Ready to quit

My best advice is that you have to count calories too, especially when
trying to maintain, at least that's been my experience. Good luck.

--
Cheri
Type 2, no meds for now.

Quoted message said:

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still…I gained two pounds this week! What the heck is that
all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it. I'm ready
to chuck it all, but I'm afraid to because if I gain weight staying at
20 carbs a day, what's going to happen if I quit? I don't want to be
one of those statistics that gain back everything they lose and then
some.

Can anybody out there give me any advice?

Thank you in advance,
Linda

1) get control of your head. You can't eat everything you want and also not
be fat. You have to decide which one you really want to do. I know it is
hard, but having a love affair with food will make things very difficult.
try to beat it down.

2) start paying attention to how much you're eating, not just carbs. decide
that not matter what, you won't let your weight creep more than 5 lbs over
where you want to be (well, you must be realistic about this - 127 may just
be too little for you. Why not compromise at 135 with 140 being your "i'm
going to quit eating now" point.) Seriously, don't ever let yourself think
that you won't have to struggle to not be fat. That is the plight of a
formerly fat person, sadly.

3) look at your workout program. What are you doing? Perhaps it's time to
revise it - notch up the intensity. Add some real muscle mass to boost your
BMR.

4) you know exactly what will happen if you quit. think long and hard about
that -- try to visualize yourself naked while in front of a mirror. Yep, do
that every morning....

5) quit lurking. hanging out here will help you keep your focus. keeping
focus is very important, believe it or not.

Linda wrote:
:: I've been lurking here for quite a while, and have gotten much
:: support and information from this group (thank you!) But now I've
:: reached the end of my rope and need some advice, and I thought some
:: of you might be able to give me some words of wisdom.
::
:: I started low-carbing in May 2002, one year ahead of my wedding, at
:: the weight of 152 (I am 5'6"😉. By my wedding date, I was 25 pounds
:: lighter, at 127 (yay!) On my two-week honeymoon in Tahiti, I put on
:: 14 pounds (yikes!), 7 pounds of which I was able to take off the
:: first week back.
::
:: Since then (one year and four months) I have been basically taking
:: one step forward and two steps back. During my pre-wedding weight
:: loss, I was pretty much keeping around 30-40 carbs a day. Almost a
:: year ago I cut back to 20 grams a day, and rarely go over that.
:: Once every couple of months, either on a business trip or a weekend
:: getaway, I eat whatever I want, gain about 4 pounds, and then over
:: the next few weeks lose about 3 of them, so I've been slowly going
:: backwards. I am now at 142. Even when I go for months at a time
:: staying faithfully at 20 grams or less, I can't lose anything, and
:: often gain.
::
:: I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
:: really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
:: rules, and still.I gained two pounds this week! What the heck is
:: that all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it.
:: I'm ready to chuck it all, but I'm afraid to because if I gain
:: weight staying at 20 carbs a day, what's going to happen if I quit?
:: I don't want to be one of those statistics that gain back everything
:: they lose and then some.
::
:: Can anybody out there give me any advice?
::
:: Thank you in advance,
:: Linda

Linda said:

I've been lurking here for quite a while, and have gotten much support
and information from this group (thank you!) But now I've reached the
end of my rope and need some advice, and I thought some of you might
be able to give me some words of wisdom.

I started low-carbing in May 2002, one year ahead of my wedding, at
the weight of 152 (I am 5'6"😉. By my wedding date, I was 25 pounds
lighter, at 127 (yay!) On my two-week honeymoon in Tahiti, I put on
14 pounds (yikes!), 7 pounds of which I was able to take off the first
week back.

Since then (one year and four months) I have been basically taking one
step forward and two steps back. During my pre-wedding weight loss, I
was pretty much keeping around 30-40 carbs a day. Almost a year ago I
cut back to 20 grams a day, and rarely go over that. Once every
couple of months, either on a business trip or a weekend getaway, I
eat whatever I want, gain about 4 pounds, and then over the next few
weeks lose about 3 of them, so I've been slowly going backwards. I am
now at 142. Even when I go for months at a time staying faithfully at
20 grams or less, I can't lose anything, and often gain.

