Re: Grand Canyon MUni

Sedona and Flagstaff have a bunch of good trails. Check out some of the
descriptions here:

http://tinyurl.com/asukf

--
phlegm
------------------------------------------------------------------------
phlegm's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/8382
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

The trails down into Grand Canyon would make awesome unicycle descents.
But they are highly illegal and I do not recommend you attempt it. They
are very prone to erosion, and get high traffic from hikers (and/or
mules) all year round. There are lots of ways to fall to your death in
and around the Grand Canyon! Jacquie bought a book when we were there
last, called Death In The Canyon. It chronicles every recorded death
there from the earliest (European) explorers to the tourists, rafters
and hikers of today.

If you hike it use EXTREME CAUTION. The Grand Canyon is like climbing a
mountain in reverse. Tempeeratures are 20 degrees higher below the rim,
and of course the return hike is the hard part. Hiking to the bottom is
a piece of cake, but will beat up your quads pretty good. The hike back
out may kill you. The most common deaths in the canyon are from hikers
to don't bring enough water, eventually hallucenate, get lost and make
other mistakes.

My pictures:
http://unicycling.smugmug.com/gallery/146871/1/5402276

--
johnfoss

John Foss
"jfoss" at "unicycling.com" -- www.unicycling.com
-----------------------------------------------

"Idiot America—where fact is merely that which enough people believe,
and truth is measured only by how fervently they believe it." --
Charles Pierce, in Esquire Magazine
------------------------------------------------------------------------
johnfoss's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/832
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

Wow, it's funny to see this thread that I posted such a long time ago. I
didn't end up bringing my uni on that trip, but I did do a little
mountain biking on a rented bike on some very good trails in Sedona.
Like John said, I wouldn't recommend trying to ride in to the Grand
Canyon, at least on the touristy south rim. They seemed pretty serious
about not letting any wheeled vehicles around there.

But certainly look in to other trails in the area, I'm sure there are
some good ones.

Ben

--
Ben Plotkin-Swing

www.benps.com

Is there such thing as free wheel?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Plotkin-Swing's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/378
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

That is funny to see a thread from so long ago resurrected. As you found
out, Sedona has great trails. We spent 4 days there doing Muni back in
Nov, 2003. Here are the photos:
http://nhoover.smugmug.com/gallery/1079421

---Nathan

--
nathan
------------------------------------------------------------------------
nathan's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/251
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

johnfoss said:

The trails down into Grand Canyon would make awesome unicycle descents.
But they are highly illegal and I do not recommend you attempt it. They
are very prone to erosion, and get high traffic from hikers (and/or
mules) all year round.

If you hike it use EXTREME CAUTION. The Grand Canyon is like climbing a
mountain in reverse.

John, thanks for the info. Questions; Did you hike down into the grand
canyon or has anyone else? What is highly illegal??? Don't ya think
mules would erode the trail more than unicycles? We are going in a week
in a half so there shouldn't be a ton of toursists so do you think we
could get away with it??

The reason I posted on this old thread is because I used the search
function first to see if there was anything related to the grand canyon
and found this thread. So instead of creating a new one (like a lot of
people do) I just added to this one!

--
unicycle6869

Jamey (formerly known as tuna6869)

Which is worse, a president who screws an intern, or a president who
screws the country?

*20 Years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the things you did-EXPLORE-DREAM-LIVE!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
unicycle6869's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/8990
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

unicycle6869 said:

Did you hike down into the grand canyon or has anyone else? What is
highly illegal??? Don't ya think mules would erode the trail more than
unicycles? We are going in a week in a half so there shouldn't be a ton
of toursists so do you think we could get away with it??

We did a day tour that took us about 1/4 mile down the trail the mules
use. Just a taste. Our guide mentioned that 90% of canyon visitors
never set foot below the rim, so I thought that was pretty cool. Later
on we walked a little bit down one of the steeper trails. Hiking the
whole thing is generally an all-day affair, and I don't recommend it
unless you've hiked up several thousand feet before. Even halfway (to
the mule lunch stop) would be quite the strenuous return.

Yes, not only would mules create more erosion than non-braked
unicycles, they [censored] as they go. I always like to remind people of this
when campaigning for cyclists rights on horsie trails. Hardly anyone I
know does that. 🙂

But erosion isn't the issue. The issue is safety, liability and
legality in America's national parks. If you did try to ride the trails
in the canyon, DO expect to be caught, detained and prosecuted to the
maximum extent of the law. This is one of those situations where "when
in doubt, be a bicycle."

I will back you up if you want to start a campaign to legalize such
trails for cycling (or just unicycling), but please wait until it's
legal. Don't make us look bad!

