Plantar F. recovery question

Mike L said:

I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can tell
me - if I take a full week off running (substituting
biking) with lots of ice is it possible my PF will recover
in that time frame? If not, how much time should I plan
for? I would say I have a moderate case. I thought I was
recovered after my 10 miles on Friday, but after 11 on
Sunday it is back with a vengeance.

Thanks. Mike Lazenby

In the case of a number of people, PF symptoms appear
because the lower leg tissues have contracted with use. Have
you tried various stretches and massages to work them loose?
Soleus stretch with simultaneous toe stretch, rolling bottom
of foot on a golf ball on the floor, calf stretches in
general, ...

Mike L <[email hidden]> wrote:
: I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can tell
: me - if I take a full week off running (substituting
: biking) with lots of ice is it possible my PF will recover
: in that time frame? If not, how much time should I plan
: for? I would say I have a moderate case. I thought I was
: recovered after my 10 miles on Friday, but after 11 on
: Sunday it is back with a vengeance.

: Thanks. Mike Lazenby

I recovered from PF only after getting orthotics, and then
it took about 9 months to a year. I still have to be
cautious about overdoing it, or the PF flares up again.

Don't plan on being back to full speed for a while.

David Pinedo

I recommend limping.

My experience is similiar to David's: It takes a long time to fully recover.
Make no mistake: This is a serious injury. PF has destroyed the competitive
careers of some runners, for example Benji Durden. It appears that recovery
will occur in almost all cases--if you are patient enough. A couple of places
to look:

drpribut.comheelhtm.htmOpen ↗
heelspurs.comheelspurs.comOpen ↗

I took 2 months off from training last fall (I would
normally take 1 month off). This allowed the PF to heal
enough that I could compete in the indoor season (pure
sprinting, about the worst thing you can do with PF). I've
done lots of fast training since (in sprint spikes) and
during this period, the PF has gradually gone away, so that
now, 1 year later, it is effectively gone. You can try the
splints, stretching, and such, but from what I can see, the
most effective recovery activities (in order) are:

(1) time off (no running)
(2) time off your feet (either cut back mileage or cut
back other time on your feet on days that you run)
(3) walking around in shoes with high heels (or
heel cups)

You probably need to adjust your race calendar so that you
have a period of reduced (or no) training to give your heels
time to recover.

People who got PF due to pronation need to get orthotics, or
learn to stop heel striking. People who are overweight need
to lose weight.

Lyndon

"Speed Kills...It kills those that don't have it!" --US
Olympic Track Coach Brooks Johnson

I'm pretty good about stretching but I will start doing a
lot more. I am trying the golf ball right now. Thanks, and
thanks to all those who have responded thus far. I don't
think it is a serious case at this point so it hopefully
won't turn out as bad as those horror stories!

ML

Hi Mike-

PF can be notoriously slow to heal. I had it in my right
foot (a mild but annoying case) for almost 1 1/2 years. It
was, at that level, ok to run *easily* on it. I now have it
in the left foot (speedwork) and will take *at least* two
weeks completely off running, and then will do a very easy
"run test". I will only continue to run if it doesn't hurt
at all during the test, and then, I'll only run 1/2 as much
as usual, and continue the other days cross-training for a
month. I do hope you're icing and using ibuprofen, it's
important to keep it from swelling during healing. It is
also helpful to keep your Achille's tendon and hamstrings
areas well stretched, so they don't add additional stress to
your fascia. But don't over- stretch such that you keep
pulling the fascia at the heel junction or it won't heal.
Then work slowly back up in mileage, cutting back again if
it starts to get sore at all. It's really a bit of a pain,
because it is so slow to heal and it's so hard to be
patient! OH- make sure your shoes are not broken down, that
will definately keep it from healing also.

Teresa in AZ (Now for the Left Foot!)

Mike L said:

I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can tell
me - if I take a full week off running (substituting
biking) with lots of ice is it possible my PF will recover
in that time frame? If not, how much time should I plan
for? I would say I have a moderate case. I thought I was
recovered after my 10 miles on Friday, but after 11 on
Sunday it is back with a vengeance.

Thanks. Mike Lazenby

Quoted message said:

Mike L

Quoted message said:

I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can tell
me

Go to www.fitter1.com. Get the circular wobble board. Use it
twice per day. 15 circles per foot each way up or work your
way up to three mintues per foot.

