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Re: fury roadmaster test report

Started by carlfogel · · Last activity · 11 posts · 497 views

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Published
28 May 2004
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3 June 2004
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carlfogel
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  1. Carl Fogel said:

    After the first five rides, it seems as if the Fury Roadmaster ($53.71
    at LawTram, plus tax) deserves its own thread. (If nothing else, this
    will keep this bicycle-shaped object from soiling other threads in
    rec.bicycles.tech.)
    Previous and overly detailed posts regarding this triumph of the bicycle-
    industry's art may be seen at:
    http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-
    http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-
    8&selm=c255ll%241k10%241%40f04n12.cac.psu.edu
    or
    http://tinyurl.com/3cucphttp://tinyurl.com/3cucp
    (which is where Dave Van Tol started it all)
    and at:
    s.google.com/groups?q=g:thl2912196017d&dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-
    8&selm=ZXv1c.8302%24Xb5.2972%40fe01.usenetserver.com
    http://tinyurl.com/yqv8ghttp://tinyurl.com/yqv8g
    (which is where Tom Sherman should have let sleeping dogs
    lie). Both posts are part of long and foolish exchanges.)
    As gloomily predicted, my expensive new bicycle suffered a potentially
    serious mechanical problem that can only be blamed upon inadequate setup
    by the overpaid slackers who took my money!
    Pedalling furiously around my four-mile route through the city park like
    Benny Hill, I noticed that my left thumb shifter did not seem as fixed
    and reliable as Julius Caesar, who likened himself to the North Star.
    Several times, either vibration or my clumsy paw moved the lever
    from "H" toward "L," whereupon the front derailleur began to make a
    faint noise, as if thinking about putting its hand on the chain's
    knee--curses!
    I considered posting a plea for advice, but feared that Sheldon Brown,
    famed for his short tempered unwillingness to suffer fools gladly, might
    lecture me severely.
    (Besides, Sheldon is a fixed-gear fanatic and may know nothing about
    sophisticated thumb-shifters. Why do so many dealers become fixed-gear
    freaks? Is it a reaction to the endless shifting problems that they see,
    somewhat like bouncers in a topless bar losing interest in--well you get
    the idea.)
    Luckily, I have a pre-publication copy of Jobst Brandt's "The Left-Hand
    Thumb Shifter" (Huffy Press, 12th edition, 2005, $49.95). It counseled
    pre-tensioning the triple-ring shifter by rotating its honkin' big cross-
    head screw clockwise "until the handlebar begins to yield locally."
    The shifter now seems much improved, but woe to those who forgo the
    services of the local bike shop!
    Carl Fogel

    A dead calm this evening promised a fast ride from the Fury RoadMaster.
    With no traffic, I began my second lap around the City Park and there
    ahead of me was an unsuspecting rider wearing a luminous green shirt and
    cruising along on a touring bike.

    Roger Bannister had someone to pace him when he broke the four-minute
    barrier, so here was my opportunity!

    Straining after him like a basset hound pursuing a trotting greyhound, I
    drew closer and began to wonder what to do next. I hear that tactics are
    terribly important in racing.

    There's a current thread debating the etiquette of uninvited wheel-
    suckers. Normally my position is that they're jerks. But what, I
    wondered, if drafting this fellow would improve my time? My goal is to
    break twelve minutes, and I'd hate to miss it out of mere courtesy and
    common sense.

    Screw it, I decided, and chose the other side of the road, slowly
    drawing ahead of the fellow in the green shirt as we pedalled past the
    zoo. He looked a bit surprised--most people do, for some odd reason--but
    he obviously had no idea that he'd been in a race.

    So this is what Lance feels like! Inspired, I pedalled like a demon for
    the next mile and ended up wheezing like a bellows with a new Fury
    RoadMaster record,
    11:52 for 4.06 miles.

    Now that I've got my breath back, I'm wondering about the merits of
    pacelines, drafting, and wheel-sucking for typical
    rec.bicycles.tech posters.

    Do pacelines at this level produce faster times or merely less
    tired riders?

    As I understand it, a paceline offers little advantage climbing because
    the riders aren't going fast enough to benefit from drafting.

    Nor should a paceline improve speeds on a descent steep enough that
    riders are coasting. Everyone behind the lead rider has to brake, yet
    they can go no faster than he's going if they pull out into the wind
    and pass him.

    On the flats, the paceline goes no faster than whoever is pedalling in
    front. The idea may be that the leader can strain and go faster than
    normal for a few minutes, with everyone following keeping up with him at
    a lazier pace, but I'm curious how this works out in real life.

    What strikes me as a potential drawback is that the leader has no
    competition to spur him on. No matter what he does, the paceline behind
    him should be able to keep up in his draft, putting out far less
    effort. It seems more like a strategy for conserving energy than for
    inspiring effort.

