Re: Olympic Marathon

SwStudio said:

I would imagine the Olympic budget would allow the monitoring
of known event agitators like this and not allowing them access to
the event, if not the entire country, during the Olympics.

It would require them to dispose of the necessary information. This in
turn would require linking the different country's computer systems for
very clearly-defined record types. It would also require those systems
to actually record something useful and in a coherent and exhaustive
manner.

Also, you are forgetting that Europe is now pretty much like the USA.
Could you seriously tell me you can stop someone leaving any of the
mainland states of the USA and making his way into Montana (for example)
if he really wants to? Even if he looks like Frank Zappa?

SwStudio said:

I would imagine the Olympic budget would allow the monitoring
of known event agitators like this and not allowing them access to
the event, if not the entire country, during the Olympics.

It would require them to dispose of the necessary information. This in
turn would require linking the different country's computer systems for
very clearly-defined record types. It would also require those systems
to actually record something useful and in a coherent and exhaustive
manner.

Also, you are forgetting that Europe is now pretty much like the USA.
Could you seriously tell me you can stop someone leaving any of the
mainland states of the USA and making his way into Montana (for example)
if he really wants to? Even if he looks like Frank Zappa?

Mel Rimmer said:

In the UK we have some problems with football hooligans (an
unrepresentative minority)

An unrepresentative minority, true, but who've been [censored] up the sport
since the 70s (proof that the [censored] breed) which is why, as a kid, I
never dared go to see a professional football match despite being mad on
football and a keen supporter (of Leeds United, which may explain things
:-)

Quoted message said:

When there are major international football
tournaments, convicted hooligans are required to hand in their passports
at a local police station to prevent them from travelling to the
tournament and causing trouble.

OK. And why is such particular attention being (at last) paid to
football hooligans? Isn't it because of the national and international
backlash from repeated violence by British thugs, impacting thousands of
people and property at home and abroad, during neigh-on 30 years?

Yes it was actually _worth_ doing something about it in this case. Is
our lone lunatic comparable? So, because he's done it again and in such
a visible manner, our mad Paddy perhaps now merits being put on a
special list.

I still maintain that you can't hope to prevent all risks of this type,
short of tatooing bar codes on everyone at birth or, better still,
hanging first offenders (this is meant to be humourous, for those
lacking the appropriate glands).

Quoted message said:

you may as well "[censored] in a violin",

I did that once. That guy who owned it was really, really mad when he found out
too!

Quoted message said:

http://www.bootsnall.com/images/eu/aug04gre1.jpg

YIKES! That's gotta be VERY effective battle gear, because I know if I ever saw
that coming at me in a battle, I'd run like hell.

What is interesting is the fellow who got into the diving arena got several
months yet no one was harmed in any way by his exhibitionism.

"steve common" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (Anders Lustig) wrote:

I was angry too.

Quoted message said:

The appearance of his name
in a passenger list should´ve made the computer
displays of Hellenic Customs beep like mad.

True. Or maybe there was someone really dangerous in the airport at the
same time? Or is it because Ireland and Greece are both part of the EU:
Are customs still an issue for EU nationals travelling between EU
countries?

Or it's perhaps just a consequence of the incomplete cooperation between
EU police forces' information systems on such "lesser" matters and that
there exists no link between national police computer systems?

Let's just hope that the said systems aren't stupidly-programmed and
aren't full of "subjective" information, rumours and the like, when they
finally *do* start sharing all, cf the American who was wrongly linked
to the Madrid bombings by over-zealous (euphemism) CIA/FBI data-mining
techniques.

It all boils down to the same old argument: do you deprive everyone of
some liberties in order to foil an extra few individuals who _may_ abuse
those liberties?

Quoted message said:

Besides, unless he somehow managed to disguise himself
as a normal-looking spectator and/or appear only at the
last moment before his attack, the failure to spot such
a conspicious individual and to act correctly upon an
observation of what obviously should be regarded as a
potential threat is quite inexplicable and unpardonable.

I would have agreed, had I never seen skinheads in the 60s, punks in the
70s etc or those greek palace guards and their (Monty Python) silly walk
http://www.bootsnall.com/images/eu/aug04gre1.jpg

Also remember that greek (and other) national costumes were being worn
all over the town, because people where partying. What was so weird
about a kilt? What criteria could be used to judge "normality",
especially in such a festive context?

Quoted message said:

Anders (who thinks osteopathy is quack, but it works)

I'll let you know, around Sunday lunchtime, if it worked (again) for me
too :-)

Quoted message said:

What is interesting is the fellow who got into the diving arena got several
months yet no one was harmed in any way by his exhibitionism.

