Re Chelation Benefits

Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is only a
response.

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://www.holistic-online.com/Chelation/hol_chelation.htm

In article <[email hidden]>,

Markiosos2 Probertiosos2 said:

Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is only a
response.

The fact that she forgot the colon after the "Re" was the dead giveaway.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-F71615.12040127112003
@host9.newsfeeds.com:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Markiosos2 Probertiosos2 said:

Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is only a
response.

The fact that she forgot the colon after the "Re" was the dead giveaway.

I am surprised she didn't use a string of commas, upcarets or some other
[censored] to add "style".

r

--
Nothing beats the bandwidth of a station wagon filled with DLT tapes.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Rich Andrews said:

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-F71615.12040127112003
@host9.newsfeeds.com:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Markiosos2 Probertiosos2 said:

Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is only a
response.

The fact that she forgot the colon after the "Re" was the dead giveaway.

I am surprised she didn't use a string of commas, upcarets or some other
[censored] to add "style".

Too complicated for her.

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-00966D.12300227112003@news4-
ge1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Rich Andrews said:

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-F71615.12040127112003
@host9.newsfeeds.com:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
"Markiosos2 Probertiosos2" <[email hidden]> wrote:

> Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is

only a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> response.

The fact that she forgot the colon after the "Re" was the dead

giveaway.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I am surprised she didn't use a string of commas, upcarets or some

other

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

[censored] to add "style".

Too complicated for her.

I disagree. Any tardo can push a key and hold it down.

r

--
Nothing beats the bandwidth of a station wagon filled with DLT tapes.

Rich Andrews <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-00966D.12300227112003@news4-
ge1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Rich Andrews said:

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-F71615.12040127112003
@host9.newsfeeds.com:

> In article <[email hidden]>,
> "Markiosos2 Probertiosos2" <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>> Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is

only a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> response.
>
> The fact that she forgot the colon after the "Re" was the dead

giveaway.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>

I am surprised she didn't use a string of commas, upcarets or some

other

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

[censored] to add "style".

Too complicated for her.

I disagree. Any tardo can push a key and hold it down.

No, not any.

--

Robert Bronsing

Can't you see?
It all makes perfect sense,
expressed in dollars and cents, pounds, shillings and pence

(R. Waters)

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Re Chelation Benefits
From: "Bronsing" [email hidden]
Date: 11/28/2003 1:18 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Rich Andrews <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-00966D.12300227112003@news4-
ge1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Rich Andrews <[email hidden]> wrote:

> Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-F71615.12040127112003
> @host9.newsfeeds.com:
>
> > In article <[email hidden]>,
> > "Markiosos2 Probertiosos2" <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >
> >> Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is

only a

Quoted message said:

> >> response.

WOW, now the whinng is reduced to a Re.

How pathetic.

Quoted message said:

The fact that she forgot the colon after the "Re" was the dead

Quoted message said:

giveaway.

It appears nothing was said about Chelation benefits, just an Re, without the
colon.

How terrible,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Quoted message said:

I am surprised she didn't use a string of commas, upcarets or some

Quoted message said:

other

Quoted message said:

> [censored] to add "style".

Too complicated for her.

More about Jan, nothing about the article,

Quoted message said:

I disagree. Any tardo can push a key and hold it down.

No, not any.

You little boys done yet??

Now Chelation Benefits.

http://www.holistic-online.com/Chelation/hol_chelation.htm

What Are The Benefits of Chelation Therapy?

Chelation therapy is widely used for the treatment of atherosclerosis and other
chronic degenerative diseases involving the circulatory system. It also has
other benefits. Many scientists suggest that the beneficial effect of chelation
treatment is from the removal of metallic catalysts that causes excessive free
radical proliferation. This reduces the oxidation of lipids, DNA, enzyme
systems and lipoproteins. The chelation halts the bad effects and initiates the
body's healing process, often reversing the damage. It removes the calcium and
copper anions from the blood stream. The plaque lining the artery walls are
made porous and brittle. Eventually they may get dislodged. Even if only a
microscopic layer of the plaque is removed, it, along with a smoothening of the
artery wall due to the healing of the cells that line the arteries, can improve
the blood flow to the artery muscles substantially. This can prevent artery
spasm and minimize or prevent angina pain. Many patients who could not walk due
to muscle pain or angina pain have reported that they can walk without pain
after chelation therapy.

Introduction

Chelation Process Is Very Common in Nature

What Are The Benefits of Chelation Therapy?

