"Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
"Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes:
Wrong (and even the most fundamentalist/extreme Muslims aren't doing that either - its for other reasons that a few small groups are killing people).
They are committing acts of terror. Do you even know what it is to kill innocents to further a political agenda? What is motivating them to do it is their religious faith.
"Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Edward Dolan said:
"Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: > > You need to learn something about the real world.
I get all my learning from Fox News these days. It is the only cable news channel that is balanced and fair.
Dolan is an idiot.
Fox News is on 24 hours a day and has some of the best commentators in the business (the very best by the way is Bill O'Reilly, another gentleman of Irish extraction like myself - and the only Bill I have ever heard of who is not an idiot).
"Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Edward Dolan said:
"Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: > >> "Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:[email hidden]... >> > "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: >> > >> > You need to learn something about the real world. >> >> I get all my learning from Fox News these days. It is the only cable >> news >> channel that is balanced and fair. > > Dolan is an idiot.
Fox News is on 24 hours a day and has some of the best commentators in the business (the very best by the way is Bill O'Reilly, another gentleman of Irish extraction like myself - and the only Bill I have ever heard of who is not an idiot).
Dolan, you are an idiot.
Yeah, but we both know that is not true, don't we.
No, Dolan, you are truly an idiot. I'm going to ignore the rest of your rants that my newsreader just found, as you clearly just want attention.
"Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: > > Wrong (and even the most fundamentalist/extreme Muslims aren't > doing that either - its for other reasons that a few small groups > are killing people). They are committing acts of terror. Do you even know what it is to kill innocents to further a political agenda?
George W. Bush, [censored] Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, and Richard Perl sure do. They've killed at least 75,000 innocent Iraqi civilians....
That number has to be about an order of magnitude too low. It should also be mentioned that about 4 million Iraqi refugees have been created by the Cheney/Bush led conquest of Iraq - equivalent to creating more than 35 million refugees in the US.
-- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia "Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter
George W. Bush, [censored] Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, and Richard Perl sure do. They've killed at least 75,000 innocent Iraqi civilians.
That's directly, through war -- how about indirectly, through the consequences of its aftermath...absolutely criminal, what they did...Ron Paul is wrong about global warming, but he is absolutely right -- and the only Presidential candidate, Repug or DemoRat, with THE BALLS to publicly and repeatedly say that Iraq was wrong, and it's understandable why the insurgents kill U.S. soldiers....
Wrong. Dennis Kucinich has been consistently against the conquest of Iraq. Furthermore, he was the only member of Congress with enough courage to actually take the one action that could end the war, by filing for impeachment of Cheney.
Would Ron Paul put party loyalty ahead of conviction? Or maybe his opposition to the Iraq war does not run that deep?
-- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia "Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter
... Like most whackos, Ed prefers to live in a world of his own.
He's probably some old dude in a nursing home. Apparently usenet is mostly full of old folks, middle-age and up!...
Mr. Ed the Grate is 71 years old.
-- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia "Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter
On Dec 3, 9:42 am, Tim McNamara <[email hidden]> wrote: > ... > Like most whackos, Ed prefers to live in a world of his own. He's probably some old dude in a nursing home. Apparently usenet is mostly full of old folks, middle-age and up!...
Mr. Ed the Grate is 71 years old.
And he probably sounds like Mr. Ed the Horse. :-)
The front end or the back end or Mr. Ed? 😉
-- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia "Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter
> "Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: >> >> Wrong (and even the most fundamentalist/extreme Muslims aren't >> doing that either - its for other reasons that a few small groups >> are killing people). > They are committing acts of terror. Do you even know what it is to > kill innocents to further a political agenda?
George W. Bush, [censored] Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, and Richard Perl sure do. They've killed at least 75,000 innocent Iraqi civilians....
That number has to be about an order of magnitude too low. It should also be mentioned that about 4 million Iraqi refugees have been created by the Cheney/Bush led conquest of Iraq - equivalent to creating more than 35 million refugees in the US.
www.iraqbodycount.org discusses their methodology, which is to count deaths they believe can be objectively confirmed. President Bush has, on occasion, cited the numbers on the web site without specifically referencing it.
