Re: Big Pharma is fined 'pocket change'

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Big Pharma is fined 'pocket change'
From: "Anth" [email hidden]
Date: 5/15/2004 1:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

(and no I don't believe there's any evidence that this thing does what it is
said to do)

actually there is plenty of evidence

the problem is in the marketing..aka pimping..the med for indications that FDA
approval had not been granted for...ie..no clinical trials

for neuropathic pain...Neurontin is VERY successful for many folks..also for
chronic headaches...have taken it myself for headaches..and prescribed it for
neuropathic pain...

now the pharma will have to go back and do the clinical trials they should have
in the first place

but Neurontin is a good med...

hawki.....

That's a personal anecdote, and I don't want to get into arguing negatives,
which is the usual pat yourself on the back easy argument bs that's espoused
on here at a daily basis.
The pharma companies bend, hoodwink and emit statistics for their own ends
at the expense of the people, they clearly have money as a higher priority
than the peoples health why trust them?
They also claim to proponents of the scientific method, I think they should
be exposed for what they are - liars and capitalists
Anth

"Hawki63" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Big Pharma is fined 'pocket change'
From: "Anth" [email hidden]
Date: 5/15/2004 1:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

(and no I don't believe there's any evidence that this thing does what it

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

said to do)

actually there is plenty of evidence

the problem is in the marketing..aka pimping..the med for indications that

FDA

Quoted message said:

approval had not been granted for...ie..no clinical trials

for neuropathic pain...Neurontin is VERY successful for many folks..also

for

Quoted message said:

chronic headaches...have taken it myself for headaches..and prescribed it

for

Quoted message said:

neuropathic pain...

now the pharma will have to go back and do the clinical trials they should

have

Quoted message said:

in the first place

but Neurontin is a good med...

hawki.....

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Big Pharma is fined 'pocket change'
From: "Anth" [email hidden]
Date: 5/15/04 6:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

They also claim to proponents of the scientific method,

What they claim is not what they are. It does work to impress the victims (
the patients ) and it does work blind those who should know better ( the docs
), but Orac and others show, that the power of the medical monopoly covers a
lot of ground.

Quoted message said:

I think they should
be exposed for what they are - liars and capitalists
Anth

Humans, sick and diseased humans, are their source of income and power. Since
their chosen theory of medicine is false, a lie, a deciet , a con, a deception
of great proportions, what else can you expect from them? If they admit the
real truth the populace might hang them from the nearest lamp posts for lying
to them and poisoning dear ole uncle Ned to death.

DrC PhD

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Big Pharma is fined 'pocket change'
From: "Anth" [email hidden]
Date: 5/15/2004 3:22 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

That's a personal anecdote, and I don't want to get into arguing negatives,
which is the usual pat yourself on the back easy argument bs that's espoused
on here at a daily basis.

OK...forget that I took it for headaches...

I do/did prescribe it for neuropathic pain....

the "problem" with the Neurontin folks is that they blatently pimped it for
undocumented things..

"off label" is NOT illegal for a practitioner...

but for a drug company...pushing "off label" is...

for that they got their ass in a sling...and they deserved it!!

hawki.....

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Big Pharma is fined 'pocket change'
From: [email hidden] (DRCEEPHD)
Date: 5/15/2004 4:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Humans, sick and diseased humans, are their source of income and power.
Since

ahhhh...so the alties are altruistic and have no "source of income and
power"...

add to that they prey upon the desperate

add to that the their products are not covered by insurance...

yep...surely the alties are the good guys

not

hawki.....

Quoted message said:

Why do you divert and defend these pharma-quacks?

Because one of them gave me a handful of pens, notepads, AND an umbrella. I
feel "beholden" to them.

Quoted message said:

(and no I don't believe there's any evidence that this thing does what it is
said to do)

Uh, you mean you don't believe that Neurontin is good for some conditions other
than what it was initially proven for in clinical trials or are you saying that
you don't believe chelation works?

