~\
| | | | | `` | /
\ ` . . | |
\ . . ` /
\ . . /
\ . /
| . |
| |
| |

You are a typical anonymous moron.

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

TBR said:

Paul Cassel said:

Withdrawal from steroids == drug addict? I think they are different, but
then again, I'm hardly an expert.

You're a moron too. You don't think roids are drugs???

/ ~ .\
|\__/
| |
| . |
| `.` |
__| `` | `.` |/~~\
/ | | | `` |/~~\
| | | | | `` | /
\ ` . . | |
\ . . ` /
\ . . /
\ . /
| . |
| |
| |

You are a typical anonymous moron.

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

spodosaurus said:

Willow said:

Ah, that would make sense ;o)

There is a bit more to it than that, in that if you're depressed
removing the euphoric effects of anabolic steroids can make you feel a
lot worse. It's part of why steroids are blamed for suicides: people
with depression and self image problems try and fix things by getting
muscular using anabolic steroids. The problem is, this doesn't cure
their depression or their self image problems, because it doesn't matter
how they look they will still be depressed with self image problems
until the condition self resolves or they get treatment. So, after all
the steroids and working out doesn't work, they get even more depressed
and desperate and the results are not good. As I said above, withdrawing
the steroids and the euphoric effects they can induce let's the person
who was already depressed (and with self image problems, which is why
they started using the steroids) feel the full weight of the clinical
depression with sometimes fatal results. It's not the steroids that're
causing the suicides, it's untreated clinical depression.

Bakc to the original post: the OP mentions her friend is going to use
'nubain', which is an opiate pain killer (same family as morphine).

Nubain is NOT an opiate. It is an opiate agonist/antagonist. Don't make up
[censored] just to sound like you know what you are talking about. You could
take a single shot of an entire bottle of Nubain and it would not kill you.

Quoted message said:

You
get more aches and pains when stopping or reducing deca durabolin if you
have pre existing injuries that deca was masking just a bit, but not
nearly enough to need anything more than the occaisional tylenol (which,
with old injuries, you would probably be taking anyway with or without
steroids).

This is more [censored]. I suggest you stop commenting on all of this. Moron.

Quoted message said:

So, basically, the way I understand it is that the OP's
friend is an addict (as David Cohen pointed out) and is using an excuse
to abuse opiate based painkillers.

Please correct any misapprehensions I may have typed in this post.

Ari

--
spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

spodosaurus said:

Willow said:

Ah, that would make sense ;o)

There is a bit more to it than that, in that if you're depressed
removing the euphoric effects of anabolic steroids can make you feel a
lot worse. It's part of why steroids are blamed for suicides: people
with depression and self image problems try and fix things by getting
muscular using anabolic steroids. The problem is, this doesn't cure
their depression or their self image problems, because it doesn't matter
how they look they will still be depressed with self image problems
until the condition self resolves or they get treatment. So, after all
the steroids and working out doesn't work, they get even more depressed
and desperate and the results are not good. As I said above, withdrawing
the steroids and the euphoric effects they can induce let's the person
who was already depressed (and with self image problems, which is why
they started using the steroids) feel the full weight of the clinical
depression with sometimes fatal results. It's not the steroids that're
causing the suicides, it's untreated clinical depression.

Bakc to the original post: the OP mentions her friend is going to use
'nubain', which is an opiate pain killer (same family as morphine).

Nubain is NOT an opiate. It is an opiate agonist/antagonist. Don't make up
[censored] just to sound like you know what you are talking about. You could
take a single shot of an entire bottle of Nubain and it would not kill you.

Quoted message said:

You
get more aches and pains when stopping or reducing deca durabolin if you
have pre existing injuries that deca was masking just a bit, but not
nearly enough to need anything more than the occaisional tylenol (which,
with old injuries, you would probably be taking anyway with or without
steroids).

This is more [censored]. I suggest you stop commenting on all of this. Moron.

