Record Hubs

David N. Makinson said:

Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record hubs?

It makes adjustment a bit easier, and provides a convenient place to
hang the lucky rabbit's foot. And Shimano doesn't do it.
--
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David N. Makinson said:

Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record

hubs?

I've heard it's a spring, designed to pinch the non-QR end of the
skewer tighter and thus prevent it from spinning randomly when the QR
is not in tension (ie, off the bike.) For racing bikes without 'lawyer
lips', this allows the skewers of spare wheels to be adjusted in
advance, saving time and reducing risk when a wheel is swapped.

But the rabbit's foot hanger theory is good, too.

Brian Huntley said:

David N. Makinson said:

Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record

hubs?

I've heard it's a spring, designed to pinch the non-QR end of the
skewer tighter and thus prevent it from spinning randomly when the QR
is not in tension (ie, off the bike.)

What? Uh, no. It's just there to give you something to grab onto to turn
the nut if you want to.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | "What am I on? I'm on my bike, six hours a day, busting my ass.
_`\(,_ | What are you on?" --Lance Armstrong
(_)/ (_) |

"David L. Johnson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Brian Huntley said:

David N. Makinson said:

Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record

hubs?

I've heard it's a spring, designed to pinch the non-QR end of the
skewer tighter and thus prevent it from spinning randomly when the QR
is not in tension (ie, off the bike.)

What? Uh, no. It's just there to give you something to grab onto to turn
the nut if you want to.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | "What am I on? I'm on my bike, six hours a day, busting my ass.
_`\(,_ | What are you on?" --Lance Armstrong
(_)/ (_) |

There are two shapes of nuts on the early hubs one is simlply a cone and the
other is a cone with a bubble on the end . Does any one know which hubs and
the campy time scale for each one ?

PK

09 Apr 2005 20:20:13 -0400 'David N. Makinson said:

Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record hubs?

While it serves nicely as a handle, it is also a spring which presses
2 brass inserts against the threads of the QR spindle, hence a locking
mechanism so that the QR doesn't unscrew and fall apart, or just lose
adjustment, when wheels are being transported loose.

Most other manufacturers use a plastic insert making it a kind of
NyLock nut.

Campy was doing this decades before Shimano made their first QR of any
kind.

-
-----------------------------------------------
Jim Adney [email hidden]
Madison, WI 53711 USA
-----------------------------------------------

PK said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

David N. Makinson wrote:

>Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record

hubs?

There are two shapes of nuts on the early hubs one is simlply a cone and the
other is a cone with a bubble on the end . Does any one know which hubs and
the campy time scale for each one ?

Both of these are Nuovo Record (or maybe just "Record," can't remember
if the hubs ever went Nuovo).

The pointy ended QR ends came first; the rounded ends around 1977 due to
CPSC rules.

The US Consumer Products Safety Commission (CPSC) put a bunch of
requirements on the construction of bicycles sold in the US (which they
regarded as toys) around 1977; manufacturers, afraid of being shut out
of a lucrative market, played along. One of the requirements was about
pointy bits. ISTR the pointiness standard required something like parts
not being able to protrude into a small cylinder of a certain size.

Immediate consequences - the QR nuts got rounded, and front derailleur
tabs got flared; secondary consequence - Record crank arms changed to
fit the new, fatter front derailleur between the rings and crank arm.

Many of us took all this as heresy at the time, but perhaps the X-Mart
bikes got safer as a result.

Mark "historical bike trivia" Janeba

"Mark Janeba" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

PK said:

Quoted message said:

>David N. Makinson wrote:
>
>>Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record
>
>hubs?

There are two shapes of nuts on the early hubs one is simlply a cone and
the other is a cone with a bubble on the end . Does any one know which
hubs and the campy time scale for each one ?

Both of these are Nuovo Record (or maybe just "Record," can't remember if
the hubs ever went Nuovo).

The pointy ended QR ends came first; the rounded ends around 1977 due to
CPSC rules.

The US Consumer Products Safety Commission (CPSC) put a bunch of
requirements on the construction of bicycles sold in the US (which they
regarded as toys) around 1977; manufacturers, afraid of being shut out of
a lucrative market, played along. One of the requirements was about
pointy bits. ISTR the pointiness standard required something like parts
not being able to protrude into a small cylinder of a certain size.

Immediate consequences - the QR nuts got rounded, and front derailleur
tabs got flared; secondary consequence - Record crank arms changed to fit
the new, fatter front derailleur between the rings and crank arm.

Many of us took all this as heresy at the time, but perhaps the X-Mart
bikes got safer as a result.

Mark "historical bike trivia" Janeba

Thanks Mark

What about straight to curved levers, did the change to rounded nuts and
curved lever happen at the same time?
i.e. should rounded nuts and curved levers go together?

PK

PK said:

"Mark Janeba" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

PK said:

>>David N. Makinson wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record
>>
>>hubs?

There are two shapes of nuts on the early hubs one is simlply a cone and
the other is a cone with a bubble on the end . Does any one know which
hubs and the campy time scale for each one ?

Both of these are Nuovo Record (or maybe just "Record," can't remember if
the hubs ever went Nuovo).

The pointy ended QR ends came first; the rounded ends around 1977 due to
CPSC rules.

