Re: Swans

In article <[email hidden]>
[email hidden] <[email hidden]> wrote:
<snip>

Quoted message said:

I'm SURPRISED that they don't move out of my
way, especially since they stay clear of much less dangerous walkers.

Basic psychology: they don't see pedestrians as a threat so don't act
defensively, they do see cyclists as a threat so do act defensively.
Dismount and walk past, then you're a pedestrian, you won't bother them
and they won't bother you.

Rob Morley said:

In article <[email hidden]>
[email hidden] <[email hidden]> wrote:
<snip>

Quoted message said:

I'm SURPRISED that they don't move out of my
way, especially since they stay clear of much less dangerous walkers.

Basic psychology: they don't see pedestrians as a threat so don't act
defensively, they do see cyclists as a threat so do act defensively.
Dismount and walk past, then you're a pedestrian, you won't bother them
and they won't bother you.

Not quite. They do move out of the way of walkers. It's typical that as
you walk up to them they move slowly to the edge as you get nearer.
Then they slip into the water as you get close. Quite slowly but
methodically. But for cyclists they don't seem to move. It seems to me
that they see walkers as a potential threat, hence keeping their
distance, but not so for cyclists. Perhaps this is due to experience.
Maybe pedestrians are more likely to annoy swans while cyclists don't.
It's because they kept a short distance from me when I used to walk
there that I am so surprised at their very different behaviour when I'm
on a bike.

Danny Colyer said:

The OP asked whether anyone else had experienced problems with swans. I
didn't see any objection to the presence of swans, or any suggestion
that steps should be taken to remove them. To infer from the OP's
simple enquiry that he objects to swans is a bit like responding to the
question "can anyone recommend a good pair of sunglasses?" with "if you
don't like the sun then you should ride after dark and stop whinging
about it".

I think the use of the word "problem" in my original post was
ill-advised, and that I should have pointed out that I rang the bell as
an amused sort of joke, rather than in anger.

Quoted message said:

To reply to the OP, I've had difficulty getting past swans on a couple
of occasions, though not on cyclepaths.

The first time was on the riverside cyclepath in Bath, adjacent to Green
Park. I ended up lifting my bike over the park fence, climbing over the
fence myself, walking through the park, then climbing back over the
fence when I was past the swan. I then helped a couple of children over
the fence, as they were rather panicked by the swan and couldn't get
past it.

The second time was on the Bath-Bristol cyclepath, near a river
crossing. The Bath-Bristol path is rather wider than the riverside path
by Green Park, and I was able to get past, otherwise I'd have been late
for work.

The towpath I ride along gets quite narrow. Usually I can squeeze past
other cyclists and pedestrians OK, because of the confidence that
people behave reasonably. I prefer to leave a bigger gap for the swans,
as I'm not so confident that they won't suddenly move, or try to hit
the bike with their wing, potentially damaging the wing. I took a
magpie with a broken wing to a vet here, and nothing could be done for
it. I wouldn't like to be complicit in another bird getting injured.

In article <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Rob Morley said:

In article <[email hidden]>
[email hidden] <[email hidden]> wrote:
<snip>

Quoted message said:

I'm SURPRISED that they don't move out of my
way, especially since they stay clear of much less dangerous walkers.

Basic psychology: they don't see pedestrians as a threat so don't act
defensively, they do see cyclists as a threat so do act defensively.
Dismount and walk past, then you're a pedestrian, you won't bother them
and they won't bother you.

Not quite. They do move out of the way of walkers. It's typical that as
you walk up to them they move slowly to the edge as you get nearer.
Then they slip into the water as you get close. Quite slowly but
methodically.

That's not defensive behaviour, they don't feel threatened, they're just
maintaining their personal space.

Quoted message said:

But for cyclists they don't seem to move. It seems to me
that they see walkers as a potential threat, hence keeping their
distance, but not so for cyclists.

They won't back down when approached by a cyclist - that's defensive
territorial behaviour. And when you ring your bell they become overtly
aggressive, rather than just standing their ground.

Quoted message said:

Perhaps this is due to experience.

Animals are generally said to display "learned behaviour" -
'experience' tends to imply conscious thought.

Quoted message said:

Maybe pedestrians are more likely to annoy swans while cyclists don't.

Maybe swans are used to pedestrians so treat them as a minor
inconvenience, but feel threatened by cyclists.

Quoted message said:

It's because they kept a short distance from me when I used to walk
there that I am so surprised at their very different behaviour when I'm
on a bike.

We look at a person on a bike and we see a person on a bike, they look
at a person on a bike and see something that's not a pedestrian but is
apparently some sort of large animal. Swans aren't particularly bright
- they are renowned for landing on roads and car parks thinking that
they are areas of water, often injuring their feet quite badly as a
result.

Anyway, this is all speculation on my part, it's a long time since I
studied psychology and most of that was human rather than animal.

ian henden wrote on 22/11/2006 19:21 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Don't often see a puishbike with reverse gear.....

Oh I don't know. Fixies are quite common especially in London

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci