Question For Everyone

Oh yeah - had a clean license and nary a parking ticket (OK - just one
where I knowingly parked illegally and lost!) since 20th July 1983, five
months after my 17th birthday, but I can't honestly claim never to have
exceeded the speed limit.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

Ian Smith said:

Nuxx Bar said:

Spindrift claims that, despite driving regularly, he never speeds.  
 Do you believe him?

I have no evidence to justify disbelieving him.

I have six legs. You have no evidence to justify disbelieving me, but
the fact that no-one has six legs should give the game away as to
whether I'm telling the truth.

Similarly, the fact that all drivers speed gives you a pretty good
idea about whether Spindrift's telling the truth.

Quoted message said:

I cycle regularly and never go through correctly functioning red
traffic lights or the wrong way down one-way streets.  Are you also
going to call me a liar?

No, because that's completely different to "never speeding". You
don't need to almost go through red lights or almost go the wrong way
down one-way streets the whole time that you're moving.

You lot are so pathetic. None of you will admit that all regular
drivers speed, not because you don't think it's true, but because
you're rightly scared that it will make you look stupid. Absolutely
spineless.

There may be a few absolute menaces who only ever drive just down the
road and back and never go about 15mph, but they're not what I'd call
regular drivers. Anyone who drives regularly, and regularly goes more
than a few miles from their house, and is in possession of their
marbles, speeds. You know it, I know it.

If you take a stance, like "Speeding is always bad", and then you find
yourself having to say ridiculous things as a result of that stance,
like "Not all regular drivers speed", then it's very likely that the
original stance is fundamentally flawed. This instance is no
exception. Just admit that cameras are a load of [censored] and speeding
can be perfectly safe, and you'll no longer be forced to make the
ludicrous assertions. Surely it's worth it, even if you do have to
swallow your pride when you say "I was wrong". I actually think it
would take courage to admit that you were wrong. It's never too
late. Please consider it.

Nuxx Bar said:

Ian Smith said:

Nuxx Bar said:

Spindrift claims that, despite driving regularly, he never speeds.  
 Do you believe him?

I have no evidence to justify disbelieving him.

the fact that all drivers speed gives you a pretty good
idea about whether Spindrift's telling the truth.

Your supposed fact is not substantiated, so your argument is bogus.
You are (technically) begging the question - it's one of the classic
basic fallacies.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I cycle regularly and never go through correctly functioning red
traffic lights or the wrong way down one-way streets. Are you also
going to call me a liar?

No, because that's completely different to "never speeding". You
don't need to almost go through red lights or almost go the wrong way
down one-way streets the whole time that you're moving.

I do not need to almost break the speed limit. Your 'because' is
bogus.

In fact, of course - I _do_ need to almost go through red lights. If
I didn't go through traffic signals within a second or two of them
being red, I would be run down and/or accused of obstructing the
highway.

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

Nuxx Bar said:

You lot are so pathetic. None of you will admit that all regular
drivers speed, not because you don't think it's true, but because
you're rightly scared that it will make you look stupid. Absolutely
spineless.

I'll quite happily admit that most drivers speed. However, I know
that 'most' is not the same as 'all' and can recognise bogus logic
when I see it.

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

God you're a bore. That's what gets me most about the trolls, they
very rarely say anything remotely interesting, even unintentionally.

Ian Smith said:

Nuxxy - everyone else understands simple statements.  You don't need
to assume we all have your levels of comprehension.

Oh no! Please don't! You're being so horrible! How can I make you
stop? I'll do anything!

Quoted message said:

If someone says
they never speed, I see no particular reason to disbelieve them.

Except that they're lying, but apart from that, no.

Just face it will you? There's little that's more pathetic than
someone denying something that's true just because it's inconvenient
to them. Accept reality and deal with it.

Quoted message said:

Obviously (from your inability to accept the statements of others)
your driving is of a very poor standard, and you struggle to control
your speed, but that doesn't necessarily apply to everyone else.  Not
everyone is the same as you.  Many of us are grateful for this.

