Re: Time to bomb Iran?

Donald Gillies said:

Bill said:

This war is not going away unless we make all the Muslim/Islamics go
away, and a few big booms from air burst H-bombs will make little
radiation, but lots of glass we can make things from.
Suicide that, fanatical Islamics.

Bill Baka

This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

- Don Gillies
San Diego, CA, USA

Not only do I agree with you, I just hope it happens. Bush's war is even
getting bad vibes from the few Republicans I do admit to knowing. One
guy who served in Viet Nam and got sick of politics from that one says
we should either blow them to Hell or get out and let them kill each
other, and we know they will.
I'll even bet that oil prices would come down as soon as we got out of
there. I think the oil prices are the other countries way of saying we
are not wanted.
Bill Baka

On 15 Jun 2007 15:32:51 -0700, [email hidden] (Donald Gillies)

Quoted message said:

Bill said:

This war is not going away unless we make all the Muslim/Islamics go
away, and a few big booms from air burst H-bombs will make little
radiation, but lots of glass we can make things from.
Suicide that, fanatical Islamics.

Bill Baka

This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

I've read that it'll take almost a year to physically remove that many
troops and their stuff.
--
JT
****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

John Forrest Tomlinson said:

On 15 Jun 2007 15:32:51 -0700, [email hidden] (Donald Gillies)

Quoted message said:

Bill said:

This war is not going away unless we make all the Muslim/Islamics go
away, and a few big booms from air burst H-bombs will make little
radiation, but lots of glass we can make things from.
Suicide that, fanatical Islamics.

Bill Baka

This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

Dissolve the Repuglican party forever? Great idea but hard to implement.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I've read that it'll take almost a year to physically remove that many
troops and their stuff.

It didn't take that long to get them there. After the election we can
send Bush and Cheney and tell them that since they supported the war so
vigorously that they can now prove their manhood.
I wish.
Bush joined (did he really join?) the National Guard to get out of Viet
Nam, yet he sent the National Guard troops to Iraq, thus leaving us, in
a manner, unguarded.
What's pathetically funny to me is the new Army commercials.
You made them strong, we'll make them Army strong.
BTW, "We will send them home in a body bag, probably made in China."
Something is wrong here, but impeaching Bush would put OMG, Cheney in
command.
Bill (Political science in college did NOT prepare me for this) Baka

Donald Gillies said:

This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

If there is a national "emergency", will there be a 2008 election?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

Johnny Sunset said:

Donald Gillies said:

This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

If there is a national "emergency", will there be a 2008 election?

Don't laugh. It could happen. I think somewhere in the Constitution
there is a war powers act that states the sitting president can cancel
elections during a 'war'. Bush might call this a war and do something
stupid like declare himself president until the "War on American
Liberties, (err, terror)" is won, which would be never.
That is one scary thought.
Bill Baka

Quoted message said:

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

"Johnny Sunset" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Donald Gillies said:

This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

If there is a national "emergency", will there be a 2008 election?
.....

Sorry, but that scenario has already been used:

http://wired-vig.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/07/20751

Try to be a little more creative. 8)

ChuckD

Bill said:

Johnny Sunset said:

Donald Gillies said:

This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

If there is a national "emergency", will there be a 2008 election?

Don't laugh. It could happen. I think somewhere in the Constitution
there is a war powers act that states the sitting president can cancel
elections during a 'war'. Bush might call this a war and do something
stupid like declare himself president until the "War on American
Liberties, (err, terror)" is won, which would be never.
That is one scary thought.
Bill Baka

The suspension of an election "somewhere in the Constitution?" Total
and absolute [censored].

Chuck Davis said:

Johnny Sunset wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Jun 15, 5:32 pm, Donald Gillies wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

Quoted message said:

If there is a national "emergency", will there be a 2008 election?
.....

Sorry, but that scenario has already been used:

Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
killed 50+ million people?

Quoted message said:

http://wired-vig.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/07/20751

Try to be a little more creative. 8)

WTF does being creative have do to with anything, when there are
plenty of historical precedents?

Quotes by George W. Bush:

"You don't get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot
easier." (Governing Magazine 7/98)

"I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don't
agree with each other, but that's OK. If this were a dictatorship, it
would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the
dictator." (CNN.com, December 18, 2000)

"A dictatorship would be a heck of a lot easier, there's no question
about it" (Business Week, July 30, 2001)

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"The real danger is whenever we start talking with our enemies, we may
discover potential areas of compromise or even agreement." - Joe
Conason

Johnny Sunset said:

Chuck Davis said:

Johnny Sunset wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Jun 15, 5:32 pm, Donald Gillies wrote:

Quoted message said:

> This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
> minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
> and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

Quoted message said:

If there is a national "emergency", will there be a 2008 election?
.....

