UK and Europe · Public discussion

Re: Advice on MTB purchase

Simon Brooke · 2004-09-04T17:05:05+00:00

in message , blackbat Thanks all for your replies, if my nascent cycling hobby does blossom I can see me getting to know this group well. I found out that the Cyclone has 1.5 slick tyres, I didn't know they were slicks. I also mentioned that if I opted for the Cyclone with it's quick release wheels I could get another set of wheels with gnarly tyres and have the best of both worlds. At this point the guy said that he uses a Ridgeback (Nemesis?) for road use but has upgraded it to disk brakes as that years model didn't have them as standard. To do this he abandoned the original wheels as they didn't accept disk brakes. He said they would have cost approx £140 new (his Ridgeback was a better spec bike than the Cyclone) & offered to sell them for £30 with used 2" gnarly tyres. What d'ya think? Seems like a good idea but I'd liked to have at least seen the MX35. If you're happy with the bike, bite his hand off. That's a good price for a pair of wheels and tyres, and if they're coming from a reputable cycle shop owner they should be reasonably OK. The spec on the bike also looks not bad for the price. Just a question on geometry - a MTB seems to have a more upright set-up than the urban/road, the bars higher than the saddle. Is this to generate more power by leaning forward on the road bikes or purely for comfort on the MTB? No. Serious mountain bikes[1], like all serious diamond frame bikes, have the handlebars level with or lower than the saddle. They need to be both for aerodynamics and, I believe, also for power. What you're seeing is hardtail bikes with the suspension uncompressed. In use it will compress about 25% to 30% of its total travel just from the rider weight, and this will bring the front down. Also many modern mountain bikes have exceedingly 'compact' frame geometry and are designed to be ridden with a lot of seatpost showing. [1] Except specialist downhill bikes, which are not really intended to be pedalled very far anyway and are more like engineless motor bikes. -- [email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/ ;; better than your average performing pineapple

Started by Simon Brooke · 4 September 2004 · Last activity 6 September 2004 · 8 posts · 418 views

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01 / Original postRe: Advice on MTB purchaseSimon Brooke · 4 Sep 2004 02 / This pagePosts 1–8Page 1 of 1 · chronological order 03 / Latest replyPost #8Ambrose Nankivell · 6 Sep 2004

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Original section: UK and Europe
Published: 4 September 2004
Last activity: 6 September 2004
Original author: Simon Brooke
Posts: 8
Discussion status: Public discussion
Total views: 418
Views / 30 days: 0
Topics: Mountain biking Chain wear Frame geometry Punctures and flats

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Original post
Simon Brooke
Archived post

4 September 2004, 17:05 UTC #1

in message <[email hidden]>, blackbat
(') said:
Thanks all for your replies, if my nascent cycling hobby does blossom
I can see me getting to know this group well.
I found out that the Cyclone has 1.5 slick tyres, I didn't know they
were slicks. I also mentioned that if I opted for the Cyclone with
it's quick release wheels I could get another set of wheels with
gnarly tyres and have the best of both worlds. At this point the guy
said that he uses a Ridgeback (Nemesis?) for road use but has upgraded
it to disk brakes as that years model didn't have them as standard. To
do this he abandoned the original wheels as they didn't accept disk
brakes. He said they would have cost approx £140 new (his Ridgeback
was a better spec bike than the Cyclone) & offered to sell them for
£30 with used 2" gnarly tyres.
What d'ya think? Seems like a good idea but I'd liked to have at least
seen the MX35.
If you're happy with the bike, bite his hand off. That's a good price
for a pair of wheels and tyres, and if they're coming from a reputable
cycle shop owner they should be reasonably OK. The spec on the bike
also looks not bad for the price.
Quoted message said:
Just a question on geometry - a MTB seems to have a more upright
set-up than the urban/road, the bars higher than the saddle. Is this
to generate more power by leaning forward on the road bikes or purely
for comfort on the MTB?
No. Serious mountain bikes[1], like all serious diamond frame bikes,
have the handlebars level with or lower than the saddle. They need to
be both for aerodynamics and, I believe, also for power. What you're
seeing is hardtail bikes with the suspension uncompressed. In use it
will compress about 25% to 30% of its total travel just from the rider
weight, and this will bring the front down. Also many modern mountain
bikes have exceedingly 'compact' frame geometry and are designed to be
ridden with a lot of seatpost showing.
[1] Except specialist downhill bikes, which are not really intended to
be pedalled very far anyway and are more like engineless motor bikes.
--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; better than your average performing pineapple

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Simon Brooke
Archived post

4 September 2004, 22:05 UTC #2

in message <[email hidden]>, blackbat
(') said:
The guy in the shop said the cyclone had nine sprockets but the wheels
he might sell me have eight. He said it's not a prob as they are the
same size cassette - does this sound right?
Yes. I have an eight speed shifter on my Mantra but a nine speed
cassette. This of course means I can't select my highest gear but as
it's mostly a messing about bike anyway it's not too much of a problem.
If you put an eight speed cassette onto a bike that's set up for a nine
speed one then you will have to set the limit screws on your rear
deraileur to prevent selecting the gear that isn't there. This will be
a hassle because it will mean either that you have to reset your
deraileur every time you change between your road and off-road
wheelsets, or else that you permanently lock out your topmost gear.
Alternatively, a new 9 speed cassette would cost about £25 (Shimano
HG50); this would make your two wheelsets interchangeable without
problem.
--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; All in all you're just another hick in the mall
-- Drink C'lloid

