Real Bread

Fudge said:

Thank you all for the advise. The best advise is to go to a heath food
store and buy some organic wheat and give it a try. Then I will know if the
effort involved in growing the grains will be worth it. I agree, a well made
loaf of bread is a thing of beauty. A little story follows.

Phew. I was afraid for a second that you were going to suggest buy bread from a
health food store. Been there, done that, and it was awful :-)

Quoted message said:

In medieval Europe, if you were rich, you lived in a nice home, had a
lawn and ate white bread because the costlier white flour was a status
symbol. If you were poor, you had no lawn as crops grew around your
residence, your domestic animals lived downstairs and you ate black bread
from the wheat that grew around your house. Today, everybody eats white
bread but we all know bread made with whole grains is much better for us.

Everyone eats white bread? I buy the occasional loaf of fresh Italian or a
baguette, but 90% of the bread I eat is whole wheat or rye, and I don't think I
am the exception. I suppose that I fit into the category of eating white bread,
even as a minority. Maybe things are changing. I recall earlier years where
there were shelves and shelves of white bread in grocery stores and a choice of
60% or 100% whole wheat. Lately I have noticed that white bread does not
predominate the way it used to, and that a larger share of the breads are whole
wheat and grain breads. However, it's possible that the turnover of white bread
is higher.

Quoted message said:

F.J.
"sf" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Fudge said:

The white emulsified vitamin enriched Kleenex available at the local

supermarket is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

not for this boy. [censored]!!!!

This invites a real debate: Do we eat Kleenex, [censored] or something
else?

Margaret Suran wrote on 08 Jun 2005 in rec.food.cooking

Quoted message said:

Are Rye grains difficult to find? I don't want any, I just want
to know.

No. They're in the flour aisle like all the rest. A particular brand
might be tough but generic Rye is easy.

--
No Bread Crumbs were hurt in the making of this Meal.
Type 2 Diabetic Since Aug 2004
1AC- 7.2, 7.3, 5.5, 5.6 mmol
Weight from 265 down to 215 lbs. and dropping.
Continuing to be Manitoban

"Margaret Suran" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Goomba38 said:

Frogleg said:

On Mon, 06 Jun 2005 11:40:26 -0400, Margaret Suran
<[email hidden]> wrote:

> Where do you live? I cannot imagine that a decent loaf of bread is so
> difficult to find in your area.

Believe me, there are many parts of the US where any bread other than
'supermarket' is impossible to find. The (very) few bakeries
specialize in rather heavy pastry items, and what bread they have
appears to be motivated by as close an imitation as possible of the
commercial variety. SE Virginia.

I'll pipe in from down South. They have no clue what a good dense crusty
loaf of bread is. Bakeries are few and far between and lean more towards
the crisco type sugary frosting on mediocre cakes. Nothing special or
particularly noteworthy to be had. I'd kill to live in NY or a city with
the bakeries to be found. I always carry back home as much as I can when
I visit.
Goomba

A dear friend who can read our posts but cannot post herself, lives in the
Northwest here, but is German. When her father comes to visit from
Germany, he brings her packaged black whole grain bread, because he does
not like what is made here. Some months ago Steffi sent me a package of
that bread and I was stunned to realize how much better this bread is than
anything similar that is made here. I am talking about the German type
pumpernickel or similar thin sliced breads that come in small, square
packages wrapped in clear plastic and are found in nearly every
supermarket and grocery in New York City. The German made bread has
"Tam", a Yiddish word for which I know no translation. Perhaps someone
else who reads this can help me out. It has a certain je ne sais quoi
that is not found in locally commercial loaves.

HELP, someone! I am way over my head here.

Unlike traditional ryes and sour ryes, the one you describe bakes for a very
long time and low temp. Actually, the bread you describe is not the
traditional bread that is eaten for breakfast. It is generally found as the
"plate" for canapes, etc.

Here in the Northwest, you can get very traditional German sour rye breads.
They are mostly baked in the Vancouver area, with daily shipments to
Seattle. Bavarian meats in Seattle has a good selection. Of course, the SBF
swears by my homemade Finnish sour rye bread, which is a daily staple of
Finns from the west coast of Finland.

Alan

"oldfart" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Goomba38 said:

Frogleg said:

On Mon, 06 Jun 2005 11:40:26 -0400, Margaret Suran
<[email hidden]> wrote:

> Where do you live? I cannot imagine that a decent loaf of bread is so
> difficult to find in your area.

Believe me, there are many parts of the US where any bread other than
'supermarket' is impossible to find. The (very) few bakeries
specialize in rather heavy pastry items, and what bread they have
appears to be motivated by as close an imitation as possible of the
commercial variety. SE Virginia.

I'll pipe in from down South. They have no clue what a good dense crusty
loaf of bread is. Bakeries are few and far between and lean more towards
the crisco type sugary frosting on mediocre cakes. Nothing special or
particularly noteworthy to be had. I'd kill to live in NY or a city with
the bakeries to be found. I always carry back home as much as I can when
I visit.
Goomba

Amen! I lived in the SF Bay area so long I got spoiled with the
sourdough. Now I've moved to Washington state there is no good bread to
be found, at least I haven't yet!

Surely you jest!!! With your email address being what it is, I assume you
know where to find decent oysters!!!

Since I don't live near the ocean, I do understand your concerns. Maybe we
should meet halfway between Seattle and the bay, and swap, oysters for
bread.

Here in Seattle we have some absolutely wonderful artisan bakers. It all
started here with the Grand Central Bakery, in Pioneer Square. A few years
later, one of their bakers, Leslie Macke, decided to go out on her one and
opened up Macrina, in the Belltown area of Seattle. I swear you can't find
better in the States, including San Francisco. And if that wasn't enough, a
couple of years ago, up opens the Essential Bakers. Perhaps you have heard
of that one. One of their bakers was the team leader that won the U.S. its
recent first place finish in Paris at the Coupe de Monde. No good bread. For
shame.

OTOH, I do agree that good bagels are hard to find here. That's why I bake
my own. One other bread that I need to bake on my own is Finnish Sour rye. A
good 100% sour rye is hard to find in Seattle. You can go accross the border
to BC and find great German bread. More German immigrants in Canada than
U.S. Also the fact that Canada produces far more and better rye flour than
in the States, may also have something to do with it.

Alan

On Wed, 08 Jun 2005 12:48:35 -0400, Goomba38 <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Frogleg said:

Margaret Suran said:

Where do you live? I cannot imagine that a decent loaf of bread is so
difficult to find in your area.

Believe me, there are many parts of the US where any bread other than
'supermarket' is impossible to find. The (very) few bakeries
specialize in rather heavy pastry items, and what bread they have
appears to be motivated by as close an imitation as possible of the
commercial variety. SE Virginia.

I'll pipe in from down South. They have no clue what a good dense crusty
loaf of bread is.

One craves "bread you can chew" f'r sure. Not the stuff that dissolves
on the roof of your mouth.

Quoted message said:

Bakeries are few and far between and lean more
towards the crisco type sugary frosting on mediocre cakes.

You got it. Nasty frosted cakes and cinnamon buns that weigh half a
pound apiece. Also 'special' pastries that feature awful
high-fructose-corn-syrup jams.