Ah yes, yet again we have the trolling assertion that speeding equals
poor driving. I don't "struggle to control my speed", I realise that
not going too fast is infinitely more important than keeping below the
speed limit (which, these days, may well be far too low). I also
realise that many, many other factors are more important than keeping
below the speed limit. Therefore keeping below the speed limit
doesn't figure all that high on my list of priorities, and it's the
same with any half-decent driver.

If you don't realise these things, then you're stupid. And if you
don't realise from the statistics that cameras don't help, and
actually cost lives, then you're stupid. If (like Spindrift, Chapman
and others) you do realise both those things, but still campaign for
cameras because they're nifty motorist-persecuting machines, you're
scum. Simple.

Quoted message said:

regards,   Ian SMith

Jellybelly.

Nat said:

It is possible not to speed in my car because I have a thing called a
speedo and a thingy called a break (sorry for no technical names, I am
a girl). I have found them very useful in my years of driving as they
prevent me from speeding quite well. When I seee a 30 sign, I push
this break thing till the number on the speedo says 30 or less.

I never said it wasn't "possible not to speed". However, in practice,
it *is* impossible for a regular, remotely competent driver who ever
goes more than a few miles from their home to keep up the not speeding
100.00000000% of the time. Anyone who claims to be able to manage
that is likely always making improbable, arrogant claims about their
abilities.

(And if you're going to be patronising, it's best to learn how to
spell simple words like "brake".)

Nuxx Bar said:

I don't "struggle to control my speed",

So you deliberately break the law when driving. That's interesting,
and explains a degree of your opposition to sensible enforcement of
the law. Do you deliberately flout many other laws?

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

Nat said:

Na, I brake slowly and in good time like I was taught so by the time I
pass the sign I am doing 30.

*Every* *single* *time*? You're never even going at 30.5mph when you
pass it? What about when you go from a 30 zone into an NSL? Do you
never accelerate to even 30.5mph before you pass the NSL sign?

If you honestly do do that *every* *single* *time*, then to be honest
you're attaching way more importance to numerical speed than is
required, probably at the expense of other, more important factors.
You simply don't need to ensure that you're below exactly 30.000mph
every single time you pass the 30 (or NSL) sign. That's never been
what good driving was about. (Of course the trolls here seem to think
that good driving is about nothing but keeping to the speed limit.
Crazy.)

"Nuxx Bar" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
I never said it wasn't "possible not to speed". However, in practice,
it *is* impossible for a regular, remotely competent driver who ever
goes more than a few miles from their home to keep up the not speeding
100.00000000% of the time. Anyone who claims to be able to manage
that is likely always making improbable, arrogant claims about their
abilities.

What is the chance there will be a safety camera there at the point in the
driver's journey where they *just* stray from the speed limit for that
*tiny* proportion of their journey? Very small.

--
Simon Mason
http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/

you know? said:

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 02:54:59 -0700 (PDT), Nuxx Bar
<[email hidden]> said in
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

Spindrift claims that, despite driving regularly, he never speeds.  Do
you believe him?

More to the point, do we care? At all?  Even a tiny bit?

OK. I think we've established beyond any kind of doubt that you hate
motorists, you're a callous scumbag who doesn't care about road users
dying, and you're basically a bit of a [censored]. I will now skip all of
your posts without exception. Bye.

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 10:05:42 -0700 (PDT), Nuxx Bar
<[email hidden]> wrote:

You said you would go. Or was that a lie?

-NUX QUOTE-

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So admit that cameras cost lives, admit that you only support them
because you hate motorists (and possibly because of a financial
interest), and we can all go home.

-REPLY-

Quoted message said:

We admit cameras cost lives, we support them because we hate motorists
and because they subsidise cyclists.

"Nuxx Bar" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

You lot are so pathetic. None of you will admit that all regular
drivers speed, not because you don't think it's true, but because
you're rightly scared that it will make you look stupid. Absolutely
spineless.

That's because it is not true.

A lot of drivers speed, but not all.
A lot of drivers use their mobile phone when driving, but not all.
A lot of drivers park illegally, but not all.

You are making a sweeping statement. There are plenty of law abiding drivers
out there, don't be silly.