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still…I gained two pounds this week! What the heck is that
all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it. I'm ready
to chuck it all, but I'm afraid to because if I gain weight staying at
20 carbs a day, what's going to happen if I quit? I don't want to be
one of those statistics that gain back everything they lose and then
some.

Can anybody out there give me any advice?

i'd advise you to pull your head out of your ass. at 142 you're not
overweight by any stretch of the imagination.

Linda said:

Almost a year ago I
cut back to 20 grams a day, and rarely go over that.

Have you considered trying Atkins? In the book where it says it
is safe to stay at 20 for as long as six months if you satisfy
a long list if qualifications. I notice at least 3 from the
list that you miss, thus you aren't qualified to stay that low.

The ones I notice are: 1) It continues to work at 20. 2) You
have "a lot" to lose (and general experience says he means 100+
to mean a lot). 3) Six months except for folks who are under
direct supervision and still have a lot to lose.

There are several other qualifying questions in that section
and you may well fail even more of them.

Less is not more. Remember that you did better at 30-40 than
you are now doing at 20.

Are you still in ketosis? If yes then move up and find your
CCLL by spending a week out of ketosis, then settling in at
5-10 lower than that. Sure, right now you want to quote the
book that CCLL is about loss rate, but your stall just
conclusively disproved that for you.

(Linda) said:

I started low-carbing in May 2002, one year ahead of my wedding, at
the weight of 152 (I am 5'6"😉. By my wedding date, I was 25 pounds
lighter, at 127 (yay!) On my two-week honeymoon in Tahiti, I put on
14 pounds (yikes!), 7 pounds of which I was able to take off the first
week back.

Since then (one year and four months) I have been basically taking one
step forward and two steps back. During my pre-wedding weight loss, I
was pretty much keeping around 30-40 carbs a day. Almost a year ago I
cut back to 20 grams a day, and rarely go over that.

What was the reason you decided to cut back to 20 -- sounds like you
were doing well with 30-40, so why the change? Also, are you or were
you following any particular plan?

Quoted message said:

Once every
couple of months, either on a business trip or a weekend getaway, I
eat whatever I want, gain about 4 pounds, and then over the next few
weeks lose about 3 of them, so I've been slowly going backwards. I am
now at 142.

That likely puts you at a size 10 and about a 23 BMI. Not model thin,
but not fat either.

It may be a wise move to maintain the 142 for now and work with what
you've got. In fact, it would be one heck of an accomplishment if you
could do just that. Add some serious weight training to your exercise
routine, if you haven't done so already. Work up to it, of course.
Building some significant muscle mass will help *considerably*.

Quoted message said:

Even when I go for months at a time staying faithfully at
20 grams or less, I can't lose anything, and often gain.

A year is a darned long time to stick to 20 carbs/day, and can
frequently be counterproductive. Try increasing your carbs a bit and
eating a much wider variety and quantity of vegetables, not just
salads.

Quoted message said:

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still…I gained two pounds this week! What the heck is that
all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it.

I'd imagine this draconian eating plan you've had yourself on for
almost a year now is probably not helping in controlling the
occasional weekend binging either. Time to start moving towards
something you can live with long-term.

(snip)

Try eating less and doing some exercise, fatty.

--
You take stupid to a new level. -- MFW

"Linda" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I've been lurking here for quite a while, and have gotten much support
and information from this group (thank you!) But now I've reached the
end of my rope and need some advice, and I thought some of you might
be able to give me some words of wisdom.

I started low-carbing in May 2002, one year ahead of my wedding, at
the weight of 152 (I am 5'6"😉. By my wedding date, I was 25 pounds
lighter, at 127 (yay!) On my two-week honeymoon in Tahiti, I put on
14 pounds (yikes!), 7 pounds of which I was able to take off the first
week back.

Since then (one year and four months) I have been basically taking one
step forward and two steps back. During my pre-wedding weight loss, I
was pretty much keeping around 30-40 carbs a day. Almost a year ago I
cut back to 20 grams a day, and rarely go over that. Once every
couple of months, either on a business trip or a weekend getaway, I
eat whatever I want, gain about 4 pounds, and then over the next few
weeks lose about 3 of them, so I've been slowly going backwards. I am
now at 142. Even when I go for months at a time staying faithfully at
20 grams or less, I can't lose anything, and often gain.

