Re: Chelation To Avoid Heart Bypass

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Jan) said:

http://www.freevas.demon.co.uk/students/chelation%20therapy.htm

Looks like an essay by a medical student, and not a very good one.

If she were my student, I would give the essay a failing grade. Not only
was the essay incomplete and not well written, but she didn't cite even
a single one of the three or four small double-blind randomized clinical
trials for chelation therapy that are out there. (None of them showed a
benefit for chelation.) Instead she wrote uncritically, as though it was
accepted that chelation does help atherosclerotic heart disease.

A medical student needs to develop better skills at reviewing the
literature on a topic. It's part of our medical education. On that basis
alone, she gets a failing grade for this essay, as the review is very
incomplete.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Chelation To Avoid Heart Bypass
From: Orac [email hidden]
Date: 11/26/2003 5:44 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Looks like an essay by a medical student, and not a very good one.

also noted that all her references were from alternative medicine cites!!

me thinks she is perhaps not in a mainstream medical program

hawki

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Hawki63) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Chelation To Avoid Heart Bypass
From: Orac [email hidden]
Date: 11/26/2003 5:44 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Looks like an essay by a medical student, and not a very good one.

also noted that all her references were from alternative medicine cites!!

me thinks she is perhaps not in a mainstream medical program

I suspect she probably is in a mainstream program in Britain. She
probably got assigned this essay and just did a [censored] poor job of
reviewing the literature, either through laziness or inexperience. It's
fairly easy to find articles from "alternative medicine" journals by
doing Google searches on "chelation therapy," going to chelation therapy
sites and following from there or to find a couple of review articles in
chelation therapy sites and crib from them. Although it's probably just
as easy to do MedLine searches and find the peer-reviewed data on
chelation therapy, along with the three or four randomized trials out
there, it's harder to actually read the studies and distill them into
conclusions.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

http://www.freevas.demon.co.uk/students/chelation%20therapy.htm

My favorite line from this link...provided by you, Jan:

"However, Gundling and Ernst (1999) have concluded that the few
studies that have been done do not support the use of chelation
therapy for cardiovascular disease. They found that the results from a
randomised controlled trial show no benefit in terms of objective
signs or subjective improvement compared to placebo and state that
chelation has been associated with renal problems, hypocalcaemia and
death. Long-term consequences of chelation are as yet unknown
(Gundling and Ernst, 1999)."

Do you *ever* read for content?

Mark, MD

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Mark) said:

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

http://www.freevas.demon.co.uk/students/chelation%20therapy.htm

My favorite line from this link...provided by you, Jan:

"However, Gundling and Ernst (1999) have concluded that the few
studies that have been done do not support the use of chelation
therapy for cardiovascular disease. They found that the results from a
randomised controlled trial show no benefit in terms of objective
signs or subjective improvement compared to placebo and state that
chelation has been associated with renal problems, hypocalcaemia and
death. Long-term consequences of chelation are as yet unknown
(Gundling and Ernst, 1999)."

Do you *ever* read for content?

Heh heh. Actually, that passage reminds me. When I speak of the risks of
chelation therapy, I usually mention mainly cardiac arrhythmias (which
can be fatal). I tend to forget to mention the potential for renal
problems. I'll remember to do that in the future. Thanks, Jan, for
reminding me of this other potential complication of chelation therapy!
;-)

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Chelation To Avoid Heart Bypass
From: [email hidden] (Mark)
Date: 11/29/2003 11:00 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

http://www.freevas.demon.co.uk/students/chelation%20therapy.htm

My favorite line from this link...provided by you, Jan:

"However, Gundling and Ernst (1999) have concluded that the few
studies that have been done do not support the use of chelation
therapy for cardiovascular disease. They found that the results from a
randomised controlled trial show no benefit in terms of objective
signs or subjective improvement compared to placebo and state that
chelation has been associated with renal problems, hypocalcaemia and
death. Long-term consequences of chelation are as yet unknown
(Gundling and Ernst, 1999)."