Quoted message said:

Like I say if you want proof then bugger off to sci.med or something - that
way you will be abosorbed into the pharma dogma and lies and they can
swallow your soul whole.

Ah, Grasshopper, your self-righteous indignation ill-becomes you!

Quoted message said:

Show me where vitamin c kills people or causes them to suicide or actually
does people harm?

It makes some people obsessively post off-topic, irrelevant, and silly content.

Quoted message said:

Also as for your comment on vitamin c and chelation (which is a futile
attempt at baiting me btw) people who used it in both arms showed
significant positive effects.

Oh, really? What did the radiographic evidence say?

Quoted message said:

You have your little rants and counter arguments but all you can do is sit
there with your lack of solutions..

Forgive me for not conquering CAD. I feel so ashamed of my failure to even
try! I guess I can console myself by saying it isn't my job as I am an [Wait
for it............................................] Educator!

Quoted message said:

Anth

Quoted message said:

"Vitamins are Chemicals"

Vitamins are Chemicals
Vitamins are Chemicals
Vitamins are Chemicals

<[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Don't you think that's a problem with the doctors prescribing this drug

for

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

things that it isn't designed todo?
Anth

Don't you think that's a problem with the "doctors" prescribing chelation

for

Quoted message said:

things that it isn't designed to do? Given its properties, there is good
reason to believe Neurontin can treat many of the conditions it was

off-label

Quoted message said:

prescribed for.

Anth, do you think Vitamin C should ONLY be used for those things it has

been

Quoted message said:

clinically proven to treat?

Llsa do yourself and everyone else a favour _don't_ take vitamin c, in fact
I recommend you try to limit it from your diet as much as posible.
Good luck - hope the statins don't upset your stomach too much.
Anth

Vitamins are Chemicals" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Why do you divert and defend these pharma-quacks?

Because one of them gave me a handful of pens, notepads, AND an umbrella.

I

Quoted message said:

feel "beholden" to them.

Quoted message said:

(and no I don't believe there's any evidence that this thing does what it

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

said to do)

Uh, you mean you don't believe that Neurontin is good for some conditions

other

Quoted message said:

than what it was initially proven for in clinical trials or are you saying

that

Quoted message said:

you don't believe chelation works?

Quoted message said:

Like I say if you want proof then bugger off to sci.med or something -

that

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

way you will be abosorbed into the pharma dogma and lies and they can
swallow your soul whole.

Ah, Grasshopper, your self-righteous indignation ill-becomes you!

Quoted message said:

Show me where vitamin c kills people or causes them to suicide or

actually

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

does people harm?

It makes some people obsessively post off-topic, irrelevant, and silly

content.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Also as for your comment on vitamin c and chelation (which is a futile
attempt at baiting me btw) people who used it in both arms showed
significant positive effects.

Oh, really? What did the radiographic evidence say?

Quoted message said:

You have your little rants and counter arguments but all you can do is

sit

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

there with your lack of solutions..

Forgive me for not conquering CAD. I feel so ashamed of my failure to

even

Quoted message said:

try! I guess I can console myself by saying it isn't my job as I am an

[Wait

Quoted message said:

for it............................................] Educator!

Quoted message said:

Anth

Quoted message said:

"Vitamins are Chemicals"

Vitamins are Chemicals
Vitamins are Chemicals
Vitamins are Chemicals

<[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

>Don't you think that's a problem with the doctors prescribing this

drug

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

for

Quoted message said:

>things that it isn't designed todo?
>Anth

Don't you think that's a problem with the "doctors" prescribing

chelation

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

for

Quoted message said:

things that it isn't designed to do? Given its properties, there is

good

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

reason to believe Neurontin can treat many of the conditions it was

off-label

Quoted message said:

prescribed for.

Anth, do you think Vitamin C should ONLY be used for those things it

has

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

been

Quoted message said:

clinically proven to treat?