Sorry, but that scenario has already been used:

Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
killed 50+ million people?

Quoted message said:

http://wired-vig.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/07/20751

Try to be a little more creative. 8)

WTF does being creative have do to with anything, when there are
plenty of historical precedents?

Quotes by George W. Bush:

"You don't get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot
easier." (Governing Magazine 7/98)

"I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don't
agree with each other, but that's OK. If this were a dictatorship, it
would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the
dictator." (CNN.com, December 18, 2000)

"A dictatorship would be a heck of a lot easier, there's no question
about it" (Business Week, July 30, 2001)

I'm guessing that every one of these quotes does not convey the true
context. Convenient for the easily misguided, though.

R Brickston said:

Johnny Sunset said:

Chuck Davis said:

Johnny Sunset wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> On Jun 15, 5:32 pm, Donald Gillies wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
>> minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
>> and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> If there is a national "emergency", will there be a 2008 election?
> .....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Sorry, but that scenario has already been used:

Quoted message said:

Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
killed 50+ million people?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

http://wired-vig.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/07/20751

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Try to be a little more creative. 8)

Quoted message said:

WTF does being creative have do to with anything, when there are
plenty of historical precedents?

Quoted message said:

Quotes by George W. Bush:

Quoted message said:

"You don't get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot
easier." (Governing Magazine 7/98)

Quoted message said:

"I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don't
agree with each other, but that's OK. If this were a dictatorship, it
would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the
dictator." (CNN.com, December 18, 2000)

Quoted message said:

"A dictatorship would be a heck of a lot easier, there's no question
about it" (Business Week, July 30, 2001)

I'm guessing that every one of these quotes does not convey the true
context. Convenient for the easily misguided, though.

The quotes are totally inappropriate considering the source, even if
meant to be humor.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"The real danger is whenever we start talking with our enemies, we may
discover potential areas of compromise or even agreement." - Joe
Conason

"Johnny Sunset" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

...
Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
killed 50+ million people?
...

So, you're saying that, not only are George Bush et al, guilty of any number
of crimes in the PAST, they're now guilty of any number of crimes in the
FUTURE - crimes having no requirement for definition other than your fertile
imagination?

BTW - Nice way to sidestep Godwin's Law.

ChuckD

Chuck Davis said:

Johnny Sunset wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

...
Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
killed 50+ million people?
...

So, you're saying that, not only are George Bush et al, guilty of any number
of crimes in the PAST, they're now guilty of any number of crimes in the
FUTURE - crimes having no requirement for definition other than your fertile
imagination?

No, and it is a sleazy debating tactic to say so.

Let us look at past behavior. The administration was asleep at the
wheel, and let September 11, 2001 happen. They managed to spin that
into Bush being a great leader, then followed up by violating the
"supremacy clause" of the US Constitution by launching an aggressive
war of conquest, implementing an illegal surveillance program of US
citizens, violating the habeas corpus rights of US citizens, and
claiming rights for the executive branch far beyond those allotted by
the US Constitution.

Is it such a stretch to imagine the POSSIBILITY of such people doing
whatever it takes to hold onto power?

Quoted message said:

BTW - Nice way to sidestep Godwin's Law.

Godwin's Law involves INAPPROPRIATE comparisons to [censored] and/or
Nazis.

The Nazi's used the Reichstag Fire to increase their political power.

The Cheney/Bush administration used 9/11/2001 to increase their
political power.

How is the comparison inappropriate?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"The real danger is whenever we start talking with our enemies, we may
discover potential areas of compromise or even agreement." - Joe
Conason

Johnny Sunset said:

Chuck Davis said:

Johnny Sunset wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

...
Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
killed 50+ million people?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

BTW - Nice way to sidestep Godwin's Law.

Godwin's Law involves INAPPROPRIATE comparisons to [censored] and/or
Nazis.

The Nazi's used the Reichstag Fire to increase their political power.

The Cheney/Bush administration used 9/11/2001 to increase their
political power.

How is the comparison inappropriate?

Totally inappropriate because the power [censored] seized that very night
and in the successive days, could not be remotely, even in someone's
wildest imagination, compared to any action Bush, or in fact, *any*
President of the United States has ever taken.