Quoted message said:

So, basically, the way I understand it is that the OP's
friend is an addict (as David Cohen pointed out) and is using an excuse
to abuse opiate based painkillers.

Please correct any misapprehensions I may have typed in this post.

Ari

--
spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

Hellina Handbasket said:

On Thu, 19 Jan 2006 03:22:14 +0800, spodosaurus

spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com said:

Your friend needs to be under the care of a clinical psychologist who
specialises in treating patients with addiction problems, and probably a
psychiatrist as well (or at least a General Practitioner who is not
averse to communicating with the psychologist and probably writing a
prescription for anti-depressants). Like I described, it sounds like
your friend has bigger issues than long term steroid use, and these can
be dangerous, even deadly, if not treated. He's been self medicating
with drugs, including opiates now if he does not have a serious chronic
pain problem, and trying to 'go it alone' can have very unfortunate
consequences in such cases. He can get better, but there'll likely be
relapses into drug use along the way, and it'll be a (sometimes) long
process where his committment to getting clean will be tested many times
along the way.

Ari

I completely agree with your take on this. He's going to need help
with the changes that will occur in his body when he goes "natural",
and will obviously need psych help to do that-if we can get him to go
to one. He's pretty massive, and always has been. Acadaemia and
lifting have always been his passions, and the things for which he's
received praise, glory and attention. Can I ask, though, if you have
any advice for those of us that will be around as he's going through
this? I mean, do his fiancee and I need to look at this as attending
to a drug addict, as opposed to a bodybuilding addict? I guess I'm
answering my own question as I write, but it's so complicated. Any
ideas for ng's or forums online that can help? I've been to getbig.com
and the like, but it's prety much all about Titus and Ryan in there.
It's different than just watching someone get off booze or other
drugs-the change in his body is going to be distressing for him-even
though the rest of us will barely be able to notice the difference. I
dunno. I'm freaking out, I guess. Going to e-mail him now re the
therapist suggestion. Thanks.

~Lola

IF your friend can not taking steroids, which are not addictive, then he is a
coward and should just kill himself.

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

Hellina Handbasket said:

On Thu, 19 Jan 2006 03:22:14 +0800, spodosaurus

spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com said:

Your friend needs to be under the care of a clinical psychologist who
specialises in treating patients with addiction problems, and probably a
psychiatrist as well (or at least a General Practitioner who is not
averse to communicating with the psychologist and probably writing a
prescription for anti-depressants). Like I described, it sounds like
your friend has bigger issues than long term steroid use, and these can
be dangerous, even deadly, if not treated. He's been self medicating
with drugs, including opiates now if he does not have a serious chronic
pain problem, and trying to 'go it alone' can have very unfortunate
consequences in such cases. He can get better, but there'll likely be
relapses into drug use along the way, and it'll be a (sometimes) long
process where his committment to getting clean will be tested many times
along the way.

Ari

I completely agree with your take on this. He's going to need help
with the changes that will occur in his body when he goes "natural",
and will obviously need psych help to do that-if we can get him to go
to one. He's pretty massive, and always has been. Acadaemia and
lifting have always been his passions, and the things for which he's
received praise, glory and attention. Can I ask, though, if you have
any advice for those of us that will be around as he's going through
this? I mean, do his fiancee and I need to look at this as attending
to a drug addict, as opposed to a bodybuilding addict? I guess I'm
answering my own question as I write, but it's so complicated. Any
ideas for ng's or forums online that can help? I've been to getbig.com
and the like, but it's prety much all about Titus and Ryan in there.
It's different than just watching someone get off booze or other
drugs-the change in his body is going to be distressing for him-even
though the rest of us will barely be able to notice the difference. I
dunno. I'm freaking out, I guess. Going to e-mail him now re the
therapist suggestion. Thanks.

~Lola

IF your friend can not taking steroids, which are not addictive, then he is a
coward and should just kill himself.

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/