Re: What would the Devil have driven?

landotter ??? said:

...
Religion is a belief in nonsense,...

Utter rubbish. The Flying Spaghetti Monster created the Universe with
His Noodly Appendage.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"And never forget, life ultimately makes failures of all people." A. Derleth

"Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

landotter ??? said:

...
Religion is a belief in nonsense,...

Utter rubbish. The Flying Spaghetti Monster created the Universe with His
Noodly Appendage.

No, it was the aliens. As you would know if you listened to Bob.

"landotter" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Amy Blankenship said:

I'm not of any religious persuasion that is easy to explain, but I find
the
fact that you keep making all sorts of flames based on religion is
getting
to be a little offensive.

Religion is a belief in nonsense, as such, it should develop a thicker
skin, and less of an attitude. On my local newspaper's message boards,
nearly half the messages are religious folks condemning others.
Strangely enough, when one responds in kind, one is labeled as
intolerant.

Direct attacks on others' deeply held beliefs isn't funny, whether I share
them or not.

"donquijote1954" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Amy Blankenship said:

"landotter" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

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Quoted message said:

Amy Blankenship said:

I'm not of any religious persuasion that is easy to explain, but I find
the
fact that you keep making all sorts of flames based on religion is
getting
to be a little offensive.

Quoted message said:

Religion is a belief in nonsense, as such, it should develop a thicker
skin, and less of an attitude. On my local newspaper's message boards,
nearly half the messages are religious folks condemning others.
Strangely enough, when one responds in kind, one is labeled as
intolerant.

Direct attacks on others' deeply held beliefs isn't funny, whether I share
them or not.

But when those beliefs are used as cover for evil things then they are
fair game.

------------------

But you haven't attacked them as a cover for evil things. You've
essentially said

"All Christians drive SUV's"
"SUV's are evil"
"Therefore, all Christians are evil."

Only you've managed to pad it out to make it much more offensive than that.

"Chalo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Amy Blankenship said:

landotter said:

Amy Blankenship wrote:
>
> I'm not of any religious persuasion that is easy to explain, but I
> find
> the
> fact that you keep making all sorts of flames based on religion is
> getting
> to be a little offensive.

Religion is a belief in nonsense, as such, it should develop a thicker
skin, and less of an attitude. On my local newspaper's message boards,
nearly half the messages are religious folks condemning others.
Strangely enough, when one responds in kind, one is labeled as
intolerant.

Direct attacks on others' deeply held beliefs isn't funny, whether I
share
them or not.

Disabusing others of their ridiculous notions is a righteous act, even
if it's often ineffective.

It's not what, it is how.

Quoted message said:

If you had a friend or coworker who you discovered actually harbored a
belief in Santa Claus that was guiding his decisions and interfering
with his education or career, would you try to straighten him out in
any way?

I certainly wouldn't do it in a way that made fun of his belief and
deliberately offended him. For one thing, it's not a nice thing to do. For
another thing, people tend not to listen to those who are rude to them. So,
if my actual intention was to change his opinion and/or behavior, I wouldn't
rub his face in how stupid I thought he was.

Quoted message said:

How about someone who refused to travel internationally for
fear of falling off the edge of the earth, and therefore missed out on
seeing other places? Would you consider it an act of _respect_ to
refrain from challenging his foolishness?

Oh, absolutely I would leave that one alone. Some people are born to be
homebodies, and these kinds of excuses reflect their wish to stay at home.

Quoted message said:

Religious tolerance is a concept crafted to keep various primitive
thinkers from murdering each other in the names of their respective
imaginary friends. It is about making violent fools keep peace with
each other, not about compelling the reality-based community to
pretend that delusional people are on an equal footing with sane
ones.

That is one way to look at it. However, it is NOT the way it is viewed by
people who hold strong religious views, so approaching them with that
attitude will never sway them. If you insist on doing so, you are doing it
because you want to vent and because you like being mean. Or possibly
because you haven't realized that attacking people isn't a useful way to try
to change their behavior. Certainly you're not doing it out of an honest
and thoughtful desire to change their behavior.

-Amy

Chalo said:

Disabusing others of their ridiculous notions is a righteous act, even
if it's often ineffective.

As long as they're Christians, Jews, Catholics, Mormons, Scientologists,
right? I bet you (and the "cultural you"😉 wouldn't DARE mock or deride a
Muslim.

It's all about intimidation and agendas.

BS (piled up and getting deeper)

"Amy Blankenship" wrote: (clip) However, it is NOT the way it is viewed by

Quoted message said:

people who hold strong religious views, so approaching them with that
attitude will never sway them. (clip)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
People who hold strong religious views generally have them because they were
brought up that way. The architecture of the brain is formed while they are
young, and they cannot usually free themselves from these beliefs. Trying
to dissuade them is pointless.

