Road or Sidewalk?

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available? I prefer riding on the road, and
the sidewalks, while not crammed with pedestrians, are never
free of them either. What are ya'lls thoughts? TIA!

Ken [/B][/QUOTE]

As cyclists we have every right to the road that motorized vehicles do. Unfortunately, we sometimes have run ins with the occasional ignorant driver that disregards this fact. Most sidewalks are actually dangerous to us as cyclists. When a sidewalk crosses driveways and side roads, for example, there is a far greater chance of the cyclist not being seen by motorists. There are instances such as crossing bridges and along some narrow highways that the sidewalk may be safer (and may be mandated by law). In these instances, especially when intersected by side roads it is safer to walk your bike than ride it on the sidewalk. There are also cities, towns, and states that strictly prohibit bicyclists from sidewalks (often a fineable offense). So, in my humble opinion... stay on the road whenever possible.
www.capecodcyclist.8k.com

K-Man said:

I had my first encounter with a jerk with an automobile
the other day. I was riding on the main 4-lane road going
through town, as far to the right as I could without going
into the gutter, when from behind me I hear the
belligerent shout of "Get off the road!" I look back to
see a college punk in a black SUV. The traffic was light,
and he had plenty of room to pass me. I just ignored him
and biked on.

But the incident brought to mind a question. I'm a fairly
new cyclist, having gotten my bike for Christmas last
year. I've learned all the rules of riding on the road and
sharing the road with cars, and I follow those rules
religiously. I've never had a problem with a motorist
until the above mentioned incident. I see lot of cyclists
riding on that same road, and I also see a lot of cyclists
riding on the sidewalks paralleling that road.

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available? I prefer riding on the road, and
the sidewalks, while not crammed with pedestrians, are
never free of them either. What are ya'lls thoughts? TIA!

My thought? Don't let one idiot influence your
safety/enjoyment of riding. (Don't cower over by the gutter,
either; you're entitiled to the right-side portion of the
lane, and sometimes the whole damned thing.)

A bicycle is a vehicle that belongs on the road (or a
trail), NOT the sidewalk.

Bill "cautious yet assertive" S.

"K-Man" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I had my first encounter with a jerk with an automobile
the other day. I was riding on the main 4-lane road going
through town,

I'll let others deal with the 'should I take the sidewalk?'
part as I'm sure many are eager to.

My 2 cents worth regarding the 'as far to the right as I
could without going into the gutter' part: It may seem counter-
intuitive, and most jurisdictions laws are worded in the
manner of: 'cyclists should stay as far to the right as is
_practical_ or _reasonable_' or some other qualifying words
BUT: sometimes that merely encourages auto-addicts to crowd
you off the road. Some motorcyclist acquaintances of mine
claim similar experiences especially wrt to cars passing
them without moving fully into the other lane. They say
eventually they get crowded right off the roadway.
Consequently they ride near to the centre line to force
autos to fully take the other lane to pass.

As cyclist you should consider whether the conditions merit
'taking the lane' for your own safety - Both to be more
visible, and less likely to be crowded off.

As I said; my 2 Canuckian cents worth.

--
Ricky: 'What's an aptitude test?' Lahey: 'A suitability
test, Ricky' Ricky: 'I'll wear a suit if I have to'

In article <[email hidden]>,
k- [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

I had my first encounter with a jerk with an automobile
the other day. I was riding on the main 4-lane road going
through town, as far to the right as I could without going
into the gutter, when from behind me I hear the
belligerent shout of "Get off the road!" I look back to
see a college punk in a black SUV. The traffic was light,
and he had plenty of room to pass me. I just ignored him
and biked on.

But the incident brought to mind a question. I'm a fairly
new cyclist, having gotten my bike for Christmas last
year. I've learned all the rules of riding on the road and
sharing the road with cars, and I follow those rules
religiously. I've never had a problem with a motorist
until the above mentioned incident. I see lot of cyclists
riding on that same road, and I also see a lot of cyclists
riding on the sidewalks paralleling that road.