If you do this daily. You will NOT have plantar
faciaities(sp?) problems. For more info. Email me.

Gleshna

Overheard at 2004 ESA Northeastern Regional Surf Contest:

"F%&*, I got beaten by a guy from the Great Lakes!"

Nothing worked for my husband who struggled with it for 7
years and tried all sorts of treatments until I learned
about Augmentive Soft Tissue Mobilization from a different
physical therapist. He took a plastic thing that looked like
a spatula and scraped the surface of my husbands feet and
legs to the point where they were black and blue (i.e.
treatment was painful). He repeated this about 3 times a
week for 5-6 weeks at the PT office, drank a lot of water,
and slowly started to work back up to running a mile on
site. NOw he can run as much as he has time for pain free.
He got orthotics after the treatments were done and this was
about 4 years ago. The theory behind the treatment is that
it breaks up the scar tissue that forms from PF and it heals
correctly. It sounds like black magic mixed with torture but
it worked. We sent another friend for the same problem and
it worked for her too. See if your local physical therapists
offer this if the pain persists. Good luck.

"Mike L" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can tell
me - if I take a full week off running (substituting
biking) with lots of ice is it possible my PF will recover
in that time frame? If not, how much time should I plan
for? I would say I have a moderate case. I thought I was
recovered after my 10 miles on Friday, but after 11 on
Sunday it is back with a vengeance.

Thanks. Mike Lazenby

I have never heard a good story of treatment of PF by a
podiatrist. My co-worker was treated by a Podiatrist at the
same time I used my wobble board. Mine was cured within a
few weeks. He went on for the rest of the year with problems
and exercises. Finally, he had surgery to remove parts from
his foot. He doesn't do sports, if he did I would have to
think that you would not want parts of your foot removed.

Gleshna

Overheard at 2004 ESA Northeastern Regional Surf Contest:

"F%&*, I got beaten by a guy from the Great Lakes!"

Teresa Bippert-Plymate <[email hidden]> wrote in news:cakveh$q5a$1
@oasis.ccit.arizona.edu:

Thanks for the info Teresa, I'll try to follow your
guidelines. I really trashed my right hamstring last fall
and it tightens up wicked after about 8 or 9 miles. I am
wondering if that is a major contributing factor here too. I
hadn't realized tight hams could cause PF!

Cheers. ML

Quoted message said:

Hi Mike-

PF can be notoriously slow to heal. I had it in my right
foot (a mild but annoying case) for almost 1 1/2 years.
It was, at that level, ok to run *easily* on it. I now
have it in the left foot (speedwork) and will take *at
least* two weeks completely off running, and then will do
a very easy "run test". I will only continue to run if it
doesn't hurt at all during the test, and then, I'll only
run 1/2 as much as usual, and continue the other days cross-
training for a month. I do hope you're icing and using
ibuprofen, it's important to keep it from swelling during
healing. It is also helpful to keep your Achille's tendon
and hamstrings areas well stretched, so they don't add
additional stress to your fascia. But don't over- stretch
such that you keep pulling the fascia at the heel
junction or it won't heal. Then work slowly back up in
mileage, cutting back again if it starts to get sore at
all. It's really a bit of a pain, because it is so slow
to heal and it's so hard to be patient! OH- make sure
your shoes are not broken down, that will definately keep
it from healing also.

Teresa in AZ (Now for the Left Foot!)

Mike L said:

I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can
tell me - if I take a full week off running (substituting
biking) with lots of ice is it possible my PF will
recover in that time frame? If not, how much time should
I plan for? I would say I have a moderate case. I thought
I was recovered after my 10 miles on Friday, but after 11
on Sunday it is back with a vengeance.

Thanks. Mike Lazenby

I forgot to add "calves" in that stretching list. But all of
the muscles behind can add stress to your foot. I also have
to be careful of tight hamstrings, that gets me in fast
races. Are your feet either a) flat and overpronating or b)
high-arched, tight, and under-pronating? Both of these
contribute to getting PF. Mine is case "b". I have to
constantly keep not only the foot, but all the muscles sets
behind stretched, loose, and relaxed. Good luck, I sure hope
yours does not last so long!!

