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Re: Drug makers deceive doctors

Started by fresh~horses · · Last activity · 7 posts · 246 views

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
5 May 2004
Last activity
6 May 2004
Original author
fresh~horses
Posts
7
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Public discussion
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  1. "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<WkTlc.22054$Ia6.3198278@attbi_s03>...

    Quoted message said:

    The source is an online Canadian news source. The sources the article
    quotes as proof of this are zero. Ilena... posting more hearsay, are we?
    According to Star magazine - with just as many sources as your article -
    George Washington was really a woman and Mars (or Saturn?... I forget now)
    is really an alien space station.

    Of course, without a means of verifying stories, they are just that
    stories - works of fiction. Have a good day (and do try to spend this one
    in reality).

    More of that pesky reality:

    http://www.healthyskepticism.org/index.htm
    Sample from one of 245 hits on this topic
    "An internal document advised staff at the international drug giant
    GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) to withhold clinical trial findings in 1998 that
    indicated the antidepressant paroxetine (Paxil in North America and
    Seroxat in the UK) had no beneficial effect in treating adolescents."

  2. withholding evidence is not the same as and is not related to ghost writing.
    That, crazy horse, is reality.

    "fresh~horses" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message


    news:<WkTlc.22054$Ia6.3198278@attbi_s03>...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    The source is an online Canadian news source. The sources the article
    quotes as proof of this are zero. Ilena... posting more hearsay, are


    we?

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    According to Star magazine - with just as many sources as your article -
    George Washington was really a woman and Mars (or Saturn?... I forget


    now)

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    is really an alien space station.

    Of course, without a means of verifying stories, they are just that
    stories - works of fiction. Have a good day (and do try to spend this


    one

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in reality).

    More of that pesky reality:

    http://www.healthyskepticism.org/index.htm
    Sample from one of 245 hits on this topic
    "An internal document advised staff at the international drug giant
    GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) to withhold clinical trial findings in 1998 that
    indicated the antidepressant paroxetine (Paxil in North America and
    Seroxat in the UK) had no beneficial effect in treating adolescents."

  3. "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<1S6mc.36515$kh4.1812979@attbi_s52>...

    Quoted message said:

    withholding evidence is not the same as and is not related to ghost writing.
    That, crazy horse, is reality.

    "fresh~horses" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message


    news:<WkTlc.22054$Ia6.3198278@attbi_s03>...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    The source is an online Canadian news source. The sources the article
    quotes as proof of this are zero. Ilena... posting more hearsay, are


    we?

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    According to Star magazine - with just as many sources as your article -
    George Washington was really a woman and Mars (or Saturn?... I forget


    now)

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    is really an alien space station.

    Of course, without a means of verifying stories, they are just that
    stories - works of fiction. Have a good day (and do try to spend this


    one

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in reality).

    More of that pesky reality:

    http://www.healthyskepticism.org/index.htm
    Sample from one of 245 hits on this topic
    "An internal document advised staff at the international drug giant
    GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) to withhold clinical trial findings in 1998 that
    indicated the antidepressant paroxetine (Paxil in North America and
    Seroxat in the UK) had no beneficial effect in treating adolescents."

    Keep responding to me. Everytime you do, there's another hit on the
    topic of MARKETING NOT RESEARCH being archived in google.

  4. "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<1S6mc.36515$kh4.1812979@attbi_s52>...

    Quoted message said:

    withholding evidence is not the same as and is not related to ghost writing.
    That, crazy horse, is reality.

    "fresh~horses" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message


    news:<WkTlc.22054$Ia6.3198278@attbi_s03>...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    The source is an online Canadian news source. The sources the article
    quotes as proof of this are zero. Ilena... posting more hearsay, are


    we?

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    According to Star magazine - with just as many sources as your article -
    George Washington was really a woman and Mars (or Saturn?... I forget


    now)

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    is really an alien space station.