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Big Pharma is fined 'pocket change'
From: "Anth" [email hidden]
Date: 5/16/2004 12:15 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Llsa do yourself and everyone else a favour _don't_ take vitamin c, in fact
I recommend you try to limit it from your diet as much as posible.
Good luck - hope the statins don't upset your stomach too much.
Anth

Vitamins are Chemicals" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Why do you divert and defend these pharma-quacks?

Because one of them gave me a handful of pens, notepads, AND an umbrella.

I

Quoted message said:

feel "beholden" to them.

Quoted message said:

(and no I don't believe there's any evidence that this thing does what it

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

said to do)

Uh, you mean you don't believe that Neurontin is good for some conditions

other

Quoted message said:

than what it was initially proven for in clinical trials or are you saying

that

Quoted message said:

you don't believe chelation works?

Quoted message said:

Like I say if you want proof then bugger off to sci.med or something -

that

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

way you will be abosorbed into the pharma dogma and lies and they can
swallow your soul whole.

Ah, Grasshopper

Poor Andrew just keeps messing up. That was one of his favorite names.

*Your reading leaves much to be desired, just like your writings,

Quoted message said:

Grasshopper. Now clean your chamber pot, and soak your head in it.
Do be sure to wash the chamber pot afterward, it was not meant to be
fouled in such a manner!*

*Herbie,

Quoted message said:

You still won't address the point I made that you and Jan
started shooting off your mouths prior to reading the documents.
Now stop projecting your inadequacies on others and get some
education. Call the court if you want the answers you seek,
Grasshopper*

Jan

Quoted message said:

Llsa do yourself and everyone else a favour _don't_ take vitamin c, in fact
I recommend you try to limit it from your diet as much as posible.
Good luck - hope the statins don't upset your stomach too much.
Anth

Vitamins are Chemicals" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Dude, I have the entire pharmacopia of suppressed, natural substances at my
disposal. I have immortality rings, collodial silver, & magnetic everything.
Ilsa9 is timeless & eternal.

Seriously, Anth, your access to 1gram Tablets of Vit-A-Min C are not at risk by
Codex. You can easily get high doses of that in fruits & vegetables, and yes,
supplements.

Now, Anth, why do you keep calling the pharmaceutical companies "crooks" when
they sell prescription meds but view them as potential victims of CoDeX when
they sell vitamins. IOW, don't you realize the same people you vilify for
selling pharaceuticals manufacture a large percentage of supplements?

C'mon llsa - use your brain - since when can you get 1 gram from fruit and
veggies?
I'd have to eat 15 oranges for 1g, and since I sometimes take 2-5g that's an
incredible amount of fruit.
Unlike gorillas who munch all day, and burn off the sugars in doing do, I
could not possibly do what they do
and stay healthy. Pharma companies are crooks because they have been
demonstrated to be so by law.
Anth

"Vitamins are Chemicals" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Llsa do yourself and everyone else a favour _don't_ take vitamin c, in

fact

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I recommend you try to limit it from your diet as much as posible.
Good luck - hope the statins don't upset your stomach too much.
Anth

Vitamins are Chemicals" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Dude, I have the entire pharmacopia of suppressed, natural substances at

my

Quoted message said:

disposal. I have immortality rings, collodial silver, & magnetic

everything.

Quoted message said:

Ilsa9 is timeless & eternal.

Seriously, Anth, your access to 1gram Tablets of Vit-A-Min C are not at

risk by

Quoted message said:

Codex. You can easily get high doses of that in fruits & vegetables, and

yes,

Quoted message said:

supplements.

Now, Anth, why do you keep calling the pharmaceutical companies "crooks"

when

Quoted message said:

they sell prescription meds but view them as potential victims of CoDeX

when

Quoted message said:

they sell vitamins. IOW, don't you realize the same people you vilify for
selling pharaceuticals manufacture a large percentage of supplements?

Quoted message said:

C'mon llsa - use your brain - since when can you get 1 gram from fruit and
veggies?
I'd have to eat 15 oranges for 1g, and since I sometimes take 2-5g that's an
incredible amount of fruit.