R Brickston said:

Johnny Sunset said:

Chuck Davis said:

Johnny Sunset wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> ...
> Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
> killed 50+ million people?
BTW - Nice way to sidestep Godwin's Law.

Quoted message said:

Godwin's Law involves INAPPROPRIATE comparisons to [censored] and/or
Nazis.

Quoted message said:

The Nazi's used the Reichstag Fire to increase their political power.

Quoted message said:

The Cheney/Bush administration used 9/11/2001 to increase their
political power.

Quoted message said:

How is the comparison inappropriate?

Totally inappropriate because the power [censored] seized that very night
and in the successive days, could not be remotely, even in someone's
wildest imagination, compared to any action Bush, or in fact, *any*
President of the United States has ever taken.

Aggressive invasion of a sovereign nation is a common action. If you
believe Iraq was attacking or about to attack the US in 2003, you are
truly delusional.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
Rationality, as the primary cognitive system for comprehending our
world, has been rejected in favor of unyielding dogmatic belief. -
David Michael Green

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman said:

R Brickston said:

Johnny Sunset said:

On Jun 16, 3:59 pm, Chuck Davis wrote:
> Johnny Sunset wrote in message

Quoted message said:

>news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

> > ...
> > Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
> > killed 50+ million people?
> BTW - Nice way to sidestep Godwin's Law.

Quoted message said:

Godwin's Law involves INAPPROPRIATE comparisons to [censored] and/or
Nazis.

Quoted message said:

The Nazi's used the Reichstag Fire to increase their political power.

Quoted message said:

The Cheney/Bush administration used 9/11/2001 to increase their
political power.

Quoted message said:

How is the comparison inappropriate?

Totally inappropriate because the power [censored] seized that very night
and in the successive days, could not be remotely, even in someone's
wildest imagination, compared to any action Bush, or in fact, *any*
President of the United States has ever taken.

Aggressive invasion of a sovereign nation is a common action. If you
believe Iraq was attacking or about to attack the US in 2003, you are
truly delusional.

Clarify you statement as to my rebuttal above, I have no idea what
comparison you are making.

R Brickston said:

Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman said:

R Brickston said:

On Sat, 16 Jun 2007 14:33:01 -0700, Johnny Sunset wrote:
> On Jun 16, 3:59 pm, Chuck Davis wrote:
>> Johnny Sunset wrote in message

>> news:[email hidden]...

>>> ...
>>> Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed
>>> that killed 50+ million people?
>> BTW - Nice way to sidestep Godwin's Law.

> Godwin's Law involves INAPPROPRIATE comparisons to [censored] and/or
> Nazis.

> The Nazi's used the Reichstag Fire to increase their political
> power.

> The Cheney/Bush administration used 9/11/2001 to increase their
> political power.

> How is the comparison inappropriate?

Totally inappropriate because the power [censored] seized that very
night and in the successive days, could not be remotely, even in
someone's wildest imagination, compared to any action Bush, or in
fact, *any* President of the United States has ever taken.

Aggressive invasion of a sovereign nation is a common action. If you
believe Iraq was attacking or about to attack the US in 2003, you are
truly delusional.

Clarify you statement as to my rebuttal above, I have no idea what
comparison you are making.

Neither does he. HTH!

"Johnny Sunset" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Jun 16, 3:59 pm, Chuck Davis wrote:
...

Quoted message said:

So, you're saying that, not only are George Bush et al, guilty of any
number
of crimes in the PAST, they're now guilty of any number of crimes in the
FUTURE - crimes having no requirement for definition other than your
fertile
imagination?

Quoted message said:

...
No, and it is a sleazy debating tactic to say so.
...

I didn't know that we were debating. Anyway, YOUR comment is the sleazy
debating tactic. Prefacing your reply by calling my valid, albeit mildly
rhetorical question sleazy is sleazy in itself.

Quoted message said:

Let us look at past behavior. The administration was asleep at the
....

The point in my original post is that there were people accusing Clinton of
planning to use Y2K as his Reichstag Fire. Someone accusing an
administration they don't like of planning and coniving to maintain power is
nothing new - and none of the accusers have ever apologized for their
comments after there was an orderly transition to the next administration.

Regardless, let's assume that what you say is true. Let's say that there's
planning and scheming going on right now in the current administration in
preparation for this takeover. What is your purpose in posting your
speculation? Do you have a proposal to implement that will stop this
"Reichstag Fire" from happening? Are you trying to garner support for your
preventative measures?

Quoted message said:

...
Godwin's Law involves INAPPROPRIATE comparisons to [censored] and/or
Nazis.
....