    Of course, without a means of verifying stories, they are just that
    stories - works of fiction. Have a good day (and do try to spend this


    one

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in reality).

    More of that pesky reality:

    http://www.healthyskepticism.org/index.htm
    Sample from one of 245 hits on this topic
    "An internal document advised staff at the international drug giant
    GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) to withhold clinical trial findings in 1998 that
    indicated the antidepressant paroxetine (Paxil in North America and
    Seroxat in the UK) had no beneficial effect in treating adolescents."

    ....Another hit in google archives.....brought to you by Skeptic.

  5. "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<1S6mc.36515$kh4.1812979@attbi_s52>...

    Quoted message said:

    withholding evidence is not the same as and is not related to ghost writing.
    That, crazy horse, is reality.

    "fresh~horses" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message


    news:<WkTlc.22054$Ia6.3198278@attbi_s03>...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    The source is an online Canadian news source. The sources the article
    quotes as proof of this are zero. Ilena... posting more hearsay, are


    we?

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    According to Star magazine - with just as many sources as your article -
    George Washington was really a woman and Mars (or Saturn?... I forget


    now)

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    is really an alien space station.

    Of course, without a means of verifying stories, they are just that
    stories - works of fiction. Have a good day (and do try to spend this


    one

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    in reality).

    More of that pesky reality:

    http://www.healthyskepticism.org/index.htm
    Sample from one of 245 hits on this topic
    "An internal document advised staff at the international drug giant
    GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) to withhold clinical trial findings in 1998 that
    indicated the antidepressant paroxetine (Paxil in North America and
    Seroxat in the UK) had no beneficial effect in treating adolescents."

    Yawn.

    Another slice of the same pie: ghostwriting, buying docs, withholding
    negative results. Brought to you dear reader by SKEPTIC. Go ahead
    thank him. But be sure to leave allllllll the post in when you do.

    The Objectivity of Science

    Flawed Evidence

    Doctors "author" drug company articles without seeing the raw data

    Persuasion works best when it's invisible. The most effective
    marketing worms its way into our consciousness, leaving intact the
    perception that we have reached our opinions and made our choices
    independently. As old as humankind itself, over the past few years
    this approach has been refined

    While, in the past, companies have created fake citizens' groups to
    campaign in favour of trashing forests or polluting rivers, now they
    create fake citizens. Messages purporting to come from disinterested
    punters are planted on listservers at critical moments, disseminating
    misleading information in the hope of recruiting real people to the
    cause. The next step is to publish flawed evidence, backed by
    respected scientists.

    Detective work by the campaigner Jonathan Matthews and the freelance
    journalist Andy Rowell shows how a PR firm contracted to the biotech
    company Monsanto appears to have played a crucial but invisible role
    in shaping scientific discourse. Recently, one of the world's foremost
    scientific journals was persuaded to do something it had never done
    before, and retract a paper it had published.

    In recent years, decline in the state funding of research has placed
    scientists in a vulnerable position which industry is able to exploit.
    Scientists in all areas of medicine are increasingly dependent on
    pharmaceutical companies to fund their work. This places the industry
    in a position to control data and to have papers drafted by company
    employees. Scientists are offered large fees to put their names to
    articles which have been ghostwritten by authors paid by the drug
    company. Researchers who have agreed to put their names to articles
    based on raw data which they have not seen, were possibly unaware of
    the consequences. Drug companies involved in court cases over the
    effects of SSRIs (the family of drugs to which Prozac belongs) have
    apparently relied in their defence upon such articles, attempting to
    shuffle responsibility onto the "authors".

    Fuller Torrey, executive director of the Stanley Foundation Research
    Programmes at Bethesda, Maryland said recently, "Some of us believe
    that the present system is approaching a high-class form of
    professional prostitution".