In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Bill Z.) wrote:
> "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: > >> "Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:[email hidden]... >>> "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: >>> >>> Wrong (and even the most fundamentalist/extreme Muslims aren't >>> doing that either - its for other reasons that a few small groups >>> are killing people). >> They are committing acts of terror. Do you even know what it is to >> kill innocents to further a political agenda? George W. Bush, [censored] Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, and Richard Perl sure do. They've killed at least 75,000 innocent Iraqi civilians....
That number has to be about an order of magnitude too low. It should also be mentioned that about 4 million Iraqi refugees have been created by the Cheney/Bush led conquest of Iraq - equivalent to creating more than 35 million refugees in the US.
www.iraqbodycount.org discusses their methodology, which is to count deaths they believe can be objectively confirmed. President Bush has, on occasion, cited the numbers on the web site without specifically referencing it.
The methodology used in the study published by the Lancet is well accepted, and by that standard, one million excess deaths in Iraq would not be an unreasonable estimate.
-- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia "Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter
[email hidden] (Bill Z.) wrote in news:[email hidden]:
Quoted message said:
Tom Sherman said:
Prisoner at War said:
On Dec 3, 9:42 am, Tim McNamara <[email hidden]> wrote: > ... > Like most whackos, Ed prefers to live in a world of his own. He's probably some old dude in a nursing home. Apparently usenet is mostly full of old folks, middle-age and up!...
[email hidden] (Bill Z.) wrote in news:[email hidden]:
Quoted message said:
Tom Sherman said:
Prisoner at War wrote: > On Dec 3, 9:42 am, Tim McNamara <[email hidden]> wrote: >> ... >> Like most whackos, Ed prefers to live in a world of his own. > He's probably some old dude in a nursing home. Apparently usenet is > mostly full of old folks, middle-age and up!... Mr. Ed the Grate is 71 years old.
-- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia "Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter
George W. Bush, [censored] Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, and Richard Perl sure do.
Quoted message said:
They've killed at least 75,000 innocent Iraqi civilians....
That number has to be about an order of magnitude too low. It should also be mentioned that about 4 million Iraqi refugees have been created by the Cheney/Bush led conquest of Iraq - equivalent to creating more than 35 million refugees in the US.
www.iraqbodycount.org discusses their methodology, which is to count deaths they believe can be objectively confirmed. President Bush has, on occasion, cited the numbers on the web site without specifically referencing it.
That web site claims to measure Iraqi deaths due to violence, not deaths due to inadequate health care, bad water, etc., all due to the loss of infrastructure that occurs during a war.
Tim McNamara wrote: > In article <[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] (Bill Z.) wrote: > >> "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: >> >>> "Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>> news:[email hidden]... >>>> "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: >>>> >>>> Wrong (and even the most fundamentalist/extreme Muslims aren't >>>> doing that either - its for other reasons that a few small >>>> groups are killing people). >>> They are committing acts of terror. Do you even know what it is >>> to kill innocents to further a political agenda? > George W. Bush, [censored] Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, and Richard Perl sure > do. They've killed at least 75,000 innocent Iraqi civilians.... That number has to be about an order of magnitude too low. It should also be mentioned that about 4 million Iraqi refugees have been created by the Cheney/Bush led conquest of Iraq - equivalent to creating more than 35 million refugees in the US.
www.iraqbodycount.org discusses their methodology, which is to count deaths they believe can be objectively confirmed. President Bush has, on occasion, cited the numbers on the web site without specifically referencing it.
The methodology used in the study published by the Lancet is well accepted, and by that standard, one million excess deaths in Iraq would not be an unreasonable estimate.
The difference (in part) is that Lancet measured all deaths that were caused by the war and aftermath, whereas the web site mentioned in the post you replied to measured only the deaths caused directly by violence.
