Racing titanium?

Bigbananabike said:

-Someone should teach Colnago a thing or two about building bikes....🙂

WOT??!! 😄

Bigbananabike said:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
It was the tube - not the weld. Someone should teach Colnago a thing or two about building bikes....🙂

Haha, super funny. Our biggest in-state rival races them. I know many people who like them, but obviously that's the last bike I'd choose to ride!

Ti actually for racing would be the best material if your involved in a crash. Steel too. Carbon and aluminum would be more likely to need replacement if the crash is fairly serious.
If you check on the internet you can often find great prices on Ti frames and complete bikes.

Wurm said:

WOT??!! 😄

I was trying to be funny. Actually I WAS being funny - someone further down got it:o

Hogan said:

Does anyone have experience racing with titanium frames? Pros/cons, etc. I am a newbie and in the market for a new frame and have not seen many or is carbon the only way to go?
Thanks

I race on Al and train on 3-2.5 Ti. My Ti bike is obvious slower than my Al on a local climb. I like stiff frame and wheels for climb.

Bigbananabike said:

I was trying to be funny. Actually I WAS being funny - someone further down got it:o

And I meant to show I was laughing about it. 🙂

alpha2k said:

I race on Al and train on 3-2.5 Ti. My Ti bike is obvious slower than my Al on a local climb. I like stiff frame and wheels for climb.

How exactly is it obviously slower?

alienator said:

How exactly is it obviously slower?

From his post, it looks like his Ti bike does not have wheels.🙄

Yes, that would probably slow one down.

Hi,

It`s simple, do your homework, ignore the nonsense, ride some bikes ...

1. Titanium cannot corrode

I have a 10year old Gazelle team frame, it`s perfect

2. I have ridden steel 531 / 653 / 753 / 853

Deddacci aluminium

3. I now have a DeRosa Titanio XS made to measure

I thought the 753 built by Gerald O`Donovan was sweet

The Gazelle is a great frame , stiffer, more comfortable , more responsive

The DeRosa is totally awesome, its like getting out of a family car into a
Ferrari, my LBS Pedalsport who supplied is ex national squad, he has
ridden allsorts, took the DeRosa for a proper ride and came back much
to his surprise and said it`s the best bike I have ever ridden ! It`s
Record equipped.
It`s silky smooth, cushy ride, it accerlates like an arrow sprinting,
it carves round corners precisely, like a plane slicing through hardwood.

4. Titanium is not `out of fashion` there are actually more TI bikes
appearing.

5. As with all materials the `builder` has to understand the material,
be able to work with it professionally, and undstand frame geometry
etc, many don`t seem to ... It was a little concerning spending nearly
3 times the price of the Gazelle ti but the DeRosa is worth every penny,
ask anyone else who owns one !

Bigbananabike said:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
It was the tube - not the weld. Someone should teach Colnago a thing or two about building bikes....🙂

Ti isn't indestructible. The welded part area can become stronger than the tube be it Al, Steel or Ti.

alienator said:

How exactly is it obviously slower?

With my max effort, the climb takes me 16' - 16'20'' for Al againest 17'+ for Ti. The Ti setup is about 2 pounds heavier than Al one.
The climb is a classic local racing and training course. My club always starts the racing season with a climb TT on it in March each year. I trained a lot there and every one or two monthes, I tested my fitness improvement with TT effort. I wrote down the time and avg/max HR in my training diary(i don't have a power meter) to keep track of my progress.

alpha2k said:

With my max effort, the climb takes me 16' - 16'20'' for Al againest 17'+ for Ti. The Ti setup is about 2 pounds heavier than Al one.
The climb is a classic local racing and training course. My club always starts the racing season with a climb TT on it in March each year. I trained a lot there and every one or two monthes, I tested my fitness improvement with TT effort. I wrote down the time and avg/max HR in my training diary(i don't have a power meter) to keep track of my progress.

I dont think its the frame material making you slow. 2 pounds makes a lot of difference in a climb. Same engine + heavier car = slower time.

hd reynolds said:

I dont think its the frame material making you slow. 2 pounds makes a lot of difference in a climb. Same engine + heavier car = slower time.

I don't think the 2 pounds leads to the 1' difference, maybe 1/3 of it.

As I mentioned in my previous post, my Ti bike is wholely made of 3-2.5 Ti. I heard some good stories on the stiffer 6-4 Ti. I guess, a bike made of 6-4 Ti or at least with a 6-4 Ti BB shell is a good racing bike.