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available? I prefer riding on the road, and
the sidewalks, while not crammed with pedestrians, are
never free of them either. What are ya'lls thoughts? TIA!

Pedestrians are generally much less predictable than drivers
and their vehicles, so from the way you describe it, you
will probably be safer on the road. Also, drivers don't
expect fast-moving vehicles on the sidewalk when they are
coming out of side streets and driveways, and will likely
pull out in front of you. Now if there were no shoulder and
bumper-to-bumper traffic in both lanes so that you don't
have any room to ride, it might be a different matter, but
bikes usually are safer on the road than on the sidewalk.

You really have to use your judgement for any given
situation.

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts in
the newsgroups if possible).

K-Man said:

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available? I prefer riding on the road, and
the sidewalks, while not crammed with pedestrians, are
never free of them either. What are ya'lls thoughts? TIA!

Ken

Here are a few links, and I'm sure others will post much
better ones. Educate yourself as to your rights and
responsibilities. Don't let one misinformed kid stop you
from using the roads.

kenkifer.comindex.htmOpen ↗

sfbike.orgMotorists STR.pdfOpen ↗

California laws regarding bicycles and roadways- most states
should have similar laws, but check...

leginfo.ca.govcgiOpen ↗
bin/displaycode?section=veh&group=21001-
22000&file=21200-21212

loki said:

Some motorcyclist acquaintances of mine claim similar
experiences especially wrt to cars passing them without
moving fully into the other lane. They say eventually they
get crowded right off the roadway. Consequently they ride
near to the centre line to force autos to fully take the
other lane to pass.

The motorcyclist way of treating the lane as being three--
the middle being "verboten" because of the oil drippage--
works great around here in Nashville, where folks often
refuse to acknowledge a bike as a vehicle
[vs. a toy] I occupy the right side of the lane in the city
here and have have much better interaction with traffic
because of it. I also make sure to smile at folks and
wink at the cute ladies... Sometimes I'll ride far far
right when I know somebody really has to pass and the
going's tight, but for the most part "occupying" the
lane when I'm going withing 5-10mph of traffic calms
people that feel this burning desire to pass otherwise--
even if it's not going to really be in anybody's best
interest--since they simply can't.

The classic "pass" around here is the guy that MUST get past
you because you are a cyclist (!), then slows down and cuts
you off making a right turn. [slaps forehead and says
duh...] I get a couple of these per day even with my
"assertive" style.

Oh well.

😄

K-Man said:

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available? I prefer riding on the road, and
the sidewalks, while not crammed with pedestrians, are
never free of them either. What are ya'lls thoughts?

Sidewalk riding is a no-no in virtually all situations.
Here's John Forester's ("Effective Cycling" author's)
recommendations:

kba.tripod.comecbasic.htmOpen ↗

--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA bike.terrymorse.combike.terrymorse.comOpen ↗

maxo said:

Oh, and I hate to mention this, but over 25% of cyclists
around here do it (!) so, make sure you're riding on the
correct side of the road--with traffic. ;D

Happy travels!

Ya know, I intend to follow all the rules and regs and be a
responsible rider, but mebbe b/c I'm new to road riding - I
find myself violating the rules fairly frequently, all the
while going 'wtf are you doing!'.

I think it's a fear factor thing.

We have a couple scary intersections with like five lanes
leading into it, all going different directions. I try to
wait for the light, but worry about having to de-toeclip,
and stuff, so I end up seeing a 'prime time' opening and
jetting through it.

I hope it's a passing thing. Gotta practice that track
standing more...

Maybe it's the slight anoxia - leading to questionable
judgement.

Am I the only one who does this, almost involuntarily - spur
of the moment? Yikes!

-B

K-Man said:

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available? I prefer riding on the road, and
the sidewalks, while not crammed with pedestrians, are
never free of them either. What are ya'lls thoughts? TIA!

Read:

bikexprt.comindex.htmOpen ↗

Matt O.

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

loki said:

Some motorcyclist acquaintances of mine claim similar
experiences especially wrt to cars passing them
without moving fully into the other lane. They say
eventually they get crowded right off the roadway.
Consequently they ride near to the centre line to
force autos to fully

take

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the other lane to pass.