Godwin's Law : "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a
comparison involving Nazis or [censored] approaches one." Nothing there about
appropriateness. We've now reached "one".

Quoted message said:

The Nazi's used the Reichstag Fire to increase their political power.

The Cheney/Bush administration used 9/11/2001 to increase their
political power.

How is the comparison inappropriate?
...

The comparison feeds your imagination and makes George Bush et al guilty by
default of any and everything you conclude will/could happen with no need
for evidence that it actually happened.....because it's in the FUTURE. If
it's important to denigrate the Bush administration, the PAST should be
plenty enough for you to work with.

ChuckD

Chuck Davis said:

Johnny Sunset wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Jun 16, 3:59 pm, Chuck Davis wrote:
...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So, you're saying that, not only are George Bush et al, guilty of any
number
of crimes in the PAST, they're now guilty of any number of crimes in the
FUTURE - crimes having no requirement for definition other than your
fertile
imagination?

...
No, and it is a sleazy debating tactic to say so.
...

I didn't know that we were debating. Anyway, YOUR comment is the sleazy
debating tactic. Prefacing your reply by calling my valid, albeit mildly
rhetorical question sleazy is sleazy in itself.

[YAWN]

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Let us look at past behavior. The administration was asleep at the
....

The point in my original post is that there were people accusing Clinton of
planning to use Y2K as his Reichstag Fire. Someone accusing an
administration they don't like of planning and coniving to maintain power is
nothing new - and none of the accusers have ever apologized for their
comments after there was an orderly transition to the next administration.

Regardless, let's assume that what you say is true. Let's say that there's
planning and scheming going on right now in the current administration in
preparation for this takeover. What is your purpose in posting your
speculation? Do you have a proposal to implement that will stop this
"Reichstag Fire" from happening? Are you trying to garner support for your
preventative measures?

Mostly I post things like this because it annoys those who pretend to
be in the moral right, but at some level know they are not. This is
Usenet, after all.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Godwin's Law involves INAPPROPRIATE comparisons to [censored] and/or
Nazis.
....

Godwin's Law : "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a
comparison involving Nazis or [censored] approaches one." Nothing there about
appropriateness. We've now reached "one".

Look up the discussions on Godwin's Law, and you will see
appropriateness mentioned.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The Nazi's used the Reichstag Fire to increase their political power.

Quoted message said:

The Cheney/Bush administration used 9/11/2001 to increase their
political power.

Quoted message said:

How is the comparison inappropriate?
...

The comparison feeds your imagination and makes George Bush et al guilty by
default of any and everything you conclude will/could happen with no need
for evidence that it actually happened.....because it's in the FUTURE. If
it's important to denigrate the Bush administration, the PAST should be
plenty enough for you to work with.

September 11, 2001 is in the future??? Wow!!!

The PATRIOT ACT is in the future? The violation of habeas corpus for
United States citizens Jose Padilla and Yasar Hamdi is in the future?
The US invasion of Iraq is in the future? The Military Commissions Act
of 2006 is in the future? Recording the phone calls of United States
citizens by the NSA without warrants is in the future? Bush declaring
that he can interpret laws passed by Congress in signing statements is
in the future? The approval of torture is in the future?

The comparison was based on past behavior, but someone was too quick
in trying to score cheap Usenet points.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia

Johnny Sunset said:

Chuck Davis said:

Johnny Sunset wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Jun 15, 5:32 pm, Donald Gillies wrote:

Quoted message said:

> This war is going away exactly 1 year, 7 months, 5 days, and 12
> minutes from now, roughly 10 seconds after we swear in a new president
> and kick the current fascists from office, forever.

Quoted message said:

If there is a national "emergency", will there be a 2008 election?
.....

Sorry, but that scenario has already been used:

Yep, Reichstag Fire, and those little incidents that followed that
killed 50+ million people?

Quoted message said:

http://wired-vig.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/07/20751

Try to be a little more creative. 8)

WTF does being creative have do to with anything, when there are
plenty of historical precedents?

Quotes by George W. Bush:

"You don't get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot
easier." (Governing Magazine 7/98)

"I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don't
agree with each other, but that's OK. If this were a dictatorship, it
would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the
dictator." (CNN.com, December 18, 2000)

"A dictatorship would be a heck of a lot easier, there's no question
about it" (Business Week, July 30, 2001)

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
"The real danger is whenever we start talking with our enemies, we may
discover potential areas of compromise or even agreement." - Joe
Conason