Q Factor

iridemymuni said:

all this Q factor rubbish is really annoying me.

from my understanding, Q factor comes from bicycling, and is the
distance between pedals. ( i think )

but the majority of unicyclists use the Q factor to indicate how far
out the pedal is from the bit of the crank that goes onto the hub.

therefore i think we should adapt the Q factor for unicyclists, and
change it's meaning from the bicycling world. thus:

Q FACTOR IS THE DISTANCE FROM THE PEDAL TO THE BIT WHERE
THE CRANK GOES ONTO THE HUB, MEASURED FROM THE START POINT OF THE THE
CRANK AT THE HUB, TO THE END POINT OF THE CRANK ON THE PEDAL SIDE.
MEASUREMENT MUST BE MADE IN THE SAME LINEAR DIRECTION AS THE ROTATIONAL
AXIS OF THE HUB AND PEDAL.

that sounded rather shonky, can somebody maybe fix it up?

(something like this may have already been posted but i havent seen
one, so dont shoot me if there already is one 🙂 )

there is one, but its all good, the Q factor should stay the way it is
because it determines how the unicycle rides i.e. big Q factor = wobbly
wheel small Q= smooth rider

how about we call that M(for miss) factor??

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iridemymuni said:

all this Q factor rubbish is really annoying me.

from my understanding, Q factor comes from bicycling, and is the
distance between pedals. ( i think )

but the majority of unicyclists use the Q factor to indicate how far
out the pedal is from the bit of the crank that goes onto the hub.

If you want to describe something different, use a different term.
Q-factor, as it is used in the bicycling world, is absolutely relevant
to unicyclists. For example, on my basketball/freestyle unicycle, I
aim for very low Q-factor; that means a narrow hub, narrow frame, and
straight cranks. (Frame width isn't an issue on bikes, but it does
contribute to Q-factor on unicycles).

What's wrong with simply calling cranks straight or angled, if that's
what you're trying to describe?

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tholub said:

If you want to describe something different, use a different term.
Q-factor, as it is used in the bicycling world, is absolutely relevant
to unicyclists. For example, on my basketball/freestyle unicycle, I
aim for very low Q-factor; that means a narrow hub, narrow frame, and
straight cranks. (Frame width isn't an issue on bikes, but it does
contribute to Q-factor on unicycles).

What's wrong with simply calling cranks straight or angled, if that's
what you're trying to describe?

well, speaking for Iridemymuni, I have a unicycle w/ straight cranks,
but has about 1" of frame clearance (M factor... or should we call it C
factor??)

--
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sorta hardcore for 3 months (before that the only trick i did was a
hop-180 to backwards riding or a spin off of a wall or something

-stephen-
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The Q factor is how far apart the pedals are. We use it to refer to the
extra spread caused by the shape of the cranks because we vaguely
assume (incorrectly) that all hubs are the same width.

Given that cranks are an easily replaceable item, whereas a hub isn't,
it seems reasonable to have a word to describe the specific effect of
the cranks on overall Q factor.

We could call that "additional crank-derived Q factor", or "extra Q
factor arising from the shape of the cranks", or we could just say "Q
factor" and know what we mean.

When did you last look at something a long way away using telescopic
forks?

Disc brakes usually have rings rather than discs.

Is it only Mountain Unicycling if you're on a mountain?

What is a mountain? There are whole countries whose lowest valleys are
higher than England's highest mountains.

How many speeds does a 21 speed bicycle really have?

Unicycle as a verb is not in the Concise Oxford Dictionary.

Nor is unicyclist, as a noun.

Words are used imprecisely, and meanings change. On the rare occasions
when we need to be more specific about Q factor, surely that can be
embodied in the accompanying explanation.

--
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Mikefule said:

The Q factor is how far apart the pedals are. We use it to refer to the
extra spread caused by the shape of the cranks because we vaguely
assume (incorrectly) that all hubs are the same width.