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still.I gained two pounds this week! What the heck is that
all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it. I'm ready
to chuck it all, but I'm afraid to because if I gain weight staying at
20 carbs a day, what's going to happen if I quit? I don't want to be
one of those statistics that gain back everything they lose and then
some.

Can anybody out there give me any advice?

Thank you in advance,
Linda

[email hidden] (Doug Freyburger) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Linda said:

Almost a year ago I
cut back to 20 grams a day, and rarely go over that.

Have you considered trying Atkins? In the book where it says it
is safe to stay at 20 for as long as six months if you satisfy
a long list if qualifications. I notice at least 3 from the
list that you miss, thus you aren't qualified to stay that low.

The ones I notice are: 1) It continues to work at 20. 2) You
have "a lot" to lose (and general experience says he means 100+
to mean a lot). 3) Six months except for folks who are under
direct supervision and still have a lot to lose.

There are several other qualifying questions in that section
and you may well fail even more of them.

Less is not more. Remember that you did better at 30-40 than
you are now doing at 20.

Are you still in ketosis? If yes then move up and find your
CCLL by spending a week out of ketosis, then settling in at
5-10 lower than that. Sure, right now you want to quote the
book that CCLL is about loss rate, but your stall just
conclusively disproved that for you.

No, I'm not in ketosis. I've NEVER been in ketosis. Even during my
active weight loss period, I've never registered anything on the
strip. I've always wondered about that. I thought maybe I got a bad
batch of strips so I bought another bottle, and still nothing.

I'm afraid to increase my carb intake because I know my body pretty
well, and I'll start gaining immediately. I mean, obviously if I'm
gaining at 20 grams, I'll gain more at 40, won't I? It just makes
sense to me.

(Linda) said:

I'm afraid to increase my carb intake because I know my body pretty
well, and I'll start gaining immediately. I mean, obviously if I'm
gaining at 20 grams, I'll gain more at 40, won't I? It just makes
sense to me.

I don't pretend to know the specifics of why, but if I stay at very,
very low carbs, like 20 or less, I don't lose weight. I don't gain,
but I don't lose. I have to eat about 40 grams a day to lose weight,
which for me means adding at least a cup of yogurt or 1/4 of a
cantaloupe a day to boost it up a little. Weird, but that's how it
goes, so maybe you should try it for a week or two?

It's probably mentioned why in Atkins' book somewhere, but I'm on the
Anti-X diet, from the book "Syndrome X," and it doesn't get into that
sort of detail.

Hope that helps,

Kristen

--
"Who is the patriot, I ask you? Those who wrap themselves in the flag and pledge
allegiance to it, or those who keep the pledge and wrap themselves in what the
flag represents?" -Ira Glasser

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Linda) said:

I'm afraid to increase my carb intake because I know my body pretty
well, and I'll start gaining immediately. I mean, obviously if I'm
gaining at 20 grams, I'll gain more at 40, won't I? It just makes
sense to me.

It depends. I view low-carb as a tool for lowering overall calories.
While there have been some studies showing that you may be able to lose at
a higher caloric intake on low-carb than on low-fat, it makes sense to me
that this will only work up to a point.

The reason I think low-carb works in general is that you end up eating less
because low-carb foods are more satisfying. But, this doesn't lead to
weight loss for everyone. My father, for example, can eat obscene amounts
of meat. He got used to huge portions when he was a young man with a high
metabolism, when he was much more active. He was one of those muscular,
athletic guys who could eat huge amounts of food and not get fat. Once he
got hurt, got older, and got less active, it started to catch up with him.

Now, if you're staying at 20g but your portions are small, then it
shouldn't hurt you. But, you may run into the same trap my dad did, if you
have a big appetite. Instead of having a side salad and some steamed
broccoli with his steak, he'd rather have another steak. It could very well
add up to too many calories to lose weight. Some people find that if they
add more vegetables (which all have some carbs) they can keep the bulk of
the food the same, while lowering calories, and result in more weight loss.