BTW, I like the ride feel of my Ti bike very much and hate to be on the faster Al bike.

hd reynolds said:

I dont think its the frame material making you slow. 2 pounds makes a lot of difference in a climb. Same engine + heavier car = slower time.

Two pounds makes little difference on a climb. That's the math says. Difference in stiffness likely means as little or less. Hell, even the bicycle experts agree how important "stiffness" is.

Likely the difference is in conditioning between different "tests", different levels of effort, and a psychological edge. A blind test would likely reveal a much smaller difference.

alpha2k said:

As I mentioned in my previous post, my Ti bike is wholely made of 3-2.5 Ti. I heard some good stories on the stiffer 6-4 Ti. I guess, a bike made of 6-4 Ti or at least with a 6-4 Ti BB shell is a good racing bike.

I don't think material has anything to do with it. I have an Klein made from AL. I also have a Moots made from ti. I have not actually measured them, but to my calibrated eyeballs the tubes in the main triangle of both bikes look to be the same diameter. If there is a difference it has be nothing more than a few millimeters. The only visible difference in the main triangle is the Moots' top tube is slightly flattened near the seat tube cluster. Guess what? I cannot tell the difference in stiffness. If there is any difference in climbing speed it is just noise buried in large differences in how I perform on a day to day basis.

You may have a flexy ti bike but it's not due to the material, it's due to how the material was used. Heck, I am not even sure how much flexiness affects performance. How much power can be lost due to BB flex?

alienator said:

Two pounds makes little difference on a climb. That's the math says. Difference in stiffness likely means as little or less. Hell, even the bicycle experts agree how important "stiffness" is.

Likely the difference is in conditioning between different "tests", different levels of effort, and a psychological edge. A blind test would likely reveal a much smaller difference.

Likely the diff is marketing, wanting to own the most "exclusive" or "blingy" bike/parts. or both. And marketing.

titancorsa said:

The DeRosa is totally awesome, its like getting out of a family car into a
Ferrari, my LBS Pedalsport who supplied is ex national squad, he has
ridden allsorts, took the DeRosa for a proper ride and came back much
to his surprise and said it`s the best bike I have ever ridden ! It`s
Record equipped.
It`s silky smooth, cushy ride, it accerlates like an arrow sprinting,
it carves round corners precisely, like a plane slicing through hardwood.

5. As with all materials the `builder` has to understand the material,
be able to work with it professionally, and undstand frame geometry
etc, many don`t seem to ... It was a little concerning spending nearly
3 times the price of the Gazelle ti but the DeRosa is worth every penny,
ask anyone else who owns one !

What if you presented the De Rosa in plain paint and says cromoly made in china all over, I wonder what the reaction will be. I think the brand or name painted on the frame is partly responsible for the wow feeling.

hd reynolds said:

What if you presented the De Rosa in plain paint and says cromoly made in china all over, I wonder what the reaction will be. I think the brand or name painted on the frame is partly responsible for the wow feeling.

Then the rider would say that it accelerated like a parapalegic turtle, because it's absolutely not the rider that makes the bike go, it's the brand....er.....I mean the material....er........something. 🙄

titancorsa said:

Hi,

It`s simple, do your homework, ignore the nonsense, ride some bikes ...

1. Titanium cannot corrode

I have a 10year old Gazelle team frame, it`s perfect

2. I have ridden steel 531 / 653 / 753 / 853

Deddacci aluminium

3. I now have a DeRosa Titanio XS made to measure

I thought the 753 built by Gerald O`Donovan was sweet

The Gazelle is a great frame , stiffer, more comfortable , more responsive

The DeRosa is totally awesome, its like getting out of a family car into a
Ferrari, my LBS Pedalsport who supplied is ex national squad, he has
ridden allsorts, took the DeRosa for a proper ride and came back much
to his surprise and said it`s the best bike I have ever ridden ! It`s
Record equipped.
It`s silky smooth, cushy ride, it accerlates like an arrow sprinting,
it carves round corners precisely, like a plane slicing through hardwood.

4. Titanium is not `out of fashion` there are actually more TI bikes
appearing.

5. As with all materials the `builder` has to understand the material,
be able to work with it professionally, and undstand frame geometry
etc, many don`t seem to ... It was a little concerning spending nearly
3 times the price of the Gazelle ti but the DeRosa is worth every penny,
ask anyone else who owns one !

I'll stick with the Madone, thanks though.