Question for cyclists...

flyingdutch said:

Uncle Bully said:

What bike lanes would those be? We don't have any where I live.

Yippee!!!

that means you are nowhere near me 😄

LOL, mustn't be here either.

--
Peter McCallum
Mackay Qld AUSTRALIA

Uncle Bully said:

What is with lanesplitting to the front of traffic at a red light, then
pulling in front of everyone so that when the light turns green everyone has
to wait for you because you are by far the slowest thing on the road?

I do it when there's a danger of being hit when the light changes if I
don't - narrow lanes and dual-purpose straight/turning lanes are the
most common reasons.

If that slows you down a little, tough - I don't design the roads, and
I'm entitled to do what's necessary for my safety, including using an
entire lane when necessary.

--
Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw

Uncle Bully said:

What about the people who are faster than you, yet still have to wait?

What about them? There is no guarantee of being able to travel at the
speed limit, regardless of your maximum possible speed or acceleration.
They don't entitle you to right of way.

--
Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw

HellenWheels said:

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 11:25:51 +0930, Michael Warner <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Uncle Bully said:

What is with lanesplitting to the front of traffic at a red light, then
pulling in front of everyone so that when the light turns green everyone has
to wait for you because you are by far the slowest thing on the road?

I do it when there's a danger of being hit when the light changes if I
don't - narrow lanes and dual-purpose straight/turning lanes are the
most common reasons.

If that slows you down a little, tough - I don't design the roads, and
I'm entitled to do what's necessary for my safety, including using an
entire lane when necessary.

You'd think. But today I'm riding down a very short, low traffic, narrow
side street with on-street parking on one side. Some lady in a compact car
is coming towards me, having just turned the corner from a four-way stop.

On -her- side of the road someone has parked a truck. So naturally she
thinks nothing of coming over to -my- side of the street, and I have
reached the front of truck first on my bike.

I see her coming right at me at only about 10km/hr, slowly and she is
angling right at me - I couldn't believe it!

I had some room on my side for an emergency dive-out, being in the left
tire track postion about 2 feet from the side of the road. She had plenty
of room to get by the truck even still.

About ten feet before 'impact', she suddenly does a quick tire squeeking
yank of the wheel back to her side and I go by without incident.

Whew, that was a close one...wouldn't have been fun, even though I was at
about 8km/hr, but that's a first for me.

I should have U-turned and gone back and gotten her license number, because
it was coming into my neighborhood, and I suspect she was one of my
neighbors!

Had I been a car, she would have definitely stopped on her side behind the
truck to allow me by, but because I'm a bicycle, there's no entitlement in
some people's minds when it all comes down to it.

Not sure if it was inattention or she tied to play "chicken". It was too
brief to do much about it...and fortunately slow...

-Wheels

Had a near miss once.. in glenferrie rd hawthorn when the mini I was
beside pulled straight in the bike lane without looking.. I braked hard
and he came across just in front of me, overtook a half dozen cars.. on
the left and then turned left

Unluckily for him he was one of my work collegues.

🙂

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 11:25:51 +0930, Michael Warner <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Uncle Bully said:

What is with lanesplitting to the front of traffic at a red light, then
pulling in front of everyone so that when the light turns green everyone has
to wait for you because you are by far the slowest thing on the road?

I do it when there's a danger of being hit when the light changes if I
don't - narrow lanes and dual-purpose straight/turning lanes are the
most common reasons.

If that slows you down a little, tough - I don't design the roads, and
I'm entitled to do what's necessary for my safety, including using an
entire lane when necessary.

You'd think. But today I'm riding down a very short, low traffic, narrow
side street with on-street parking on one side. Some lady in a compact car
is coming towards me, having just turned the corner from a four-way stop.

On -her- side of the road someone has parked a truck. So naturally she
thinks nothing of coming over to -my- side of the street, and I have
reached the front of truck first on my bike.

I see her coming right at me at only about 10km/hr, slowly and she is
angling right at me - I couldn't believe it!

I had some room on my side for an emergency dive-out, being in the left
tire track postion about 2 feet from the side of the road. She had plenty
of room to get by the truck even still.

