Recumbent = Clipless??

When I rode a bent for about 4 months I rode a Bacchetta Corsa. I live
in a hilly geography and starting the sucker from a dead stop on any
hill was an adventure. My first priority was to find a set of pedals
that was easy to get into no matter what was going on in my head or
with the terrain. The advice was to go for two sided something or
others with a lot of float. I went for Bebops in stainless steel and
they worked remarkably well. Those cleats could find those pedals no
matter what I looked like flailing to find those pedals. Alas, in the
end, having my feet in front of my face all the time was not the
posture for me, but the pedals were da bomb. Another day there will be
a less radical bent in my life I am certain of that.

"Peter Cole" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Your experience isn't typical for rider with more developed leg muscles.
When you "pull up" you're using the leg "flexors" which are much weaker
than leg "extensors". When your extensors get strong enough, they'll use
all of your cardio-vascular capacity by themselves, so there isn't any
gain by adding the flexors, except for short (anaerobic) efforts.

You've seen my legs, then?

And when my extensors use all of my cardiovascular capacity, will I black
out from lack of cardiovascular capacity to my brain?

Cheers, in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way, helen s

Peter Cole said:

all of your cardio-vascular capacity by themselves, so there isn't any
gain by adding the flexors, except for short (anaerobic) efforts.

Or "small hills", as we call them here... ;-)

For "large hills" being clipped in makes it easier to spin up, which is
a much better way on a 'bent, so you're still winning.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

wafflycat said:

"Peter Cole" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Your experience isn't typical for rider with more developed leg
muscles. When you "pull up" you're using the leg "flexors" which are
much weaker than leg "extensors". When your extensors get strong
enough, they'll use all of your cardio-vascular capacity by
themselves, so there isn't any gain by adding the flexors, except for
short (anaerobic) efforts.

You've seen my legs, then?

And when my extensors use all of my cardiovascular capacity, will I
black out from lack of cardiovascular capacity to my brain?

Cheers, in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way, helen s

I think it's pretty uncommon to black out from anaerobic exertion
(likely severe evolutionary penalty to passing out when running from the
saber tooth). I can push myself into some symptoms of low brain oxygen
such as tunnel and monochromatic vision (on rare heroic occasions, but
also sometimes when just rising from the sofa). When I'm doing a long
sustained effort that I want to be right at my aerobic maximum, I can
judge it accurately by the slight numbness I get in my upper lip,
another symptom I think of blood being diverted from my face.

If you get better *sustained* performance when recruiting extra leg
muscles, then you have either girly legs or a lion's heart -- I couldn't
guess with certainty, but I am certain that your legs aren't taxing your
C-V system as much as mine are.

Peter Clinch said:

Peter Cole said:

all of your cardio-vascular capacity by themselves, so there isn't any
gain by adding the flexors, except for short (anaerobic) efforts.

Or "small hills", as we call them here... ;-)

For "large hills" being clipped in makes it easier to spin up, which is
a much better way on a 'bent, so you're still winning.

I agree that it's easier to pedal at high cadence with feet attached to
the pedals. It's probably more efficient, too.

eflayer2 said:

When I rode a bent for about 4 months I rode a Bacchetta Corsa. I live
in a hilly geography and starting the sucker from a dead stop on any
hill was an adventure. My first priority was to find a set of pedals
that was easy to get into no matter what was going on in my head or
with the terrain. The advice was to go for two sided something or
others with a lot of float. I went for Bebops in stainless steel and
they worked remarkably well. Those cleats could find those pedals no
matter what I looked like flailing to find those pedals. Alas, in the
end, having my feet in front of my face all the time was not the
posture for me, but the pedals were da bomb. Another day there will be
a less radical bent in my life I am certain of that.

Curious...whatsamatta with the Corsa, exactly? Like, are you really
tall or overweight or something?

Michael Press said:

I

First let us make clear what we are talking about. Are you
asking why many riders prefer using clip-less pedals? Or
are you asking why you might consider using clip-less
pedals? Since you have not used them, and are disinclined
to try them, and since you choose a derisive tone to ask;
I think you are attempting to initiate a heated discussion
where there is no controversy. This matter has been
discussed at length in r.b.t. as you could discover for
yourself. You might remove r.b.t from the Newsgroups:
header.

--
Michael Press

In some 25 posts to this thread, yours is the only one where things
approach "heated." Since I have no luck with search engines -- and
current information is better than anything possibly dated in any case
-- I suggest you exercise extreme discretion in reading usenet.

