Rack and mudguard stays on same bolt

Ben Mack used his keyboard to write :

Quoted message said:

Hi All

Got a bit of a puzzle on my new Specialized Sirrus

Trying to mount a rack (EX1) and full mudguards. There is only one bolt
hole on the rear axle carrier (or whatever it's called)

Dropout (plus mudguard eyelet).

Quoted message said:

so both have to
go on the same bolt. The mudguard stays go inside the rack stay
(otherwise I have to twist the stays round each other). So I end up with
the rack stay cantilevered out on the end of the bolt, because of the
mudguard stay thickness. Also I cannot tighten the bolt much 'cos the
mudguard stay eyelet starts to open.

Is there another way to tackle this?

I'm wondering if I can find a small flat plate with two holes in (bit
like a short piece of meccano), that I can fit on the bolt holding the
rack, then bolt the mudguard stays to the other end?

I'd stick with your current solution. 25 years ago very few frames had
double eyelets, and your arrangement was standard.

The extension is just going to be something else to vibrate loose, and
certainly won't be as rigid as your current set up.

Quoted message said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

I presume you mean the bosses near the top of the seatstays? It sounds
a bit of a bodge. Not a lot you can do about it, unfortunately. 10mm is
a long way out!

--
Simon
www.simondaw.freeserve.co.uk

Ben Mack said:

Trying to mount a rack (EX1) and full mudguards. There is only one bolt
hole on the rear axle carrier (or whatever it's called), so both have to
go on the same bolt. The mudguard stays go inside the rack stay
(otherwise I have to twist the stays round each other). So I end up with
the rack stay cantilevered out on the end of the bolt, because of the
mudguard stay thickness. Also I cannot tighten the bolt much 'cos the
mudguard stay eyelet starts to open.

Is there another way to tackle this?

I'd be tempted to use p-clips for the mudguards.

Anthony

Ben Mack said:

Hi All

Got a bit of a puzzle on my new Specialized Sirrus

Trying to mount a rack (EX1) and full mudguards. There is only one bolt
hole on the rear axle carrier (or whatever it's called), so both have to
go on the same bolt. The mudguard stays go inside the rack stay
(otherwise I have to twist the stays round each other). So I end up with
the rack stay cantilevered out on the end of the bolt, because of the
mudguard stay thickness. Also I cannot tighten the bolt much 'cos the
mudguard stay eyelet starts to open.

Is there another way to tackle this?

I have one eylet on my tourer and my rack an mudguards have been fine
for the last 19 years and many thousands of miles. The rack should be
nearest the frame because it carries most weight, mine isn't, it's fine
so this is not crucial. A washer might stop the mudguard stay
spreading.

Quoted message said:

I'm wondering if I can find a small flat plate with two holes in (bit
like a short piece of meccano), that I can fit on the bolt holding the
rack, then bolt the mudguard stays to the other end?

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

Thats very shoddy,are you sure its not the rack that is out. I hope the
frame is correct in all other respects, such as each fork blade/seat
stay/chainstay the same length. Doesn't give me much confidence about
the quality of Specialized frames, the one I rode a few weeks ago was
quite good too,

Ben Mack said:

Hi All

Got a bit of a puzzle on my new Specialized Sirrus

<snip>

Quoted message said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

If its new and they are 10mm out, take it back to the shop and have them
replace it with a non-shoddy frame under warranty.

--
Tony

"The best way I know of to win an argument is to start by being in the
right."
- Lord Hailsham

Ben Mack said:

Hi All

Got a bit of a puzzle on my new Specialized Sirrus

Trying to mount a rack (EX1) and full mudguards. There is only one bolt
hole on the rear axle carrier (or whatever it's called), so both have to
go on the same bolt. The mudguard stays go inside the rack stay
(otherwise I have to twist the stays round each other). So I end up with
the rack stay cantilevered out on the end of the bolt, because of the
mudguard stay thickness. Also I cannot tighten the bolt much 'cos the
mudguard stay eyelet starts to open.

Is there another way to tackle this?

I assume the leg of the rack is pushing into the stays. So try a
washer. A flat surface may avoid the problem.

Tony Raven said:

Ben Mack said:

Hi All

Got a bit of a puzzle on my new Specialized Sirrus

<snip>

Quoted message said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

If its new and they are 10mm out, take it back to the shop and have them
replace it with a non-shoddy frame under warranty.

--
Tony

Or insist that they braze on a new eyelet in the right position for the
rack and whilst they are at it to add a pair for the mudguards.

cheers

Jacob

Quoted message said:

Or insist that they braze on a new eyelet in the right position for the
rack and whilst they are at it to add a pair for the mudguards.

Who wants a brand new bike with a respray because of brazing done to
correct a poor build? To say nothing of if the builder was sloppy
there, what about the rest of the joints?

--
Tony

"The best way I know of to win an argument is to start by being in the
right."
- Lord Hailsham

Quoted message said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

Sounds shoddy. I just took a look at my Sirrus and they are lined up OK.

Rather than fit a full mudguard I've got a rack with a solid top and a short
mudguard attached to the back of that.
Doesn't cover the front section of the wheel but that doesn't seem to be a
problem and it stops the stripe-up-the-back effect just fine.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If its new and they are 10mm out, take it back to the shop and
have them replace it with a non-shoddy frame under warranty.

-- Tony

Quoted message said:

Or insist that they braze on a new eyelet in the right position for
the rack and whilst they are at it to add a pair for the mudguards.

And a new paint job - take it back and get it replaced or get a full
refund.

--
A T (Sandy) Morton
on the Bicycle Island
In the Global Village
http://www.millport.net

Quoted message said:

Or insist that they braze on a new eyelet in the right position for
the rack and whilst they are at it to add a pair for the mudguards.