Reduces Free Radical Activity in The Blood

The Story of Free Radicals

Blocks Calcium Absorption, Repairs Damaged Muscles, Improves the Cell Energy
Production

Reduces Blood Stickiness or Clotting

Normalizes Abnormal Cholesterol and HDL Levels

Removes Calcium from the Plaque

Cancer Treatment

Mental Health

Other Benefits

How Is Chelation Therapy Administered?

Medical Examination
EDTA Treatment

Side Effects of Chelation Therapy

Safety Concerns

Clinical Trials/Results

Chelation therapy is backed by a large number of testimonials and experiments
that shows the effectivity of this therapy. Many of these were not
scientifically conducted (such as a double blind study). Chelation therapists
rightfully point out that it is hard to give a placebo when administering the
compound (especially from the therapist as is required for the double blind
study).

Therapists point out that about 500,000 chelation therapies are being done in
the USA alone every year and the patients are very happy, placebo effect or
not. Rosenfeld, author of "Guide to Alternative Medicine" talked about two of
his patients whose condition has improved substantially after the chelation
therapy, although he could not clinically identify what was different about
them. Chelation therapy saves considerable amount of money. A typical chelation
therapy cost about $3000 compared to a bypass surgery at about $30,000. There
is not much risk in chelation therapy as compared to the surgery.

A review of treatment results from 2,870 patients in Brazil found significant
improvement in patients with heart disease or peripheral vascular disease who
were treated with chelation therapy. 76.9 percent of the heart patients treated
reported "marked improvement" and another 16.6 percent reported "good
improvement". The results were even better for the patients who were treated
for peripheral vascular disease. 91 percent showed "marked" improvement and 7.6
percent showed "good" improvement. So, 96-98 percent of the patients treated
reported improvement after chelation therapy.

[Chelation Therapy Home][Alternative Therapies Home][Holisticonline.com Home]

Jan

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Jan) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Re Chelation Benefits
From: "Bronsing" [email hidden]
Date: 11/28/2003 1:18 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I disagree. Any tardo can push a key and hold it down.

No, not any.

You little boys done yet??

Now Chelation Benefits.

http://www.holistic-online.com/Chelation/hol_chelation.htm

What Are The Benefits of Chelation Therapy?

Chelation therapy is widely used for the treatment of atherosclerosis and
other
chronic degenerative diseases involving the circulatory system.

Someone needs to tell this twit that just because something is used does
not mean it is effective.

Quoted message said:

It also has
other benefits.

"Other" benefits? I haven't seen evidence for one benefit yet.

Quoted message said:

Many scientists suggest that the beneficial effect of
chelation
treatment is from the removal of metallic catalysts that causes excessive
free
radical proliferation.

"Many" scientists? Who are these "scientists" who make this claim, and
on what scientific evidence and experimentation do they base this claim?

Quoted message said:

This reduces the oxidation of lipids, DNA, enzyme
systems and lipoproteins.

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

The chelation halts the bad effects and
initiates the body's healing process, often reversing the damage.

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

It
removes the calcium and copper anions from the blood stream.

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

The
plaque lining the artery walls are made porous and brittle.
Eventually they may get dislodged. Even if only a microscopic layer
of the plaque is removed, it, along with a smoothening of the artery
wall due to the healing of the cells that line the arteries, can
improve the blood flow to the artery muscles substantially.

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

This can
prevent artery spasm and minimize or prevent angina pain. Many
patients who could not walk due to muscle pain or angina pain have
reported that they can walk without pain after chelation therapy.

Really? And in what peer-reviewed medical journal is this reported?

Quoted message said:

Introduction

Chelation Process Is Very Common in Nature

What Are The Benefits of Chelation Therapy?

Reduces Free Radical Activity in The Blood

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

The Story of Free Radicals

Blocks Calcium Absorption, Repairs Damaged Muscles, Improves the Cell Energy
Production

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

Reduces Blood Stickiness or Clotting

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

Normalizes Abnormal Cholesterol and HDL Levels

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

Removes Calcium from the Plaque

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

Cancer Treatment

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

Mental Health

Scientific evidence to support this claim, please?

Quoted message said:

Other Benefits

How Is Chelation Therapy Administered?

Medical Examination
EDTA Treatment

Side Effects of Chelation Therapy

Safety Concerns

Clinical Trials/Results

Chelation therapy is backed by a large number of testimonials and experiments
that shows the effectivity of this therapy.

Really? Why doesn't the author cite them?

Quoted message said:

Many of these were not
scientifically conducted (such as a double blind study).