It's all about finding the balance that works for you. Some people can get
full at 20g and at whatever calorie level they need to eat at to lose
weight, and some people need to add more carbs in order to keep calories
low enough.

--
Michelle Levin
http://www.mindspring.com/~lunachick

I have only 3 flaws. My first flaw is thinking that I only have 3 flaws.

Hi Linda.

Now, believe me, I KNOW how frustrating it can be to do 'everything
right' and not lose a pound. I stalled for 4 damned years doing
'everything right'. It turned out that a large part of my problem was
medical, which wasn't picked up until earlier this year. When that
problem was dealt with, the weight loss started happening again.

Quoted message said:

During my pre-wedding weight loss, I
was pretty much keeping around 30-40 carbs a day. Almost a year ago I
cut back to 20 grams a day, and rarely go over that.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still…I gained two pounds this week! What the heck is that
all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it. I'm ready
to chuck it all, but I'm afraid to because if I gain weight staying at
20 carbs a day, what's going to happen if I quit? I don't want to be
one of those statistics that gain back everything they lose and then
some.

You were losing nicely at 30 -40 g before your wedding. So why cut
back? There are MANY people here who can attest they do better at
slightly higher carb counts! It would seem that you found your
critical carb level for loss a year ago. Try going back to THAT carb
count and seeing what happens. If you have food diaries detailing
what you were eating so much the better - you can try your old menus
for a few weeks, which you KNOW were successful for YOU, and see if
that's the problem. You might be one of those people who CAN eat at a
higher carb level and still do fine - which means that you CAN have
some small portions of those foods you're missing, instead of making
yourself frustrated as you are now.

As to your current 2 lb gain - where are you in your menstrual cycle?
I know (from bitter experience) that I start to gain (water) weight at
Ovulation and can gain easily 10 or more pounds before it all goes
away at the start of my cycle. It's a pain, I know, but cyclical
water weight is something we women get to deal with. Even women who
no longer have a cycle (from hysterectomy, for instance) but still
have working ovaries can see this kind of cycling up-and-down.

Best of luck.

Aramanth

Linda,

My experience is that something ugly happens to our metabolisms when we get
to a very low weight. Our caloric needs drop and anything can put weight
back on.

I certainly haven't gotten this one beat. I've maintained okay, but only by
limiting calories very tightly all the time.

A couple thoughts:

1. When you are low carbing are you eating commercial "low carb" foods that
are full of sugar alcohols and, increasingly, transfat? If so, you may be
getting a lot more carbohydrate than you think.

2. Have you tracked your calorie intake while low carbing to see how much
you are eating. The classic low carb diet which works so beautifully when
people have 30 or more pounds to lose can stop working for those of us who
are even just ten pounds below the weight our bodies would like to be. I
find it takes 500 less calories a day to maintain at 142 lbs than it did at
152 lbs. That's because 152 was my body's chosen weight and 142 the level I
forced it down to.

3. I have found that high insulin production can mess up my weight even when
I am eating perfectly. Do you have a family history of diabetes or any
other suggestion that you might have high insulin levels. Contrary to what
the diet books suggest, long term low carbing can increase insulin
resistance. It did in my case. However, this takes some specialized medical
tests to check out.
One hint that high insulin might be at work is if you are mostly gaining
abdominal weight--pants tighter at same weight as before.

-- Jenny - Low Carbing for 4 years. Below goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes,
hba1c 5.7 .
Cut the carbs to respond to my email address!

Jenny's new site: What they Don't Tell You About Diabetes
http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/

Jenny's Low Carb Diet Facts & Figures
http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/

Looking for help controlling your blood sugar?
Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/Newly%20Diagnosed.htm

"Linda" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I've been lurking here for quite a while, and have gotten much support
and information from this group (thank you!) But now I've reached the
end of my rope and need some advice, and I thought some of you might
be able to give me some words of wisdom.

I started low-carbing in May 2002, one year ahead of my wedding, at
the weight of 152 (I am 5'6"😉. By my wedding date, I was 25 pounds
lighter, at 127 (yay!) On my two-week honeymoon in Tahiti, I put on
14 pounds (yikes!), 7 pounds of which I was able to take off the first
week back.