It's an Aluminium frame, doesn't that mean brazing's out of the question?
Which is immaterial anyway, as the OP should just request a refund.

Ben Mack said:

Got a bit of a puzzle on my new Specialized Sirrus

Trying to mount a rack (EX1) and full mudguards. There is only one
bolt hole on the rear axle carrier (or whatever it's called), so both
have to go on the same bolt.

On my Pletscher I can mount the mudguard stays on the rack rather then
on the frame. Tubus offers this option on some racks also.

Quoted message said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

Is this a frame suitable for mounting a rear disk brake? If so, these
frames are sometimes quite odd-shaped for giving clearing for a rack
and the disk caliper. Might well be that the non-symmetric eyelets are
not a sign of a faulty built. Provided this is the case you will need a
rack with adjustable legs. Surly and Pletscher come to mind. Other
companies might have similar products.

Günther

I'm not too sure what the question is but here perhaps this is the
answer, or at least how I have done it. Again apologies if I have
misunderstood the proposition.

Take a long bolt and insert it from the inside of the frame outwards.
Place the rack on the bolt, add washer, add nut, lock tight, place
another washer on top of the nut, add mudguard stays, add washer, add
nut, or indeed at this state I add two nuts. Cut off surplus bolt with
hacksaw and clean with file.

In article <[email hidden]>, Günther Schwarz

() said:

Ben Mack said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

Is this a frame suitable for mounting a rear disk brake? If so, these
frames are sometimes quite odd-shaped for giving clearing for a rack
and the disk caliper. Might well be that the non-symmetric eyelets are
not a sign of a faulty built.

My Trek 4300 frame is like this, and that's not even disc-compatible!
It has got some odd holes on the nearside chainstay/seatstay junction,
but they're not spaced to fit any disc brake caliper made of man.

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
Dead journalists make excellent objets d'art.

Dave Larrington said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Günther Schwarz

() said:

Ben Mack said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

Is this a frame suitable for mounting a rear disk brake? If so, these
frames are sometimes quite odd-shaped for giving clearing for a rack
and the disk caliper. Might well be that the non-symmetric eyelets are
not a sign of a faulty built.

My Trek 4300 frame is like this, and that's not even disc-compatible!
It has got some odd holes on the nearside chainstay/seatstay junction,
but they're not spaced to fit any disc brake caliper made of man.

I've seen frames where the RH mounting point was moved up to make room
for a redesigned replacable derailleurhanger. Ofcourse nobody bothered
to update the drawing for the lefthand part

--
---
Marten Gerritsen

INFOapestaartjeM-GINEERINGpuntNL
www.m-gineering.nl

In article <[email hidden]>, Simon D
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Ben Mack used his keyboard to write :

Quoted message said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

I presume you mean the bosses near the top of the seatstays?

No, I mean the threaded holes on the dropout

--
Ben Mack
Watchfront Electronics - Bespoke R&D - http://www.watchfront.co.uk/
Watchfront Internet - ADSL, Colo - http://www.watchfront.net/
Are you bricking it? - Firewalls - http://www.firebrick.co.uk/

In article <[email hidden]>, M-gineering
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

I've seen frames where the RH mounting point was moved up to make room
for a redesigned replacable derailleurhanger. Ofcourse nobody bothered
to update the drawing for the lefthand part

Mmm, it is the RH one that is higher...

--
Ben Mack
Watchfront Electronics - Bespoke R&D - http://www.watchfront.co.uk/
Watchfront Internet - ADSL, Colo - http://www.watchfront.net/
Are you bricking it? - Firewalls - http://www.firebrick.co.uk/

In article <[email hidden]>, citizen142
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Take a long bolt and insert it from the inside of the frame outwards.
Place the rack on the bolt, add washer, add nut, lock tight, place
another washer on top of the nut, add mudguard stays, add washer, add
nut, or indeed at this state I add two nuts. Cut off surplus bolt with
hacksaw and clean with file.

I did wonder about that. However if I put the mudguard stay outside the
rack stay, I have to twist the mudguard stay around the rack stay, messy
and will probably rattle.

If I do this with the stays the other way round, the rack stays just get
pushed further out (and they are already a long way out, with the EX1
you have to flex the stays out, and it takes some doing!)

I'll occasionally be putting a child seat on this rack, which is why I'm
keen to get a solid fitting

Cheers
--
Ben Mack
Watchfront Electronics - Bespoke R&D - http://www.watchfront.co.uk/
Watchfront Internet - ADSL, Colo - http://www.watchfront.net/
Are you bricking it? - Firewalls - http://www.firebrick.co.uk/

In article <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven <junk@raven-
family.com> writes

Quoted message said:

Ben Mack said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

If its new and they are 10mm out, take it back to the shop and have them
replace it with a non-shoddy frame under warranty.

Hmmmm, a few of you said that, think I will go back to the shop and see
what they say

Thanks all
--
Ben Mack
Watchfront Electronics - Bespoke R&D - http://www.watchfront.co.uk/
Watchfront Internet - ADSL, Colo - http://www.watchfront.net/
Are you bricking it? - Firewalls - http://www.firebrick.co.uk/

Ben Mack has brought this to us :

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Simon D
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Ben Mack used his keyboard to write :

Quoted message said:

While I'm on the subject, I discovered that the frame holes are about
10mm higher on one side than the other, which tilts the rack to one
side. A bit annoying, means I have to grind a slot in the rack stay.

I presume you mean the bosses near the top of the seatstays?

No, I mean the threaded holes on the dropout

In that case I'd take the frame back to the supplier, as others have
suggested, unless it's clearly a (not very helpful) design feature.

--
Simon
www.simondaw.freeserve.co.uk