I think it would be perfectly legal to ride up in the rim areas, but in
general the rule is that cycling is only allowed on pavement. The same
is true in Yellowstone, with a few exceptions. One of which I rode on
so I can say I rode in Yellowstone. While on this deserted (closed
gate) dirt road, I startled a huge elk, and exchanged stares with a
coyote. Pretty cool.

Quoted message said:

The reason I posted on this old thread is because I used the search
function first to see if there was anything related to the grand canyon
and found this thread.

Kudos to you for setting a good example! When I started reading this I
wondered why Ben was unsure about bringing his unicycle on a plane.
Then when he mentioned 16 it still took me a moment to figure out to
check the date! 😕

--
johnfoss

John Foss
"jfoss" at "unicycling.com" -- www.unicycling.com
-----------------------------------------------

"Idiot America—where fact is merely that which enough people believe,
and truth is measured only by how fervently they believe it." --
Charles Pierce, in Esquire Magazine
------------------------------------------------------------------------
johnfoss's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/832
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

I did a double-take on Ben's age too! :p

What sends you to PA, Ben?

--
U-Turn

Weep in the dojo... laugh on the battlefield.
'LiveWire Unicycles' (http://www.livewireunicycles.com)
'Strongest Coker Wheel in the World'
(http://www.unicyclist.com/gallery/albup39)
'29er Tire Study' (http://u-turn.unicyclist.com/29erTireStudy/)
'New York Unicycle Club' (http://www.newyorkunicycle.com)
-- Dave Stockton
------------------------------------------------------------------------
U-Turn's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/691
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

The Grand Canyon is made for hiking, enjoy it that way. Besides, the
uphill would kill ya. If you are looking for MUni in the area, PM me
and I will get in touch with the hardcore Flagstaff MUni gang.

--
aspenmike
------------------------------------------------------------------------
aspenmike's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/3768
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

Don't bring your unicycle to ride down the grand canyon, not only is it
against their "don't erode what's left of the trails" policy, but it
would be extremely hard. They have logs in the path every ten feet or
so to stop erosion and each one is followed by a foot drop from all of
the people that have walked on it before you. Just hike it, don't try
to ride it.

If you are going all the way to the bottom though, I suggest you take
the bright angel trail, at least on the way back up. It's awesome.

--
Spudman

*| B B|* This space owned by Fly '😎'
(http://www.unicyclist.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27264)
*| I O |* This space owned by Frees*TYLER!*
*| L A |* *MERCYME owns this space!!!* . . . . . . . . .*X*
<--Chosen's spot
*| L R |* This space owned by unijesse
*|__'-' (www.selectric.org)____'D'
(http://www.cathodecorner.com/nixiewatch/index.html)___|* This space
rendered by forrest. . . . . A spot for Evan Byrne--> *X*
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Spudman's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/10752
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

I think we will probably just walk down it. we will probably only be in
the area for a day... thanks for the responses....
lindsey

--
uniprincess
------------------------------------------------------------------------
uniprincess's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/12
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

I felt the need to chime in here. My Grand Canyon resume includes over
100 nights spent below the rim and over 700 miles walked on every named
trail, both north and south rims. As was said earlier, the park
rangers will ticket you and prosecute you to the fullest extent of the
law. I've heard that the law specifically states "wheeled vehicles" and
they are indeed serious about it. Plenty of places on any of the
trails are precarious and a minor slip-up could easily result in a 500
ft. sheer drop. There are places I worry about this when I'm walking
and topheavy with the weight of a backpack. Erosion is also an issue.
I mountain bike and muni (a little, easy stuff) so I am sympathetic, to
a point, but I also hike a lot. I have to admit to getting irritated
when one of my favorite hiking trails get discovered by mountain
bikers. There is definite and noticable erosion from the foot traffic
but once the mountain bikes start running back and forth a deep rut
quickly develops in the trail.

As for muni opportunities, on the south rim, anything with a wheel on
it is restricted to pavement🙁 . On the north rim, there is a long rim
trail that is open to cycling and is supposed to have spectacular
vistas. Keep in mind though that it's a 5 hour drive around the canyon
from the south rim to the north.

As for trail riding in northern AZ there's plenty of great stuff around
here. If Moab is considered the mountain bike capital of the world
Flagstaff/Sedona has got to be a close second. There's a huge mtn.
bike community here and a reasonably good sized muni group as well.
Aspenmike referred to the hardcore muni gang here. I'm not good enough
to consider myself a part of that group but they do exist. It's become
fairly commonplace to see somebody muniing on the local trails here.