"Leo Lichtman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Amy Blankenship" wrote: (clip) However, it is NOT the way it is viewed
by

Quoted message said:

people who hold strong religious views, so approaching them with that
attitude will never sway them. (clip)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
People who hold strong religious views generally have them because they
were brought up that way. The architecture of the brain is formed while
they are young, and they cannot usually free themselves from these
beliefs. Trying to dissuade them is pointless.

I was brought up VERY Southern Baptist.

"Chalo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Amy Blankenship said:

Leo Lichtman said:

People who hold strong religious views generally have them because they
were brought up that way. The architecture of the brain is formed
while
they are young, and they cannot usually free themselves from these
beliefs. Trying to dissuade them is pointless.

I was brought up VERY Southern Baptist.

I was brought up half-heartedly Southern Baptist. I'm glad to say I
am now fully cured of that ailment.

Maybe Southern Baptists should take up shunning or honor killings as a
way to improve retention.

Must suck to be so bitter.

Chalo said:

Bill Sornson said:

Chalo said:

Disabusing others of their ridiculous notions is a righteous act,
even if it's often ineffective.

As long as they're Christians, Jews, Catholics, Mormons,
Scientologists, right? I bet you (and the "cultural you"😉 wouldn't
DARE mock or deride a Muslim.

You'd lose that bet. Crackpot religions are crackpot religions. The
Prophet Mohammed (PBUH), if you read about his life and works, comes
off every bit as much of a huckster and a con artist as Joseph Smith,
just slightly less perverted and a lot more bloodthirsty. And Islam
has had centuries longer than Mormonism for highly-placed but
psychologically damaged individuals to reach deep into their rectums
and draw forth pearls of "wisdom" that become enshrined as dogma and/
or laws.

Believing that it's a bad idea to pick a pointlessly destructive fight
with the entire Islamic world is not the same as cutting them slack
for their ludicrous religion.

In the spirit of addressing the problem you actually have, taking the
[censored] out of Christholes is a lot more appropriate for intelligent
Americans to do than getting all bent out of shape about Muslims. I
mean, which one of those two equally hogwashy belief systems is really
damaging this country politically and culturally?

Your answer to Amy betrays your bitterness. I'm no church-goer by any
means, but I have no problem with those who are (as long as they leave me
alone, which they do without exception). This imagined "damage" done by the
so-called Christian Right is mainly a media-driven myth. They're not my cup
of tea, but they're more charitable and perform more selfless service than
pretty much any other group you can name.

My point was that it's OK to /publicly/ bash or mock Christianity or
Catholicism or others, but doing anything even close to that re. Islam will
literally get you killed. (Hell, people can't publish opinionated books in
England nowadays, lest the Muslims sue -- successfully -- for libel.)

And God save anyone who dares draw a cartoon...

BS

"Bill Sornson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

And God save anyone who dares draw a cartoon...

Which one???

Chalo Colina said:

...
In the spirit of addressing the problem you actually have, taking the
[censored] out of Christholes is a lot more appropriate for intelligent
Americans to do than getting all bent out of shape about Muslims. I
mean, which one of those two equally hogwashy belief systems is really
damaging this country politically and culturally?

It is truly disturbing how many of the laws in the US have their origin
in fundamentalist/evangelical belief, and not the rational basis of
trading certain privileges for the betterment of society as a whole.
Separation of church and state my ass!

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"And never forget, life ultimately makes failures of all people." A. Derleth

Bill Sornson said:

Chalo said:

Bill Sornson said:

Chalo wrote:
> Disabusing others of their ridiculous notions is a righteous act,
> even if it's often ineffective.
As long as they're Christians, Jews, Catholics, Mormons,
Scientologists, right? I bet you (and the "cultural you"😉 wouldn't
DARE mock or deride a Muslim.

You'd lose that bet. Crackpot religions are crackpot religions. The
Prophet Mohammed (PBUH), if you read about his life and works, comes
off every bit as much of a huckster and a con artist as Joseph Smith,
just slightly less perverted and a lot more bloodthirsty. And Islam
has had centuries longer than Mormonism for highly-placed but
psychologically damaged individuals to reach deep into their rectums
and draw forth pearls of "wisdom" that become enshrined as dogma and/
or laws.

Believing that it's a bad idea to pick a pointlessly destructive fight
with the entire Islamic world is not the same as cutting them slack
for their ludicrous religion.

In the spirit of addressing the problem you actually have, taking the
[censored] out of Christholes is a lot more appropriate for intelligent
Americans to do than getting all bent out of shape about Muslims. I
mean, which one of those two equally hogwashy belief systems is really
damaging this country politically and culturally?

Your answer to Amy betrays your bitterness. I'm no church-goer by any
means, but I have no problem with those who are (as long as they leave me
alone, which they do without exception). This imagined "damage" done by the
so-called Christian Right is mainly a media-driven myth. They're not my cup
of tea, but they're more charitable and perform more selfless service than
pretty much any other group you can name....