The motorcyclist way of treating the lane as being three--
the middle being "verboten" because of the oil drippage--
works great around here in Nashville, where folks often
refuse to acknowledge a bike as a vehicle
[vs. a toy] I occupy the right side of the lane in the
city here and have have much better interaction with
traffic because of it.

In the discussion with the motorcyclists the circumstance
was highway driving. I'm not sure they felt the same way
about city driving.

--
Fiona: 'What kind of knight are you?!?!' Shrek: 'One
of a kind.'

In article <[email hidden]>,

K-Man said:

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available?

Side walks and separated paths are much more dangerous than
riding on the road. While cars crossing them usually look
for traffic on the road, they're often completely oblivious
to whatever isn't on the main road.

--
<a href="poohsticks.orgdrewOpen ↗">Home Page</a

"loki" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

loki said:

Some motorcyclist acquaintances of mine claim similar
experiences especially wrt to cars passing them without
moving fully into the other lane. They say eventually
they get crowded right off the roadway. Consequently
they ride near to the centre line to force autos to
fully take the other lane to pass.

The motorcyclist way of treating the lane as being three--
the middle being "verboten" because of the oil drippage--
works great around here in Nashville, where folks
often refuse to acknowledge a bike as a vehicle [vs. a
toy] I occupy the right side of the lane in the city
here and have have much better interaction with
traffic because of it.

In the discussion with the motorcyclists the circumstance
was highway driving. I'm not sure they felt the same way
about city driving.

Regardless, motorcyclists should be riding in the driver's
wheeltrack, which in the US is the left side of the lane,
because that's the most visible position to the driver in
front's rear-view mirror and wing mirror. The centre of
the lane is safe enough on the highway, it's at
intersections you get the big oil buildups in the centre
of the lane. The gutterside of the lane is a no-no
whichever way you look at it, it collects all the [censored] and
is the least visible position.

--

A: Top-posters.
B: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available?

it's generally illegal for cyclists to ride on the sidewalk,
although there are usually exceptions for children.

--
mac the naïf

K-Man said:

I had my first encounter with a jerk with an automobile
the other day. I was riding on the main 4-lane road going
through town, as far to the right as I could without going
into the gutter, when from behind me I hear the
belligerent shout of "Get off the road!" I look back to
see a college punk in a black SUV. The traffic was light,
and he had plenty of room to pass me. I just ignored him
and biked on.

Good move. I sometimes add a slow shake of my head, as in
"What a dolt."

Quoted message said:

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available?

Absolutely not. First, you've got a legal right to the road.
Second, in many places (perhaps most?) cycling on the
sidewalk is illegal. Third, in almost every case, cycling on
the sidewalk is more dangerous.

Regarding the last bit, there have been several studies of
bike crashes on different "riding facilities." AFAIK, every
such study has found sidewalks to be significantly more
dangerous than roads. I can dig up citations, if you like,
but IIRC the numbers run from approximately 2.5 times as
dangerous, to about a dozen times as dangerous.

And, as others have mentioned, you're not required to ride
at the edge of the gutter. It's good to be courteous, but
it's often safer to be further left.

The incident with the SUV guy is negligible. Don't let him
rattle you.

--
--------------------+ Frank Krygowski [To reply, remove
rodent and vegetable dot com, replace with cc.ysu dot edu]

Badger_South said:

Ya know, I intend to follow all the rules and regs and be
a responsible rider, but mebbe b/c I'm new to road riding
- I find myself violating the rules fairly frequently, all
the while going 'wtf are you doing!'.

I think it's a fear factor thing.

We have a couple scary intersections with like five lanes
leading into it, all going different directions. I try to
wait for the light, but worry about having to de-toeclip,
and stuff, so I end up seeing a 'prime time' opening and
jetting through it.

I hope it's a passing thing. Gotta practice that track
standing more...

Maybe it's the slight anoxia - leading to questionable
judgement.

Am I the only one who does this, almost involuntarily -
spur of the moment? Yikes!