The US Consumer Products Safety Commission (CPSC) put a bunch of
requirements on the construction of bicycles sold in the US (which they
regarded as toys) around 1977; manufacturers, afraid of being shut out of
a lucrative market, played along. One of the requirements was about
pointy bits. ISTR the pointiness standard required something like parts
not being able to protrude into a small cylinder of a certain size.

Immediate consequences - the QR nuts got rounded, and front derailleur
tabs got flared; secondary consequence - Record crank arms changed to fit
the new, fatter front derailleur between the rings and crank arm.

Many of us took all this as heresy at the time, but perhaps the X-Mart
bikes got safer as a result.

Mark "historical bike trivia" Janeba

Thanks Mark

What about straight to curved levers, did the change to rounded nuts and
curved lever happen at the same time?
i.e. should rounded nuts and curved levers go together?

Oops, yes, I forgot to add that. Exactly so, curved levers with rounded
nuts, straight levers with conical QR nuts.

One of the CPSC mandates, IIRC, was to write "closed" and "open" on QR
levers - I believe the curved Campy (Nuovo?) Record QR levers all have
this "feature".

Mark Janeba

David L. Johnson said:

Brian Huntley said:

David N. Makinson said:

Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record

hubs?

I've heard it's a spring, designed to pinch the non-QR end of the
skewer tighter and thus prevent it from spinning randomly when the QR
is not in tension (ie, off the bike.)

What? Uh, no. It's just there to give you something to grab onto to turn
the nut if you want to.

I stand corrected. After a second guy had this comment about them being
used as a sort of thread-grabber, I took a look at one. Sure enough, the
little loop presses against two brass inserts in the nut, which form part
of the threads. The brass inserts actually move.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored
_`\(,_ | by little statesmen and philosophers and divines." --Ralph Waldo
(_)/ (_) | Emerson

David L. Johnson said:

I stand corrected. After a second guy had this comment about them

being

Quoted message said:

used as a sort of thread-grabber, I took a look at one. Sure enough,

the

Quoted message said:

little loop presses against two brass inserts in the nut, which form

part

Quoted message said:

of the threads. The brass inserts actually move.

Thanks for completing my description - I was fuzzy and didn't mention
the brass bits.

I still like the 'rabbits foot' idea, though. But for my old Bianchi
Vitoria, a keychain-sized rubber tree toad, celeste with blue spots,
would be better.

10 Apr 2005 00:22:56 -0400 'David L. Johnson said:

What? Uh, no. It's just there to give you something to grab onto to turn
the nut if you want to.

I recommend that you take one apart someday and see for yourself.

It really is a locking mechanism which happens to be a lot more
elaborate than most.

-
-----------------------------------------------
Jim Adney [email hidden]
Madison, WI 53711 USA
-----------------------------------------------

David N. Makinson said:

Why does Campy put the wire loops on the quick-release nuts of Record hubs?

This is a campagnolo trademark invention. originally, bicycles had
wing nuts instead of QR levers/nuts. Wing nuts were kinda scary as
they could stab you in a fall.

The campy loops are "virtual wing nuts" that can be folded down and
out of the way. it was probably patented originally in the 1950's
when the hubs first came out, and probably expired sometime in the mid
1960's.

The hubs from the 1970's just have the loops which are clamp-fit into
slots in the side of the nuts. There are no brash bushing inside to
somehow clamp the axle. imho that idea sounds like a needless patent,
just to keep others from copying every aspect of the campagnolo record
hub design. i cannot see a benefit verses putting a nyloc lining into
the QR nuts. i guess campy does nuisance patents, too.

- Don Gillies
San Diego, CA

"Donald Gillies" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
..

Quoted message said:

The hubs from the 1970's just have the loops which are clamp-fit into
slots in the side of the nuts. There are no brash bushing inside to
somehow clamp the axle. imho that idea sounds like a needless patent,
just to keep others from copying every aspect of the campagnolo record
hub design. i cannot see a benefit verses putting a nyloc lining into
the QR nuts. i guess campy does nuisance patents, too.

You're wrong.

The spring-and-brass insert method used by Campagnolo is superior.

Nyloc, or Simmonds nuts, have a reduced locking capability with every use.
As the lawyers in the US of A have made the rest of the world use their
silly "slow-release" fork ends, this means that most people should buy new
nuts every <some number smaller than 5> times they remove their front wheel;
otherwise the lawyers will force them (and the R.O.W.) to do so, by
requiring such nuts to self-destruct when used more than <some number
smaller than 5> times.

Think of the profits...

On 10 Apr 2005 23:37:21 -0700, [email hidden] (Donald

Gillies) said:

The hubs from the 1970's just have the loops which are clamp-fit into
slots in the side of the nuts. There are no brash bushing inside to
somehow clamp the axle.

Dear Don,

A female in-law who lives in Italy assures me that no matter
how often you ask an Italian to take his brash hand off your
knee, he'll somehow clamp your axle.

Carl Fogel

That's funny!!!

Luigi

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 10 Apr 2005 23:37:21 -0700, [email hidden] (Donald

Gillies) said:

The hubs from the 1970's just have the loops which are clamp-fit into
slots in the side of the nuts. There are no brash bushing inside to
somehow clamp the axle.

Dear Don,

A female in-law who lives in Italy assures me that no matter
how often you ask an Italian to take his brash hand off your
knee, he'll somehow clamp your axle.

Carl Fogel