The reason the US is so full of "sexual predators" is due to the
excessive repression of normal childhood behavior, which leads to
fetishisms; some of which involve others and are not harmless.

Historically, US laws regulating behavior that goes beyond interfering
in the rights of others (paternalistic laws) have been promoted and
passed by self-proclaimed "Christians". This behavior is not a thing of
the past.

So no, the "Christian" right does NOT leave others alone.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"And never forget, life ultimately makes failures of all people." A. Derleth

Amy Blankenship said:

"Bill Sornson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And God save anyone who dares draw a cartoon...

Quoted message said:

Which one???

Any one depicting Mohammed, good light or bad.

"donquijote1954" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Bill Sornson said:

Chalo said:

Disabusing others of their ridiculous notions is a righteous act, even
if it's often ineffective.

As long as they're Christians, Jews, Catholics, Mormons, Scientologists,
right? I bet you (and the "cultural you"😉 wouldn't DARE mock or deride a
Muslim.

Some Christians already did while sitting smilingly on top of naked
Muslims.

Just out of curiosity, what basis do you have for saying that they were
Christians? I've never seen any news reports that suggested what they said
their faith was.

donquijote1954 ??? said:

...
Observing evolution of human mind, one can notice humanity traveling
from MONOLOG into DIALOGUE. Human beings are traveling from the
tyranny of the command, out of the slavery to the word, out of the
authoritarian, hierarchic order of ancient times, into a democratic,
non-authoritarian, non-violent, horizontal, classless society with
social and ecological awareness.

However, we have not arrived yet, although the end is already shinning
out of the darkness....

Bah. We have arrived at a point where a fascist government can come into
being, while the citizens still believe that they are living in a democracy.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"And never forget, life ultimately makes failures of all people." A. Derleth

Tom Sherman said:

donquijote1954 ??? said:

...
Observing evolution of human mind, one can notice humanity traveling
from MONOLOG into DIALOGUE. Human beings are traveling from the
tyranny of the command, out of the slavery to the word, out of the
authoritarian, hierarchic order of ancient times, into a democratic,
non-authoritarian, non-violent, horizontal, classless society with
social and ecological awareness.

However, we have not arrived yet, although the end is already shinning
out of the darkness....

Bah. We have arrived at a point where a fascist government can come into
being, while the citizens still believe that they are living in a
democracy.

With the Patriot Act and such, aren't you afraid
of a knock on the door at midnight for speaking so
openly in public?

You're obviously a very brave person.

SMH

Stephen Harding said:

Tom Sherman said:

donquijote1954 ??? said:

...
Observing evolution of human mind, one can notice humanity traveling
from MONOLOG into DIALOGUE. Human beings are traveling from the
tyranny of the command, out of the slavery to the word, out of the
authoritarian, hierarchic order of ancient times, into a democratic,
non-authoritarian, non-violent, horizontal, classless society with
social and ecological awareness.

However, we have not arrived yet, although the end is already shinning
out of the darkness....

Bah. We have arrived at a point where a fascist government can come
into being, while the citizens still believe that they are living in a
democracy.

With the Patriot Act and such, aren't you afraid
of a knock on the door at midnight for speaking so
openly in public?

You're obviously a very brave person.

Yep, advocating a political/economic system such as is used in
Scandinavia could well earn one a trip to the detention camps
Halliburton is building that Blackwater will guard.

Heck, even advocating the system used in countries such as England,
Canada and New Zealand makes one an Anti-American Communist by the
standards of Faux News, the Heritage Foundation and American Enterprise
Institute and the shouting heads of talk radio.

It is questionable if the remaining freedom of speech, travel, etc. in
the US could withstand another Reichstag Fire, er 9/11/2001 incident.
Such an incident would be easy to arrange with the "assets" on the
payroll of the CIA, not to mention the covert services of several
countries friendly to the neocon agenda.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"And never forget, life ultimately makes failures of all people." A. Derleth

Tom Sherman said:

Yep, advocating a political/economic system such as is used in
Scandinavia could well earn one a trip to the detention camps
Halliburton is building that Blackwater will guard.

Heck, even advocating the system used in countries such as England,
Canada and New Zealand makes one an Anti-American Communist by the
standards of Faux News, the Heritage Foundation and American Enterprise
Institute and the shouting heads of talk radio.

It is questionable if the remaining freedom of speech, travel, etc. in
the US could withstand another Reichstag Fire, er 9/11/2001 incident.
Such an incident would be easy to arrange with the "assets" on the
payroll of the CIA, not to mention the covert services of several
countries friendly to the neocon agenda.

Looks like you've got it all figured out.

Wish I could be so confident with my political beliefs.

SMH