--
Simon Mason
http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/

"Nuxx Bar" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Nat said:

Na, I brake slowly and in good time like I was taught so by the time I
pass the sign I am doing 30.

*Every* *single* *time*? You're never even going at 30.5mph when you
pass it? What about when you go from a 30 zone into an NSL? Do you
never accelerate to even 30.5mph before you pass the NSL sign?

Speedos aren't accurate to +/- 0.5 mph. They are designed to read high to be
on the safe side. If the speedo is reading 30 mph then you are more than
likely doing 27-28 mph.

Even so, ACPO guidelines state you are given 10% plus 2 mph before you're
fined. Which means you won't get done unless you are doing 36 mph plus, so
there is no need to worry about 0.5 mph here and there.

--
Simon Mason
http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 07:37:16 -0700 (PDT), Nuxx Bar
<[email hidden]> said in
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Why not? Neither do I - that's why I have a clean licence and have done
since 1996. I don't park illegally as well and lo and behold I have never
had a parking ticket either. How odd.

Oh look, another liar.

Prove it. Using objective and verifiable evidence, not
proof-by-assertion.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

85% of helmet statistics are made up, 69% of them at CHS, Puget Sound

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 18:36:17 +0100, "Simon Mason"
<[email hidden]> said in
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

What is the chance there will be a safety camera there at the point in the
driver's journey where they *just* stray from the speed limit for that
*tiny* proportion of their journey? Very small.

Especially when you consider that you have to *just* stray from the
speed limit by over 10%.

I think the major problem is that people think 30mph means "30-ish
and certainly not much more than 40, or at least not for long". And
then when they stray over the *ACPO prosecution guidelines* by a few
mph, they manage to persuade themselves that actually they only
strayed over the *speed limit* by a few mph and act all aggrieved
when Nasty Mr. Justice Cocklecarrot tells them that actually, no, it
means not more than *30*, just like it says in the book.

It is actually trivially easy to keep within the limit. What
Nuxxy's ilk will not accept is that depending on conditions this
might mean a speed of between about 25mph and 30mph in a 30 zone,
when they want to do at least 35 because they think they won't be
prosecuted at that speed. And who are we to disagree? It is, after
all, the guy behind in the BMW who owns the road, as his actions
make perfectly plain.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

85% of helmet statistics are made up, 69% of them at CHS, Puget Sound

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 10:37:59 -0700 (PDT), Nuxx Bar
<[email hidden]> said in
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I will now skip all of
your posts without exception. Bye.

Would you mind skipping all of yours, instead? Thanks awfully.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

85% of helmet statistics are made up, 69% of them at CHS, Puget Sound

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 09:52:18 -0700 (PDT), Nuxx Bar
<[email hidden]> said in
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

I have six legs.

You are Gregor Samsa and I claim my five pounds.

Quoted message said:

You have no evidence to justify disbelieving me, but
the fact that no-one has six legs should give the game away as to
whether I'm telling the truth.

Quoted message said:

Similarly, the fact that all drivers speed gives you a pretty good
idea about whether Spindrift's telling the truth.

You appear to be having difficulty differentiating /fact/ from
/assertion/. It is a /fact/ that there are no documented instances
of humans with six legs (outside of the realms of fiction). It is
your /assertion/ that all drivers speed, but you have not proved
your assertion.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

85% of helmet statistics are made up, 69% of them at CHS, Puget Sound

On Apr 16, 5:13 pm, "Simon Mason" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

"Nuxx Bar" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...
On Apr 16, 1:55 pm, "Simon Mason" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

"Nuxx Bar" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Spindrift claims that, despite driving regularly, he never speeds. Do
you believe him?

Quoted message said:

Why not? Neither do I - that's why I have a clean licence
So just to confirm that you're saying that you never exceed the >speed
limit, by any amount, for any amount of time?

That is correct, yes.

Do you have cruise control?

On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 12:50:02 -0700 (PDT), Nuxx Bar
<[email hidden]> said in
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

Do you have cruise control?

Oooh! Me! I do!

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

85% of helmet statistics are made up, 69% of them at CHS, Puget Sound