Are oranges the only source? Are 1gram tablets being banned? You have
options, Anth.

Quoted message said:

Unlike gorillas who munch all day, and burn off the sugars in doing do, I
could not possibly do what they do
and stay healthy. Pharma companies are crooks because they have been
demonstrated to be so by law.

Yeah, yeah. Now answer the question that you avoided. Why don't you realize
that the same company you call crooked when it sells Neurontin is the same one
you consider to be a victim of Codex when it sells vitamins. IOW, why don't
you understand that the mainstream pharmaceutical companies produce a lot of
the supplements and that they are don't require an Rx?

Quoted message said:

Anth

"Vitamins are Chemicals" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Llsa do yourself and everyone else a favour _don't_ take vitamin c, in

fact

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I recommend you try to limit it from your diet as much as posible.
Good luck - hope the statins don't upset your stomach too much.
Anth

Vitamins are Chemicals" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Dude, I have the entire pharmacopia of suppressed, natural substances at

my

Quoted message said:

disposal. I have immortality rings, collodial silver, & magnetic

everything.

Quoted message said:

Ilsa9 is timeless & eternal.

Seriously, Anth, your access to 1gram Tablets of Vit-A-Min C are not at

risk by

Quoted message said:

Codex. You can easily get high doses of that in fruits & vegetables, and

yes,

Quoted message said:

supplements.

Now, Anth, why do you keep calling the pharmaceutical companies "crooks"

when

Quoted message said:

they sell prescription meds but view them as potential victims of CoDeX

when

Quoted message said:

they sell vitamins. IOW, don't you realize the same people you vilify for
selling pharaceuticals manufacture a large percentage of supplements?

Oranges are a good source of vitamin c, perhaps you know of other fruits
which I can use to get 1-5g of ascorbate ?
I have no idea what you are talking about, or what you are trying to say -
you explain to me how it's fair for the consumer to package
little vitamin pills up and sell them at a higher price than a big pill at
lower price?
BTW
If you continue to have childish [censored] names like 'codex knows best'
etc., in an attempt to rile me then I will cease responding to your posts.
Anth

"Codex Knows Best" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

C'mon llsa - use your brain - since when can you get 1 gram from fruit

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

veggies?
I'd have to eat 15 oranges for 1g, and since I sometimes take 2-5g that's

an

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

incredible amount of fruit.

Are oranges the only source? Are 1gram tablets being banned? You have
options, Anth.

Quoted message said:

Unlike gorillas who munch all day, and burn off the sugars in doing do, I
could not possibly do what they do
and stay healthy. Pharma companies are crooks because they have been
demonstrated to be so by law.

Yeah, yeah. Now answer the question that you avoided. Why don't you

realize

Quoted message said:

that the same company you call crooked when it sells Neurontin is the same

one

Quoted message said:

you consider to be a victim of Codex when it sells vitamins. IOW, why

don't

Quoted message said:

you understand that the mainstream pharmaceutical companies produce a lot

of

Quoted message said:

the supplements and that they are don't require an Rx?

Quoted message said:

Anth

Found this
http://www.naturalhub.com/natural_food_guide_fruit_vitamin_c.htm
I've have to eat 1/2 kilo of some of these things (That I've not seen in the
shops)
'Camu Camu' - what the hell?
Anth

After a bit of thought it makes more sense for me to pay the extra and get
some of these - Camu Camu or Rosehip.
(If I can find them in the UK I will)
There you go, who says I don't change my mind?
Anth

"Anth" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oranges are a good source of vitamin c, perhaps you know of other fruits
which I can use to get 1-5g of ascorbate ?

Well, the fact that few of NATURE'S foods have that much vit-a-min C should
tell you something. Its just not that important beyond the basic RDA.

Quoted message said:

I have no idea what you are talking about, or what you are trying to say

Ok.
-

Quoted message said:

you explain to me how it's fair for the consumer to package
little vitamin pills up and sell them at a higher price than a big pill at
lower price?