Ah, that's why the author didn't cite them.

Quoted message said:

Chelation therapists
rightfully point out that it is hard to give a placebo when administering the
compound (especially from the therapist as is required for the double blind
study).

What a load of [censored]! Does this guy know how stupid and lame this
excuse is? Chelation would be exceedingly easy to do a double-blinded
randomized clinical trial--one of the easiest, since there isn't even
the issue of having to disguise the taste or smell of the placebo. Since
EDTA is colorless, there would be no difference in appearance between
the IV bags containing EDTA and those containing the saline placebo.

Quoted message said:

Therapists point out that about 500,000 chelation therapies are being done in
the USA alone every year and the patients are very happy, placebo effect or
not.

So what?

Quoted message said:

Rosenfeld, author of "Guide to Alternative Medicine" talked about two of
his patients whose condition has improved substantially after the chelation
therapy, although he could not clinically identify what was different about
them.

ROTFLMAO! If he can't identify what's different about them, then how the
hell did he know they improved?

Quoted message said:

Chelation therapy saves considerable amount of money.

I'm sure this might be true, but it's irrelevant. People who use
cheaper, but ineffective, treatment probably do spend less--and they
probably die earlier as well.

Quoted message said:

A typical
chelation
therapy cost about $3000 compared to a bypass surgery at about $30,000.

Ah, but the author forgets to mention that chelation therapy almost
always ends up being repeated, with patients taking multiple rounds of
it. He also forgets to mention that there is no good evidence whatsoever
from clinical studies that chelation does anywhere near as good as
bypass for atherosclerotic heart disease.

Quoted message said:

There
is not much risk in chelation therapy as compared to the surgery.

Probably true, but also utterly irrelevant, given that there is also not
much risk of chelation therapy helping the atherosclerotic heart disease
it is supposedly being used to treat.

Quoted message said:

A review of treatment results from 2,870 patients in Brazil found significant
improvement in patients with heart disease or peripheral vascular disease who
were treated with chelation therapy. 76.9 percent of the heart patients
treated
reported "marked improvement" and another 16.6 percent reported "good
improvement". The results were even better for the patients who were treated
for peripheral vascular disease. 91 percent showed "marked" improvement and
7.6
percent showed "good" improvement. So, 96-98 percent of the patients treated
reported improvement after chelation therapy.

Note that the specific study isn't cited. Also note that this appears to
be a retrospective uncontrolled study, without a description of what
parameters were used to judge a patient as having gotten "better."

Jan, this piece you reposted was a very lame defense of chelation
therapy? Was this the best you could dig up off the web?

--
Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
|
|"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
| inconvenience me with questions?"

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Re Chelation Benefits
From: "Bronsing" [email hidden]
Date: 11/28/2003 1:18 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Rich Andrews <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-00966D.12300227112003@news4-
ge1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net:

> In article <[email hidden]>,
> Rich Andrews <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>> Orac <[email hidden]> wrote in news:orac-F71615.12040127112003
>> @host9.newsfeeds.com:
>>
>> > In article <[email hidden]>,
>> > "Markiosos2 Probertiosos2" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> >
>> >> Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is
only a
>> >> response.

WOW, now the whinng is reduced to a Re.

How pathetic.

Quoted message said:

The fact that she forgot the colon after the "Re" was the dead

Quoted message said:

giveaway.

It appears nothing was said about Chelation benefits, just an Re, without

the

Quoted message said:

colon.

OK, I'll say something about chelation benefits.

Chelation for anythong other than heavy metal poisoning *financially*
benefits the quack administering it. It doe snot benefit the patient and
puts the patient at increased risk of cardiac arrythmias.

Happy now?

Quoted message said:

How terrible,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Quoted message said:

I am surprised she didn't use a string of commas, upcarets or some

Quoted message said:

other
>> [censored] to add "style".
>
> Too complicated for her.

More about Jan, nothing about the article,

Because it is [censored].

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I disagree. Any tardo can push a key and hold it down.

No, not any.

You little boys done yet??

Now Chelation Benefits.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

for the quack.

In said:

http://www.holistic-online.com/Chelation/hol_chelation.htm

I couldn't find the before-and-after angigrams.
Jan, could you point them out?

--
begin signature.exe
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet?

In said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
"Markiosos2 Probertiosos2" <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Note Jan's clever use of "Re" in the subject line to imply it is only a
response.

The fact that she forgot the colon after the "Re" was the dead giveaway.

She cleansed it.

--
begin signature.exe
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet?