power cranks vs power meter

trilung said:

Being a gadget geek, I'm looking towards my next big purchase for my bike. I figured I'd spend it on training gear. I know power cranks and power meters are two completely different items, but I need help in all areas.
If you were me and wanting to improve performance, efficiency, etc., which training item would you suggest?

Go with a good power meter. There's a fair amount of debate about the effectiveness of power cranks, but power based training is the way to go regardless of what cranks you use. Go with the power meter now and you can always add power cranks to the equation (assuming you don't go the SRM route, but how much money do you have to spend?) in the future if you still think you want to work on your pedal stroke and experiment with their concept.

I'd say the jury's still out on power cranks. I'm not knocking their concept since all I've done is read the claims and some rebuttals. I'm just saying power based training is a sure bet whereas the power cranks won't help you train, measure your overall training load, help plan your peaks or help you pacing in time trials and solo efforts. Nor will power cranks help you assess your current fitness level relative to other cyclists in your category. I know Andy doesn't want us to take those W/Kg charts too literally, but it's pretty helpful to gauge where you are and help manage expectations. If you're only turning 2 W/kg at FTP then you might want to save the entry fee to the district championship TT and continue to train.

Good luck,
Dave

Dave has it right. Go powermeter. Powercranks don't assist you in building power, they just develop muscles (hamstrings) which allow you to relieve your quads possibly leading to greater endurance. Training with a powermeter will allow you to maximise efficiency and pacing. That will lead to a more effective training regime.

find somewhere and test the powercranks. Then ask yourself if you want to change your cycling or measure your cycling

I voted change and went with powercranks but not without trying them first

doh! ....and if all else fails there's the 90 day moneyback thing

markhr said:

find somewhere and test the powercranks. Then ask yourself if you want to change your cycling or measure your cycling

I voted change and went with powercranks but not without trying them first

That's the response that involves no thought.

People that think will know that a power meter is a tool, training aid, and an accurate way to guage and moderate training. If you actually went to any of the hundred or more websites that deal with it, read any of the books or magazine articles that deal with it, then you might know more.

The "power cranks" is THE training tool is about as stupid and ill-informed as something can get.

If you're serious about your training, then a powermeter is the way to go.

alienator said:

...The "power cranks" is THE training tool...If you're serious about your training...is the way to go.

+1

thanks - I think it's a no brainer too

wow, maybe im way off, but my cycling coach as well as many other high level cyclists have told me that you do NOT pull up on your pedal stroke to increase efficiency. Rather you pull over the top and through the bottom to get rid of the weak points of the top and bottom of the stroke. your hamstrings are nowhere near powerful enough to be efficient in matching with your quads, therefore there is a natural rest phase in every pedal motion. i have been told by several that going clipless so that you can pull up is a myth and that clipless pedals are for getting rid of the top and bottom weaknesses in stroke as i mentioned, and for keeping your feet on the pedals at high cadance.

personally i have found this to be pretty accurate. i use to pull up on my stroke thinking it was good practice, but later my coach told me to just pull at the bottom and over the top and that has made all the difference.

markhr said:

+1

thanks - I think it's a no brainer too

Mark you are twisting words. That quote is missing vital information as to wat its correct topic is. Do you work for the media?

alienator said:

The "power cranks" is THE training tool is about as stupid and ill-informed as something can get.

If you're serious about your training, then a powermeter is the way to go.

THAT/\, is what markhr +1 for. Kind of contradicting yourself eh.

stea1thviper said:

wow, maybe im way off, but my cycling coach as well as many other high level cyclists have told me that you do NOT pull up on your pedal stroke to increase efficiency. Rather you pull over the top and through the bottom to get rid of the weak points of the top and bottom of the stroke. your hamstrings are nowhere near powerful enough to be efficient in matching with your quads, therefore there is a natural rest phase in every pedal motion. i have been told by several that going clipless so that you can pull up is a myth and that clipless pedals are for getting rid of the top and bottom weaknesses in stroke as i mentioned, and for keeping your feet on the pedals at high cadance.

personally i have found this to be pretty accurate. i use to pull up on my stroke thinking it was good practice, but later my coach told me to just pull at the bottom and over the top and that has made all the difference.

Thanks, you have confirmed my personal theory. The 'up' stroke is the least efficient time to apply power, followed by the 6 and 12, then the most efficient somewhere around 2-3 and 8-9 depending on seat angle. All you have to do is scrape over the top with the side that is going over the top. Scraping the bottom is optional, the deadspot has already been eliminated.

bobbyOCR said:

Thanks, you have confirmed my personal theory. The 'up' stroke is the least efficient time to apply power, followed by the 6 and 12, then the most efficient somewhere around 2-3 and 8-9 depending on seat angle. All you have to do is scrape over the top with the side that is going over the top. Scraping the bottom is optional, the deadspot has already been eliminated.

Yup. Trying to apply force all the way around the pedal cycle is not a very efficient technique most of the time. I think most experts believe that, now, pulling up in the pedal stroke should only be done when climbing or sprinting. Otherwise, it burns too much energy.

And that points out one weakness of Powercranks: they're a one-dimensional training tool, and by themselves they provide no quantitative measure of how effectively you're training or how your condition is improving. A powermeter provides feedback no matter how you want to train on the bike.

For the cost of Powercranks, a person could buy or build a nice fixie.

alienator said:

Yup. Trying to apply force all the way around the pedal cycle is not a very efficient technique most of the time. I think most experts believe that, now, pulling up in the pedal stroke should only be done when climbing or sprinting. Otherwise, it burns too much energy.

And that points out one weakness of Powercranks: they're a one-dimensional training tool, and by themselves they provide no quantitative measure of how effectively you're training or how your condition is improving. A powermeter provides feedback no matter how you want to train on the bike.

For the cost of Powercranks, a person could buy or build a nice fixie.

If you want to sprint well, buy a fixie and take it up some short steep hills. End of story.

Markhr, though you plug powercranks shamelessly, don't try to sell them on this forum. That is not what the forum was designed for.

alienator said:

...For the cost of Powercranks, a person could buy or build a nice fixie.

bobbyOCR said:

If you want to ... well, buy a fixie and take it up some short steep hills. End of story...

Bingo!

Agreed - if you want to improve your cycling then, in order of expense, try single leg drills, fixed gear riding and powercranks.

Unfortunately I only get the satisfaction of reading first ride reports of powercank virgins from all the powercranks fanboi promotion I do. They're even more satisfying to read when the rider starts on powercranks with a lot of preconceptions about how good a cyclist they are, how smooth their pedal stroke is and how well balanced their legs are.

The very rare person who find powercranks easy to use are 99/100 a long term fixed gear rider. Even then they're usually shocked and amazed at the instant feedback from the cranks about how there's still room for improvement in their pedalling stroke.

Anyway, as ever for every n people in a room there are n+(n-1)^n opinions....or something like that. As we're all aware there's an ongoing disagreement in training about pedalling circles. Everything from just stamping on the pedals to circular pedalling and everything in between. So far it's a lot of shouting and chest slapping but no clear winner.

cyclingforums.comt 233514 15 25.htmlOpen ↗

Buy the Power Meter, then study a little, be honest with yourself, and train right. You won't regret it.

J

yes, this thread pretty much covers the "pull up" thing, and towards the end it "discusses" Power Cranks

http://www.cyclingforums.com/t233514.html

531Aussie said:

cyclingforums.comt233514.htmlOpen ↗

Nice. What I got from that is that FDay is nutter.