Teresa

Oh, and be sure your everyday shoes are good "foot support"
shoes so they don't aggrevate the condition. It sometimes
helps to put a heel lift or arch support in your everyday
shoes. I do best with an arch support, the heel lift makes
my feet ache! But some people do very well with heel lifts.

Mike L said:

Teresa Bippert-Plymate <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:cakveh$q5a$1 @oasis.ccit.arizona.edu:

Thanks for the info Teresa, I'll try to follow your
guidelines. I really trashed my right hamstring last fall
and it tightens up wicked after about 8 or 9 miles. I am
wondering if that is a major contributing factor here too.
I hadn't realized tight hams could cause PF!

Cheers. ML

Quoted message said:

Hi Mike-

PF can be notoriously slow to heal. I had it in my right
foot (a mild but annoying case) for almost 1 1/2 years.
It was, at that level, ok to run *easily* on it. I now
have it in the left foot (speedwork) and will take *at
least* two weeks completely off running, and then will do
a very easy "run test". I will only continue to run if it
doesn't hurt at all during the test, and then, I'll only
run 1/2 as much as usual, and continue the other days cross-
training for a month. I do hope you're icing and using
ibuprofen, it's important to keep it from swelling during
healing. It is also helpful to keep your Achille's tendon
and hamstrings areas well stretched, so they don't add
additional stress to your fascia. But don't over- stretch
such that you keep pulling the fascia at the heel
junction or it won't heal. Then work slowly back up in
mileage, cutting back again if it starts to get sore at
all. It's really a bit of a pain, because it is so slow
to heal and it's so hard to be patient! OH- make sure
your shoes are not broken down, that will definately keep
it from healing also.

Teresa in AZ (Now for the Left Foot!)

Mike L said:

I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can
tell me - if I take a full week off running (substituting
biking) with lots of ice is it possible my PF will
recover in that time frame? If not, how much time should
I plan for? I would say I have a moderate case. I thought
I was recovered after my 10 miles on Friday, but after 11
on Sunday it is back with a vengeance.

Thanks. Mike Lazenby

OUCH!!!

I can see where this might be helpful if there is a lot of
scar tissue, but yikes! I did get several massages from my
PT when it was the worst (and 4 ultrasound treatments). She
specifically kneaded the area where the fascia meets the
heel to break up scar tissue, and told me to rub it myself,
and to run my foot over a tennis ball for just that reason.
Thanks for the reminder!

Teresa in AZ

MSEagan said:

Nothing worked for my husband who struggled with it for 7
years and tried all sorts of treatments until I learned
about Augmentive Soft Tissue Mobilization from a
different physical therapist. He took a plastic thing
that looked like a spatula and scraped the surface of my
husbands feet and legs to the point where they were black
and blue (i.e. treatment was painful). He repeated this
about 3 times a week for 5-6 weeks at the PT office,
drank a lot of water, and slowly started to work back up
to running a mile on site. NOw he can run as much as he
has time for pain free. He got orthotics after the
treatments were done and this was about 4 years ago. The
theory behind the treatment is that it breaks up the scar
tissue that forms from PF and it heals correctly. It
sounds like black magic mixed with torture but it worked.
We sent another friend for the same problem and it worked
for her too. See if your local physical therapists offer
this if the pain persists. Good luck.

"Mike L" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can tell
me - if I take a full week off running (substituting
biking) with lots of ice is it possible my PF will recover
in that time frame? If not, how much time should I plan
for? I would say I have a moderate case. I thought I was
recovered after my 10 miles on Friday, but after 11 on
Sunday it is back with a vengeance.

Thanks. Mike Lazenby

Teresa Bippert-Plymate <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

OUCH!!!

I can see where this might be helpful if there is a lot of
scar tissue, but yikes! I did get several massages from my
PT when it was the worst (and 4 ultrasound treatments).
She specifically kneaded the area where the fascia meets
the heel to break up scar tissue, and told me to rub it
myself, and to run my foot over a tennis ball for just
that reason. Thanks for the reminder!