Do you *ever* read for content?

Mark, MD

So very strange that is your favorite. I have noticed you always look for the
negative and skip right over the positive, if it is something I post. Must be
that natural pugnacious tendency.

I don't pick and chose as this is selective, and dishonest.

I post the entire article.

ALL of the content.

http://www.freevas.demon.co.uk/students/chelation%20therapy.htm 

Coronary artery disease (CAD) is the greatest cause of premature death in
industrialised countries. It is managed by revascularisation techniques, such
as coronary artery bypass surgery and percutaneous transluminal coronary
angioplasty. By restoring blood flow to damaged myocardium, revascularisation
frees cardiac patients of their symptoms, leading to a more comfortable
existence. Another possible technique is that of chelation therapy. It can be
used as an adjunct to the above methods or, in some cases, may even replace the
need for such invasive procedures.

Chelation therapy, more specifically EDTA chelation therapy, is a procedure
using intravenous administration of EDTA (ethylene diamine tetra-acetic acid),
together with nutrients to aid in the management of atherosclerotic vessel
disease and partially rejuvinate the circulation. EDTA is a chelating agent
that is excreted from the body, mostly in urine. Modern chelation therapy
developed from using EDTA to remove toxic minerals from the body. It is most
effective when used as an aid to dietary and lifestyle changes, nutritional
supplements, exercise, stress reduction and medication.

Chelation involves trapping the target ion in a unit, which is stabilised by
multiple sites of bonding with the chelating agent. EDTA partially surrounds
and binds with, and tightly grips metal ions, then facilitates their excretion
via urine. The EDTA compound used for removal of lead from the body is the
calcium-EDTA salt; disodium-EDTA salt is used for circulatory revitalisation.

Therapy involves intravenous infusion of an osmotically standardised solution
over 1.5-3.0 hours. This treatment is usually given once or twice a week and
for those patients who are symptomatic, a series of thirty or more infusions
may be given. Rozema (1997) has shown that all forms of atherosclerotic
occlusive arterial disease benefit from chelation therapy.

Other diseases have also been found to be improved by chelation. Scleroderma
patients have shown improvement but degeneration was also found to occur
(Schachter, 1996). Rozema (1997) claimed that diabetics showed a vast
improvement in their condition, with some patients reducing the amount of
medication they used. Other conditions known to benefit are Alzheimer’s
disease, multiple sclerosis, rheumatiod arthritis, porphyrias, hypertension,
calcinosis universalis and other calcium deposition diseases (Rozema, 1997).

Contraindications for EDTA therapy include chemical intolerance to EDTA,
patients with acute lead encephalopathy or those on renal dialysis. EDTA
chelation therapy has not yet been proven to be safe for women who are pregnant
or might become pregnant.

It is possible that other substances, such as magnesium (as chloride or
sulphate), sodium bicarbonate, local anaesthetics, heparin, ascorbic acid, B
vitamins and minerals can be used for co-administration with EDTA in order to
achieve a longer lasting effect.

Iron chelation therapy with desferrioxamine (DFO) has had dramatic effects in
patients with beta-thalassemia. Parenteral DFO reduces morbidity and mortality,
with little serious toxicity and removes iron from the body by binding it and
then exchanges it in the blood stream and excretes it via the kidneys while the
components that execute such a mechanism are recycled (Giardina, 2001).

Although EDTA chelation has not been subjected to a vast number of clinical
trials, those that it has been involved in has shown that EDTA chelation
therapy benefits cardiovascular symptoms in more than four out of five patients
(Kidd, 1999). Thus, it is possible that EDTA chelation therapy may eventually
provide an alternative to bypass or angioplasty. Hancke and Flytlie reported
that of 470 patients with atherosclerosis, 65 were awaiting bypass surgery and
subjected to chelation. The vast majority showed clinical improvement and when
chelation was completed, only seven still required bypass. Of 27 patients
scheduled for leg amputation, only three required surgery after courses of
chelation therapy. However, Gundling and Ernst (1999) have concluded that the
few studies that have been done do not support the use of chelation therapy for
cardiovascular disease. They found that the results from a randomised
controlled trial show no benefit in terms of objective signs or subjective
improvement compared to placebo and state that chelation has been associated
with renal problems, hypocalcaemia and death. Long-term consequences of
chelation are as yet unknown (Gundling and Ernst, 1999).