BTW, the number of U.S. deaths is understated too - they consider a soldier to have died in Iraq if he expires in Iraq. Medical care has gotten good enough that they can keep a many fatally injured soldiers alive long enough to expire after being taken outside of Iraq for treatment. If one dies on the plane after it has left Iraqi airspace, that one is not counted as having died in Iraq.
In article <[email hidden]>, Tom Sherman <[email hidden]> wrote:
> Tim McNamara wrote: >> In article <[email hidden]>, >> [email hidden] (Bill Z.) wrote: >> >>> "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: >>> >>>> "Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>>> news:[email hidden]... >>>>> "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> writes: >>>>> >>>>> Wrong (and even the most fundamentalist/extreme Muslims aren't >>>>> doing that either - its for other reasons that a few small >>>>> groups are killing people). >>>> They are committing acts of terror. Do you even know what it is >>>> to kill innocents to further a political agenda? >> George W. Bush, [censored] Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, and Richard Perl sure >> do. They've killed at least 75,000 innocent Iraqi civilians.... > That number has to be about an order of magnitude too low. It > should also be mentioned that about 4 million Iraqi refugees have > been created by the Cheney/Bush led conquest of Iraq - equivalent > to creating more than 35 million refugees in the US. www.iraqbodycount.org discusses their methodology, which is to count deaths they believe can be objectively confirmed. President Bush has, on occasion, cited the numbers on the web site without specifically referencing it.
The methodology used in the study published by the Lancet is well accepted, and by that standard, one million excess deaths in Iraq would not be an unreasonable estimate.
The difference (in part) is that Lancet measured all deaths that were caused by the war and aftermath, whereas the web site mentioned in the post you replied to measured only the deaths caused directly by violence.
BTW, the number of U.S. deaths is understated too - they consider a soldier to have died in Iraq if he expires in Iraq. Medical care has gotten good enough that they can keep a many fatally injured soldiers alive long enough to expire after being taken outside of Iraq for treatment. If one dies on the plane after it has left Iraqi airspace, that one is not counted as having died in Iraq.
Not to mention the deaths of mercenaries. When the mercenaries are counted, the size of the Iraq occupation force increases to approximately three hundred thousand.
-- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia "Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter
George W. Bush, [censored] Cheney, Don Rumsfeld, and Richard Perl sure do. > They've killed at least 75,000 innocent Iraqi civilians.... That number has to be about an order of magnitude too low. It should also be mentioned that about 4 million Iraqi refugees have been created by the Cheney/Bush led conquest of Iraq - equivalent to creating more than 35 million refugees in the US.
www.iraqbodycount.org discusses their methodology, which is to count deaths they believe can be objectively confirmed. President Bush has, on occasion, cited the numbers on the web site without specifically referencing it.
That web site claims to measure Iraqi deaths due to violence, not deaths due to inadequate health care, bad water, etc., all due to the loss of infrastructure that occurs during a war.
To be fair, Clinton killed hundred of thousands of innocent Iraqis this way, since he insisted on maintaining sanctions that did not allow Iraq to rebuild critical infrastructure, such as water and wastewater treatment facilities. Of course, these facilities were deliberately (the Pentagon admits to it) and illegally targeted by the US under Bush I.
-- Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia "Localized intense suction such as tornadoes is created when temperature differences are high enough between meeting air masses, and can impart excessive energy onto a cyclist." - Randy Schlitter
"Bill Z." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Sherman <[email hidden]> writes:
BTW, the number of U.S. deaths is understated too - they consider a soldier to have died in Iraq if he expires in Iraq. Medical care has gotten good enough that they can keep a many fatally injured soldiers alive long enough to expire after being taken outside of Iraq for treatment. If one dies on the plane after it has left Iraqi airspace, that one is not counted as having died in Iraq.
American casualties in Iraq have been minimal. Compared to most preceding wars that the US has ever engaged in the casualties are hardly worth mentioning. Both WWI and WWII had single battles which resulted in many times more casualties.
The issue is not the absolute numbers but that the government is misleading the American public about what is actually going on.