Teresa in AZ

MSEagan said:

Nothing worked for my husband who struggled with it for
7 years and tried all sorts of treatments until I
learned about Augmentive Soft Tissue Mobilization from a
different physical therapist. He took a plastic thing
that looked like a spatula and scraped the surface of my
husbands feet and legs to the point where they were
black and blue (i.e. treatment was painful). He repeated
this about 3 times a week for 5-6 weeks at the PT
office, drank a lot of water, and slowly started to work
back up to running a mile on site. NOw he can run as
much as he has time for pain free. He got orthotics
after the treatments were done and this was about 4
years ago. The theory behind the treatment is that it
breaks up the scar tissue that forms from PF and it
heals correctly. It sounds like black magic mixed with
torture but it worked. We sent another friend for the
same problem and it worked for her too. See if your
local physical therapists offer this if the pain
persists. Good luck.

"Mike L" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm hoping someone who has successfully recovered can
tell me - if I take a full week off running
(substituting biking) with lots of ice is it possible my
PF will recover in that time frame? If not, how much
time should I plan for? I would say I have a moderate
case. I thought I was recovered after my 10 miles on
Friday, but after 11 on Sunday it is back with a
vengeance.

Thanks. Mike Lazenby

As you can see, Mike, the healing rate of this injury is
quite varied, but usually long. My advice is to avoid
stretching yourself into another injury. What I did was cut
a hole in the center of the heel of my shoe insert to ease a
potential heel spur. Then I taped the foot as with an
Achilles injury and ran on it regardless. It took about a
year to go away completely. I had had an Achilles tear on
that same side the year before. They are tied together. But
they can also heal on their own without surgery, orthotics,
or expensive treatment.

I assume when you say "regardless" you really mean "taking
it easy..."?

[email hidden] (eddy eagle) wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

As you can see, Mike, the healing rate of this injury is
quite varied, but usually long. My advice is to avoid
stretching yourself into another injury. What I did was
cut a hole in the center of the heel of my shoe insert to
ease a potential heel spur. Then I taped the foot as with
an Achilles injury and ran on it regardless. It took about
a year to go away completely. I had had an Achilles tear
on that same side the year before. They are tied together.
But they can also heal on their own without surgery,
orthotics, or expensive treatment.

Mike L <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I assume when you say "regardless" you really mean "taking
it easy..."?

[email hidden] (eddy eagle) wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

As you can see, Mike, the healing rate of this injury is
quite varied, but usually long. My advice is to avoid
stretching yourself into another injury. What I did was
cut a hole in the center of the heel of my shoe insert
to ease a potential heel spur. Then I taped the foot as
with an Achilles injury and ran on it regardless. It
took about a year to go away completely. I had had an
Achilles tear on that same side the year before. They
are tied together. But they can also heal on their own
without surgery, orthotics, or expensive treatment.

When I said "regardless" I meant with respect to pain. If
you tape up tight you should not be able to stretch it far
enough to ever damage anything so you can have the
confidence to just run on it. There is a huge mental
component to injuries and getting through them. There is
nothing more depressing than taking time completely off
and coming back to find you have the same injury or even a
new one. So I make every effort to find a way to work
through things.

I taped it and did a brisk 3 miles with no discomfort at
all. Do you think I should tape it every time or only on
longer runs??

[email hidden] (eddy eagle) wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

When I said "regardless" I meant with respect to pain. If
you tape up tight you should not be able to stretch it far
enough to ever damage anything so you can have the
confidence to just run on it. There is a huge mental
component to injuries and getting through them. There is
nothing more depressing than taking time completely off
and coming back to find you have the same injury or even a
new one. So I make every effort to find a way to work
through things.

Mike L <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I taped it and did a brisk 3 miles with no discomfort at
all. Do you think I should tape it every time or only on
longer runs??

[email hidden] (eddy eagle) wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

When I said "regardless" I meant with respect to pain.
If you tape up tight you should not be able to stretch
it far enough to ever damage anything so you can have
the confidence to just run on it. There is a huge mental
component to injuries and getting through them. There is
nothing more depressing than taking time completely off
and coming back to find you have the same injury or even
a new one. So I make every effort to find a way to work
through things.

Good for you, Mike. It work for many people. You better tape
is for any run until you think it's better or until the tape
itself seems to be causing problems. I found that after so
many days or weeks the tape over the metatarsals seemed to
be stressing that area so I eliminated or reduced tape
across that area. It still worked. I use good duct tape and
it is still fairly tight at the end. Don't expect full
recovery this quick though. Expect pain to come and go. Just
remember not to stretch into another injury.