About ten feet before 'impact', she suddenly does a quick tire squeeking
yank of the wheel back to her side and I go by without incident.

Whew, that was a close one...wouldn't have been fun, even though I was at
about 8km/hr, but that's a first for me.

I should have U-turned and gone back and gotten her license number, because
it was coming into my neighborhood, and I suspect she was one of my
neighbors!

Had I been a car, she would have definitely stopped on her side behind the
truck to allow me by, but because I'm a bicycle, there's no entitlement in
some people's minds when it all comes down to it.

Not sure if it was inattention or she tied to play "chicken". It was too
brief to do much about it...and fortunately slow...

-Wheels

HellenWheels said:

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 12:23:15 +1000, dave <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not sure if it was inattention or she tied to play "chicken". It was too
brief to do much about it...and fortunately slow...

-Wheels

Had a near miss once.. in glenferrie rd hawthorn when the mini I was
beside pulled straight in the bike lane without looking.. I braked hard
and he came across just in front of me, overtook a half dozen cars.. on
the left and then turned left

Unluckily for him he was one of my work collegues.

🙂

Hope you were diplomatic, rather than, uh 'ballistic'. ;-D

-Wheels

You clearly dont know me 🙂

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 12:23:15 +1000, dave <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not sure if it was inattention or she tied to play "chicken". It was too
brief to do much about it...and fortunately slow...

-Wheels

Had a near miss once.. in glenferrie rd hawthorn when the mini I was
beside pulled straight in the bike lane without looking.. I braked hard
and he came across just in front of me, overtook a half dozen cars.. on
the left and then turned left

Unluckily for him he was one of my work collegues.

🙂

Hope you were diplomatic, rather than, uh 'ballistic'. ;-D

-Wheels

HellenWheels said:

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 13:16:15 +1000, dave <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

HellenWheels said:

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 12:23:15 +1000, dave <[email hidden]>
wrote:

>>Not sure if it was inattention or she tied to play "chicken". It was too
>>brief to do much about it...and fortunately slow...
>>
>>-Wheels
>>
>
>
>Had a near miss once.. in glenferrie rd hawthorn when the mini I was
>beside pulled straight in the bike lane without looking.. I braked hard
>and he came across just in front of me, overtook a half dozen cars.. on
>the left and then turned left
>
>Unluckily for him he was one of my work collegues.
>
>🙂

Hope you were diplomatic, rather than, uh 'ballistic'. ;-D

-Wheels

You clearly dont know me 🙂

So how long before the Veloflex Carbon Tubular Road Tire
track on his forehead faded out? ;-Þ

-Wheels

Oh he had a nervous breakdown and left..

So I dont really know 😉

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 13:16:15 +1000, dave <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

HellenWheels said:

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 12:23:15 +1000, dave <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

>Not sure if it was inattention or she tied to play "chicken". It was too
>brief to do much about it...and fortunately slow...
>
>-Wheels
>

Had a near miss once.. in glenferrie rd hawthorn when the mini I was
beside pulled straight in the bike lane without looking.. I braked hard
and he came across just in front of me, overtook a half dozen cars.. on
the left and then turned left

Unluckily for him he was one of my work collegues.

🙂

Hope you were diplomatic, rather than, uh 'ballistic'. ;-D

-Wheels

You clearly dont know me 🙂

So how long before the Veloflex Carbon Tubular Road Tire
track on his forehead faded out? ;-Þ

-Wheels

"flyingdutch" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Uncle Bully said:

What bike lanes would those be? We don't have any where I live.

Yippee!!!

that means you are nowhere near me 😄

and if you reckon you're MORE in control on a motorbike you are
seriously deluded. I raced Superbikes with my bro for years in another
lifetime, have ridden virtually every size of bike in all conditions
and I can assure you i have FAR more control on a bicycle.

Good for you. News alert, I'm not you.

Quoted message said:

(over
70-80kph i would agree with you tho...). Not to mention you can get
yourself INTO trouble on abike SOOO much easier.
run along trolly-wolly 🙄

Always funny when someone identifies a Troll yet still can't control
themnselves enough to not respond....