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Chris Davies
Archived post

5 September 2004, 08:34 UTC #3

On Sat, 04 Sep 2004 22:05:06 GMT, Simon Brooke <[email hidden]>
Quoted message said:
in message <[email hidden]>, blackbat
(') said:
The guy in the shop said the cyclone had nine sprockets but the wheels
he might sell me have eight. He said it's not a prob as they are the
same size cassette - does this sound right?
Yes. I have an eight speed shifter on my Mantra but a nine speed
cassette. This of course means I can't select my highest gear but as
it's mostly a messing about bike anyway it's not too much of a problem.
If you put an eight speed cassette onto a bike that's set up for a nine
speed one then you will have to set the limit screws on your rear
deraileur to prevent selecting the gear that isn't there. This will be
a hassle because it will mean either that you have to reset your
deraileur every time you change between your road and off-road
wheelsets, or else that you permanently lock out your topmost gear.
Alternatively, a new 9 speed cassette would cost about £25 (Shimano
HG50); this would make your two wheelsets interchangeable without
problem.
One thing to worry about, though, might be that casettes and chains are
really meant to wear out as a unit. Swapping wheels without also swapping
the chain might lead to problems with slipping gears.
The Maxxis Xenith is a great tyre for tarmac, but pretty awful on gravel
and mud (I have owned a Cyclone, and can tell you this from bitter
experience). At the price of speed, you might find just running one set of
wheels with gnarlies is a good idea.
The wheelset the guy in the shop is offering you sounds excellent.
Personally I would run it with gnarlies. They are not as fast (or IMO good
looking) as slicks, but still perfectly rideable, but when you're
offroading, you will find them much better. Or buy the wheels, a set of
gnarlies, and slicks. Swapping tyres is nearly as quick as changing a
wheel if you practise.
--
|C|H|R|I|S|@|T|R|I|N|I|T|Y|W|I|L|L|S|.|C|O|M|
Remove the bars to contact me

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James Annan
Archived post

5 September 2004, 09:16 UTC #4

Chris Davies said:
One thing to worry about, though, might be that casettes and chains are
really meant to wear out as a unit.
eh? Using a badly worn chain will rapidly wear out a new cassette, but
it wouldn't take much preventative maintenance to ... erm, prevent that
problem arising.
James
--
If I have seen further than others, it is
by treading on the toes of giants.
http://www.ne.jp/asahi/julesandjames/home/

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Andy
Archived post

5 September 2004, 10:58 UTC #5

"Chris Davies" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
On Sat, 04 Sep 2004 22:05:06 GMT, Simon Brooke <[email hidden]>
wrote:
Quoted message said:
One thing to worry about, though, might be that casettes and chains are
really meant to wear out as a unit. Swapping wheels without also swapping
the chain might lead to problems with slipping gears.
Sorry but that's twaddle. Changing a chain when it's reached an acceptable
wear limit will allow you to keep your cassette with a new chain.

Report
Simon Brooke
Archived post

5 September 2004, 13:08 UTC #6

in message <[email hidden]>, Andy
(') said:

"Chris Davies" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
On Sat, 04 Sep 2004 22:05:06 GMT, Simon Brooke <[email hidden]>
wrote:
Quoted message said:
One thing to worry about, though, might be that casettes and chains
are really meant to wear out as a unit. Swapping wheels without also
swapping the chain might lead to problems with slipping gears.
Sorry but that's twaddle. Changing a chain when it's reached an
acceptable wear limit will allow you to keep your cassette with a new
chain.
Attributions, please. I didn't write any of that, and I agree with you
its twaddle.
--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; Usenet: like distance learning without the learning.

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Andy
Archived post

5 September 2004, 13:16 UTC #7

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
in message <[email hidden]>, Andy
(') said:

"Chris Davies" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
On Sat, 04 Sep 2004 22:05:06 GMT, Simon Brooke <[email hidden]>
wrote:
Quoted message said:
One thing to worry about, though, might be that casettes and chains
are really meant to wear out as a unit. Swapping wheels without also
swapping the chain might lead to problems with slipping gears.
Sorry but that's twaddle. Changing a chain when it's reached an
acceptable wear limit will allow you to keep your cassette with a new
chain.
Attributions, please. I didn't write any of that, and I agree with you
its twaddle.
--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; Usenet: like distance learning without the learning.
Sorry, missed out a line when trimming original :-)

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Ambrose Nankivell
Archived post

6 September 2004, 11:26 UTC #8

Chris Davies said:
On Sat, 04 Sep 2004 22:05:06 GMT, Simon Brooke <[email hidden]>
Quoted message said:
in message <[email hidden]>, blackbat
(') said:
The guy in the shop said the cyclone had nine sprockets but the wheels
he might sell me have eight. He said it's not a prob as they are the
same size cassette - does this sound right?
Yes. I have an eight speed shifter on my Mantra but a nine speed
cassette. This of course means I can't select my highest gear but as
it's mostly a messing about bike anyway it's not too much of a problem.
If you put an eight speed cassette onto a bike that's set up for a nine
speed one then you will have to set the limit screws on your rear
deraileur to prevent selecting the gear that isn't there. This will be
a hassle because it will mean either that you have to reset your
deraileur every time you change between your road and off-road
wheelsets, or else that you permanently lock out your topmost gear.
Alternatively, a new 9 speed cassette would cost about Â£25 (Shimano
HG50); this would make your two wheelsets interchangeable without
problem.
One thing to worry about, though, might be that casettes and chains
are really meant to wear out as a unit. Swapping wheels without also
swapping the chain might lead to problems with slipping gears.
The Maxxis Xenith is a great tyre for tarmac, but pretty awful on
gravel and mud (I have owned a Cyclone, and can tell you this from
bitter experience). At the price of speed, you might find just running
one set of wheels with gnarlies is a good idea.
The Maxxis Xenith is by no stretch of the imagination a great tyre. It
has higher rolling resistance than the knobblies on my mountain bike,
yet is still very prone to picking up punctures.
A

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