If in Flagstaff, stop in at AZBikes right downtown. They seem to be
the most keyed in on the Muni group.

--
underdog

'I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody
tell you different' - Kurt Vonnegut
------------------------------------------------------------------------
underdog's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/6197
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

underdog said:

Plenty of places on any of the trails are precarious and a minor
slip-up could easily result in a 500 ft. sheer drop.

Anybody wanna try to land that one and ride out of it?

--
underdog

'I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody
tell you different' - Kurt Vonnegut
------------------------------------------------------------------------
underdog's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/6197
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

Thanks for all the helpful info guys, especially you Underdog. Sounds
like you are the most experienced and I think we'll take your advice
and not Muni in the grand canyon but might consider bringing them
anyways for riding around Flagstaff/Sedona.

Now a question or two about not Muni'ing, but the Grand Canyon. Should
we just go there and see it and not venture down into the canyon, or is
it worth it to hike down some of it and back up it in a day (I know you
can't go all the way to the river and back up in one day), but is it
worth it to go halfway down or 3/4 of the way down? I think we'll only
have one day to spend at the canyon, so what would people suggest we
do? Thanks in advance for any advice!

--
unicycle6869

Jamey (formerly known as tuna6869)

Which is worse, a president who screws an intern, or a president who
screws the country?

*20 Years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the things you did-EXPLORE-DREAM-LIVE!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
unicycle6869's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/8990
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

Spudman said:

They have logs in the path every ten feet or so to stop erosion and each
one is followed by a foot drop from all of the people that have walked
on it before you.

That sounds totally awesome.

But I agree, the traffic and exposure are just too high on the touristy
trails near the Canyon.

--
tholub
------------------------------------------------------------------------
tholub's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/804
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

To answer unicycle6869; you get a very different perspective of the
canyon by hiking down into it. I highly recommend it. An earlier post
in this thread mentioned that over 90% of visitors never go below the
rim so going in sets you apart from the crowd. Since you only have one
day, I'd recommend the Bright Angel Trail. The trail head is right by
all the lodges in the South Rim Village (this is where you'll be
anyway). The easiest thing to do is go down the the 1 1/2 mile
resthouse on the trail. This will give you a taste of what it's like
to hike in the canyon. If you're still feeling energetic, the next
obvious turn around point is the 3 mile resthouse. Those in really
good shape can go to the Indian Garden Campground at 4 1/2 miles. This
is half way to the bottom. You'll be looking at spending about 6 hours
of your day to go to Indian Gardens and back, if you're a pretty strong
hiker. Don't forget that if you're really tired when you get to
wherever you're going to turn around that you're going to be hating
life very quickly. It's after you turn around that you've got to start
climbing. Carry plenty o water. And take some snacks to keep your
energy up.

I agree with your earlier statement that the mules probably cause as
much or more damage than a Muni would but to change it you'd be
battling 150 years of the history and traditions of the old west. Not
likely. And, I think it would involve changing policy at the national
level since I think most national parks have the same kinds of rules.
Dang!

--
underdog

'I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody
tell you different' - Kurt Vonnegut
------------------------------------------------------------------------
underdog's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/6197
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

Great, thanks underdog!!

Last question; if I could talk my girlfriend into 2 days, would it be
worth hiking down to the river, camping and then hiking back up the
next day? And if so what would be the best route/campsite?

--
unicycle6869

Jamey (formerly known as tuna6869)

Which is worse, a president who screws an intern, or a president who
screws the country?

*20 Years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the things you did-EXPLORE-DREAM-LIVE!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
unicycle6869's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/8990
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

Jamey, we can't stay two days, because we might be going there with my
dad and rose.... also, there is a ton of stuff we are going to be
doing with them for the rest of the week, so we need all the days we
can get, and right now, we only have 6 days with them.

--
uniprincess
------------------------------------------------------------------------
uniprincess's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/12
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

Honey,
We can talk (aka argue) about this later, not on this forum, OK! I
might be willing to not go to Vegas and instead spend an extra day at
the canyon if I get positive feedback from people saying it's worth it
to hike in, camp and hike out.

--
unicycle6869

Jamey (formerly known as tuna6869)

Which is worse, a president who screws an intern, or a president who
screws the country?

*20 Years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the things you did-EXPLORE-DREAM-LIVE!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
unicycle6869's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/8990
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289

underdog said:

Anybody wanna try to land that one and ride out of it?

That depends... what is the roll-out like?

--
maestro8

Those are my principles. If you don't like those, I have others. --
Groucho Marx
------------------------------------------------------------------------
maestro8's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/7871
View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/17289