RAAM - Casualty list

"Callistus Valerius" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The only one I can't figure out is Kern getting pulmonary edema. Isn't
that

what you get in the death zone while climbing Everest? I know they are
riding at altitude, but that seems strange.

It's endemic to recumbent riders. That and deep vein thrombosis.

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In article <[email hidden]>,

Callistus Valerius said:

The only one I can't figure out is Kern getting pulmonary edema. Isn't that
what you get in the death zone while climbing Everest? I know they are
riding at altitude, but that seems strange.

_ One study that crops in various skiing NG claims that roughly
10-20% of the people tested coming from lower altitude to CO ski resorts
have mild pulmonary edema symptoms. Not enough to kill you, but
enough to make aerobic efforts difficult.

_ Booker C. Bense

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B. Lafferty said:

"Callistus Valerius" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The only one I can't figure out is Kern getting pulmonary edema. Isn't
that

what you get in the death zone while climbing Everest? I know they are
riding at altitude, but that seems strange.

It's endemic to recumbent riders. That and deep vein thrombosis.

Is that true?

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

"Mark & Steven Bornfeld" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:Kn%jg.3140$2R.399@trndny02...

Quoted message said:

B. Lafferty said:

"Callistus Valerius" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

>The only one I can't figure out is Kern getting pulmonary edema. Isn't
>that

what you get in the death zone while climbing Everest? I know they are
riding at altitude, but that seems strange.

It's endemic to recumbent riders. That and deep vein thrombosis.

Is that true?

Steve

Sure it is. You believe me, don't you? ;-)

A bigger surprise, Robic is out, too,

"Callistus Valerius" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

James Kern, who was aiming to be the first Solo Recumbent finisher, has
pulmonary edema. Lou Lamoureux has dropped out after a crash. Orlando
Borini had back problems that he could not shake.

Team Cyclonauts and Team Nor'easter, have sent riders to the hospital in
Brawley, Calif. The latter's rider was blown off his bike by crosswinds
that sent him skidding 5-10 yards. His fall left him unconscious but he
is
now awake and on the mends.

Valentin Zeller, of Austria, dropped out in Flagstaff, AZ after a valiant
effort to overcome the serious dehydration he suffered on Sunday.
------------
The only one I can't figure out is Kern getting pulmonary edema. Isn't
that
what you get in the death zone while climbing Everest? I know they are
riding at altitude, but that seems strange.

Mark & Steven Bornfeld said:

Quoted message said:

It's endemic to recumbent riders. That and deep vein thrombosis.

Is that true?

Steve

The only physical issues that are significant that I've heard
discussed are:

1. Swollen hands for those that ride with under seat sterring. I
experience that only to the point that my class ring can be difficult
to remove (for the record, I've never tried to remove the wedding
ring, but it seems tighter...).

2. Numb feet - lots of theories. Not related to swelling - my feet are
more elevated on the recumbent than a diamond frame and, frankly, I
experienced more numbness back in the days of clips and cleats.

3. Numb butt, recumbent butt, whatever. Never experienced this.

The deep vein thrombosis thing I've not heard discussed or experienced
it or had my GP - also a recumbent rider - bring up at all. Or
pulmonary issues, other than the more supine position seems to effect
heart rate and pulse while riding IMO - its harder to move into the
upper ranges when riding on my recumbent with a heart monitor compared
to the Fuji. Discussed it with a couple of exercise oriented
physicians, but they didn't seem all that interested.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

B. Lafferty said:

"Mark & Steven Bornfeld" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:Kn%jg.3140$2R.399@trndny02...

Quoted message said:

B. Lafferty said:

"Callistus Valerius" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

>>The only one I can't figure out is Kern getting pulmonary edema. Isn't
>>that
>
>what you get in the death zone while climbing Everest? I know they are
>riding at altitude, but that seems strange.

It's endemic to recumbent riders. That and deep vein thrombosis.

Is that true?

Steve

Sure it is. You believe me, don't you? ;-)

In all seriousness, I would think the muscular activity of the legs
would be enough to discourage thrombosis of the legs. However, other
parts of the body are relatively static over long periods of time, and I
wouldn't be surprised at all if some weird [censored] happened.

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

"Mark & Steven Bornfeld" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:YFdkg.12291$hN2.1408@trnddc05...

Quoted message said:

B. Lafferty said:

"Mark & Steven Bornfeld" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:Kn%jg.3140$2R.399@trndny02...

Quoted message said:

B. Lafferty wrote:

>"Callistus Valerius" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
>news:[email hidden]...
>
>
>>>The only one I can't figure out is Kern getting pulmonary edema.
>>>Isn't that
>>
>>what you get in the death zone while climbing Everest? I know they are
>>riding at altitude, but that seems strange.
>
>
>It's endemic to recumbent riders. That and deep vein thrombosis.

Is that true?

Steve

Sure it is. You believe me, don't you? ;-)

In all seriousness, I would think the muscular activity of the legs would
be enough to discourage thrombosis of the legs. However, other parts of
the body are relatively static over long periods of time, and I wouldn't
be surprised at all if some weird [censored] happened.

Steve

In all seriousness, I was kidding. I have a friend who did PAC Tour on a
recumbent (first one to do the Northern Route on one) and he never had a
problem. It seems odd that Kenny Souza was complaining of a lung infection,
too. Some sort of bug going around from the pre-race get together? I have
my doubts about Souza making it to Atlantic City.

It was somewhat surprising to have Patty Jo Struv retire with saddle after
so few miles.
The two Bs in the Enduro seem to be having a good back and forth battle.
Nice to follow.

in message <Kn%jg.3140$2R.399@trndny02>, Mark & Steven Bornfeld

(') said:

B. Lafferty said:

"Callistus Valerius" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

>The only one I can't figure out is Kern getting pulmonary edema.
>Isn't that

what you get in the death zone while climbing Everest? I know they
are riding at altitude, but that seems strange.