"Weenie waggers" usually get jail time if there was a large audience.

steve common <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

True. Or maybe there was someone really dangerous in the airport at the
same time? Or is it because Ireland and Greece are both part of the EU:
Are customs still an issue for EU nationals travelling between EU
countries?

The Schengen agreement allows EU nationals to pass the
customs without passport control, but it doesn´t deprive
EU countries of the right do deny entry to a certain
EU national.

(With automated systems the task of "screening everyone
at the border" takes a lesser amount of time than what
lies between a thought (such as "I think I´d like to
scratch my balls"😉 and an action (such as inserting one
hand inside one´s pants)).

Quoted message said:

Or it's perhaps just a consequence of the incomplete cooperation between
EU police forces' information systems on such "lesser" matters and that
there exists no link between national police computer systems?

This was quite possibly the case. The British didn´t
share the information (of convicted, certified sports
event inturders) with the Greek, and the Greek didn´t
get around to asking for the information (or limited
their request to the list of rightly or wrongly
suspected real terrorists).

The latter would IMHO still be a serious oversight, and
not only in hindsight. Something that could have been
avoided *should* have been avoided - even if we can
imagine that something less avoidable and possibly
quite unavoidable could have happened.

IMHO the "Silverstone protesters" and "Jimmy Jumps" (of
recent EC "fame"😉 should´ve been a recognized security
concern.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Besides, unless he somehow managed to disguise himself
as a normal-looking spectator and/or appear only at the
last moment before his attack, the failure to spot such
a conspicious individual and to act correctly upon an
observation of what obviously should be regarded as a
potential threat is quite inexplicable and unpardonable.

Quoted message said:

I would have agreed, had I never seen skinheads in the 60s, punks in the
70s etc or those greek palace guards and their (Monty Python) silly walk
http://www.bootsnall.com/images/eu/aug04gre1.jpg

His kilt was IMHO the least conspicous part. No doubt there
were plenty of colourfully, traditionally and even kookily
dressed spectators, along the marathon route, but I´d imagine
that the vast majority of them were there in the company of
their compatriots and behaving in normal innocent manner -
whereas a lone individual who bore nutcake-religious messages,
was too warmly-dressed, actednervous or agitated and/or appeared
drunk should´ve stuck out to the eye of an alert observer.
(I don´t think we should attribute the intruder too much
psychopathic ability to appear more normal than he is.)

(FWIW during the EC marathon in 1995 in Helsinki the police
shared the task of guarding the marathon route with a large
number of volunteers who could line up along the route in
a manner no paid force could. The "threat" then was limited
to unruly pedestrians or drunk loiterers, not so much
pranksters, protesters or terrorists.)

Anders

"Doug Freese" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Nicely said! Maybe his next attempt will another formula one race but
at night - splat! 😉

You must be forgiven - like the Greek:-( - for not
being familiar with F1 racing, but I must point
out that - unlike for instance sportscars in Le Mans -
F1 cars don´t race in darkness.

BTW curiously enough I felt no animosity against the
intruder: he was so obviously the victim of his
mental unbalance and committing an act of compulsive
behaviour on which he had very little control.

Anders

(Anders Lustig) said:

(With automated systems the task of "screening everyone
at the border" takes a lesser amount of time than what
lies between a thought (such as "I think I´d like to
scratch my balls"😉 and an action (such as inserting one
hand inside one´s pants)).

Now there's an example I can get a handle on. So to speak :-)

Anders Lustig said:

BTW curiously enough I felt no animosity against the
intruder: he was so obviously the victim of his
mental unbalance and committing an act of compulsive
behaviour on which he had very little control.

His showing up in Athens dressed in a kilt was compulsive? Coincident
with the finish of the marathon? How long does a compulsion last? This
must have taken some time to sort out.

Maybe I better look up the definitions of compulsive and impulsive.

SwStudio wrote in message ...

Quoted message said:

"steve common" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

SwStudio said:

I was astonished he was even there, given the history on
this guy in terms of disrupting events.

I would agree on the sentiment but not the practicality. How would you
go about screening every single individual along the roadside?

I would imagine the Olympic budget would allow the monitoring
of known event agitators like this and not allowing them access to
the event, if not the entire country, during the Olympics.

Even better, make an example out of those who are known troublemakers. 6
months jail time, and 100k euro fine. Or for a kilt-wearing freak like
that - perhaps castration? Then he can focus all his time on god 😉

Quoted message said:

cheers,
--
David (in Hamilton, ON)
www.allfalldown.org
www.absolutelyaccurate.com