    (I have in mind the 2001 Tour de France, when most of the field on the
    8th day slowed down so much in a cold rain that some disgruntled no-
    nameriders broke away and finished half an hour and ten miles ahead of
    Lance and the rest, who were busy watching each other and maintaining
    their pacelines.)

    So here's one way to frame the question. Given four average riders from
    rec.bicycles.tech, as opposed to death-or-glory pros, what results would
    you predict and why for a flat century ride with the four riders going
    individually with no drafting, the same four riders going in a paceline,
    and the same four riders on one of those long-vanished four-man tandems?

    Apart from the physics, what kind of psychological benefits and
    drawbacks would you expect? Who's faster, who's more tired?

    Carl Fogel

    --

  2. carlfogel said:

    As I understand it, a paceline offers little advantage climbing because
    the riders aren't going fast enough to benefit from drafting.

    Once, on TOSRV East (Tour Of Scenic Rural Vermont) I broke up one of my
    clubmates on the climb of Terrible Mountain.

    He as slogging up this climb in his granny gear at 3 mph.

    I crept past him in my granny gear at 3 1/2 mph, and as I drew next to
    him I said "[gasp]...[pant]...Wanna draft?...[wheeze]"

    Sheldon "Always Glad To Help" Brown
    +-------------------------------------------------------+
    | Military conscription is the worst form of slavery. |
    | A more enlightened age will consider it a War crime. |
    +-------------------------------------------------------+
    Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts
    Phone 617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041
    http://harriscyclery.com
    Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
    http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com

  3. carlfogel said:

    RoadMaster record,
    11:52 for 4.06 miles.

    Wow.

    Quoted message said:

    Do pacelines at this level produce faster times or merely less
    tired riders?

    Faster times and less tired riders. I've recently started riding
    with a group one day per week, and we do some faux-pacelining. It's
    amazing how much difference it makes.

    Consider that less tired riders can, in fact, ride faster when they
    pull.

    Quoted message said:

    As I understand it, a paceline offers little advantage climbing because
    the riders aren't going fast enough to benefit from drafting.

    Again, I'm surprised at how well it works even at lower speeds.

    Quoted message said:

    Nor should a paceline improve speeds on a descent steep enough that
    riders are coasting. Everyone behind the lead rider has to brake, yet
    they can go no faster than he's going if they pull out into the wind
    and pass him.

    Well, the limiting factor being aerodynamic drag on the leader, a
    minor increase will be realized. The leader benefits a little bit
    from the rider behind him filling the vacuum.

    Quoted message said:

    On the flats, the paceline goes no faster than whoever is pedalling in
    front. The idea may be that the leader can strain and go faster than
    normal for a few minutes, with everyone following keeping up with him at
    a lazier pace, but I'm curious how this works out in real life.

    A proper paceline doesn't have a leader in front for a few minutes.
    It is, instead, constantly rotating. When the previous leader clears
    the rear wheel of the current leader, the current leader breaks off
    and the next leader pulls.

    I've never been in a proper paceline.

    In our faux-pacelines, with leaders pulling for minutes at a time,
    we've realized new records (at least, some of us). The leader begins
    his pull well-rested, allowing him to go faster without having to
    "strain".

    Quoted message said:

    What strikes me as a potential drawback is that the leader has no
    competition to spur him on. No matter what he does, the paceline behind
    him should be able to keep up in his draft, putting out far less
    effort. It seems more like a strategy for conserving energy than for
    inspiring effort.

    It is most certainly exactly that, but the result isn't lowered
    output; rather, better output for less effort. Further, the leader
    should not have "competition to spur him on"; he should attempt to
    provide the same effort as the previous leader. On level land with
    even wind, that means he should provide the same speed. If he feels
    like it's making him tired more quickly, his turn at the front
    should be shorter.

    Quoted message said:

    So here's one way to frame the question. Given four average riders from
    rec.bicycles.tech, as opposed to death-or-glory pros, what results would
    you predict and why for a flat century ride with the four riders going
    individually with no drafting, the same four riders going in a paceline,
    and the same four riders on one of those long-vanished four-man tandems?

    Solo: I'd be lucky to complete the century.
    Paceline: I'd be happy at the end, with a reasonable average speed.
    Tandem: I hope David Reuteler the bean-eating vegetarian rider isn't
    in front of me.

    I imagine the tandem could be faster than the paceline. The riders
    are closer, and the aerodynamic drag of the tandem bicycle itself is
    probably better than the sum of the individual bikes.

    Quoted message said:

    Apart from the physics, what kind of psychological benefits and
    drawbacks would you expect? Who's faster, who's more tired?

    The soloists are slower and more tired. I don't know about the other
    two groups.