What I am saying is: Why do you call the Industry that sells Neurontin
"crooked" and yet you want to buy vit-a-mins from them? Don't you see the
inconsistency inherent in such a proposition?

And, so I can have you unconditional approval, what Screen Names would you
accept?

BTW

Quoted message said:

If you continue to have childish [censored] names like 'codex knows best'
etc., in an attempt to rile me then I will cease responding to your posts.
Anth

"Codex Knows Best" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

"Anth" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oranges are a good source of vitamin c, perhaps you know of other fruits
which I can use to get 1-5g of ascorbate ?

While not a fruit, try broccoli, a regular in our household.

Quoted message said:

I have no idea what you are talking about, or what you are trying to say -
you explain to me how it's fair for the consumer to package
little vitamin pills up and sell them at a higher price than a big pill at
lower price?
BTW
If you continue to have childish [censored] names like 'codex knows best'
etc., in an attempt to rile me then I will cease responding to your posts.
Anth

"Codex Knows Best" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

C'mon llsa - use your brain - since when can you get 1 gram from fruit

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

veggies?
I'd have to eat 15 oranges for 1g, and since I sometimes take 2-5g

that's

Quoted message said:

an

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

incredible amount of fruit.

Are oranges the only source? Are 1gram tablets being banned? You have
options, Anth.

Quoted message said:

Unlike gorillas who munch all day, and burn off the sugars in doing do,

I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

could not possibly do what they do
and stay healthy. Pharma companies are crooks because they have been
demonstrated to be so by law.

Yeah, yeah. Now answer the question that you avoided. Why don't you

realize

Quoted message said:

that the same company you call crooked when it sells Neurontin is the

same

Quoted message said:

one

Quoted message said:

you consider to be a victim of Codex when it sells vitamins. IOW, why

don't

Quoted message said:

you understand that the mainstream pharmaceutical companies produce a

lot

Quoted message said:

of

Quoted message said:

the supplements and that they are don't require an Rx?

Quoted message said:

Anth

I juice broccoli (usually every day) as it is said to inhibit colon cancer.
It doesn't contain enough ascorbate for me though, I have to balance
calories vs nutrients which is a hard thing to do.
Anth

"M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t-May 17, 2004" <M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t
[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Anth" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Oranges are a good source of vitamin c, perhaps you know of other fruits
which I can use to get 1-5g of ascorbate ?

While not a fruit, try broccoli, a regular in our household.

Quoted message said:

I have no idea what you are talking about, or what you are trying to

say -

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

you explain to me how it's fair for the consumer to package
little vitamin pills up and sell them at a higher price than a big pill

at

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

lower price?
BTW
If you continue to have childish [censored] names like 'codex knows best'
etc., in an attempt to rile me then I will cease responding to your

posts.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anth

"Codex Knows Best" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

>C'mon llsa - use your brain - since when can you get 1 gram from

fruit

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and

Quoted message said:

>veggies?
>I'd have to eat 15 oranges for 1g, and since I sometimes take 2-5g

that's

Quoted message said:

an

Quoted message said:

>incredible amount of fruit.

Are oranges the only source? Are 1gram tablets being banned? You

have

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

options, Anth.

>Unlike gorillas who munch all day, and burn off the sugars in doing

do,

Quoted message said:

I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>could not possibly do what they do
>and stay healthy. Pharma companies are crooks because they have been
>demonstrated to be so by law.

Yeah, yeah. Now answer the question that you avoided. Why don't you

realize

Quoted message said:

that the same company you call crooked when it sells Neurontin is the

same

Quoted message said:

one

Quoted message said:

you consider to be a victim of Codex when it sells vitamins. IOW,

why

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

don't

Quoted message said:

you understand that the mainstream pharmaceutical companies produce a

lot

Quoted message said:

of

Quoted message said:

the supplements and that they are don't require an Rx?

>Anth