Since then (one year and four months) I have been basically taking one
step forward and two steps back. During my pre-wedding weight loss, I
was pretty much keeping around 30-40 carbs a day. Almost a year ago I
cut back to 20 grams a day, and rarely go over that. Once every
couple of months, either on a business trip or a weekend getaway, I
eat whatever I want, gain about 4 pounds, and then over the next few
weeks lose about 3 of them, so I've been slowly going backwards. I am
now at 142. Even when I go for months at a time staying faithfully at
20 grams or less, I can't lose anything, and often gain.

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still.I gained two pounds this week! What the heck is that
all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it. I'm ready
to chuck it all, but I'm afraid to because if I gain weight staying at
20 carbs a day, what's going to happen if I quit? I don't want to be
one of those statistics that gain back everything they lose and then
some.

Can anybody out there give me any advice?

Thank you in advance,
Linda

Linda said:

Doug Freyburger said:

Are you still in ketosis?

No, I'm not in ketosis. I've NEVER been in ketosis. Even during my
active weight loss period, I've never registered anything on the
strip. I've always wondered about that. I thought maybe I got a bad
batch of strips so I bought another bottle, and still nothing.

Ketosis is the primary tool of Atkins. As you have learned from
staying low, and from losing better at 30-40 than at 20, the
scale cannot possibly be used to judge CCLL. Since staying lower
triggers stalls in some including you, the scale doersn't work
to judge ideal carb intake.

But if you've never registered anything but completely unaltered
biege, that makes it much harder to figure out your CCLL. Have
have never registered trace, right? Some folks mistakenly think
that darker purple is needed to count as positive. Your statement
"never registered anything" is quite explicit that you never saw
anything but completely unaltered biege but I like to double,
triple and quadruple check the point just in case.

Figuring out CCLL without ketosis is a much more difficult game
but staying low isn't the way to do it. You've already proven
that doesn't work.

Quoted message said:

I'm afraid to increase my carb intake

Everyone is afraid. Join the club.

Quoted message said:

because I know my body pretty well, and I'll start gaining
immediately.

False. You have confused short term temporary water swings
with long term new fat storage. Do NOT do this to yourself.
Increasing carbs does NOT trigger new fat storage like that.
That's the entire principle of how the Premaintenance phase
and finding CCLM works.

Quoted message said:

I mean, obviously if I'm gaining at 20 grams, I'll gain
more at 40, won't I?

Obvious does NOT equal true!

Obvious - You can only get fat by eating fat. Obvious -
From each according to his ability, to each according to his
need. Obvious - If we repeal Prohibition there will be
crowds of drunks in the street.

Quoted message said:

It just makes sense to me.

I know. The actual working of Atkins are not obvious and it
makes sense to not follow the directions. I bet Dr A was
astonished when he tried the obvious of telling some of his
patients to stay low and saw some stall and the non-obvious
of telling some of his patients to go higher and they lost
faster.

The 4-phase Atkins core process works better than the obvious.
The 4-phase Atkins core process does not make sense on the
surface until you dig deep into the hormones that drive what
happens. The 4-phase Atkins core process works no matter
that it isn't obvious.

How's doing the obvious been working for you these days?

Take a step back. You've spent months clutching on the
obvious and you've stalled because you did that. It is time
to try something else. The obvious has already failed for you,
so you may as well try the non-obvious.

The time scale for loss is month to month. Without ketosis
you have no choice but to try on a month to month time scale
because you don't have the week to week tool of ketosis.
Spend a month a 30, a month at 40, a month at 50. Evaluate
each month at the end of the month afterwards. When you
finish the month of 40, see how the month of 30 worked.

Yes, this is not obvious. Yes, you don't believe that it
will work. Yes, the obvious has already failed for you.
Step out in faith and try it!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still?I gained two pounds this week! What the heck is that
all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it. I'm ready
to chuck it all, but I'm afraid to because if I gain weight staying at
20 carbs a day, what's going to happen if I quit? I don't want to be
one of those statistics that gain back everything they lose and then
some.

Can anybody out there give me any advice?

i'd advise you to pull your head out of your ass. at 142 you're not
overweight by any stretch of the imagination.