    The psychological bit is a good point. Having somebody to follow can
    make you forget to worry about the hill, the wind, or how you feel.
    --
    Rick Onanian

  4. Quoted message said:

    So this is what Lance feels like! Inspired, I pedalled like a demon
    for
    the next mile and ended up wheezing like a bellows with a new Fury
    RoadMaster record,
    11:52 for 4.06 miles.

    Wow! I'm impressed!

    I rode my 40-lb Walmart MTB when I was 15 or so during Hurricane Mitch (for
    wind benefit) or something... I managed to do 11:45 for 3.75 miles. But
    with your 24-in wheels and overly-low gearing, it must have been interesting
    😉

    --
    Phil, Squid-in-Training

  5. ZeeExSixAre said:
    Quoted message said:

    So this is what Lance feels like! Inspired, I pedalled like a demon
    for
    the next mile and ended up wheezing like a bellows with a new Fury
    RoadMaster record,
    11:52 for 4.06 miles.

    Wow! I'm impressed!

    I rode my 40-lb Walmart MTB when I was 15 or so during Hurricane Mitch (for
    wind benefit) or something... I managed to do 11:45 for 3.75 miles. But
    with your 24-in wheels and overly-low gearing, it must have been interesting
    😉

    Dear Corinthians,

    When I became a man, I gave up my childish ways.

    This is the Men's Fury RoadMaster, with full-sized 26-inch
    mountain-bike wheels of indescribable rapidity:

    <http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?cat=61903&dept=4171&product_id=2073252&path=0%3A4171%3A61903%3A61904%3A4180%3A4183%3A5304#long_descr>

    or

    http://tinyurl.com/2zy5p

    You must be looking at the Boy's model, which has bashful
    24-inch wheels:

    http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=2073249&cat=61903&type=5&dept=4171&path=0%3A4171%3A61903%3A61904%3A4180%3A4183%3A5304&xsell=2073252

    or

    http://tinyurl.com/yqm3a

    St. Paul

  6. What's the gearing on it? It should be around 22-44t x 14-28t, no?

    --
    Phil, Squid-in-Training

  7. ZeeExSixAre said:

    What's the gearing on it? It should be around 22-44t x 14-28t, no?

    Dear Phil,

    Pardon my oily typing--I just counted the filthy teeth on
    all those sprockets.

    The Fury RoadMaster's mighty front triple-chain-ring
    rejoices in 48-38-28 teeth, while its indomitable five hind
    gears run the gamut from 14 teeth to 17, 20, 24, and 28.

    A spoke ruler slapped across its pedals while it lay
    helpless on its back, naked tires waving in the air, showed
    roughly 165 mm cranks, which surprised me--I'd have thought
    that they were shorter.

    Plugging the numbers into my spreadsheet, I found that at 20
    to 24 mph, the Fury RoadMaster with 14x28 gearing, a 165 mm
    crank, and 2073 mm tires demands 75 to 91 rpm from its
    passenger, rather higher than my normal glacial cadence of
    only 50 to 60 rpm on a touring bike with 53 x11 gearing, a
    175 mm crank, and 2124 mm tires.

    The overall ratio between the circle described by the Fury
    RoadMaster's rear tire and its pedals is only 6.8 to 1,
    while my touring bike has a ratio of 9.3 to 1.

    So the Fury's highest gear, coupled with its smaller tire
    and crank, rolls it only about as far as a touring bike's 53
    x 15 gear.

    I'd like higher gears, but the 10 to 17-year-old target
    market is probably perfectly happy spinning around the
    neighborhood, whooping like banshees.

    Sunday, a visiting friend emboldened me to take the Fury for
    its maiden voyage around my normal 15.25-mile route. We
    weren't pushing things, but the Fury completed the loop in a
    respectable 58:51 on a breezy morning, about twelve minutes
    slower than the average for the touring bike.

    It seemed reluctant to climb the ridge west of town, which
    is about 400 feet high, but then it's a full-figured bicycle
    compared to my touring bike. Heading back down, it achieved
    a maximum of 38.8 mph, which is about what my touring bike
    manages on a calm day.

    When I took it for its normal ride that evening, it seemed
    pleased with itself, but happier on the flats. If its paws
    were sore, it didn't complain.

    Carl Fogel

  8. Quoted message said:

    Sunday, a visiting friend emboldened me to take the Fury for
    its maiden voyage around my normal 15.25-mile route. We
    weren't pushing things, but the Fury completed the loop in a
    respectable 58:51 on a breezy morning, about twelve minutes
    slower than the average for the touring bike.

    Still fast!

    Quoted message said:

    It seemed reluctant to climb the ridge west of town, which
    is about 400 feet high, but then it's a full-figured bicycle
    compared to my touring bike. Heading back down, it achieved
    a maximum of 38.8 mph, which is about what my touring bike
    manages on a calm day.