Well, you're probably not the only one. After all, we've all
seen people riding at night, without lights, facing traffic,
with a passenger on the handlebars, carrying a grocery bag
in one arm...

OTOH, I certainly don't do what you describe. I don't think
it's smart, for several reasons.

You can practice the track stand if you want, but it sounds
like you're better off practicing getting into and out of
toe clips. And BTW, an intersection with five entering lanes
shouldn't be scary at all. Just merge into the rightmost
lane that goes where you're going.

IIRC, roughly half of serious bike accidents are the fault
of the cyclist, usually violating a very clear law. My bet
is that every one of those cyclists thought, ahead of time,
that he was smart - or smart enough - to do things his
illegal way.

The traffic laws work remarkably well. I'd advise
obeying them.

--
--------------------+ Frank Krygowski [To reply, remove
rodent and vegetable dot com, replace with cc.ysu dot edu]

Frank Krygowski said:

Badger_South said:

Ya know, I intend to follow all the rules and regs and be
a responsible rider, but mebbe b/c I'm new to road riding
- I find myself violating the rules fairly frequently,
all the while going 'wtf are you doing!'.

I think it's a fear factor thing.

We have a couple scary intersections with like five lanes
leading into it, all going different directions. I try to
wait for the light, but worry about having to de-toeclip,
and stuff, so I end up seeing a 'prime time' opening and
jetting through it.

I hope it's a passing thing. Gotta practice that track
standing more...

Maybe it's the slight anoxia - leading to questionable
judgement.

Am I the only one who does this, almost involuntarily -
spur of the moment? Yikes!

Well, you're probably not the only one. After all, we've
all seen people riding at night, without lights, facing
traffic, with a passenger on the handlebars, carrying a
grocery bag in one arm...

Those are intentional and careless acts. What I'm
describing are unplanned things that don't go the way one
initially intends.

Quoted message said:

OTOH, I certainly don't do what you describe. I don't think
it's smart, for several reasons.

No argue there.

Quoted message said:

You can practice the track stand if you want, but it sounds
like you're better off practicing getting into and out of
toe clips. And BTW, an intersection with five entering
lanes shouldn't be scary at all. Just merge into the
rightmost lane that goes where you're going.

IIRC, roughly half of serious bike accidents are the fault
of the cyclist, usually violating a very clear law. My bet
is that every one of those cyclists thought, ahead of time,
that he was smart - or smart enough - to do things his
illegal way.

The traffic laws work remarkably well. I'd advise
obeying them.

I'm trying, believe me. It's just that sometimes, being a
noob at street riding, it can be a little overwhelming.

Trouble with getting in and out of clips is that I keep
looking down and lose my bearing and swerve a bit.

I'm workin' on it.

-B

Alex Colvin said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My question is, should I be riding on the road when
sidewalks are available?

it's generally illegal for cyclists to ride on the
sidewalk, although there are usually exceptions for
children.

sadly that's not true (in the USA). it is generally legal to
ride on the sidewalk except in business areas.
--
david reuteler [email hidden]

It depends.

First of all, the idiot in the SUV notwithstanding, cyclists
have the same right to roads, streets and highways (with the
exception of most interstate highways) that motorized
vehicles have.

In some areas it is legal to ride bikes on sidewalks. In
many communities it is not.

Although riding on sidewalks is legal where I live, I
generally think it is safer to ride on the street. There are
a couple of instances -- a very congested 4-lane
thoroughfare for example -- where find it safer to ride on a
virtually deserted sidewalks. If ride on sidewalks though,
be sure to ride with the normal flow of traffic, because
motorists pulling onto streets typically only look left for
oncoming traffic -- not right for oncoming bikes on
sidewalks.

"K-Man" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I had my first encounter with a jerk with an automobile
the other day.

Get ready for more. But to answer your question, you belong
on the road. It's illegal in many places to ride on the
sidewalk. Just get the license number of the next SOB who
harrasses you, and keep an eye out for his car. A little
judicious soaping of his windshield will make you feel
better. :-)