Minus the less-than-positive comment, I whole-heartedly agree! Linda,
I think it is a matter of perception. I am 5'6" and my GOAL is 142. I
am 163 now. When I got married (21 years ago), I was 115. LOL, I can't
go by the "pre-married" weight as a goal. I'd have to be sickly to
reach that. Funny how things change. Back then I could eat anything
and never gain. Then over the next couple years of married life, I
gained up to "normal" weight (135). I was horrified then, because I
had gained 20 pounds (then babies came and *bam* I was 200 lbs.). But
now I'd LOVE to be 135. If you really want to lose more try doing more
intense exercise on the 3 days or add a day and make it 4 days.

Don't quit! Quitting is not an option. Do you want to feel more
depressed and and discouraged? You do NOT want to "go there" and you
know it. Make small changes to your diet and exercise and see if more
pounds drop, but even if you maintain, you are still doing great at
that weight.

Peggy

Peggy

[email hidden] (Doug Freyburger) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Linda said:

Doug Freyburger said:

Are you still in ketosis?

No, I'm not in ketosis. I've NEVER been in ketosis. Even during my
active weight loss period, I've never registered anything on the
strip. I've always wondered about that. I thought maybe I got a bad
batch of strips so I bought another bottle, and still nothing.

Ketosis is the primary tool of Atkins. As you have learned from
staying low, and from losing better at 30-40 than at 20, the
scale cannot possibly be used to judge CCLL. Since staying lower
triggers stalls in some including you, the scale doersn't work
to judge ideal carb intake.

But if you've never registered anything but completely unaltered
biege, that makes it much harder to figure out your CCLL. Have
have never registered trace, right? Some folks mistakenly think
that darker purple is needed to count as positive. Your statement
"never registered anything" is quite explicit that you never saw
anything but completely unaltered biege but I like to double,
triple and quadruple check the point just in case.

Beige, beige, beige. That's it. How is that possible?

Quoted message said:

Figuring out CCLL without ketosis is a much more difficult game
but staying low isn't the way to do it. You've already proven
that doesn't work.

Quoted message said:

I'm afraid to increase my carb intake

Everyone is afraid. Join the club.

Quoted message said:

because I know my body pretty well, and I'll start gaining
immediately.

False. You have confused short term temporary water swings
with long term new fat storage. Do NOT do this to yourself.
Increasing carbs does NOT trigger new fat storage like that.
That's the entire principle of how the Premaintenance phase
and finding CCLM works.

Quoted message said:

I mean, obviously if I'm gaining at 20 grams, I'll gain
more at 40, won't I?

Obvious does NOT equal true!

Obvious - You can only get fat by eating fat. Obvious -
From each according to his ability, to each according to his
need. Obvious - If we repeal Prohibition there will be
crowds of drunks in the street.

Quoted message said:

It just makes sense to me.

I know. The actual working of Atkins are not obvious and it
makes sense to not follow the directions. I bet Dr A was
astonished when he tried the obvious of telling some of his
patients to stay low and saw some stall and the non-obvious
of telling some of his patients to go higher and they lost
faster.

The 4-phase Atkins core process works better than the obvious.
The 4-phase Atkins core process does not make sense on the
surface until you dig deep into the hormones that drive what
happens. The 4-phase Atkins core process works no matter
that it isn't obvious.

How's doing the obvious been working for you these days?

Take a step back. You've spent months clutching on the
obvious and you've stalled because you did that. It is time
to try something else. The obvious has already failed for you,
so you may as well try the non-obvious.

I know it's time to try something different. I've been insanely doing
the same thing that hasn't been working, expecting it to somehow
magically start working. That IS the definition of insanity!

Quoted message said:

The time scale for loss is month to month. Without ketosis
you have no choice but to try on a month to month time scale
because you don't have the week to week tool of ketosis.
Spend a month a 30, a month at 40, a month at 50. Evaluate
each month at the end of the month afterwards. When you
finish the month of 40, see how the month of 30 worked.

Yes, this is not obvious. Yes, you don't believe that it
will work. Yes, the obvious has already failed for you.
Step out in faith and try it!

I'll give anything a try. I just didn't know what to try. Thanks for
the advice.

