Road raging pillocks in Perth

[Theo Bekkers]

PeteSig wrote:
> "PeteSig" wrote:
>> Ahah! Here is the document from some Dutch planners that I was
>> referring to.
>> http://www.cycle-helmets.com/irresistible.pdf
>>
>> Look in particular at the last two pages for a detailed summary of
>> changes made to Dutch society that have boosted cycling.
>
> Oh yeah, Theo, look also at Fig. 12 for the trend in bicycle use
> (annual kms cycled per person) 1950-2005, transposed with the cycle
> fatality rate (cyclist deaths per billion kms) over the same period.
> A nice mirror image, and a huge drop in cycle use from 1950 to 1975.
> The Netherlands of your youth was disappearing until the 70s changes
> came about.

Yes indeed, but it looks like it is coming back.

Theo
Who walked to school in winter in clogs and hand-knitted woolen socks.

 

[Theo Bekkers]

PeteSig wrote:
> "Theo Bekkers" wrote:
>> Terryc wrote:
>
>>> If it is going to be user pays, then lets make sure it really is.
>>
>> The Dutch solution was that cyclists paid for cycling infrastructure.
>
> Between 1924 and 1940!
>
> Today the social and economic policies are somewhat different:
> http://www.cycle-helmets.com/irresistible.pdf
>
> "Automobile speed limitations in cities
> - Traffic callming of residential neighboorhoods limits cars to
> speeds of 30kmh or less
> - 'Home zones' in many neighborhoods give cyclists and pedestrians
> equal rights to road use and limit cars to walking sepeed (about 7
> kmh) - Car-free zones, one-way streets, and artificial dead-ends make
> car travel through the city centre slow and inconvenient
> - Turn restrictions for cars but not for cyclists
> - Almost no limited access to highwyas (motorways) in city centres
> - Strictly enforced speed limits and traffic rules in cities (such as
> police cameras at red (lights?)
> - Frequent random speed limit enforcement checks by the police
> - Advance stop lines and traffic signal prioriyt for cyclists
>
> Taxation of automobile ownership and use
> - High taxes and fees on car purchase, ownership and use
> - Especially high excise and sales tax on petrol
> - High hourly parking rates in city centre, even in medium size cities
> - High fees and strict training requirements for obtaining a driver's
> license (over DM1,500 in Germany)"
>
> But as an ex-Dutch resident surely you're aware of this Theo???

No argument there Peter. I'm mostly in favour of the items above. It was
Terry's "motorists are evil people who deserve to be punished" that I was
having a go at.

Theo

 

[Theo Bekkers]

Resound wrote:
> "Theo Bekkers wrote

>> We're trying to agree on a suitable punishment for cyclists who
>> ignore red light. Not push the red light envelope, like motorists
>> do, but deliberately go through a red light because they think the
>> rules don't apply to them, becuase they're saving the planet or
>> something.

> While I think that cyclists who decide that the shiny red light
> doesn't really apply to them are pillocks, I'd prefer the road user
> who slows, looks and then proceeds through a red light than one who
> relies on a combination of acceleration and prayer.

Oh dearie me. I only use that procedure in the fire truck.

Theo

 

[[email protected]]

On Mar 1, 10:38 am, "Theo Bekkers" <[email protected]> wrote:
We have few adults who cycle on utility bikes wearing
> 'normal' clothing here, where that is the norm in Holland. In 95% of cases
> in Holland, you can't tell by looking at the person next to you at the
> supermarket check-out, if they came by bike. This also allows people to
> marginalise cyclists as being 'different to me' rather than 'same as my
> mum'.
>
> The point that I'm trying to make by being contrary in some of my posts is
> that we need to work to work together to improve facilities for all
> travellers. I truly don't believe that attitudes of
> Motorists need to give up facilities to improve our lot because they're
> killing the planet...
> Rules don't apply to us because we're saving the planet...
> Tax all motorists off the road....
> are going to allow us to go very far.
>
> I think we need to get representation of non-elite cyclists, every-day
> people who want to go down to the shops, without being harrassed by
> motorists and sneered at by the lycra crowd. It is these people that need to
> be catered to. Because they are being ignored by all parties, nothing is
> going to change very quickly.
>
> Cheers and thanks for that article.
>
> Theo

I was in Germany a couple of months ago, and despite being the dead of
winter, there were still plenty of cyclists, all of whom wore ordinary
street clothes on the bicycle. It is not considered an unusual
activity by the majority of people, unlike here. Admittedly, our hot
summers (with consequent sweating) make dedicated bicycle gear more
sensible at this time of year, but many cyclists here tend to regard
themselves as a separate group of people rather than being merely
ordinary people who happen to use bicycles as a mode of transport.

On the topic of obeying road rules, I dutifully came to a stop on my
bike yesterday along Victoria St in Melbourne when a tram came to a
stop to disgorge and engorge a load of passengers. Another cyclist
behind me shot past the stationery tram, weaving his way between the
passengers, and then proceeded to go straight through a red light a
bit further on. Unfortunately, this sort of behaviour gives us all a
bad name (which is ridiculous - as a few bad apples among motorists
does not and should not damn all motorists.

 

[Zebee Johnstone]

In aus.bicycle on Thu, 6 Mar 2008 01:32:17 -0800 (PST)
[email protected] <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> On the topic of obeying road rules, I dutifully came to a stop on my
> bike yesterday along Victoria St in Melbourne when a tram came to a
> stop to disgorge and engorge a load of passengers. Another cyclist
> behind me shot past the stationery tram, weaving his way between the
> passengers, and then proceeded to go straight through a red light a
> bit further on. Unfortunately, this sort of behaviour gives us all a
> bad name (which is ridiculous - as a few bad apples among motorists
> does not and should not damn all motorists.

how many noticed him and how many noticed you?

I often wonder that when someone on a motorcycle splits up to the
front when I'm sitting there not doing it, or cuts up traffic and I
don't.

Or when I'm on the bent and I don't run the red, or don't nick up the
footpath.

Alas I suspect few do, because not moving doesn't attract the
attention the way moving does.

Zebee

 

[TimC]

On 2008-03-06, Zebee Johnstone (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
> In aus.bicycle on Thu, 6 Mar 2008 01:32:17 -0800 (PST)
> [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> On the topic of obeying road rules, I dutifully came to a stop on my
>> bike yesterday along Victoria St in Melbourne when a tram came to a
>> stop to disgorge and engorge a load of passengers. Another cyclist
>> behind me shot past the stationery tram, weaving his way between the
>> passengers, and then proceeded to go straight through a red light a
>> bit further on. Unfortunately, this sort of behaviour gives us all a
>> bad name (which is ridiculous - as a few bad apples among motorists
>> does not and should not damn all motorists.
>
> how many noticed him and how many noticed you?
>
> I often wonder that when someone on a motorcycle splits up to the
> front when I'm sitting there not doing it, or cuts up traffic and I
> don't.

Then they don't notice you because you're stealth. Remember the
motorist that abused Euan because some random third party ran the
lights and Euan didn't?

--
TimC
'Vegetarian' -- it's an old Indian word meaning 'lousy hunter'. -- Red Green
'tofu' -- Old Eskimo word. Means "whale snot". -- GB in ASR