With further investigation and clinical trials, more will be understood about
the mechanism of action of EDTA. With this additional knowledge it is hoped
that EDTA chelation therapy will be able to replace surgical revascularisation
techniques or be used as an adjunct to these methods of treatment, once the
benefits and risks of this alternative therapy have been further assessed.

 
REFERENCES

Giardina, P.J. and Grady, R.W. (2001) Chelation therapy in beta-thalassemia: An
optimistic update. Semin Haematol 38(4):360-6.

Grundling, K. and Ernst, E. (1999) Complementary and alternative medicine in
cardiovascular disease: what is the evidence it works? West J Med. 171 (3):
191-4.

Hancke, C. and Flytlie, K. (1993) Benefits of EDTA in arteriosclerosis: a
retrospective study of 470 patients. J Advancement Med 6:161-170.

Kidd, P.M. (1998) Integrative cardiac revitalisation: bypass surgery,
angioplasty, and chelation. Benefits, risks and limitations. Altern Med Rev
3(1):4-17.

Rozema T.C. (1997) The protocol for the safe and effective administration of
EDTA and other chelating agents for vascular disease, degenerative disease, and
metal toxicity. J Advancement Med 10(5):5.

Schachter, M.B. (1996) Overview, historical background and current status of
EDTA chelation therapy for atherosclerosis. J Advancement Med 9:159-177.

Jan

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Jan) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Chelation To Avoid Heart Bypass
From: [email hidden] (Mark)
Date: 11/29/2003 11:00 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

http://www.freevas.demon.co.uk/students/chelation%20therapy.htm

My favorite line from this link...provided by you, Jan:

"However, Gundling and Ernst (1999) have concluded that the few
studies that have been done do not support the use of chelation
therapy for cardiovascular disease. They found that the results from a
randomised controlled trial show no benefit in terms of objective
signs or subjective improvement compared to placebo and state that
chelation has been associated with renal problems, hypocalcaemia and
death. Long-term consequences of chelation are as yet unknown
(Gundling and Ernst, 1999)."

Do you *ever* read for content?

Mark, MD

So very strange that is your favorite. I have noticed you always look for the
negative and skip right over the positive, if it is something I post. Must be
that natural pugnacious tendency.

I don't pick and chose as this is selective, and dishonest.

I post the entire article.

ALL of the content.

http://www.freevas.demon.co.uk/students/chelation%20therapy.htm 

[Snip]

Quoted message said:

However, Gundling and Ernst (1999) have concluded that the
few studies that have been done do not support the use of chelation therapy
for
cardiovascular disease. They found that the results from a randomised
controlled trial show no benefit in terms of objective signs or subjective
improvement compared to placebo and state that chelation has been associated
with renal problems, hypocalcaemia and death. Long-term consequences of
chelation are as yet unknown (Gundling and Ernst, 1999).

Actually, you don't need to post the whole article, as this is the only
segment of the article that is correct. The rest was poorly-written,
poorly researched, and revealed poor critical thinking skills and poor
ability to evaluate the existing literature on the part of the medical
student who wrote the essay. The three sentences above are the only
thing she got mostly right.

[Snip]

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

In said:

http://www.freevas.demon.co.uk/students/chelation%20therapy.htm

Jan, I couldn't find the before-and-after angiograms.
Could you please point them out?

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In said:

I don't pick and chose as this is selective, and dishonest.

ROTFLMFHOFTBAG!

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