Linda said:

.. Once every

Quoted message said:

couple of months, either on a business trip or a weekend getaway, I
eat whatever I want, gain about 4 pounds, and then over the next few
weeks lose about 3 of them, so I've been slowly going backwards.

It sounds like the binge and purge of low carb. What EXACTLY does "eat
whatever I want" mean?

Quoted message said:

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still…I gained two pounds this week!

You are treating this as a DIET not as a change in your way of eating. You
must change your way of thinking.

What the heck is that

Quoted message said:

all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it.

Where are your veggies?

--
Morgoth

morgoth said:

Linda said:

. Once every

Quoted message said:

couple of months, either on a business trip or a weekend getaway, I
eat whatever I want, gain about 4 pounds, and then over the next few
weeks lose about 3 of them, so I've been slowly going backwards.

It sounds like the binge and purge of low carb. What EXACTLY does "eat
whatever I want" mean?

Quoted message said:

I feel so frustrated, and deprived and angry at passing up the food I
really want to eat, exercising 3 times a week, following all the
rules, and still…I gained two pounds this week!

You are treating this as a DIET not as a change in your way of eating. You
must change your way of thinking.

What the heck is that

Quoted message said:

all about? I eat meat, cheese, salad, and that's about it.

Where are your veggies?

she said she eats salad.

Linda said:

Doug Freyburger said:

Linda said:

Doug Freyburger wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Are you still in ketosis?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

No, I'm not in ketosis. I've NEVER been in ketosis ...

Quoted message said:

Ketosis is the primary tool of Atkins ...
But if you've never registered anything but completely unaltered
biege, that makes it much harder to figure out your CCLL ...

Beige, beige, beige. That's it. How is that possible?

Some folks never register on the sticks. Do you have the other
physical signs like the smell on the breath or the dry mouth?
Those are more accurate and more sensative than the sticks.

When folks register on the sticks, the response is that the
sticks are like a pregnancy test. Either you're positive or
not. When folks register on the sticks that's only part of
the answer. The sticks can fail to register and give false
negatives, but if the sticks change at all they show ketones.
The sticks never give false positive. But the sticks are
supposed to show amounts and it's possible to have amounts
too low for the sticks to register.

Ketosis isn't mandatory to lose stored fat. Low fat folks
do lose stored fat and they aren't in ketosis. Even if you
can use lower carb to keep your blood sugar under control
so you aren't hungry, that's still good enough to lose.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Take a step back. You've spent months clutching on the
obvious and you've stalled because you did that. It is time
to try something else. The obvious has already failed for you,
so you may as well try the non-obvious.

I know it's time to try something different. I've been insanely doing
the same thing that hasn't been working, expecting it to somehow
magically start working. That IS the definition of insanity!

So ready or not it is time to try something else.

Go for the higher carb intake. Cautiously. Five grams this
week, five more in a few weeks, build up across time. Keep
within about the same range to total calories, eating different
food not just more to get the extra five. Start your meals with
the veggies to get to your quota and let the veggies fill you
somewhat. Do that and you'll naturally end up eating less of
the rest of the meals.

Other folks have recommended just cutting calories. I've
recommended swapping some number of other calories for more
carb calories. You could always combine the two sets of
suggestions and do a little of both.

Quoted message said:

When folks register on the sticks, the response is that the
sticks are like a pregnancy test. Either you're positive or
not. When folks register on the sticks that's only part of
the answer. The sticks can fail to register and give false
negatives, but if the sticks change at all they show ketones.
The sticks never give false positive. But the sticks are
supposed to show amounts and it's possible to have amounts
too low for the sticks to register.

IIRC (I've never used them personally) they only test for one type of ketone,
and there are more than one.
LCing since 12/01/03-
Me- 5'7" 265/175/140
& hubby- 6' 310/190/180
http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/lcer09/my_photos

LCer09 said:

Doug Freyburger said:

Either you're positive or not ... But the sticks are
supposed to show amounts and it's possible to have amounts
too low for the sticks to register.

IIRC (I've never used them personally) they only test for
one type of ketone, and there are more than one.

The three main ketones appear in a set ratio, so a test that
detects one shows the presence of the others.