Given that cranks are an easily replaceable item, whereas a hub isn't,
it seems reasonable to have a word to describe the specific effect of
the cranks on overall Q factor.

We could call that "additional crank-derived Q factor", or "extra Q
factor arising from the shape of the cranks", or we could just say "Q
factor" and know what we mean.

When did you last look at something a long way away using telescopic
forks?

Disc brakes usually have rings rather than discs.

Is it only Mountain Unicycling if you're on a mountain?

What is a mountain? There are whole countries whose lowest valleys are
higher than England's highest mountains.

How many speeds does a 21 speed bicycle really have?

Unicycle as a verb is not in the Concise Oxford Dictionary.

Nor is unicyclist, as a noun.

Words are used imprecisely, and meanings change. On the rare occasions
when we need to be more specific about Q factor, surely that can be
embodied in the accompanying explanation.

good explanation, but what about the clearance btw the frame and crank

what do we call that ??

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sorta hardcore for 3 months (before that the only trick i did was a
hop-180 to backwards riding or a spin off of a wall or something

-stephen-
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Mikefule said:

We could call that "additional crank-derived Q factor", or "extra Q
factor arising from the shape of the cranks", or we could just say "Q
factor" and know what we mean.

I don't think it's incorrect to refer to the Q-factor of your cranks.
However, I do think it's incorrect to say that some cranks have
Q-factor and some don't, or that a set of cranks are zero-Q, which is
quite common here. And it's not only a question of language being
descriptive or prescriptive; the idea of a crank having no Q-factor is
the result of sloppy thinking which is likely to lead to incorrect
conclusions.

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tholub said:

I don't think it's incorrect to refer to the Q-factor of your cranks.
However, I do think it's incorrect to say that some cranks have
Q-factor and some don't, or that a set of cranks are zero-Q, which is
quite common here. And it's not only a question of language being
descriptive or prescriptive; the idea of a crank having no Q-factor is
the result of sloppy thinking which is likely to lead to incorrect
conclusions.

lol umm
0 Q factor is techinically possible

... you could have an axle that hooks to the cranks inside the frame
and has the cranks on the opposite side of where they go, assuming they
are perfectly straight
... it would require some crazy spokes

so its a stupid thing to do, but it is possible

--
skrobo

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sorta hardcore for 3 months (before that the only trick i did was a
hop-180 to backwards riding or a spin off of a wall or something

-stephen-
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Whenever I've dealt with cranks in the BMX world, we don't talk about
"Q-Factor".. we talk about OFFSET. Zero Offset means a straight crank,
10mm offset means the ends are shifted 10mm. Makes easy sense to me
when refering to crank arms.

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Racenut
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skrobo said:

lol umm
0 Q factor is techinically possible

Maybe on an ultimate wheel, but not on anything with a frame.

If someone tells me they're cranks have 0 Q factor, I know what they
mean - although it IS incorrect. However, if someone tells me that,
say, Profiles have a bigger Q factor than KH cranks, I also know what
they mean, and it is ALSO correct. On any given hub the profiles will
have a bigger Q factor than KH. So, as long as you are using
qualitative measurements instead of quantitative (bigger/smaller vs
0,1,2,3) you are using the term correctly.

If it really gets people in a huff, however, it I think you should
measure cranks based on the angle off straight they are (5 degree, 10
degree) instead of distance from pedal to hub or pedal to pedal. You
could even call it the Q angle. (my cranks of a 0 Q angle, and my
profiles have a bigger Q angle/factor than my KH's)

You could then have a low Q factor with a high Q angle, or vice versa,
and everyone would know what everyone is talking about. And, since one
is measure in degrees and another in distance, even if you don't have
the factor/angle label correctly, people would still be able to figure
out what you mean.

//edit: although offset would work fine too, especially since it's
already adopted by the industry.

//second edit: maybe angle is dumb, since different length cranks would
then have different "offset." I refer you the above post which was
posted at the same time as mine. I think he's got a better idea than
me.

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