It's endemic to recumbent riders. That and deep vein thrombosis.

Is that true?

I find it highly unlikely. I suffer from recurrent deep vein thrombosis,
and what the physiotherapists want me to do about it is to exercise with
my feet higher than my hips. I would expect recumbent riding to lower,
not raise, the risk of DVT.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
,/| _.--''^``-...___.._.,;
/, \'. _-' ,--,,,--'''
{ \ `_-'' ' /
`;;' ; ; ;
._..--'' ._,,, _..' .;.'
(,_....----''' (,..--''

Simon Brooke said:

I find it highly unlikely. I suffer from recurrent deep vein thrombosis,
and what the physiotherapists want me to do about it is to exercise with
my feet higher than my hips. I would expect recumbent riding to lower,
not raise, the risk of DVT.

I don't suppose you've considered the possibility that your physiotherapist
is actually a woman you jilted in high school who you've forgotten about,
except she hasn't forgotten about you and hates you for the way you treated
her, which wasn't really all that bad but she's psychotic and is now
obsessed with the idea of revenge against you, transferring all the rage
and shame she's felt in her life onto you simply because you were the first
that made her angry and she blames all her subsequent emotional pain on you
(if only you had been nicer to her), and she is trying to kill you? Life
is unfair that way sometimes, but it's always a good idea to get a second
opinion in medical situations just in case something like this is going on
and riding a recumbent is the exact opposite of what you should be doing
(e.g., flying non-stop from New York to Sydney in one of those new
"standing" airline seats). If your physiotherapist is a man, it could be
he is the brother/father/uncle of the woman you jilted.

--
Bill Asher

"William Asher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Simon Brooke said:

I find it highly unlikely. I suffer from recurrent deep vein thrombosis,
and what the physiotherapists want me to do about it is to exercise with
my feet higher than my hips. I would expect recumbent riding to lower,
not raise, the risk of DVT.

I don't suppose you've considered the possibility that your
physiotherapist
is actually a woman you jilted in high school who you've forgotten about,
except she hasn't forgotten about you and hates you for the way you
treated
her, which wasn't really all that bad but she's psychotic and is now
obsessed with the idea of revenge against you, transferring all the rage
and shame she's felt in her life onto you simply because you were the
first
that made her angry and she blames all her subsequent emotional pain on
you
(if only you had been nicer to her), and she is trying to kill you? Life
is unfair that way sometimes, but it's always a good idea to get a second
opinion in medical situations just in case something like this is going on
and riding a recumbent is the exact opposite of what you should be doing
(e.g., flying non-stop from New York to Sydney in one of those new
"standing" airline seats). If your physiotherapist is a man, it could be
he is the brother/father/uncle of the woman you jilted.

--
Bill Asher

Makes sense.

Simon Brooke said:

I find it highly unlikely. I suffer from recurrent deep vein thrombosis,
and what the physiotherapists want me to do about it is to exercise with
my feet higher than my hips. I would expect recumbent riding to lower,
not raise, the risk of DVT.

I would too. I don't know if they keep stats for deep ass
thrombosis--that may be another matter.

Steve

Quoted message said:

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

William Asher said:

Quoted message said:

I don't suppose you've considered the possibility that your
physiotherapist
is actually a woman you jilted in high school who you've forgotten about,
except she hasn't forgotten about you and hates you for the way you
treated
her, which wasn't really all that bad but she's psychotic and is now
obsessed with the idea of revenge against you, transferring all the rage
and shame she's felt in her life onto you simply because you were the
first
that made her angry and she blames all her subsequent emotional pain on
you
(if only you had been nicer to her), and she is trying to kill you? Life
is unfair that way sometimes, but it's always a good idea to get a second
opinion in medical situations just in case something like this is going on
and riding a recumbent is the exact opposite of what you should be doing
(e.g., flying non-stop from New York to Sydney in one of those new
"standing" airline seats). If your physiotherapist is a man, it could be
he is the brother/father/uncle of the woman you jilted.

B. Lafferty said:

Makes sense.

Don't worry, you're not paranoid; LANCE is really out to get you.

Donald Munro said:

B. Lafferty said:

Makes sense.

Don't worry, you're not paranoid; LANCE is really out to get you.

Have you ever wondered if Lance slipped something to Brian to make him
obsessive so that nobody would take his accusations seriously? What better
way for Lance to hide the truth than to discredit his fiercest critics on
usenet.

--
Bill Asher

Curtis L. Russell said:

The deep vein thrombosis thing I've not heard discussed or experienced
it or had my GP - also a recumbent rider - bring up at all. Or
pulmonary issues, other than the more supine position seems to effect
heart rate and pulse while riding IMO - its harder to move into the
upper ranges when riding on my recumbent with a heart monitor compared
to the Fuji. Discussed it with a couple of exercise oriented
physicians, but they didn't seem all that interested.

When I started riding a recumbent I noticed that my HR was lower for the same power
output. I haven't seen any explanation for this other than that the heart doesn't work
as hard when the body is not in a vertical position. I also noticed that when I started
taking a beta-blocker for heart arrhythmias (AF), my average HR went down by about 20
bpm, and my performance on the recumbent didn't suffer much if at all. But, on the
upright bike and when hiking at altitude I am now noticeably slower.

I'm sure we'll learn in due time exactly what happened to Jim Kern. He has done well
in recent events (e.g. Race Across Oregon 2005), but he does suffer from asthma and has
run into breathing problems in hot dry air before. I hope he makes a full recovery.

--
Bill Bushnell
http://pobox.com/~bushnell/