Uncle Bully said:

Always funny when someone identifies a Troll yet still can't control
themnselves enough to not respond....

There's a first, a troll that admits they're a troll. Was commenting on
this morning's ride, this must be the most well fed troll in a long time.

DaveB

"dave" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Uncle Bully said:

Go out on a track sometime and watch how much deeper into a corner even a
standard Mitsi Mirage can get compared to a sportsbike .
You clearly have no experience with this.

NRMA test figures for standard Mirage braking performance

http://motoring.racv.com.au/racvm/fsearch_show.cfm?id=88763AB7-A3E2-11D4-B8010000E8961DD1

Braking distance from 100 kph 45.9 metres

In a test of HS ABS systems .. the NON ABS sportsbikes managed 34.6 metres
from 100 kph
http://jw4u.com/vehicles/automobile/abs/realtest.htm

Less than I would have thought but what do I know?

You clearly don't know the difference between manufacturer published figures
and professional racers on race bikes, with reaction time not taken into
account.
Even an R1 which is *the* performance bike has a braking distance @ 100km/h
closer to 40m. (still better than a Mirage I admit, but an R1 is hardly
average)

Quoted message said:

In a study by the International Motorcycle Safety Conference in 2001
http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:sd3dGhYnhLYJ:www.uem-online.org/html2/tourism/rs/ecker_pap02.pdf++motorcycle+vs+car+braking+distances&hl=en
they showed that a bike with ABS can fractionally outbrake a car (typical
passenger car) with ABS.. (By about 8 metres from 100 kph) and various non
ABS equiped bikes and riders lost to the ABS car ( average about 20
metres which is more than I would have guessed) There was no nonABS car
in this comparism.

Um, a BMW K1200 LT is not a sportsbike by any means and is a little
misleading to use this particular bike when, in the exact same study, the
test bikes and rider's own bike perfoming a lot worse. Also pretty much no
bikes have ABS outside of BMW.

Quoted message said:

Of course this is braking only not braking and cornering.. which is
obviously something cars do better than bikes but then thats what we
started of talking about. Dont really see the mirage humiliating the
sportsbike here tho.

Ok the Mirage may have been exaggerating to make a point, but that doesn't
change the fact that cars generally outbrake bikes.

Quoted message said:

Ohh and I think I might have been to a racetrack or two in my time..
Sa what was that place in Kent called Rands Satch or something?

Never been there, but I know my std Commodore brakes better than my standard
CBR.

Quoted message said:

So how long before the Veloflex Carbon Tubular Road Tire
track on his forehead faded out? ;-Þ

Dude, this is the second time you used veiled threats like this in the
newsgroup posting implying that if we were all sitting around in a
restaurant discussing this that you'd want to win the argument by physical
intimidation.

All that tells us is that you don't have sufficient debate or discussion
skills. Do you really want to be perceived in that light?

Nobody here wants to harm you, or delay you, or even slightly inconvenience
you. These are all very nice, very friendly people - many people are.
Just as many practice restraint as an art form.

Regardless of any pugilistic skills I may have I would -never- participate
in any road rage or physical mayhem, because it would detract from my sole
purpose on the roads, which is to enjoy riding my bike.

Uncle Bully said:

Quoted message said:

So how long before the Veloflex Carbon Tubular Road Tire
track on his forehead faded out? ;-Þ

Dude, this is the second time you used veiled threats like this in the
newsgroup posting implying that if we were all sitting around in a
restaurant discussing this that you'd want to win the argument by physical
intimidation.

All that tells us is that you don't have sufficient debate or discussion
skills. Do you really want to be perceived in that light?

Nobody here wants to harm you, or delay you, or even slightly inconvenience
you. These are all very nice, very friendly people - many people are.
Just as many practice restraint as an art form.

Regardless of any pugilistic skills I may have I would -never- participate
in any road rage or physical mayhem, because it would detract from my sole
purpose on the roads, which is to enjoy riding my bike.

That's what -he- said... but I give it about 0.01 on the Troll-o-meter and
you're plonked, dimwit.