    Marcia Angell wrote as follows in an editorial for the New England
    Journal of Medicine: "Researchers serve as consultants to companies
    whose products they are studying, join advisory boards and speakers'
    bureaus, enter into patent and royalty arrangements, agree to be the
    listed authors of articles ghostwritten by interested companies,
    promote drugs and devices at company-sponsored symposiums, and allow
    themselves to be plied with expensive gifts and trips to luxurious
    settings. Many also have equity interest in the companies."

    The situation has become so serious that the World Health Organisation
    has also expressed concern. Dr Jonathan Quick, director of essential
    drugs and medicines policy at WHO, says the reliability of clinical
    trials - essential for the development of new drugs - is increasingly
    imperilled by conflicts of interest, "inappropriate involvement" of
    sponsors in trial design and management, and bias in publishing the
    results.

  6. "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<1S6mc.36515$kh4.1812979@attbi_s52>...
    snip****the****[censored]

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    More of that pesky reality:

    http://www.healthyskepticism.org/index.htm
    Sample from one of 245 hits on this topic
    "An internal document advised staff at the international drug giant
    GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) to withhold clinical trial findings in 1998 that
    indicated the antidepressant paroxetine (Paxil in North America and
    Seroxat in the UK) had no beneficial effect in treating adolescents."

    dUG FIRMS WITHHOLD DATA

    This moment in REALITY brought to us by SKEPTIC. We thank you SKEPTIC.

    INTERNATIONAL ECONOMY: WHO accuses drugs groups of interference
    Financial Times; Dec 18, 2001
    By FRANCES WILLIAMS

    A senior World Health Organisation official has
    attacked growing interference by pharmaceutical
    companies in the conduct of clinical trials and the
    publication of their results.
    Dr Jonathan Quick, director of essential drugs and
    medicines policy at WHO, says the reliability of
    clinical trials - essential for the development of new
    drugs - is increasingly imperilled by conflicts of
    interest, "inappropriate involvement" of sponsors in
    trial design and management, and bias in publishing
    the results.
    Writing in the latest WHO bulletin, he calls for a
    code of practice governing the relationship between
    researchers and sponsors to safeguard scientific
    independence and ensure impartial handling and
    assessment of the results.
    This could be along the lines of the Helsinki
    declaration adopted in 1964 by the World Medical
    Association, the international doctors' grouping,
    which lays down rules protecting human subjects in
    clinical trials.
    Dr Quick says the new rules should bind sponsors and
    researchers to respect the "intellectual independence"
    of researchers, establish a registry for the details
    of all trials, prohibit legal action by sponsors
    against researchers except in the case of fraud, and
    protect whistle-blowers who report unscientific and
    unethical research practices.
    Such a declaration is needed because "in a highly
    competitive world, the pressures may be simply too
    great for individual researchers, universities,
    medical journals, or public agencies to stem the tide
    of commercial influence", he says.
    WHO's concern reflects growing evidence of commercial
    manipulation of trials or their results.
    Last September the editors of 13 leading medical
    journals made an unprecedented joint statement saying
    they would refuse to publish studies where the
    researchers did not appear to have professional
    independence. www.ft.com/globaleconomy
    www.who.int/bulletin www.globalfundatm.org
    Copyright: The Financial Times Limited 1995-1998

  7. "fresh~horses" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Skeptic" <[email hidden]> wrote in message


    news:<1S6mc.36515$kh4.1812979@attbi_s52>...

    Quoted message said:

    snip****the****[censored]

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    More of that pesky reality:

    http://www.healthyskepticism.org/index.htm
    Sample from one of 245 hits on this topic
    "An internal document advised staff at the international drug giant
    GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) to withhold clinical trial findings in 1998 that
    indicated the antidepressant paroxetine (Paxil in North America and
    Seroxat in the UK) had no beneficial effect in treating adolescents."

    dUG FIRMS WITHHOLD DATA

    This moment in REALITY brought to us by SKEPTIC. We thank you SKEPTIC.

    That would be an interesting topic to discuss, but is not what the thread
    you responded to was discussing.

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