1. feet in the air
2. starting on inclines
3. transporting
4. climbing in general
5. never got comfortable descending fast on twisty roads
6. shifting a triple while ascending

Other than that is was perfect.

Peter Cole said:

I think it's pretty uncommon to black out from anaerobic exertion
(likely severe evolutionary penalty to passing out when running from the
saber tooth). I can push myself into some symptoms of low brain oxygen
such as tunnel and monochromatic vision (on rare heroic occasions, but
also sometimes when just rising from the sofa). When I'm doing a long
sustained effort that I want to be right at my aerobic maximum, I can
judge it accurately by the slight numbness I get in my upper lip,
another symptom I think of blood being diverted from my face.

<SNIP>

I was always a crazy kid...when gramps told me not to cut myself, I did
it just to see what would happen...ditto with matches, bug spray (!!!),
and holding one's breath...I held it and the next thing I knew I woke
up on the floor....

Interestingly enough, I've never blacked out from anything without
meaning to be...as Army Infantry likes to say, "at first you'll think
you're going to die, then you'll wish you *could* die, then you'll know
you can NEVER die."

Peter Cole said:

wafflycat wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You've seen my legs, then?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Cheers, in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way, helen s

Quoted message said:

... you have either girly legs or a lion's heart...

I'd guess someone with a name like "helen s" will have girly legs.

:^)

--
Dave
dvt at psu dot edu

dvt said:

Peter Cole said:

wafflycat wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You've seen my legs, then?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Cheers, in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way, helen s

Quoted message said:

... you have either girly legs or a lion's heart...

I'd guess someone with a name like "helen s" will have girly legs.

:^)

I figured she wouldn't mind being called that...

eflayer2 said:

1. feet in the air
2. starting on inclines
3. transporting
4. climbing in general
5. never got comfortable descending fast on twisty roads
6. shifting a triple while ascending

Other than that is was perfect.

In regards to number 2, I think SWB bents in general are harder to start
when you are ascending. Between my Django, Sun EZ-1, and an upright,
the Django is definitely harder for me to start than the other two
bikes when going uphill. Once under way, I find the Django climbs as
well as the other two bikes.

---
John Knez

On 21 Feb 2006 01:18:01 -0800, "NYC XYZ" <[email hidden]>
wrote:

<snip>

Quoted message said:

So...are my knees gonna get messed up or something if I don't use
clipless pedals? Just what are they, um, good for? Is this the
equivalent of wearing spandex -- no big deal -- or more like the
difference between a 'bent and an upwrong -- like night and day??

I ride a Tour Easy, a fairly upright LWB recumbent. It came with
platform pedals and toe clips. After riding the stock pedals for a
couple of years I went with clipless for a while, and really did like
it at first. After three months or so it seemed that my knees were
about to start complaining from the lack of lateral motion. My size
14's dont fit far enough into most toe clip cages, so I decided to try
a pair of Power Grips.

http://www.powergrips.com/

My knees and I are liking them just fine.

On a more laid back recumbent, and maybe especially on some of the
really low models having your feet actually locked to the pedal might
save you from some very painful leg suck incidents.

Indiana Mike

John Knez said:

eflayer2 said:

1. feet in the air
2. starting on inclines
3. transporting
4. climbing in general
5. never got comfortable descending fast on twisty roads
6. shifting a triple while ascending

Other than that is was perfect.

In regards to number 2, I think SWB bents in general are harder to start
when you are ascending. Between my Django, Sun EZ-1, and an upright,
the Django is definitely harder for me to start than the other two
bikes when going uphill. Once under way, I find the Django climbs as
well as the other two bikes.

I find starting out on a recumbent easier than an upright, since the
only actions one has to take on a recumbent are steering and bringing
the "down" foot up to the pedals (and even the latter is not necessary
on some lowracers where the rider can use a hand on the ground
instead). On an upright, one has to steer to balance, bring the bicycle
from a leaning position to vertical, move a foot from the ground to a
pedal, and move one's body backwards all at the same time, so it is
four (4) actions instead of two (2) actions. I believe that this is
part of the reason casual and inexperienced riders like the
crank-forward (semi-recumbent/semi-upright) bicycles, since they allow
the rider to put both feet on the ground with the bicycle upright and
the rider seated on the saddle.

--
Tom Sherman

Peter Clinch said:

... prefer platforms on the Brompton folder I use as an urban
hack bike because it means I don't have to put on special shoes to use
the bike...

I prefer Power Grips for this type of use, since one can still benefit
from the foot retention while wearing regular shoes.

--
Tom Sherman