-Wheels

Uncle Bully said:

Regardless of any pugilistic skills I may have I would -never- participate
in any road rage or physical mayhem, because it would detract from my sole
purpose on the roads, which is to enjoy riding my bike.

Let's hope you soon find a more worthwhile purpose /off/ the roads, too.

--
Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw

And there I was under the impression that veicular traffic has to give way to all non-motorised traffic on the road.

That’s why motorists have to be careful when out driving, It’s not for their sakes but everyone else out on the roads. Cars are built in such a way that you could hit a street pole & get off quite comfortably. This is reflected in the behaviours of some motorists where even though they may not be in total charge of their facalities – like poor eye sight, disabiling arthritis, physical injuries or conditions which may impead physcial co-ordination, reflex action or good judgement – the option of driving comes easy, as it’s seems the ‘safest’ means for them to get about.

I don’t want to preach the contention that cyclists are ‘holier than thou’, but they (we) should be regarded as having different needs from other road traffic & treated accordingly. This means things like letting them in where possible, allowing them to filter to the head in the line of traffic, understanding that a cyclists abilities to brake, accellerate & corner are ‘limited’ (different) to other vehcular traffic & may require allowances.
After having said all this it’s important to realise that cyclists go a long way to make allowances for motorised traffic on the road. Some cyclists even take detours & modify their behaviour ot avoid dealing with traffic on an equal basis. Examples like doing a ‘hook turn’ when turning right out of a busy road, utliseing pedstrain corssings & some ‘off’road’ paths to negotciate intersections or roads with no provision for slower moving traffic.

(all this to answer a troll….)

Uncle Bully wrote:

Never been there, but I know my std Commodore brakes better than my standard CBR.

Having driven a Conformadore, I find this quite scary. Conformadore brakes are truly [censored].

I think Bully's question is valid - a lot of cyclists pass traffic only to force traffic to pass them shortly after. This, in most - but not all - cases, is not necessary and it is usually, in my opinion, safer to sit behind the last car in the cue (in the middle of the lane) and ride with traffic until it is safe to move further left. That's how I ride.... not others.

Having said that, I don't think that it is normal to want to implement any sort of scare tactics upon someone just because they do something you don't like. That's just being hostile.

Also, it's wise not to put all cyclists in one basket - the same way, when I'm driving my car, I respect motorcyclists, despite many of them being utter dickwads.

My 2c worth.

LotteBum

LotteBum said:

I think Bully's question is valid - a lot of cyclists pass traffic only to force traffic to pass them shortly after.

I agree with what you're saying and that's how I ride, however I take issue with the ``force'' aspect of the above.

The cyclist may put a motorist in a position where the motorist finds it desireable to overtake, that is a far cry from ``forcing'' the motorist to take action. The motorist is at perfect liberty to overtake or maintain traffic position, the cyclist has no influence on that.

The duty of care is, at all times, on the vehicle overtaking (or in the case of a cyclist, undertaking at times).

LotteBum said:

I think Bully's question is valid - a lot of cyclists pass traffic only
to force traffic to pass them shortly after. This, in most - but not
all - cases, is not necessary and it is usually, in my opinion, safer
to sit behind the last car in the cue (in the middle of the lane) and
ride with traffic until it is safe to move further left. That's how I
ride.... not others.

It seems to me Vicroads is encouraging the pass on the left and then
block off the head of the traffic method. On the multi-lane roads I ride
along with marked bike lanes, when I get to traffic lights there is
usually a box with a bike outline sitting across the front of the left
lane. I'll take what VicRoads want me to do with a grain of salt but
that is telling me, ride along the bike lane and when you get to the
front of the traffic, move to the centre of the car lane (I'm assuming
to minimise the risk of being hit by left turn traffic).

Quoted message said:

Having said that, I don't think that it is normal to want to implement
any sort of scare tactics upon someone just because they do something
you don't like. That's just being hostile.

Oh my gawd, aliens have abducted LotteBum and replaced her with a
cyclist that is non-violent. A pacifist with a shottie, that I want to see.

DaveB

HellenWheels said:

That's not cool. An experienced cyclist should not 'filter up'.

Quoted message said:

The other time is if there is an extremely long line of cars.

That would be two cars then.

Theo