    39 mph shows you have a lot of trust in that bike 😉

    --
    Phil, Squid-in-Training

  9. ZeeExSixAre said:
    Quoted message said:

    Sunday, a visiting friend emboldened me to take the Fury for
    its maiden voyage around my normal 15.25-mile route. We
    weren't pushing things, but the Fury completed the loop in a
    respectable 58:51 on a breezy morning, about twelve minutes
    slower than the average for the touring bike.

    Still fast!

    Quoted message said:

    It seemed reluctant to climb the ridge west of town, which
    is about 400 feet high, but then it's a full-figured bicycle
    compared to my touring bike. Heading back down, it achieved
    a maximum of 38.8 mph, which is about what my touring bike
    manages on a calm day.

    39 mph shows you have a lot of trust in that bike 😉

    Dear Phil,

    Occasional comments like that puzzle me. The friend behind
    me mentioned that he doesn't like to go that fast on his
    bike because it feels "squirrelly" at such speeds.

    Yet Pueblo's answer to the Stelvio Pass is a smoothly paved
    two-lane rural highway with a decent shoulder posted at 65
    mph. You could land a light airplane on most of the descent,
    which has gentle quarter-mile curves, but no side roads or
    potholes. There aren't even any trees until you reach the
    bottom.The closest thing to an obstruction is the happy
    brown or black prairie tarantula wandering across the road
    in early fall or a startled lizard scuttling off into the
    brush.

    I suppose that 39 mph is more exciting where there's
    traffic, side roads, driveways, potholes, and trees, but
    it's routine on this pleasant stretch of road. With a
    wonderful tailwind, I've reached 54 mph.

    Neither the Fury RoadMaster nor my trusty Schwinn touring
    bike make any fuss at such speeds. They don't twitch or
    swerve or rumble. I read the posts here about "shimmy" and
    assume that some bikes do indeed behave oddly, but I've
    never had it happen to me. The bikes just roll faster.

    Here's the clincher: this section is so smooth and pleasant
    that I've had flat front and rear tires and lost all
    pressure by the time that I stopped without any real
    trouble. Hell, you could probably land light planes on much
    of the road, if they didn't mind the slope.

    With some real curves or places that need braking, I expect
    that such speeds would be quite different, but what I'm
    doing is about as exciting as taking a shortcut down the
    beginner's slope at an uncrowded ski resort.

    Carl Fogel

  10. Quoted message said:

    Occasional comments like that puzzle me. The friend behind

    I come from Florida... the biggest hill nearby we have is probably 100 feet
    in elevation.

    Quoted message said:

    me mentioned that he doesn't like to go that fast on his
    bike because it feels "squirrelly" at such speeds.

    "Iron grip" most likely...

    Quoted message said:

    I suppose that 39 mph is more exciting where there's
    traffic, side roads, driveways, potholes, and trees, but
    it's routine on this pleasant stretch of road. With a
    wonderful tailwind, I've reached 54 mph.

    I wish I could attain those speeds, hehe.

    --
    Phil, Squid-in-Training

  11. carlfogel said:

    Now that I've got my breath back, I'm wondering about the merits of
    pacelines, drafting, and wheel-sucking for typical
    rec.bicycles.tech posters.
    Do pacelines at this level produce faster times or merely less
    tired riders?

    Could be either. One example is the group ride I did tonight. The average
    speed was *much* higher than I would have maintained on my own.

    Quoted message said:

    As I understand it, a paceline offers little advantage climbing because
    the riders aren't going fast enough to benefit from drafting.

    Yep.

    Quoted message said:

    Nor should a paceline improve speeds on a descent steep enough that
    riders are coasting. Everyone behind the lead rider has to brake, yet
    they can go no faster than he's going if they pull out into the wind
    and pass him.

    Not quite true. The following riders get a boost from the draft, and they
    can use that momentum to pass the leader. Each rider continues that trend,
    raising the average speed slightly.

    Quoted message said:

    On the flats, the paceline goes no faster than whoever is pedalling in
    front. The idea may be that the leader can strain and go faster than
    normal for a few minutes, with everyone following keeping up with him at
    a lazier pace, but I'm curious how this works out in real life.

    Depends on the group's goals.

    The person going to the front (aka pulling) has to get around the prior leader.
    That can be quite a challenge sometimes, and it's peer pressure that gets
    a rider to push himself hard enough to get around.

    Quoted message said:

    What strikes me as a potential drawback is that the leader has no
    competition to spur him on.

    In friendly competition, you're wrong. Peer pressure can be quite powerful.
    In serious competition, some riders are paid to pull their team leader to
    the finish.

    --
    Dave
    dvt at psu dot edu

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